[1.12.5] Cormorant Aeronology - Mk3 Space Shuttle

[drtedastro]

Hello to all.

Just in case any of you use ModularFuelTanks, I built a little mm config file to allow you to change what the strake and the wing contain.

Link to config file for modulemanager to add mft ability to strake and deltawing

I have tested with my setup and all seems to be working ok.

please let me know if you have any issues.

Cheers.

[_Krieger_]

2 hours ago, awfulhumanbeing said:

Great job, guys! I only have two issues:

a) It would be nice to include a cargo bay with radiators, like the real one;

b) Don't really know how to make the Buran, do I have to slap the 0-90 engines at the OMS fuel tank? Then how to make the launch stack? Are there good mods for the Energia?

AB Launchers has an excellent stockalike Energia, also, the Buran didn't use its own engines during ascent, it was mounted on the side of the Energia, the Eergia's core (The external tank looking section) had four Hydrolox engines assisted by four strap on Kerolox liquid boosters that helped during lift off. the Buran only has the 2 OMS thrusters and in some configurations a pair of jet engines to assist in the descent and landing. I hope that helps! By the way, if you use the Interstellar mod the cargo bays function as radiators.

Cheers!

Edited June 19, 2016 by _Krieger_

[Paranoid Shark]

Hi @Pak,

I love the update! Its great that we can now fill the lifting body with whatever fuel we want. However I've noticed a few little problems with some of the new parts;

• The OMS Engines both have the description from the offset one.
• The Relative wing area seems to not scale correctly. (Full length lifting body with tank is 4, just the lifting body is 1, half length is 0.75, quarter length is 0.25).
• The lines between the tiles on the nose don't quite line up with the tiles on either retextured cockpit. 

Can I make a request that the ailerons get the same treatment as the wings with the black tiles on the bottom? Maybe the wheel pods as well? To save having to have extra parts possibly you could use the texture switching code that you have used on the cockpits, or what @NecroBones uses for ColourCodedCanisters/Fuel Tanks Plus. This actually replaces the stock texture by default, and then gives you options to change it from there.

Is there any way you can also put in support for tweakscale as well? I have a couple of shuttle designs that use it to get the correct size wings.

Thanks!

[MrMeeb]

Very nice work. I hope that someday the things I try to make look half as good as yours. 

[trooperMNG]

Did you make something to OMSEngineA? Because after updating my .craft said it was missing. Anyway I reverted to the previous version, deleted the engine, redownloaded new version and added engine, so the craft is now fine.

[Pak]

5 hours ago, trooperMNG said:

Did you make something to OMSEngineA?

Fixed. An old cfg snuck in while I was moving files around. Sorry about that.

[trooperMNG]

34 minutes ago, Pak said:

Fixed. An old cfg snuck in while I was moving files around. Sorry about that.

No problem. Nice new pallet anyway! 

[G'th]

21 hours ago, Pak said:

Hey it worked out. I figured there'd be some confusion with the current wings so I'm glad there's another option within my limited capabilities. It lets me put a flag on just the left wing too.

 

Idk, I like my method better

[FlyMeToTheMinmus]

Is another mod required for the texture switching? There's no options for for switching on any of the relevent parts, and both the lifting body part and the wings are z-fighting as if both textures are in place at the same time.

Edited June 19, 2016 by FlyMeToTheMinmus

[Sgt.Shutesie]

Just now, FlyMeToTheMinmus said:

Is another mod required for the texture switching? There's no options for for switching on any of the relevent parts, and both the lifting body part and the wings are z-fighting as if both textures are in place at the same time.

You need the firespitter plugin, which should be included in the download.

[Battledamaged10]

Hello! I really love this mod, but I have 1 problem, the OMS engines. Just using the monoprop in the lifting body, nose RCS ports, OMS pods, and Mk3 cockpit, I don't have enough Delta-V to make orbit. Do I have to add my own monopropellant tanks?

Edited June 19, 2016 by Battledamaged10

[Sgt.Shutesie]

4 minutes ago, Battledamaged10 said:

Hello! I really love this mod, but I have 1 problem, the OMS engines. Just using the monoprop in the lifting body, nose RCS ports, OMS pods, and Mk3 cockpit, I don't have enough Delta-V to make orbit. Do I have to add my own monopropellant tanks?

I need a lot more info on the ship before I can diagnose the problem. What kind of launcher (energia or STS or other), ascent profile, ap & pa, etc. Some screenshots would be nice as well.

[TimothyC]

6 minutes ago, Battledamaged10 said:

Hello! I really love this mod, but I have 1 problem, the OMS engines. Just using the monoprop in the lifting body, nose RCS ports, OMS pods, and Mk3 cockpit, I don't have enough Delta-V to make orbit. Do I have to add my own monopropellant tanks?

What you need to do is fly a trajectory that is dramatically flatter than most people do in KSP. You want to have Main Engine Cut Off (MECO) with your PE already above the ground. This will reduce the deltaV needed for the circularization burn. Remember, the OMS on the real shuttle only had a deltaV of about 300m/s - and that was also needed for reentry.

[Battledamaged10]

Just now, TimothyC said:

What you need to do is fly a trajectory that is dramatically flatter than most people do in KSP. You want to have Main Engine Cut Off (MECO) with your PE already above the ground. This will reduce the deltaV needed for the circularization burn. Remember, the OMS on the real shuttle only had a deltaV of about 300m/s - and that was also needed for reentry.

I don't build shuttles very often, so I'm not used to flying flat. I'll try it though

[G'th]

11 hours ago, Battledamaged10 said:

I don't build shuttles very often, so I'm not used to flying flat. I'll try it though

Presuming your launcher is decent enough, the best trajectory I've found for a Shuttle-like stack is as follows. This is also presuming FAR and the procedure starts from lift-off. I'm also going to edit in an Imgur album of my Shuttles launch profile once I get done walking the dog.

1. Fly straight up until ~60-75m/s, depending on TWR. On the higher end, from 1.4 to 2.0, go for 60m/s. On the lower end, from 1.2 to 1.39 go for 75m/s. During this phase, roll your craft as you need to get both in the belly up position and in position to fly into your desired inclination. Depending on the launcher, you may also want to use this phase to correct your pitch. Most shuttles have a tendency to pitch in some direction (as its really hard to zero out your torque, and the stock engine gimbals don't always correct for it fast enough, even if their started before your boosters), so make sure you pitch accordingly to keep your velocity vector on top of the NavBall.  With my shuttle, even though the Main Engines are also my boosters, my auto-pitch is a result of the (only slightly. KER gives an offset of 0.049 in negative pitch, which is enough to push the shuttle backwards a bit. Its also kind of nice though because this neg-pitch also helps with stabilizing the stack as then its able to fight the stacks tendency to pitch the other way) off-balance thrust and the weaker gimbals in the engines.

2. Then, begin pitching over. With my shuttle, I'm actually able to just pitch over a bit and then lock SAS to prograde, and that will work up to about 7-10km up (where the air starts to thin so my stack isn't pitching over on its own anymore). On yours, you may have to go manual more. Best pitch over process is to hit 45* at ~10km, and then continue pitching to about 20-15* after that and hold that position until you hit your desired apoapsis. If you fly the trajectory just right, your MECO (or in my shuttles case, booster ejection), which should be happening once your periapsis hits ~30-40km, should also occur just as you're hitting your max/desired apoapsis.  

But, as most of the time you aren't going to be packing the max payload of your shuttle, you'll typically have to go about this the KSP way, with MECO 1, Main Engine Reignition, and then MECO2. IE, once you hit your desired apoapsis, MECO, then coast until apo, then MER until periapsis hits the 30/40km region, then MECO 2. In my experience, the difference between doing this and flying the optimal trajectory is negligible, so don't take this method as wasteful, more, just something the Kerbals have to deal with given their wildly different planet.

3. Use OMS engines to circularize. From 30km, should only take 200m/s max to circularize with any given apoapsis. Presuming your shuttle is the basic one you can make with this mod (Mine isn't), then that should leave you with plenty to perform reentry.

Here's an album showcasing a launch of my shuttle. Should help give you an idea of how it should be flown.

 

 

Edited June 20, 2016 by G'th

[trooperMNG]

14 hours ago, Pak said:

Fixed. An old cfg snuck in while I was moving files around. Sorry about that.

now it says I'm missing OMSEngineB. And it's the same craft. I redid the same thing (reverted to previous version, removed part, installed new version and attached new part)

Edited June 20, 2016 by trooperMNG

[Sgt.Shutesie]

7 hours ago, G'th said:

~snip~

 

Hey, uhh, what Shuttle IVA do you use? It's umm, very... pretty.

[Spartan-S63]

1 hour ago, Sgt.Shutesie said:

Hey, uhh, what Shuttle IVA do you use? It's umm, very... pretty.

It's going to be this one: 

I use it too and it's a pretty great IVA overhaul for the Mk3 cockpit.

Edited June 20, 2016 by Spartan-S63

[NecroBones]

17 hours ago, FlyMeToTheMinmus said:

Is another mod required for the texture switching? There's no options for for switching on any of the relevent parts, and both the lifting body part and the wings are z-fighting as if both textures are in place at the same time.

 

Three different plugins offer this capability now:

• Interstellar Fuel Switch (favored by FTP/CCC)
• B9 Part Switch (favored by Nertea's Cryogenic Engines)
• Firespitter

Each is a little different in how it handles things. B9 is more MM-friendly than the others. However, IFS is backward-compatible with FS, so you can easily add support for both of those with one set of configs. FTP/CCC support all three, if you want to look at an example.

[FlyMeToTheMinmus]

See, I have installed the FS dll but it still does it. I'll try one of the other one NecroBones suggested though.

[davidy12]

@Pak: Do you think you'll ever get around to FAR support?

[G'th]

3 minutes ago, davidy12 said:

@Pak: Do you think you'll ever get around to FAR support?

Doesn't really need it. Flies pretty well for me. (Granted I moved past the stock wings, but even so)

[Pak]

2 hours ago, FlyMeToTheMinmus said:

See, I have installed the FS dll but it still does it. I'll try one of the other one NecroBones suggested though.

I had this happen on my testing version of kerbal but never found a solution. I grabbed a new KSP file from steam and everything worked. Maybe try a file verification? (if you use steam)

[FlyMeToTheMinmus]

Sure, I'll give it a go with a fresh install in a bit

[sharpspoonful]

I present to you: "MECO"

Edited June 21, 2016 by sharpspoonful