Any engine as RCS

[Feradose]

As my landers got bigger and turning them got harder I started adding LFO engines pointing sideways to help turn/translate, but it gets really tiring and confusing after you roll a bit and I end up exploding all over the place. Is there a mod that when I activate RCS, detects engines giving thrust sideways and uses the engines properly to change attitude/translate? Also, is this even possible?

[entaran]

There's vernier engines in the control section. They act like LFO fuelled RCS engines and work with RCS controls. Good luck!

[Feradose]

I know they are there but.. I find them too small, too inefficient and too weak. I use Lv-909 mostly.

Maybe a better vernier engine that is bigger, heavier and much more efficient with more power? Can I copy the rcs part of cfg file of vernier engine and add them to engines I like?

---and if it could keep the gimbal for CoM/T offsetting as the fuel runs dry

[Mighty1]

You could try with this mod if you want complicated or this if you prefer to keep it simple.

[Feradose]

These mods look really nice for stabilizing offcenter thrust and changing orientation, but do they translate the vehicle?

(Downloaded anyway because major life saver for launching space stations for dres)

[Haze-Zero]

You can copy the cfg file of the verniers and make more powerful verniers, and personally I would scale them up in size just to make them appear different. Though, the single thruster RCS ports look better than the verniers imo and they too could be scaled up in size and the cfg edited to do the same as or better than the verniers. You could easily make them match the 909 in performance.

[Feradose]

Yeah Im no good at cfgs but it sounds fairly easy. How can one balance it so it matches 909's performance better? Having a 0.03t 120kN vernier sounds OP in my opinion.. Balancing is hard stuff

---Also which size would be okay for such an engine?

[Mighty1]

For translation just pitch the craft. When using TCA it will keep your hight by balancing engine trust. If you want to stop just click on "stop horizontal movement" and it will automaticly pitch in the oposite direction to stop.

[Feradose]

Thats the problem, the reason I needed this is because some of my crafts are so heavy and big, they dont want to rotate. I know I can rotate them better now, but, during landing, all rotation is in vain when I pick up some horizontal speed because of my horrible piloting skills and slope detecting skills.

Oh also the fearsome burden of necessary orbital construction and docking..

Edited June 8, 2015 by Feradose

[hab136]

Check out Throttle Controlled Avionics

Though I suspect you're just covering over a design problem

[TheKurgan]

I apologize for digging up an old topic, but my search showed this topic, and I have a very similar question as the author.

Can you change the .cfg of an engine to make it act as an RCS thruster?

I tried taking the cfg from the vernier engine, modifying it and dumping it in the place of the cfg file for a small liquid fuel/oxidizer engine, and it didn't work...

I did change the name, the mesh = Vernier_Engine.mu to point to the correct .mu file of the donor engine, and the thruster power.

am I missing something critical? is there something in the .mu file that prevents what I am trying to do?

Edited November 11, 2016 by TheKurgan

[Mecripp]

Thought the transform was set different in unity might try and take a look what engine are you trying with ?

 

EDIT- looking at it looks like just the transform in unity one is set RCSthruster where engines are thrustTransform

Edited November 11, 2016 by Mecripp2

[TheKurgan]

Right now I'm trying to get it to work on an engine from a mod (for personal use only of course) 

The engine is the subengine_3x from the mod T.G.O.L

https://spacedock.info/mod/668/ Radial Engine for spacecraft - T.G.O.L group

[Mecripp]

5 minutes ago, TheKurgan said:

Right now I'm trying to get it to work on an engine from a mod (for personal use only of course) 

The engine is the subengine_3x from the mod T.G.O.L

https://spacedock.info/mod/668/ Radial Engine for spacecraft - T.G.O.L group

Will take a look and PM you

[TheKurgan]

That is awesome, thank you very much!!

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

@MeCripp The big problem you'll have here is that the RCS transform and the thrustTransform point in completely different directions,  RCS has plus Y pointing in the direction of thrust and thrustTransform has plus Z pointing in direction of thrust, you may be able to tweak it via an offset in the cfg but I'm not aware of one that will do what you need.

[Mecripp]

15 minutes ago, SpannerMonkey(smce) said:

@MeCripp The big problem you'll have here is that the RCS transform and the thrustTransform point in completely different directions,  RCS has plus Y pointing in the direction of thrust and thrustTransform has plus Z pointing in direction of thrust, you may be able to tweak it via an offset in the cfg but I'm not aware of one that will do what you need.

looking at vernorEngine and a engine there the same ?

[Tyko]

@TheKurgan you may have an easier time scaling up an RCS or Vernier engine than adding RCS capabilities to a standard engine. Since the little RCS is already coded as an RCS, all you have to do is mess with the mass, thrust and fuel consumption, then scale up the model to the a size that looks right.

When I'm modifying parts I tend to keep the Square-Cube rule in mind - all things being equal, if you double the size you'll cube the mass.

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

14 minutes ago, MeCripp said:

looking at vernorEngine and a engine there the same ?

That i don't know, though I'd say not,  granted the vernor uses rocket fuel, but by the same token an engine can be powered by dust if it has a mass that can be calculated,   and by looking  at an exported version you can't really tell as the transforms end up being rotated incorrectly.  That though is a matter of minutes to test if you know the names of the transforms in the model, just swap a normal small engine cfg onto a  vernor , if they are the same transform rotation the engine will work, if they aren't it won't

[TheKurgan]

I was thinking along these lines too, but I am just beginning to learn the advanced config stuff... the Vernor has this line in the cfg under MODEL_MULTI_PARTICLE

localRotation = -90, 0, 0

and I have no idea what it means.   

[Mecripp]

1 hour ago, SpannerMonkey(smce) said:

@MeCripp The big problem you'll have here is that the RCS transform and the thrustTransform point in completely different directions,  RCS has plus Y pointing in the direction of thrust and thrustTransform has plus Z pointing in direction of thrust, you may be able to tweak it via an offset in the cfg but I'm not aware of one that will do what you need.

Well it did turn out alittle easier then i thought it would be has you and TheKurgan pointed out just had to rename the TransformName and change the MODULE in the cfg and the localRotation = 0, 0, 0  and worked

 

[Gotmachine]

You're on the right track, but changing the "localRotation" only affects the plume FX, not the thrust vector. If you do this, the RCS block plume effect will appear in the right direction, but in reality, the thrust will still be rotated by 90° (you can check that using the RCS Build Aid mod). The problem in RCS modules is that they use the Y axis of the thrust transform, while engines use the Z axis. Fortunately, there a setting for that. The steps to convert an engine to a RCS thruster are :

• In the old engine CFG, find the line "thrustVectorTransformName = name"
• In the new CFG, add this ModuleRCSFX (note the "useZaxis = true" line) :

	MODULE
	{
		name = ModuleRCSFX
		stagingEnabled = False
		thrusterTransformName = thrustTransform // Change this to the "thrustVectorTransformName" of the engine.
		useZaxis = True // This line is mandatory so the thrust direction is the Z axis, because engines transform use this setting.
		thrusterPower = 12 // The thrust of the RCS block in kN
		resourceName = LiquidFuel
		resourceFlowMode = STAGE_PRIORITY_FLOW
		runningEffectName = running
		PROPELLANT
		{
			name = LiquidFuel
			ratio = 0.9
			DrawGauge = True
			resourceFlowMode = STAGE_PRIORITY_FLOW
		}
		PROPELLANT
		{
			name = Oxidizer
			ratio = 1.1
			resourceFlowMode = STAGE_PRIORITY_FLOW
		}
		atmosphereCurve
		{
			key = 0 320 // Vacuum ISP
			key = 1 220 // Atmospheric ISP
			key = 5 0.001
		}
	}

• If the engine already has a EFFECTS { running{} } section, you can copypaste it (delete any other nodes than "running").
• If it use the old FX system (if you things like "fx_smokeTrail_light = 0, -0.75, 0, 0, -1.0, 0.0, running" in the part definition, you should delete those and you can use this EFFECTS section (remember to change the transformName ) :

	EFFECTS
	{
		running
		{
			AUDIO
			{
				channel = Ship
				clip = sound_rocket_mini
				volume = 0.0 0.0
				volume = 0.1 0.0
				volume = 0.5 0.05
				volume = 1.0 0.5
				pitch = 0.0 0.5
				pitch = 1.0 1.0
				loop = true
			}
			MODEL_MULTI_PARTICLE
			{
				modelName = Squad/FX/Monoprop_medium // same effect as the Vernor engine. You can use "Squad/FX/Monoprop_big" for a larger plume.
				transformName = thrustTransform // Change this to the thrustVectorTransformName of the engine
				emission = 0.0 0.0
				emission = 0.1 0.0
				emission = 1.0 1.0
				speed = 0.0 0.8
				speed = 1.0 1.0
				localRotation = 0, 0, 0
				localPosition = 0, 0, 0 // you can use this to offset the plume effect, if it appears far away or inside the part (example 0, 0, -0.5 will move the effect toward the part)
			}
		}		
	}

• Delete any other module, like ModuleSurfaceFX, ModuleGimbal or ModuleAnimateHeat

This is an example of a converted engine (from the NovaPunch mod) :

Original CFG :

Spoiler

PART
{

// --- general parameters ---
name = NP_aux_radialvernier
module = Part
author = Sunday Punch (converted by Tiberion)

// --- asset parameters ---
mesh = model.mu
scale = 1

// --- node definitions ---
// definition format is Position X, Position Y, Position Z, Up X, Up Y, Up Z
node_attach = 0.0, 0.0, -0.07, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0

// --- FX definitions ---
fx_smokeTrail_light = 0, -0.75, 0, 0, -1.0, 0.0, running
fx_exhaustlight_blue = 0, -0.75, 0, 0, 0.0, -1.0, running
fx_exhaustFlame_blue_small = 0, -0.75, 0, 0, -1.0, 0.0, running

// --- Sound FX definition ---

sound_vent_medium = engage
sound_rocket_hard = running
sound_vent_soft = deactivate

// --- editor parameters ---
TechRequired = specializedControl
entryCost = 4000
cost = 234
category = 1
subcategory = 0
title = SAS-2 vernier pod
manufacturer = Wobbly Rockets
description = A self contained attitude stabilisation pod, ready to be welded to any available surface on your rocket.

// attachment rules: stack, srfAttach, allowStack, allowSrfAttach, allowCollision
attachRules = 0,1,0,0,0

// --- standard part parameters ---
mass = 0.2
dragModelType = default
maximum_drag = 0.2
minimum_drag = 0.1
angularDrag = 2
crashTolerance = 45
breakingForce = 1000
breakingTorque = 1000
maxTemp = 2000
bulkheadProfiles = srf
stagingIcon = LIQUID_ENGINE
 
MODULE
{
    name = ModuleEngines
    thrustVectorTransformName = thrustTransform
    exhaustDamage = True
    ignitionThreshold = 0.1
    minThrust = 0
    maxThrust = 33
    heatProduction = 50
    fxOffset = 0, 0, 0.15
    PROPELLANT
    {
        name = LiquidFuel
                   ratio = 0.9
        DrawGauge = True
    }
    PROPELLANT
    {
        name = Oxidizer
        ratio = 1.1
    }
    atmosphereCurve
     {
        key = 0 289
     key = 0.8 256
       key = 1 224
     key = 8 0.001
     }
    
}
MODULE
{
    name = ModuleSurfaceFX
    thrustProviderModuleIndex = 0
    fxMax = 0.5
    maxDistance = 30
    falloff = 1.5
    thrustTransformName = thrustTransform
}

MODULE
{
    name = ModuleGimbal
    gimbalTransformName = thrustTransform
    gimbalRange = 2.0
}

MODULE
{
      name = ModuleAnimateHeat
      ThermalAnim = EmissiveAnimation
}

MODULE
{
    name = ModuleTestSubject
    
    // nowhere: 0, srf: 1, ocean: 2, atmo: 4, space: 8
    environments = 15
    
    useStaging = True
    useEvent = False
}

}

RCS CFG :

Spoiler

PART
{

// --- general parameters ---
name = NP_aux_radialvernier
module = Part
author = Sunday Punch (converted by Tiberion)

// --- asset parameters ---
MODEL
{
    model = StockExtendedPack/Parts/RCS/Novapunch_Models/model
}
scale = 1

// --- node definitions ---
// definition format is Position X, Position Y, Position Z, Up X, Up Y, Up Z
node_attach = 0.0, 0.0, -0.07, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0

//--- FX definitions ---
// fx_smokeTrail_light = 0, -0.75, 0, 0, -1.0, 0.0, running
// fx_exhaustlight_blue = 0, -0.75, 0, 0, 0.0, -1.0, running
// fx_exhaustFlame_blue_small = 0, -0.75, 0, 0, -1.0, 0.0, running

//--- Sound FX definition ---
// sound_vent_medium = engage
// sound_rocket_hard = running
// sound_vent_soft = deactivate

// --- editor parameters ---
TechRequired = specializedControl
entryCost = 12500
cost = 1950
category = Control
subcategory = 0
title = R-D HLR-24 RCS Thruster
manufacturer = Kerbodyne
description = A self contained attitude stabilisation pod, ready to be welded to any available surface on your rocket.

// attachment rules: stack, srfAttach, allowStack, allowSrfAttach, allowCollision
attachRules = 0,1,0,0,0

// --- standard part parameters ---
mass = 0.15
dragModelType = default
maximum_drag = 0.2
minimum_drag = 0.1
angularDrag = 2
crashTolerance = 45
breakingForce = 1000
breakingTorque = 1000
maxTemp = 2000
bulkheadProfiles = srf

fuelCrossFeed = True
 
    MODULE
    {
        name = ModuleRCSFX
        stagingEnabled = False
        thrusterTransformName = thrustTransform
        useZaxis = True
        thrusterPower = 24
        resourceName = LiquidFuel
        resourceFlowMode = STAGE_PRIORITY_FLOW
        runningEffectName = running
        PROPELLANT
        {
            name = LiquidFuel
            ratio = 0.9
            DrawGauge = True
            resourceFlowMode = STAGE_PRIORITY_FLOW
        }
        PROPELLANT
        {
            name = Oxidizer
            ratio = 1.1
            resourceFlowMode = STAGE_PRIORITY_FLOW
        }
        atmosphereCurve
        {
            key = 0 300
            key = 1 220
            key = 5 0.001
        }
    }
    
    EFFECTS
    {
        running
        {
            AUDIO
            {
                channel = Ship
                clip = sound_rocket_mini
                volume = 0.0 0.0
                volume = 0.1 0.0
                volume = 0.5 0.05
                volume = 1.0 0.5
                pitch = 0.0 0.5
                pitch = 1.0 1.0
                loop = true
            }
            MODEL_MULTI_PARTICLE
            {
                modelName = Squad/FX/Monoprop_medium
                transformName = thrustTransform
                emission = 0.0 0.0
                emission = 0.1 0.0
                emission = 1.0 1.0
                speed = 0.0 0.8
                speed = 1.0 1.0
                localRotation = 0, 0, 0
                localPosition = 0, 0, 0.2
            }
        }        
    }

 

Edited November 14, 2016 by Gotmachine