Van Disaster Posted September 28, 2015 Share Posted September 28, 2015 Yeah, a lot of this seems to be catering to the AI more than laws of flight - mine seems to love just trying to run away by flying in circles despite it being able to pull until the plane is about to break up.Not sure why it thought this was a good plan either: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceplaneAddict Posted September 28, 2015 Share Posted September 28, 2015 Ahem, umm, Wanderfound, you know, your MiK-4 was real good. As in, with fine tuning, it might've out-done the MiK-6. Oh well, with design tips borrowed from the MiK-4, I shall design a new fighter, the K-1E, short for Kerbal-1Engine. More details soon, design is largely based on the MiK-4.Words have been repeated in this post. A lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnavox Posted September 28, 2015 Share Posted September 28, 2015 A scissors requires that both pilots know what they are doing and the advantages of doing it. I don't think the AI has that capability yet. From my test flights against the K-35 and the Skua, they seem to fall into a natural weaving, but I'm not sure I'd call it a scissors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceplaneAddict Posted September 28, 2015 Share Posted September 28, 2015 A little update on the K-1E. Design working well, over high speed at least. Low speed tuning in the works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doke Posted September 28, 2015 Share Posted September 28, 2015 A scissors requires that both pilots know what they are doing and the advantages of doing it. I don't think the AI has that capability yet. From my test flights against the K-35 and the Skua, they seem to fall into a natural weaving, but I'm not sure I'd call it a scissors.Fair enough. It's interesting that they do use brakes in certain situations, though. The first time I saw a plane force an overshoot via brakes and weaving, then go for a kill, I have to say I was impressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceplaneAddict Posted September 28, 2015 Share Posted September 28, 2015 Hey Doke, got any tips for low-speed manueverability? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sashan Posted September 28, 2015 Share Posted September 28, 2015 Steer damping is maxed - problem is it'll pull until it stalls, and then fly in small circles at 30m/s. Only way to get it to keep speed up is to turn the steer factor down to about 2, and then it wants to fly over the horizon . Ideally I'd like to link steer factor to airspeed...Baha once said he'll eventually add AoA limeter, which-ll do exactly that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van Disaster Posted September 28, 2015 Share Posted September 28, 2015 (edited) Wanderfound: do you think you could put your savegame for the current champion up? and the order you start the competitors.Also: flying at full throttle with the airbrakes out fully, not taking any avoiding action while being shot, is this something I just have to live with? Edited September 29, 2015 by Van Disaster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanderfound Posted September 29, 2015 Author Share Posted September 29, 2015 Wanderfound: do you think you could put your savegame for the current champion up? and the order you start the competitors.There's always a link to the current champion in the first post. The ships always start facing in opposite directions, as close to simultaneous as I can make them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doke Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Hey Doke, got any tips for low-speed manueverability?Hmm. Maybe moar wing area, possibly a different aspect ratio (i.e. narrow wings, though delta-like wings are meant to be better if you want crazy AoA shenanigans). Also, leading edge slats. Give them a negative pitch setting; this will hold off stalls a bit longer in exchange for drag. I have a prototype 'Great Skua' with leading edge slats that is godly at subsonic speeds; the problem is that it loses some control authority at transonic and supersonic speeds. It seems like you can't have it all.Your K-35 seems to be pretty good at low speeds, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceplaneAddict Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Your K-35 seems to be pretty good at low speeds, though.Ye, but it fishtails. I hate that.Also, I was asking for my K-1E. Trying to find a balance of maneuverability and stability is hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnavox Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 This is the basic problem of aeronautics. a wing shape that works well at low speed doesn't perform well at high speed and vice versa. That's why variable geometry wings were created and smart materials are being worked on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van Disaster Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Hm.. 1 win, 1 loss, 1 draw ( both exploded due to over enthusiastic piloting it appears ) vs the Skua... I still can't build something to match that thing for gunnery though. Getting really sick of the autopilot making itself a sitting duck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceplaneAddict Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Give it less control authority at low pressures. Or at pressure where it stalls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van Disaster Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 (edited) It's not stalling, it's just bad piloting - several times I've seen it turn onto a *lead* heading for the opponent, make a couple of cursory attempts at avoidance once it's settled at a conveniently good gunnery range for the opponent and then sit there with the airbrakes on & full thrust and just sit in a gentle turn. I don't see what fiddling with aero is going to counteract that sort of brain freeze - even ditching airbrakes just means it throttles down instead.Rather like the way it can sometimes completely ignore incoming missiles... Edited September 29, 2015 by Van Disaster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceplaneAddict Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 I am at a loss for words. The I in BD AI needs to be strengthened. It's still an AI I guess, I'm notone to criticize it. I ain't no modder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnavox Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 The AI does sometime get caught in a hard turn it's true. but it normally breaks out of it eventually. Gunnery in terms of accurace seems to come down to controlling the pitch oscillation problem. I've played around with the .50's and found that for the weight the vulcan is better. One vulcan works just as well as 2+ as far as I can tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihtoit Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 A scissors requires that both pilots know what they are doing and the advantages of doing it. I don't think the AI has that capability yet. From my test flights against the K-35 and the Skua, they seem to fall into a natural weaving, but I'm not sure I'd call it a scissors.my Berkuts are very good at Scissors. They can even thread the needle (roll one plane between another two with not even a wing width between the two outer planes). At supersonic speed. Using the AI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceplaneAddict Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Seriously, have you tested those Berkuts with FAR? Forward swept wings are a PAIN to work with. Plus, you're using conventional elevators, a mistake I made a while back. Get some all moving ctrl surfaces and tweak it, then it might just out maneuver everything. Forward sweep may be unstable, but with tweaking, they can be extremely maneuverable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihtoit Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 I don't use FAR, too much messing around. Not that I've got much time for KSP right now. Dealing with my mum's estate is swallowing most of my waking hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceplaneAddict Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 But, but, this challenge is for FAR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihtoit Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 so many BDAI challenges I'm getting lost... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van Disaster Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 The AI does sometime get caught in a hard turn it's true. but it normally breaks out of it eventually. Gunnery in terms of accurace seems to come down to controlling the pitch oscillation problem. I've played around with the .50's and found that for the weight the vulcan is better. One vulcan works just as well as 2+ as far as I can tell.It's not even a hard turn, I wouldn't mind that much - it looks like it's trying to do three things at once and not getting any of them right, which ends up making it a gunnery target you could hardly beat if you tried to set it up. Forward sweep in current FAR is fine:- forward sweep with default wing pieces doesn't seem to work too well though, which I'm wondering if is something to do with ferram's current fiddling because that used to be fine too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceplaneAddict Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 I know right? Try Top Gun AI if ya want to stock aero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanderfound Posted September 29, 2015 Author Share Posted September 29, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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