The Elcano Challenge : Ground-based circumnavigation

[smjjames]

Yes please. With the exception of heat, use the parts as intended.

Okay. I'll fix that back as soon as I finish this periapsis change burn. Will post progress info soon.

Launch of the craft, this is actually the second launch because I screwed up with the fairing the first time. Also, those are 20m tweakscaled first stage boosters and stage section, THAT massive. Also excrutiatingly slow to turn after I get into orbit, so I didn't record that.

I also didn't realize how wobbly the whole thing was until I watched it in movie maker.

The darker screenshots came out worse than I thought they might.

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Edited August 29, 2015 by smjjames

[ComradeWolfe]

Question on scoring/mod notation... I'm working on a Kerbin circumnavigation with stock parts and only eye-candy mods. My vehicle's design would greatly benefit from the use of mechjeb or kOS, but I did not include either because I wasn't sure if these would count as mods for credit-purposes.

Right now I'm too far in to my run to add them, but for future planets will mechjeb or kOS mean being listed as having mods? Also, I assume those visual mods (clouds, planet-shine, etc) don't count against being listed as stock. Is this correct?

Edit: Also, will ScanSAT BTDT count as a mod if used for tracking? Otherwise, what's the best way to track mariners?

Edited August 29, 2015 by ComradeWolfe
Extra Q.

[smjjames]

Question on scoring/mod notation... I'm working on a Kerbin circumnavigation with stock parts and only eye-candy mods. My vehicle's design would greatly benefit from the use of mechjeb or kOS, but I did not include either because I wasn't sure if these would count as mods for credit-purposes.

Right now I'm too far in to my run to add them, but for future planets will mechjeb or kOS mean being listed as having mods? Also, I assume those visual mods (clouds, planet-shine, etc) don't count against being listed as stock. Is this correct?

Edit: Also, will ScanSAT BTDT count as a mod if used for tracking? Otherwise, what's the best way to track mariners?

He said in the first post that BTDT is fine for tracking, I'm using that for my Laythe circumnavigation craft.

Anyways, I've decided to go circumpolar since half of the equatorial route is wide open ocean, which makes it seem rather easy, and the other person who did Laythe went equatorial anyway. I am also going to let the RNG decide which direction I go in from the poles (besides north or south, I mean which longitude direction).

Edited August 29, 2015 by smjjames

[Claw]

Okay,

Here is my entry for Master Mariner Circumnavigator, and I suppose Laythe as well.

The crew, Julella and Obemy, were on another adventure... But they are my Elcano crew, so I scooped them up and sent them off to Jool. This trip reused the Cockroach (from my Kerbin circumnavigation) with no changes to the baseline boat itself. I did add some fuel, engines, and chutes for launch, interplanetary travel, and Laythe landing. All of those bits were jettisoned at key points in the trip, before the circumnavigation began.

To keep the part counts down and craft sizes manageable, main elements were sent up separately. La Cucaracha needed to be refueled once established in LKO, and used a powered direct entry into Laythe (for fuel/size considerations). A crew recovery ship was sent on a bit slower path and arrived during one of La Cucaracha's refueling stops.

Enjoy!

(Oh, I forgot...It's all stock.)

Cheers,

~Claw

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Edited August 31, 2015 by Claw

[damerell]

(Oh, I forgot...It's all stock.)

Coo, nice one. Rather you than me. :-)

[Fengist]

Question on scoring/mod notation... I'm working on a Kerbin circumnavigation with stock parts and only eye-candy mods. My vehicle's design would greatly benefit from the use of mechjeb or kOS, but I did not include either because I wasn't sure if these would count as mods for credit-purposes.

Right now I'm too far in to my run to add them, but for future planets will mechjeb or kOS mean being listed as having mods? Also, I assume those visual mods (clouds, planet-shine, etc) don't count against being listed as stock. Is this correct?

Edit: Also, will ScanSAT BTDT count as a mod if used for tracking? Otherwise, what's the best way to track mariners?

There are over 1,000 mods that I'm aware of. If we get into splitting hairs about which mod is and which mod isn't valid for stock, this thread would become very boring. Therefore: Stock is stock and a mod is a mod. Sorry.

- - - Updated - - -

Okay,

Here is my entry for Master Mariner Circumnavigator, and I suppose Laythe as well.

The crew, Julella and Obemy, were on another adventure... But they are my Elcano crew, so I scooped them up and sent them off to Jool. This trip reused the Cockroach (from my Kerbin circumnavigation) with no changes to the baseline boat itself. I did add some fuel, engines, and chutes for launch, interplanetary travel, and Laythe landing. All of those bits were jettisoned at key points in the trip, before the circumnavigation began.

To keep the part counts down and craft sizes manageable, main elements were sent up separately. La Cucaracha needed to be refueled once established in LKO, and used a powered direct entry into Laythe (for fuel/size considerations). A crew recovery ship was sent on a bit slower path and arrived during one of La Cucaracha's refueling stops.

Enjoy!

(Oh, I forgot...It's all stock.)

Cheers,

~Claw

http://i.imgur.com/6mvmbzH.jpg

http://imgur.com/a/p1KRp

Congratulations, Claw! You are now the first that I'm aware of to circumnavigate not one, but two orbital bodies. If we had another water planet, I'd send you off in that direction. Does this mean you're going to try ground circumnavigations next?

Feel free to grab the badge if you wish and I'll attempt to update the board later today.

[ComradeWolfe]

There are over 1,000 mods that I'm aware of. If we get into splitting hairs about which mod is and which mod isn't valid for stock, this thread would become very boring. Therefore: Stock is stock and a mod is a mod. Sorry.

I was simply trying to double-check where the line was drawn before attempting the use of MJ or kOS.

My confusion comes from the entries that used MJ but were still "stock" (Hotaru's Mun entry, John Deaux's minmus entry). In both cases, they used autopilot mods that didn't meaningfully change the vehicle (they were still in the 'spirit' of a stock vehicle, as it were).

I had hoped for more of a wishy-washy-wavy "if it doesn't really change your vehicle physically and just automates the driving, it's stock enough" type of rule. Sort of like your stance on what constitutes cheating.

That said, this challenge is supposed to be difficult for the players, not the judge -- if it's easier for you, then I'm alright with grandfathering the status of old entries and adhering to a simple "mods are mods" boundary going forward.

Also, please don't be sorry. Text has that horrid ability to make everyone sound either upset, argumentative, or offended. Quite to the contrary, I think this is an awesome challenge and can't wait to submit an entry in the coming days.

[smjjames]

Hey Fengist, I'm going to make my own mission report thread for the Laythe attempt.

Also, my first launch after a redesign got absolutely speared by the warping launchclamp glitch......

Edit: My mission report thread: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/133084-The-Elcano-Challenge-Laythe-Circumpolar?p=2171062#post2171062

Edited August 31, 2015 by smjjames

[nigelvn]

Little sneak preview!

I am unfortunately very busy, so it will take me maby up untill after the 1.1 release. I'll keep a 1.0.4 copy and the save file to finish it though.

Edited August 31, 2015 by nigelvn

[Fengist]

http://i.imgur.com/m7z3KlI.jpg

Little sneak preview!

I am unfortunately very busy, so it will take me maby up untill after the 1.1 release. I'll keep a 1.0.4 copy and the save file to finish it though.

That's one way to get a boat into orbit. Don't plan on anything for 1.5 that'll break boats.

[KN_Namida]

Busy here too, unfortunately.. and I'll be busy for a few days. Maybe even 2 weeks or so..

Should I wait for 1.1? I heard rover (or rather, wheel) physics will be tweaked and improved. Hehe, Squad you're tempting me. We'll see. I'll plan my route in the meantime though.

[smjjames]

Busy here too, unfortunately.. and I'll be busy for a few days. Maybe even 2 weeks or so..

Should I wait for 1.1? I heard rover (or rather, wheel) physics will be tweaked and improved. Hehe, Squad you're tempting me. We'll see. I'll plan my route in the meantime though.

Depends on where you're going. If you're going for Laythe (I didn't see a way to land that craft though), sure, go for it. I had actually been thinking of doing a Kerbin circumnavigation origionally, but I decided that since 1.1 or 1.0.5 (whichever version is bringing the new wheel physics and Unity5 and other stuff) is coming out soonish, I decided to hold off on that since I don't know how long the Kerbin circumnavigation would take.

[KN_Namida]

Depends on where you're going.

Nah, just Minmus. I'm starting easy, you might say, hehe. But still

[smjjames]

Nah, just Minmus. I'm starting easy, you might say, hehe. But still

I don't think Minmus would take all that long.

Before I decided to do Kerbin and then Laythe, I was trying to get a rover to work on Pol, but I couldn't get it to not flip end over end or work very well, it was worse than Minmus.

Edited September 1, 2015 by smjjames

[Claw]

Congratulations, Claw! You are now the first that I'm aware of to circumnavigate not one, but two orbital bodies. If we had another water planet, I'd send you off in that direction. Does this mean you're going to try ground circumnavigations next?

Thanks! And lets say I have some plans. My Laythe post says that Julella and Obemy are my Elcano crew, and that they were on another mission...

(Also, picture assembly is a pain.)

Feel free to grab the badge if you wish and I'll attempt to update the board later today.

Thank you very much, good sir.

Cheers,

~Claw

[smjjames]

Please forgive me for giving in and needing to use the 'ignore max temp' cheat so I can do phys warp because this engine is so damn slow XD Took me ALL FREAKING DAY yesterday just to circularize down my orbit at Jool.

I'll only use that cheat while changing inclination since further changing the orbit and circularizing requires a bit more finesse.

Edited September 1, 2015 by smjjames

[Fengist]

I was simply trying to double-check where the line was drawn before attempting the use of MJ or kOS.

My confusion comes from the entries that used MJ but were still "stock" (Hotaru's Mun entry, John Deaux's minmus entry). In both cases, they used autopilot mods that didn't meaningfully change the vehicle (they were still in the 'spirit' of a stock vehicle, as it were).

I had hoped for more of a wishy-washy-wavy "if it doesn't really change your vehicle physically and just automates the driving, it's stock enough" type of rule. Sort of like your stance on what constitutes cheating.

That said, this challenge is supposed to be difficult for the players, not the judge -- if it's easier for you, then I'm alright with grandfathering the status of old entries and adhering to a simple "mods are mods" boundary going forward.

Also, please don't be sorry. Text has that horrid ability to make everyone sound either upset, argumentative, or offended. Quite to the contrary, I think this is an awesome challenge and can't wait to submit an entry in the coming days.

Normally, when I look at the images of a circumnavigation I'm looking at the parts and tend to ignore the interface. So, if MJ or KE or any other such non-part or non-physics changing mod is used, I'll normally ignore it. If I listed them as stock but they used such mods, it's more of an oversight on my part but not a hard and fast rule. If you say your vessel is stock and you want to be listed as stock, it really doesn't matter to me. The classification to me is secondary to the completion.

- - - Updated - - -

Depends on where you're going. If you're going for Laythe (I didn't see a way to land that craft though), sure, go for it. I had actually been thinking of doing a Kerbin circumnavigation origionally, but I decided that since 1.1 or 1.0.5 (whichever version is bringing the new wheel physics and Unity5 and other stuff) is coming out soonish, I decided to hold off on that since I don't know how long the Kerbin circumnavigation would take.

Here's my theory on 1.1.

There are still mods out there that are busted as a result of the .90 changes to the way connection nodes work. There are plenty of mods out there that haven't even been updated for 1.0.4. If you're waiting for 1.1 and you plan on using wheels from mods, don't expect them to work for some time till the mod creators get around to fixing them.

- - - Updated - - -

Thank you very much, good sir.

Cheers,

~Claw

Thank you and glad you've enjoyed this so far. OP updated.

- - - Updated - - -

Please forgive me for giving in and needing to use the 'ignore max temp' cheat so I can do phys warp because this engine is so damn slow XD Took me ALL FREAKING DAY yesterday just to circularize down my orbit at Jool.

I'll only use that cheat while changing inclination since further changing the orbit and circularizing requires a bit more finesse.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v214/smjjames/Laythe%20circumnavigation_screenshot_2015-09-01--08-03-32_zpssqqgsvdk.png

Like most concerns about rules, I'll let you decide what's 'cheating' and what isn't. If you're happy, I'm happy.

[smjjames]

The KSS Airwhale has now landed!

Actually the second landing because I F9'd when I realized that I was accidentially travelling in a circle, but forgot that I didn't F5 after landing.

Edit: New imgur album up on my mission report thread.

Edited September 2, 2015 by smjjames

[Claw]

Normally, when I look at the images of a circumnavigation I'm looking at the parts and tend to ignore the interface. So, if MJ or KE or any other such non-part or non-physics changing mod is used, I'll normally ignore it. If I listed them as stock but they used such mods, it's more of an oversight on my part but not a hard and fast rule. If you say your vessel is stock and you want to be listed as stock, it really doesn't matter to me. The classification to me is secondary to the completion.

On this subject, I had bugged Fengist previously about using my own StockBugFixes in conjunction with this challenge. He successfully convinced me that the only real way about it is "stock is stock, and if you add things to the GameData folder or fiddle with the physics settings, it's not pure stock anymore." There are simply too many add-ons to keep up with.

While I definitely find it frustrating watching my kerbals ragdoll in their seats, and my wheels to break if I click on them, I have also come to agree with Fengist that there's really no way to keep a list of mods that are "okay to qualify as stock." As such, I even uninstalled my own add-ons for this challenge. Although I'm a nearly all stock player to begin with, so I suppose I don't feel like I'm missing much.

I know he's trying to be generous and let people have their fun, but personally I agree that if you want that coveted Stock title, it comes with a certain level of pain. (Believe me...I forgot how often kerbals ragdoll while in seats, even in a boat on the water...)

Just my personal two cents, but this is Fengist's challenge so he's definitely the king on this subject for Elcano.

Cheers,

-Claw

- - - Updated - - -

The KSS Airwhale has now landed!

Nice job. That looks pretty sweet (I've not built an airship like that before). Looking forward to seeing your journey.

[ComradeWolfe]

Normally, when I look at the images of a circumnavigation I'm looking at the parts and tend to ignore the interface. So, if MJ or KE or any other such non-part or non-physics changing mod is used, I'll normally ignore it. If I listed them as stock but they used such mods, it's more of an oversight on my part but not a hard and fast rule. If you say your vessel is stock and you want to be listed as stock, it really doesn't matter to me. The classification to me is secondary to the completion.

This makes my day. Thank you.

[nigelvn]

Sneak preview 2! Also on Laythe, using Fengist's beautiful Maritime Pack!

Everything should be ready, time to make some progress

[smjjames]

Currently doing a long crossing through open ocean, it'll be some time before I hit land.

[Claw]

Good luck to both of you!

---

Fengist,

Any chance of also listing me in the Laythe category? Or will I need to do it again?

Thanks,

-Claw

Edited September 3, 2015 by Claw

[smjjames]

Okay, long story short, glitches, sheneinighans, explosions, unfixable roll caused by I don't know what, ship exploded near the equator, I got two kerbals out, but then glitches hit and the cockpit that the kerbal was in exploded, so............

Back to square one or something. Maybe I'll go equatorial this time.

You can read the whole conversation and posts over on the Maritime pack thread.

Edit: Is it okay if it's a somewhat radical redesign? I'm going to try and get pontoons on there though, and some other changes perhaps.

Edited September 3, 2015 by smjjames

[Hagen von Tronje]

The final leg of my Kerbin Elcano is up, completing my circumnavigation of the home planet!

I'm already making preparations for Duna, and Eve to follow. Duna will be a pretty nice base and a whole new rover design, and Eve is going to be something special I have cooked up.

Fengist,

Kerbin completed, just getting your attention.