[1.8+] Real Fuels

NathanKell · November 22, 2014

You yourself can delete posts. Click edit, then click delete, then add a message and click delete.

As for throttling, as the FAQ in the Realism Overhaul OP says, that's entirely proper. Real rocket engines (with *very* few exceptions) don't throttle.

Northstar1989 · November 23, 2014

Is anyone else having problems with the rescaled SRBs (FOWDS & RT-5) or launch clamps? For me, both of the SRBs still look like the full scale 1.25m Squad parts, but with the attach nodes moved to the correct locations. Maybe this is due to the scaling changes (bug fix?) in 0.25?
Even if I turn the launch clamp pumps on in the VAB, when I launch the rocket, they are always set to "Pump Enabled: False" without a toggle to turn them on.
I've even tried a fresh copy of KSP with just Real Fuels v8.1 and the latest Stockalike RF engine configs (KSP 0.25 32-Bit on Win 7 64bit), but both problems persisted.

I have the same problem. I was meaning to mention this to you NathanKell, but I got a little caught-up trying to get a more aerodynamic/larger Thermal Fin into the mod.

Speaking of which, KSP-Interstellar already has a rather visually-appealing triangular radiator fin; the model for which would make s superior (and better-looking) replacement for the current Thermal Fin. Among other improvements, the radiator is not only triangular (and thus more aerodynamic) it is also black. REAL radiators are black in color, because that maximizes their Blackbody Radiation (color affects their emissivity under the Stefan-Boltzmann Law)- which is the *only* way to cool anything in space. There was a *reason* all the concept art for JIMO showed black radiators...

Maybe I could convince Fractal_UK (the creator of KSP-Interstellar) to allow a fork of the radiator model I was talking about (the large, triangular, black one), with a re-scale to bring the model down to a smaller (more reasonable) size? If so, maybe I could post a revised version of the Thermal Fin part using the new model (but same balance), and you could use it in the next release NathanKell?

Regards,

Northstar

Edited November 23, 2014 by Northstar1989

ghost4dog · November 28, 2014

When i've installed real fules mod, all parts (besides aviation lights) had failed to load:/ I'm using KSP 0.25, 32-bit, with mods: Real solar system, KW rocketry, soviet engines, near future solar, mechjeb, aviation lights. After uninstalling real fuels mod and re-launching the game everything's get back to normal, all parts are in VAB:/ So what am I doing wrong?

NathanKell · November 28, 2014

Please post your log. See here for how.

Tyrador · November 28, 2014

It seems that since installing realfuels I cannot rescale engines using tweak scale. Does anyone has the same issue? Thank you.

ghost4dog · November 28, 2014

OK I know what was the cause of the problem with missing parts - it was soviet engines mod. I've reinstalled everything from the begining, and without soviet engines pack - parts are back. Now I'm struggling with engines config, first I've installed "reaching for the stars" config and it had messed up sizes and attachment nodes for most engines:/ I'll try this "stockalike" config.

Starwaster · November 28, 2014

It seems that since installing realfuels I cannot rescale engines using tweak scale. Does anyone has the same issue? Thank you.

Everyone does. Engine tweaks scaling is disabled. (Edit: when using real fuels)

Edited November 29, 2014 by Starwaster

November 29, 2014

I just had an idea. How about adding a KAS container as a type of "fuel" for SM-type (or a new type altogether) tanks? It could be useful in that it would essentially result in a procedural KAS container, with an added ability to convert a part of it into, say, a water or food container. It'd be great for resupply vehicles like Cygnus and ATV.

Lexx Thai · November 30, 2014

Nathan, we have problems with RF (and MFT too, I think). Currently, mod incorrectly calculates the mass of complex details, consisting of several partmodules (Engines and Tank).

For example:


@PART[Kosmos_VA_RRV_Propulsion_Unit]:NEEDS[RealFuels]:AFTER[RealFuels_StockEngines]:FINAL // VA Propulsion Block
{
    @mass = 0.112

    @MODULE[ModuleFuelTanks]
    {
        @type = ServiceModule
        @volume = 75
        @basemass = -1
    }

    @MODULE[ModuleRCS*]
    {
        @name = ModuleRCSFX
        @thrusterPower = 0.3293
        !resourceName = DELETE
        @atmosphereCurve
        {
            @key,0 = 0 250
            @key,1 = 1 150
        }
        !PROPELLANT[LiquidFuel] {}
        !PROPELLANT[Oxidizer] {}
        !PROPELLANT[MonoPropellant] {}
        PROPELLANT
        {
            name = UDMH
            ratio = 47.823219
        }
        PROPELLANT
        {
            name = NTO
            ratio = 52.176781
        }
    }

    MODULE
    {
        name = ModuleEngineConfigs
        type = ModuleRCSFX
        techLevel = 1
        origTechLevel = 1
        engineType = L
        origMass = 0.054
        configuration = UDMH+NTO
        modded = false
        CONFIG
        {
            name = Hydrazine
            thrusterPower = 0.3293
            PROPELLANT
            {
                name = Hydrazine
                ratio = 1
            }
            IspSL = 0.23
            IspV = 0.72
        }

        CONFIG
        {
            name = HTP
            thrusterPower = 0.3293
            PROPELLANT
            {
                name = HTP
                ratio = 1
            }
            IspSL = 0.2
            IspV = 0.465
        }

        CONFIG
        {
            name = Nitrogen
            thrusterPower = 0.3293
            PROPELLANT
            {
                name = Nitrogen
                ratio = 1
            }
            IspSL = 0.1
            IspV = 0.195
        }

        CONFIG
        {
            name = UDMH+NTO
            thrusterPower = 0.3293
            PROPELLANT
            {
                name = UDMH
                ratio = 0.47823219
            }
            PROPELLANT
            {
                name = NTO
                ratio = 0.52176781
            }
            IspSL = 0.396
            IspV = 0.943
        }

        CONFIG
        {
            name = MonoPropellant
            thrusterPower = 0.3293
            PROPELLANT
            {
                name = MonoPropellant
                ratio = 1
            }
            IspSL = 0.243
            IspV = 0.64
        }
    }
}

This code should (in theory) give us the part with dry mass not less 0.166 t (without multipliers in MFTSettings.cfg), but in-game we can see two pictures below:[table=width: 500]

[tr]

[td]Part just after selection, tank is empty[/td]

[td]Same part, tank filled[/td]

[/tr]

[tr]

[td][/td]

[/tr]

[/table]

NathanKell · November 30, 2014

In ModuleEngineConfigs, remove line

origMass = 0.054

Since that tells RF that the part's original mass is 0.054 tons, and to scale that mass based on tech level.

Lexx Thai · November 30, 2014

In ModuleEngineConfigs, remove line
origMass = 0.054
Since that tells RF that the part's original mass is 0.054 tons, and to scale that mass based on tech level.

Still no changes, except part info.

NathanKell · November 30, 2014

Ok. Please pastebin the original configs and your patches for both parts.

Lexx Thai · November 30, 2014

Original KOSMOS part config: http://pastebin.com/rJA1DKq7

I think, the KOSMOS tanks config file from RF don't needed for you. Except RealSettings.cfg: http://pastebin.com/PZbEqzdf

And my patch for that part: http://pastebin.com/sr8Mf1Tr

Is it correct?

NathanKell · November 30, 2014

You can't have two pass settings in a MM patch, so either use AFTER[whatever] or FINAL, not both. I'm not sure, beyond that, what's going wrong, the cfg looks ok to me. I can't test it, however, I'm away right now.

Ingame, can you hit Alt-F12, go to Database->Configs, scroll down to the part config for the part, and click Debug on the right? That will show the final config passed to the game. Make sure everything looks right...

ANWRocketMan · December 1, 2014

You can't have two pass settings in a MM patch, so either use AFTER[whatever] or FINAL, not both. I'm not sure, beyond that, what's going wrong, the cfg looks ok to me. I can't test it, however, I'm away right now.
Ingame, can you hit Alt-F12, go to Database->Configs, scroll down to the part config for the part, and click Debug on the right? That will show the final config passed to the game. Make sure everything looks right...

Sorry to interrupt here and slightly off-topic, but if you reload the database from in-game will MM patches and RSS etc still be applied afterwards?

NathanKell · December 1, 2014

Hit Alt-F11 (or modifier-F11 if not on Windows) in Space Center to bring up MM's menu, and reload from there.

Felbourn · December 2, 2014

Isn't RF supposed to override the mass of the tank (unless basemass=-1) and use its own basemass? (for example basemass = 0.000016 * volume etc does an override)

I'm seeing that this test below is still including the base mass of the tank AND the extra mass as tank volume is increased or filled. For example, a PART with mass=10 and MODULE ModuleFuelTanks as shown below has a total mass of 10+13000*0.000016+13000*X where X is the additional tank type definition mass per volume.

In my part file:

MODULE

{

name = ModuleFuelTanks

type = MyTest

volume = 13000

}

In a tank config file:

@TANK_DEFINITION[Default]

{

@name = MyTest

!TANK[Aerozine50] {}

!TANK[MMH] {}

// various other lines like these

!TANK[MON3] {}

!TANK[MON10] {}

// all the same

}

MrHatty · December 3, 2014

Has anyone by chance started work on compatibility with the Mark IV Space Plane System from Nertea?

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/101699-0-25-Mark-IV-Spaceplane-System-%282-5m-aircraft-fuselage%29

Edited December 3, 2014 by MrHatty

Starwaster · December 3, 2014

Has anyone by chance started work on compatibility with the Mark IV Space Plane System from Nertea?
http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/101699-0-25-Mark-IV-Spaceplane-System-%282-5m-aircraft-fuselage%29

Interesting, so it's ready for prime time then is it?

I might write up something for it...

NathanKell · December 3, 2014

Felbourn, that confuses me greatly; I've not seen that ever occur before. What part are you adding the module to, and what is the entire (patched) config of the part?

Felbourn · December 3, 2014

Felbourn, that confuses me greatly; I've not seen that ever occur before. What part are you adding the module to, and what is the entire (patched) config of the part?

I hope it's not going to be a stupid thing staring me in the face... this is the output of a MM database debug dump, plus some comments I just added.

{
name = KW3mtankL4A
module = Part
author = KW Rocketry
rescaleFactor = 1.0
scale = 1.25
node_stack_top = 0.0, 6.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 3
node_stack_bottom = 0.0, -6.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 3
node_attach = 0.0, 0.0, -1.515, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 3
TechRequired = veryHeavyRocketry
entryCost = 25920
cost = 51840
category = 0
subcategory = 0
title = Odyssey Short Core Fuel Tank
manufacturer = KW Rocketry
description = an unpainted 3.75m liquid fuel tank..
attachRules = 1,1,1,1,0
mass = 146.7 // I set this so it would sort properly with my part organizer when sorting by wet mass
dragModelType = default
maximum_drag = 0.2
minimum_drag = 0.3
angularDrag = 2
maxTemp = 1550
crashTolerance = 10
breakingForce = 1500
breakingTorque = 1500
MODEL
{
model = KWRocketry/Parts/Fuel/KW_Universal_Tanks/KW_Fuel_3mL4A
scale = 1.25, 1.25, 1.25
}
MODULE
{
name = ExtendedPartInfo // a module I programmed myself; just adds extra UI to the in-flight part popup
}
MODULE
{
name = ModuleFuelTanks
type = Odyssey_Core
volume = 140000
}
MODULE
{
name = TweakScale
type = Scale_Stack
defaultScale = 3.75
}
}
TANK_DEFINITION
{
name = Odyssey_Core
basemass = 0.000016 * volume
TANK
{
name = LqdOxygen
mass = 0.000014
utilization = 1
fillable = True
amount = 0.0
maxAmount = 0.0
temperature = -183
loss_rate = 0.00000001
note = (lacks insulation)
}
TANK
{
name = Kerosene
mass = 0.000012
utilization = 1
fillable = True
amount = 0.0
maxAmount = 0.0
}
TANK
{
name = LqdHydrogen
mass = 0.000002
utilization = 1
fillable = True
amount = 0.0
maxAmount = 0.0
temperature = -253
loss_rate = 0.00000004
note = (lacks insulation)
}
TANK
{
name = NTO
mass = 0.000016
utilization = 1
fillable = True
amount = 0.0
maxAmount = 0.0
}
TANK
{
name = UDMH
mass = 0.000016
utilization = 1
fillable = True
amount = 0.0
maxAmount = 0.0
}
}
PART

The tank shows a mass in the VAB that is correct, but once taken to the launch pad it jumps up by 146.7 tons.

Edited December 3, 2014 by Felbourn

Raptor831 · December 3, 2014

...snip...
The tank shows a mass in the VAB that is correct, but once taken to the launch pad it jumps up by 146.7 tons.

Not that I claim to know much (configs looks ok to me), but if it were me I'd dump TweakScale and see what happens. Betting you've tried that, though.

@NathanKell: Just saw on your comment on Felbourn's latest Alexandria vid (awesome vid, BTW!) that RF had solid rocket motor thrust curves. How'd I miss that?!? Checked out RO for some examples, but is there any nice (read: easy) way of creating those key => value pairs?

Felbourn · December 3, 2014

Not that I claim to know much (configs looks ok to me), but if it were me I'd dump TweakScale and see what happens. Betting you've tried that, though.
@NathanKell: Just saw on your comment on Felbourn's latest Alexandria vid (awesome vid, BTW!) that RF had solid rocket motor thrust curves. How'd I miss that?!? Checked out RO for some examples, but is there any nice (read: easy) way of creating those key => value pairs?

Oh that reminds me....

@NathanKell: I just looked over https://github.com/NathanKell/ModularFuelSystem/blob/master/Source/ModularEngines.cs and it seems like this uses the same code or at least same module as EngineControllerV2? So basically I can just remove that DLL, then.

*EDIT* LOL I just looked at the thrust curve for RealismOverhaul\REWORK\RO_FASA_BigG.cfg and I guess I'd have to call that a "flipping the bird" curve.

Edited December 3, 2014 by Felbourn

Felbourn · December 3, 2014

is there any nice (read: easy) way of creating those key => value pairs?

I use Unity to create them for me, and it's easy. If you want, draw a line with any paint program, imgur it for me, and I'll make a curve that matches your desire.

Felbourn · December 3, 2014

Not that I claim to know much (configs looks ok to me), but if it were me I'd dump TweakScale and see what happens. Betting you've tried that, though.

1. I thought I tried it.

2. I thought if I used the tank at its defaultScale then it would not matter anyway since I've only had issues in the past when scale was changed.

It is a TweakScale interaction bug of some kind after all, so I must not have tested it enough. I removed the DLL and the tank was correct. I put the DLL back and the basemass was treated as -1 instead of the TANK definition. I was wrong... it appears to be basemass=-1 instead of basemass=old mass + default tank + added tank. At least... that's what it was doing now after several changes during testing.

Mod DLLs found:
Assembly-CSharp v1.0.0.0
ModuleManager.2.5.1 v2.5.1.0
aaa_Toolbar v1.0.0.0
ActiveTextureManagement v1.0.0.0
BDAnimationModules v0.0.0.0
CameraTools v0.0.0.0
CITUtil v1.0.0.0
NodeHelper v1.1.0.0
FusTek_Sumghai v1.0.0.0
CrewManifest v0.5.9.0
CrossFeedEnabler v0.3.5393.40022
DeadlyReentry v6.1.5398.39637
DistantObject v0.0.0.0
DMagic v0.8.6.1
EngineThrustController v1.0.0.0
EnhancedNavBall v1.3.3.0
CityLights v1.0.0.0
Clouds v1.0.0.0
Geometry v1.0.0.0
OverlayMgr v1.0.0.0
Terrain v1.0.0.0
FerramAerospaceResearch v0.14.3.0
ferramGraph v1.3.0.0
Firespitter v7.0.5398.27328
Fusebox v0.0.0.0
HullCamera v0.3.0.0
MechJeb2 v2.3.0.0
RasterPropMonitor v0.17.0.0
MechJebRPM v0.17.0.0
KAS v1.0.5394.34415
ObjectTools v1.0.0.0
Wheels v1.0.0.0
KerbalIspDifficultyScaler v1.4.1.0
HyperEdit v1.2.4.1
KerbCam v0.13.5295.40781
GeodesicGrid v1.0.5363.29417
Kethane v1.0.5393.30221
km_Gimbal_2.0 v1.0.5347.43069
km_Lib v1.0.5350.41027
km_special v0.0.0.0
InfernalRobotics v0.19.0.0
KSPAPIExtensions v1.7.1.2
Scale_Redist v1.0.0.0
KerbalKonstructs v1.0.0.0
DockingPortAlignment v1.0.0.0
ModuleDockingNodeNamed v1.0.0.0
NearFutureSolar v1.0.0.0
ORSX v1.0.0.0
PartHighlighter v1.0.0.0
MiniAVC v1.0.2.4
PlanetShine v1.0.5406.35751
ProceduralFairings v0.0.0.0
RCSBuildAid v0.5.1.35131
RCSBuildAidToolbar v0.5.1.35132
RcsSounds v4.2.0.0
RealChute v1.2.5394.42483
RealFuels v0.8.1.33418
RealSolarSystem v0.8.0.0
RemoteTech v1.0.0.0
ResourceOverview v1.0.1.1
SCANsat v1.0.8.0
sceneJumper v0.0.0.0
SelectRoot v0.0.0.0
SimplePartOrganizer v3.0.0.0
SmokeScreen v2.5.0.0
TacFuelBalancer v2.4.1.0
TextureReplacer v1.7.3.22984
TacLifeSupport v0.10.1.0
ToadicusTools v0.0.0.0
Trajectories v0.4.1.0
KerbalAlarmClock v3.0.4.0
KSPAlternateResourcePanel v2.6.0.0
TweakableAnimateGeneric v1.5.5405.25485
TweakableDecouplers v1.5.5405.25482
TweakableDockingNode v1.5.5405.25482
TweakableEVA v1.4.5405.25486
TweakableGimbals v1.5.5405.25484
TweakableIntakes v1.5.5405.25487
TweakableRCS v1.5.5405.25484
TweakableSolarPanels v1.5.5405.25483
TweakableStaging v1.5.5405.25481
Scale v1.44.0.0
TweakScale_RealFuels v0.0.0.0
UbioWeldingLtd v1.0.1.4
Karbonite v1.0.0.0
USITools v1.0.0.0
USI_Converter v1.0.0.0
VesselView v1.0.0.0
VesselViewPlugin v1.0.0.0
VesselViewRPM v1.0.0.0
VVDiscoDisplay v1.0.0.0
VVPartSelector v1.0.0.0
WheelSounds v0.4.0.0
Non-DLL mods added:
MEPS
HotRockets
TweakableEverything
Mods by directory (sub directories of GameData):
000_Toolbar
AerojetKerbodyne
AIES_Aerospace
BahaSP
BoulderCo
BoxSat alpha
CIT
CMES
CommunityResourcePack
DDSLoader
DMagic Orbital Science
EnvironmentalVisualEnhancements
FASA
Habitat Pack
HGR
HullCameraVDS
Interstellar
JSI
KerbalFoundries
KerbalStockLauncherOverhaul
Kerbaltek
KerbinSide
Klockheed_Martian
Klockheed_Martian_Special
KOSMOS
KWRocketry
LackMisc
LifeSupport
LLL
MagicSmokeIndustries
medsouz
ModsByTal
MP_Nazari
NASAmission
NAU
NavyFish
NearFutureConstruction
NearFutureElectrical
NearFutureProps
NearFuturePropulsion
NearFutureSpacecraft
NEBULA
NovaPunch2
Odyssey
ResourceOverview_1.0.1.1
SovietPack
SPD
Squad
StationPartsExpansion
SurfaceLights
Tantares
ThunderAerospace
TriggerTech
TweakScale
UmbraSpaceIndustries
ViewInternals

[1.8+] Real Fuels

Recommended Posts

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Guest

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Join the conversation