Ziv

Kasuha: I understood that you were counting with more and more expensive fuel as it get farther to the stations and then refueling from that and counting that price, and the numbers look right but that was a very complex way with a lot of new units... but anyway, that's a well thought Laythe Tours Company, well done! mr_ygourt: I have designed a badge, look: What do you think? I already added it to my signature, let me know if you accept this as the official badge for your challenge. What I really like, btw, because it's hard and can be very complex, and on the other hand it's a very easy on the points: get Kerbals onto Laythe and back for the cheapest. Awesome.

Nooo, I was just kidding, everybody can build as big ships as they like... or can. (Don't get me wrong: this is not a new sub-challenge! )

Pamynx: Oh, I see now how you did the sorting of the landers. Yeah, symmetry is important. I guess you are the first to choose that small badge!

BTW, after seeing some if these giant ships, I'm thinking about a new rule like "your ship can't be wider as the launch pad"...

All right, I have allowed NEAR too.

Pamynx: Congratulations, you have finished the JOOL-5 Challenge on Level 3! Nice one with the simultaneous flag planting, I don't remember too much mission like this. I also liked as your landers became little ion powered pod at the end, that's a cool idea! And also smart because this way you will have a lot of dV with your last stage. That was strange that you brought 2 more spare ion-landers and that's funny that you had to use one of them as a rescue pod. Nice saving of a Kerbal life! I also liked your Pol lander, very unique. And this picture is awesome! I always like views from the Cupola! That's a cool mission with nice ion ideas, thank you for participating!

Yeah I read that there, I mean, what does it change in gameplay, especially on Kerbin and Laythe? Is it easier or harder, does it mean more fuel or less, etc...

To be honest, I try to understand your /F LF LFOX etc. stuff but I can't. Why don't you just count everything in funds?

Oh, I see. Hmm, tell me more about NEAR and I consider allowing it, if you want. Yeah, same name isn't god. I edited the first page that if you would see a mod in the list then link it.

...then you didn't check the links at the mod list: FAR, NEAR Future Technologies NEAR is that ion/electro/etc. propulsion part set, not the aerodynamics model.

Checked, spoilers still don't work, there's no cog neither. Only the imgur logo (links to the main site) and the left-right arrows jumped in the center of the black screen. but the links work, thanks!

Kasuha: the imgur albums doesn't load, when I open a spoiler then there are no pictures

FAR makes the atmospheres more tricky, and so the challenge harder. I guess NEAR has parts which are better than the stock parts, so that would make the challenge easier. I don't have experience with NEAR so if it is stockalike then let me know and I will consider it.

But please remember that for the JOOL-5 Challenge you have to go from Kerbin orbit to Jool as one big ship. So no pre-sent refuel bases there, also no parallel ships. Or you can do that, but that won't go in the official Hall of Fame.

If you are so harsh to your Kerbal that you would put him in a chair for some years then yes, it's allowed (except for the Level 1 Low-mass challenge, there you have to have a pod for the interplanetary phase of the mission).

What is funny about space exploration is that the smaller you go, the more effective you are. And this is very true about your final stage, the lander, in this case. If your lander is big, you need a much bigger stage to move that into a moon, and you need a much bigger stage to move that stage around Jool, and you need a much bigger stage to move that joolian stage to Jool. OH, and you need a much bigger stage to move this stuff out into low Kerbin orbit. Let's say an example, where X is the weight of an imaginary final stage (lander) weight, and every stage needs five times more fuel to move the lander or the other upper stages: Total weight = ((((X + 5X) * 5) * 5) *5) = 6X * 5 * 5 * 5 = 750X So if your lander is 1 tons then your whole ship will be 750 tons. If your lander is 20 tons then your ship will be 15000 tons.... So, every gram in your lander counts as tons on your ship on the launchpad... and with JOOL-5, if you use some good logistics and put your main ship together in low Kerbin orbit (LKO), and with space tugs to move the lander around into the moon orbit and out, and you have a "base" where you can refuel, it's also faaar more effective...

going into a 100 km orbit around each moon is a very bad idea: it's a tremendous amount of fuel waste. The best solution is to park your main ship in an orbit between the moons, and use a smaller space-tug to bring your lander into orbit around the moons. And this way you don't have to move the weight of that parts and fuel into and out of each orbit what you will not use there. Moving things in space needs energy, so move only what is absolutely neccessary.

Sounds great, looking forward to it! what I really like about this challenge that you can have static structures without the mess of taking them there... and also the tourist trips are a good idea, and with a simple comparable indicator (ticket prize), this is just great!

mr_yogurt: the SpacePlane Plus has a closed part for 4 kerbals, but it has a cargo bay with closable doors on top too. Is it allowed to pack Command Seats into the cargo bay for the interplanetary parts of the journey? Edit: I'm planning it with seats in the cargo bay right now, but I personally would not allow it because it would give a huge advantage in size/weight and number of tourists over the normal closed parts (like pods or hitch-hiker units), so it would be similar like having a normal plane with seats on it during the whole mission (which is prohibited)... so this would be the only winning way and everybody would be forced down onto this solution. With closed pods it's more difficult, but more realistic, more challenging and more fun!

Yeah, the SSTOs will win here. But I will do a big multi-stage style mission too. Edit: I was thinking about a "Singe Stage to Laythe and back" kind of plane...

I allow it for you but don't want to write it out into the list because it won't be a common thing, I guess.

With Infernal Robotics you can scale stuff and I don't like it... but if you want to use it's robotic arms then write me and I will consider letting it to be used. FAR and DRE are allowed, added to the list. I checked RLA Stockalike and I really like it, so I allow this mod too. The mini nuke and the tricky ion-hybrid engines can be an advantage at small crafts but at JOOL-5 small crafts are not common...

Building a real SSTO for this challenge turns out to be much more harder than it seems at first...

Yeah, I know the firespitter directory in SP+ but it doesn't have parts. Yes, I also love how SP+ looks!

I agree, it's enough to demonstrate that they can put their foot on Laythe, no need to put all the 482912 Kerbals out. Yeah, command seat landing will be cheaper, I guess it too (but more work to put all the Kerbals into the seats ).