DDS or ATM?

[drswagboss]

Which one is better for memory budgeting?

Edited March 17, 2015 by drswagboss

[Van Disaster]

Preconverting dds is better from a pure memory usage point of view, but takes considerably more personal management. ATM has a ~400MB overhead for me, but I run either DX11 or OpenGL so it may be different for straight up DX9 users.

[BudgetHedgehog]

I'm pretty sure DDSLoader is simply a load time saving mod. Rather than having KSP load a png/tga/mbm, decompress it and then recompress it to a format your graphics card can display, it simply allows the Gamedatabase loader to load those recompressed textures which is quicker. I don't think it saves any memory in and of itself, so I'd say go for ATM. But.. why not use both?

[rkman]

I'm pretty sure DDSLoader is simply a load time saving mod. ... I don't think it saves any memory in and of itself

The converter needed to use DDSLoader has the option to reduce texture resolution.

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/98672-WIN-KSP-to-DDS-texture-converter

[Van Disaster]

I'm pretty sure DDSLoader is simply a load time saving mod. Rather than having KSP load a png/tga/mbm, decompress it and then recompress it to a format your graphics card can display, it simply allows the Gamedatabase loader to load those recompressed textures which is quicker. I don't think it saves any memory in and of itself, so I'd say go for ATM. But.. why not use both?

Both is pointless - they both use the same process, only one is entirely external to the game and requires your personal intervention. I don't know why ATM has the memory overhead it has for me though, but obviously any ingame system is going to use more resources than an external one.

[superm18]

DDS all the way! plus openGL and popup window

[Dazpoet]

I prefer DDSLoader since to me it seems to load faster. I'm using autopruner either way so I don't really have a problem with some added manual intervention.

[Stone Blue]

Please let me know if I have this wrong, but, IIRC, there are mods that dont seem to work well with DDS textures (hence the exception list in the converter), yet you can use ATM with...??

Also, DDS loader is NOT just for quicker loading times, as it replaces loading the .mbm/.png textures with the .dds ones, which DO seem to provide a nice RAM savings...

Again, this is just MY interpretation of what ATM/DDS does...

I know I have significant RAM savings since using ATM for the past several months...And now I have even bigger RAM saving since using DDS the past couple of weeks...

So yes, i use BOTH: DDS seems to be best, but i still use ATM to pick up where DDS textures cant be used...

As an example, previous to 0.25, the Squad "Spaces" folder was obscenely HUGE at around 700MB, IIRC...Or about 1/3-1/4 of the total size of my GameData folder, with 50-70 mods installed..

So much so, that I was deleting it, and not using IVA at all, as I could install 5-10 part mods using that space instead...

In 0.25/0.90, Squad managed to shrink it down to 260MB...Still way too large, IMHO...I converted them to DDS, and now that folder is 1/10th of what it was, at around 27.5MB. Still equivalent to one or two decent sized mod packs, but at least down to reasonable size now, IMHO...

Edited March 17, 2015 by Stone Blue

[drswagboss]

So you converted the whole Squad and Nasa Mission folders?

[AccidentalDisassembly]

Conversion to DDS (and resizing) via DDS4KSP produces a whole lot more RAM savings than ATM for me (with similar parameters for each).

Plus it's at least (not exaggerating, I mean this literally) 10 or 20 times faster than ATM at converting textures.

[Stone Blue]

So you converted the whole Squad and Nasa Mission folders?

If this is directed at me, then yes...I convert my whole GameData folder... I run HEAVILY modded: 60-80+ mods...Again, it seems not all mods work with DDS textures, so i keep ATM to gain savings by shrinking those textures that DDS cant do...

i only mentioned the Squad Spaces folder as an example, because I was actually DELETING that whole folder, to help keep my GameData folder under 2.25GB or so...

And now by converting that folder alone to DDS, it goes from 260MB to 27.5MB...QUITE a huge difference...

And i also have gained on game loading speeds...With ATM alone, I was still taking 8-10+ mins to load...Now with DDS, its only maybe 3-5 mins?...I'm not sure exactly, but its DEFINATELY, MUCH faster...

Edited March 17, 2015 by Stone Blue

[drswagboss]

Ok, I did some tests with ATM, DDS, and regular no compression

KSP-Stock______1941.7mb

DDS____________1614.2mb

ATM-Basic______1759.9mb

It looks like DDS is actually better at saving ram.

[tygoo7]

I just use OpenGL. Converting everything to DDS is too much work for me.

[drswagboss]

I just use OpenGL. Converting everything to DDS is too much work for me.

You literally just specify where your GameData is and let the program convert for you.

[Stone Blue]

I just use OpenGL. Converting everything to DDS is too much work for me.

Hmmm...This is like comparing apples to oranges....I have been using OpenGL for over a year, and STILL managed to see significant RAM savings after using DDS...

And yeah, the whole DDS thing takes maybe a dozen mouse clicks?...Thats only like a minute's worth of surfing p0rn ...........NOT that I would ever DO that!!....lol

Edited March 17, 2015 by Stone Blue

[NathanKell]

We're talking about addons? Why goodness me, there's a forum for that!

Moved.

[sarbian]

I was wondering how I missed that thread yesterday.

DDS with ATM config present. This is how you save the most.

[Van Disaster]

Please let me know if I have this wrong, but, IIRC, there are mods that dont seem to work well with DDS textures (hence the exception list in the converter), yet you can use ATM with...??

KSP converts everything to DDS internally anyway - what the preconverters can do is 1) make it so that KSP doesn't have to do this every game load which makes loading massively faster, and 2) resize textures before conversion so they're converted efficiently/are resized if you're running some of the aggressive settings.

[rkman]

Using DDS instead of whatever else KSP/Unity can use is one of the things that Squad could have done a long time ago - without having to worry how it would impact development of the game. Imagine how much time would have been saved on loading the game.

[sarbian]

As I explained in the DDSLoader thread a long time ago the call I use to load DDS (Texture2D.LoadRawTextureData) was an undocumented (and so unsupported) feature of Unity when I wrote it. Using an undocumented feature is a bet on the future and if it is removed you are left in the cold. Squad not using it makes perfect sense to me.

That call is now in the Unity 5 documentation, so that would make it safer to use. But it is their game and their call.

[NathanKell]

And as the Dev Notes state, Mike wrote a DDS loader and KSP's textures have been moved to DDS, making things much faster (and lowering leaks/bugs from png/tga loading).

[jrodriguez]

And as the Dev Notes state, Mike wrote a DDS loader and KSP's textures have been moved to DDS, making things much faster (and lowering leaks/bugs from png/tga loading).

Nice. So can we assume that DDS is going to be a standard and recommended format for KSP textures?

After reading all the posts of this thread I have spent 2 hours converting my entire Gamedata folder with 32 mods to DDS and leaving some NRM due to issues trying to convert them for ATM + using OpenGL.

And I have to say that the result is quite amazing, my KSP with 32mods (RSS is one of them of course) is using something close to my KSP Stock!