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[1.5 - 1.10] Kerbalism 3.11


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Bug: It looks like Kerbalism doesn't recognizes the difference between the small and large robotic arms (from Breaking Ground) for the ROC experiments.

With the small arm the stock dialogue shows that the small arm only gives a percentage  of the total possible science for the ROC experiment, but Kerbalism gives a greater number of credits, which would make sense for the large arm.

Screenshots in spoiler:

Spoiler

Stock dialogue shows 60.8 Science :science::

8NZDkTI.png

Kerbalism dialogue shows 182.2 Science :science: on the harddrive for the same experiment:

stS2m7N.png

KSP version: 1.10.1

Kerbalism version: 3.12

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10 hours ago, EchoLima said:

Bug: It looks like Kerbalism doesn't recognizes the difference between the small and large robotic arms (from Breaking Ground) for the ROC experiments.

With the small arm the stock dialogue shows that the small arm only gives a percentage  of the total possible science for the ROC experiment, but Kerbalism gives a greater number of credits, which would make sense for the large arm.

Screenshots in spoiler:

  Reveal hidden contents

Stock dialogue shows 60.8 Science :science::

8NZDkTI.png

Kerbalism dialogue shows 182.2 Science :science: on the harddrive for the same experiment:

stS2m7N.png

KSP version: 1.10.1

Kerbalism version: 3.12

This is a known compromise. I wish I could send you a direct quote, but I can't seem to find it! Basically, stock's "partial science retrieval" system is incompatible with Kerbalism's science system. This is why samples are only retrievable, and anything that is transmitted eventually gives you full science. This obviously doesn't play nice with the rover arms, so the team decided to just leave both arms in the game and have them both work 100% efficiently. I believe the only workaround would be to create a brand new experiment for the small arm that would have less science value, but then of course you're enabling the player to retrieve more science in total if they have both arms... so maybe not worth the hassle?

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1 hour ago, EchoLima said:

Is there a way to generate Oxygen in space? I know IRL its done with electrolysis of water, but I can't find a way to do it in KSP.

It’s done the same way. Use one of the tiny ISRU units (under Kerbalism) VAB tab, configure it to electrolyze water, making sure to get the dumped resources right, and add a water tank. For best results add a hydrogen-oxygen fuel cell, a sabatier reactor, and a water recycler to achieve near-closed-loop life support except for food.

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I just made a complete list of all Kerbalism processes and resouces (if I missed any, please let me know)

Here is the link for the doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1jFIKDgSt7dw9SdGXqq892OFFaGEBCa-w1jcIIAIJG_A/edit?usp=sharing

Or the PDF

Or as a spoiler:

Spoiler

Kerbalism Resources and Processes

Resources 

Resource Name:

Used in:

Produced by:

Ammonia

  • Greenhouse

  • Hydrazine

  • SCO

  • Haber

  • Waste Processor

  • Waste Recycler

Carbon Dioxide

  • Greenhouse

  • Sabatier

  • SOE

  • Molten Regolith Electrolysis

  • Scrubber

  • Waste Incinerator

  • Waste recycler

Food

  • Kerbals

  • Greenhouse

Hydrogen

  • Anthraquinoe

  • Fuel Cell

  • Haber

  • Sabatier

  • Electrolysis

Liquid Fuel

  • Propulsion

  • Sabatier

Monoprop

  • Monoprop Fuel Cell

  • RCS

  • Hydrazine

  • Hydrazine N2

Nitrogen

  • Haber

  • HydrazineN2

*Can be lost to cabin leaks*

  • Monoprop Fuel Cell

  • SCO

Ore

  • Molten Regolith Electrolysis

  • Drilling

Oxidizer1

  • Hydrazine

  • HydrazineN2

  • Propulsion

  • Anthraquinoe

Oxygen

  • Anthraquinoe

  • Fuel Cell

  • Kerbals

  • Monoprop Fuel Cell

  • SCO

  • Waste Incinerator

  • Electrolysis

  • Greenhouse

  • Hydrazine

  • Molten Regolith Electrolysis

  • SOE

Shielding

  • Protection from radiation

  • Molten Regolith Electrolysis

  • SOE

  • Waste Compressor

Waste

  • Waste Incinerator

  • Kerbals

Waste Atmosphere

  • Greenhouse

  • NonRegen Scrubber

  • Scrubber

  • Kerbals

Waste Water

  • Water Recycler

  • Kerbals

Water

  • Greenhouse

  • Kerbals

  • Fuel Cell

  • Hydrazine

  • Monoprop Fuel Cell

  • Sabatier

  • SCO

  • Water Recycler

  • Waste Incinerator

Processes

All processes take in EC except processes with an asterisk (*) which produce EC.

Name:

Intake:

Output:

Anthraquinoe

  • Hydrogen

  • Oxygen

  • Oxidizer

Electrolysis

  • Water

  • Hydrogen

  • Oxygen

Fuel Cell*

  • Hydrogen

  • Oxygen

  • Water

Greenhouse

  • Ammonia

  • Carbon Dioxide

  • Waste Atmosphere

  • Water

  • Food

  • Oxygen

Haber

  • Hydrogen

  • Nitrogen

  • Ammonia

Hydrazine

  • Ammonia

  • Oxidizer

  • Monoprop

  • Oxygen

  • Water

Kerbals

  • Food

  • Oxygen

  • Water

  • Waste 

  • Waste Atmosphere

  • Waste Water

Molten Regolith Electrolysis

  • Ore

  • Carbon Dioxide

  • Oxygen

  • Shielding

Monoprop Fuel Cell*

  • Monoprop

  • Oxygen

  • Nitrogen

  • Water

NonRegen Scrubber

  • Waste Atmosphere

  • Saturated filters

Sabatier

  • Carbon Dioxide

  • Hydrogen

  • Water

  • Liquid Fuel2

SCO

  • Ammonia

  • Oxygen

  • Nitrogen

  • Water

SOE

  • Carbon Dioxide

  • Oxygen

  • Shielding

Scrubber

  • Waste Atmosphere

  • Carbon Dioxide

Waste Compressor

  • Waste

  • Shielding

Waste Incinerator*

  • Oxygen

  • Waste

  • Carbon Dioxide

  • Water

Waste Processor

  • Waste

  • Ammonia

Water Recycler

  • Waste Water

  • Ammonia

  • Water

Feel free to download and print off for reference.

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I have another question:

what happens when the stress level reach 100%?

For every other indicator, the kerbal dies immediately. Stress doesn't kill immediately. On th eother hand, with the other parameters you are fine until you reach 100%, with stress you can get stress-induced accidents already from the very first day.

is 100% stress simply a higher chance of accidents, or does something more drastic happens?

 

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I've noticed that at the start of my settings.cfg file there's the line -

"Reliability = false                 // component malfunctions and critical failures, missing configs and so disabled"

I've got reliability set on in the settings so I'm guessing this is saying that something is conflicting with it and so it's set itself to off ? Anyone know how I can diagnose this ?

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Just now, DC said:

I've noticed that at the start of my settings.cfg file there's the line -

"Reliability = false                 // component malfunctions and critical failures, missing configs and so disabled"

I've got reliability set on in the settings so I'm guessing this is saying that something is conflicting with it and so it's set itself to off ? Anyone know how I can diagnose this ?

It doesn't show that on my copy of KerbalismConfig. Are you using some other set of configurations, for instance SIMPLEX Kerbalism? Those will have reliability disabled to provide simple gameplay.

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Just now, DC said:

Sorry, I should have mentioned that. I'm running it with RP1 so using the RO Kerbalism Config.

Looking at ROKerbalism, that seems to be intended. I thought it might be there because of TestFlight, but that seems to only cover engine failures. IDK why not component failures, I haven't played RO for any significant time in a while.

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So sometimes I've noticed that even when I have a ton of hydrogen & oxygen on my ship, when I turn on the fuel cell nothing happens? It says running but no oxygen or hydrogen is used & no EC is generated..... Is this a bug?

Also a bug with nitrogen, if you have the pressure module running & then someone EVAs, when they come back in the pressure module begins to use ungodly amounts of nitrogen. Like what would have lasted for a year before the EVA now suddenly only lasts for 1 hour or less. Any way to fix this?

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8 minutes ago, RX2000 said:

So sometimes I've noticed that even when I have a ton of hydrogen & oxygen on my ship, when I turn on the fuel cell nothing happens? It says running but no oxygen or hydrogen is used & no EC is generated..... Is this a bug?

Also a bug with nitrogen, if you have the pressure module running & then someone EVAs, when they come back in the pressure module begins to use ungodly amounts of nitrogen. Like what would have lasted for a year before the EVA now suddenly only lasts for 1 hour or less. Any way to fix this?

For the first- make sure that the fuel cell is set to dump water, or that you have water storage available.

For the second, try disabling a habitat before EVA, depressurizing it, do your EVA stuff, then return and pressurize the habitat by reenabling it. It might be best to have a small airlock module so you don’t have to do that whole cycle- which takes a lot of time- on a habitat with more volume. I would also recommend having a lot more N2 on your long-term craft, as it’s easy to forget to ship more up or depressurize your habitats before EVA.

Edited by Clamp-o-Tron
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3 hours ago, Clamp-o-Tron said:

For the first- make sure that the fuel cell is set to dump water, or that you have water storage available.

For the second, try disabling a habitat before EVA, depressurizing it, do your EVA stuff, then return and pressurize the habitat by reenabling it. It might be best to have a small airlock module so you don’t have to do that whole cycle- which takes a lot of time- on a habitat with more volume. I would also recommend having a lot more N2 on your long-term craft, as it’s easy to forget to ship more up or depressurize your habitats before EVA.

Yea its set up to dump & all that. I should mention that sometimes it doesnt even wanna work right in the VAB. When I turn it on it still shows I have perpetual supply of hydrogen. Fuel cell just seems buggy in 1.11.

I'm EVAing from an unpressurized MK1 with a pressurized crew cabin attached. So you're saying I need to depressurize the crew cabin before EVAing from the MK1?

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9 hours ago, RX2000 said:

Yea its set up to dump & all that. I should mention that sometimes it doesnt even wanna work right in the VAB. When I turn it on it still shows I have perpetual supply of hydrogen. Fuel cell just seems buggy in 1.11.

I'm EVAing from an unpressurized MK1 with a pressurized crew cabin attached. So you're saying I need to depressurize the crew cabin before EVAing from the MK1?

Don't depressurize habitats. It's bugged.

About fuel cells in VAB - if you also have solar panels, to test fuel cells make sure that the planner is set to night time, as fuel cell won't work if solar panels are sufficient.

In the flight just turn them off and on a couple of times, and it should start.

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Can anyone explain how the Surface Deployed Experiments from Breaking Ground interface with Kerbalism?  I would have thought the Central Station would just collect data the same as any other experiment, but that doesn't seem to be the case. 

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9 hours ago, MagicCuboid said:

Can anyone explain how the Surface Deployed Experiments from Breaking Ground interface with Kerbalism?  I would have thought the Central Station would just collect data the same as any other experiment, but that doesn't seem to be the case. 

The work like stock. Kerbalism doesn't do anything with them.

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2 hours ago, Cruesoe said:

The work like stock. Kerbalism doesn't do anything with them.

Ah okay, thank you! I wonder why my Goo station on the Mun hasn't transmitted any Science yet then... guess I have to install one of those deployable relays even though it says it has connection. 

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Orbiting Moho, I am well outside of its radiation belt, yet I still find myself exposed to radiations

qKwp3JN.png

as you can see from the orbit, i am staying clear of the belt, and well inside the magnetosphere to protect myself from storms. I even have an active shield on board, which is doing its duty.

According to the data given, i should be exposed to 2 mrad/h, which the active shield should remove entirely. instead I am taking 128, which the shield is reducing to 88, whenever i am not in shade. Why? where is this radiation coming from? why is it not listed anywhere?

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by the way, there's also something profundly wrong with the way the game counts stress. i have this luxury palace of a spaceship, with gravity rings, hitchhiker containers, greenhouses, cupolas, and twice as much living space as needed, and according to the VAB editor, stress should be under control for 20 years. yet after less than 1 year on mission, everyone in the crew is well above 50%.

after 200 days of mission i split a ship from that, and this second ship is nowhere near as luxurious as the first, though still decently comfortable. kerbonauts in that ship has been in space for just as long as the first crew. and yet they have stress between 20 and 30%. and that, they accumulated while they were in the first ship. it's clearly not how things are supposed to work

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On 1/3/2021 at 7:28 PM, king of nowhere said:

Orbiting Moho, I am well outside of its radiation belt, yet I still find myself exposed to radiations

qKwp3JN.png

as you can see from the orbit, i am staying clear of the belt, and well inside the magnetosphere to protect myself from storms. I even have an active shield on board, which is doing its duty.

According to the data given, i should be exposed to 2 mrad/h, which the active shield should remove entirely. instead I am taking 128, which the shield is reducing to 88, whenever i am not in shade. Why? where is this radiation coming from? why is it not listed anywhere?

The moderate radiation you're experiencing is from the "tail" and little bubble around Moho's magnetic field. If you squint you can see it. 0.088 rad/h isn't that much compared to if you were right in the belt.

As for stress, I have also noticed some discrepancy between what I am told in the planner and what my kerbals experience, but I haven't sent them on long enough missions to really test it. 

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55 minutes ago, MagicCuboid said:

The moderate radiation you're experiencing is from the "tail" and little bubble around Moho's magnetic field. If you squint you can see it. 0.088 rad/h isn't that much compared to if you were right in the belt.

As for stress, I have also noticed some discrepancy between what I am told in the planner and what my kerbals experience, but I haven't sent them on long enough missions to really test it. 

what do you mean by tail and little bubble?

i am inside the magnetosphere and outside of the belt, i don't see any other zone.

anyway, it seems i get similar values anywhere inside moho's SoI. i tried to change the orbit a lot, but no way.

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Also, if it's not too much of a hassle to add it, i would find it extremely useful to have additional power settings for automated vehicles; so far there is 80% battery and 20% battery, and i'm doing a lot with those, but I still need to manually follow my operations. having a 50% battery setting would be very convenient. 40% and 60%  would be even better.

detailed explanation on automated power setting follows

Spoiler

Ideally, my solar powered mining vehicles should drill by day, and rest by night.

unfortunately, setting the automation on day and night cycle does not work. because those automations only kick in at dawn and dusk. so, while my diggers can work by day, there will come a time when the sun is at the right angle that all the solar panels are shading each other. or perhaps an ike eclipses. anyway, they have a power shortage. I cannot, of course, let that happen, or i risk the crew dead for lack of life support. So I created an emergency routine to shut down mining work and activate fuel cells when power is low.

So, if I set my mining on day and night, what happens is that at the first power shortage everything is shut down. and then it's not restarted when power comes back, because day and night only kick in at dawn and dusk.

Incidentally, also triggering the day condition again every time the high batter is triggered would also be a way to tackle the problem, but perhaps less straightforward.

anyway, I had to set my mining on full and empty battery. so by day I mine with solar power. By night I keep mining until i reach 20% power. then everything shuts down and the fuel cells are activated. they slowly recharge the battery, until at 80% the mining starts again. this cycle goes on all night, but it's not a problem because i have plenty of oxygen and hydrogen.

this cycle, though, produces water, and dumps it. of course i must tell my fuel cells to dump water, i can't risk a life support failure because the water tank is full. anyway, i have the problem of remaking the hydrogen, and for that i use electrolysis. i tie it to high and low power, again. but electrolysis uses more electricity than my digger generates, so with it on i keep having power shortages. and after dumping water by night, now electrolysis risks draining all the remaining water and killing my crew by thirst.

So far, I am coping by controlling every digger every few days and manually performing electrolysis

ultimately, it would be much easier if i could set electrolysis to shut down at 50% power. also, if i could set fuel cells to shut down at 50% power, i wouldn't spend all night in the mine-drain battery-shut down-recharge cycle. the fuel cell would only work with battery power running from 50 to 20%, and it would provide life support and nothing else. this would drain much less hydrogen.

 

I also have an orbiter with insufficient battery to last through the night, unless i shut down the greenhouses, which i don't want to do for longer than necessary. and setting electrolysis to happen at high power creates this weird cycle of charge-discharge, which also creates problems at high time warp. again, if i could shut down the electrolysis at 50%, it would save me the hassle of doing it manually.

Furthermore, i would like to start the fuel cell at night and shut it down at day, but i cannot with the current setting; when the sun sets i have a full battery, so if i program my fuel cell to turn on there, in a few minutes the power level will reach 80%; then the fuel cell will shut down. similarly, as the orbiter reaches the new day with empty battery, if the battery was shut down by the new day, as soon as it hits 20% it would turn on again. at least, i assume so; i didn't try

EDIT: furthermore, it would be useful to be able, in the config window, to remove the message when batteries are at 20%, but keep it when they are at 0%. during the cycle i set up, it's perfectly normal that battery level will fall to 20% before activating fuel cells and recovering. i don't want a notification at every orbit. but if the level goes to 0%, then something definitely went wrong and i need to know it asap

Edited by king of nowhere
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Additional question: is it intentional that getting nitrogen by mining is virtually impossible? i have a nitrogen drill, but it's barely producing enough to compensate losses. and i scouted every biome on duna and can't find any concentration higher than 2.5%

It would make sense to have it difficult to find, since it's quite rare in most planetary crusts. just trying to figure out if it was indeed supposed to be THAT rare

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