[Min KSP: 1.12.2] Pathfinder - Space Camping & Geoscience

[Aelfhe1m]

@B-STRK I'm not sure what the problem you're encountering is here. Workshop uses a very simple method to decide where to store finished products:

• Get a list of all KIS inventory containers on current vessel (multiple docked vessels count as a single vessel) which have been "favoured"
• Starting from container nearest vessel root check them in order until one is found with large enough free space
• If no favoured container contains enough free space then repeat for unfavoured containers.

Containers that are not part of the vessel or have been stored inside another KIS container are never checked.

Pathfinder modules that are uninflated or are configured as something other than storage still have a small KIS inventory. It's possible that the new part was being stored in an unexpected module? I am looking into how to implement some sort of inventory management with highlighting to make it easier to find where manufactured parts have been stored in a future version of Workshop.

[B-STRK]

 

@B-STRK I'm not sure what the problem you're encountering is here. Workshop uses a very simple method to decide where to store finished products:

• Get a list of all KIS inventory containers on current vessel (multiple docked vessels count as a single vessel) which have been "favoured"
• Starting from container nearest vessel root check them in order until one is found with large enough free space
• If no favoured container contains enough free space then repeat for unfavoured containers.

Containers that are not part of the vessel or have been stored inside another KIS container are never checked.

Pathfinder modules that are uninflated or are configured as something other than storage still have a small KIS inventory. It's possible that the new part was being stored in an unexpected module? I am looking into how to implement some sort of inventory management with highlighting to make it easier to find where manufactured parts have been stored in a future version of Workshop.

Thanks for the reply, and good to know of future plans for OSE. I tried checking the deflates, but the built stuff wasn't found there either. As mentioned, taking out the deflates was what allowed the builds to load into the OSE inventory. And this was when I hadn't unloaded the two buckboards which were  configured as KIS containers either (they're empty too). Haven't been able to replicate it either. Maybe it was just a weird set of circumstances (old and used OSE in the inventory of a new vessel with a new OSE, new OSE building out parts of a new mod never before built, oh and the vessel's root was built out with Ground Construction, the Pathfinder OSE being KISd to it subsequently), and everything sorted itself out after a little inventory cleaning. 

That being said, I'm grateful for the attention that you and Angel had poured into these mods, and in their integration together for the gameplay I'm enjoying, and again, thanks for your reply. 

PS: so that's what "Favor inventory" was, thanks for the insight into OSE's inner workings. 

[rottielover]

I was hoping I could find someone to point me in the correct direction.  I'm getting back into KSP after a long hiatus (I think the last I really seriously played was in .23 days,  I came back to touch-base with 1.0 etc but never sat down and did a career save).   Anyway that said I play with a handful of mods, the short list is KIS/KAS, Pathfinder, TAC LS, Planetary Base sys, mech jeb, BARIS, MOLE, and Buffalo  to name most.

Anyway, I was reading the Wiki on setting up a starter base, but it doesn't' cover how to cover life support needs with TAC installed.   I was hoping that I could find someone with experience to help coach me along.   I'd like to tackle learning this again in a few steps.   Step 1 was remembering/re-learning KIS/KAS so that's done, I did the Wiki starter base.   Step 2 is how to I use pathfinder parts to setup a sustainable supply of food, water, and oxygen for a pair of kerbals (I want to send a survey team to Minmus in prep for a perm. base and station).   Finally the last phases would be learning the rest of Pathfinder to be able to produce the items needed for OSI (I think thats the name, with the 3D printer and storage) so that I can create new base modules as needed.

Back in the day I played with MKS/OKS as well, but to be perfectly honest a lot of these mods are getting way to complex and over my head to be fun.  I'd like some challenge, but I also don't want to spend 3 hours calculating a resource chain when I could be blowing stuff up in a game of little green men.  I guess I'm that guy that wants complexity up to a certain point, then it hits a tipping point of becoming grindy .    So I'm open to suggestions!!

 

Thank you in advance, and much appreciated! 

[Angelo Kerman]

Spent more time planning Pathfinder's post 1.3.1 release, and dusted off some old plans. In a nutshell, the aforementioned Ranch House not only boosts productivity, it generates science data (like you get when you send experiment results to an MPL) that can be used in an MPL/Doc Commercial Science Lab, or used as prospecting data to improve your chances of finding a GoldStrike lode, or as trajectory data for something inspired by this:

I've revised an old concept on my drawing boards called Pipelines, which is a mass driver. Essentially, it's a resource cannon that shoots resources between bases or between the ground and orbit. You'll need a mass catcher part on your orbiting station or vessel to receive the payloads. In addition to the requirement for trajectory data, you'll need some LiquidFuel/Oxidizer and a lot of ElectricCharge. It works best in a vacuum, but it can be used in an atmosphere; Eve's atmosphere is too think for practical use, however.

Edited October 5, 2017 by Angel-125

[Sudragon]

I'm thinking a BARIS fail in a Mass Catcher might be a bit of a problem.

[Angelo Kerman]

 

I'm thinking a BARIS fail in a Mass Catcher might be a bit of a problem.

Yup, you could do things like have misfires that lose shipments, critical failures where the payload canister clips the catcher and it explodes, and so on.

[B-STRK]

 

Yup, you could do things like have misfires that lose shipments, critical failures where the payload canister clips the catcher and it explodes, and so on.

Or even accidentally break into parts of the destination space station (translation: have BARIS break BOTH the shipment and the consignee. Whoops! ).

Okay, maybe TOO catastrophic of a failure. 

What's your vision for the mechanism of the resource transfer? Will it be a simple deduct from source tank-deposit in target tank when the check succeeds? Or could it be something like the mission manager mods which can create a craft (being the capsule referred to) bearing said resources at the target destination? And what would you expect its range to be?

[Angelo Kerman]

 

Or even accidentally break into parts of the destination space station (translation: have BARIS break BOTH the shipment and the consignee. Whoops! ).

Okay, maybe TOO catastrophic of a failure. 

What's your vision for the mechanism of the resource transfer? Will it be a simple deduct from source tank-deposit in target tank when the check succeeds? Or could it be something like the mission manager mods which can create a craft (being the capsule referred to) bearing said resources at the target destination? And what would you expect its range to be?

For ease of implementation, just a simple transfer of resources. As cool as creating a craft is, that's too complicated to implement. When you load the target craft you get the delivery.

[Angelo Kerman]

As mentioned, I didn't think I'd get the Ranch House done by the time 1.3.1 drops, but I got pretty far:

Each of those ports doubles as an airlock.

More pics:

I have a job interview tomorrow so my updates will have to wait until the weekend at the earliest..

[Sudragon]

Dang, that's impressive. It's yuuuuge.

 

[Angelo Kerman]

30 minutes ago, Sudragon said:

Dang, that's impressive. It's yuuuuge.

 

Thanks! The Ranch House is shaping up nicely. It's 12.5 meters in diameter, which is plenty big for a community center. It'll have that big meeting room in the bottom and a garden on the top floor. It's the last of the inflatable parts for the foreseeable future, and it represents a step between portable inflatable modules and the permanent konkrete structures coming in Pathfinder's Sandcastle release.

Like the Bison gondola modules, the Ranch House comes packaged in a Buckboard-sized box that you drop onto the ground. Hook up a KAS pipe or use Pathfinder’s resource distribution system, and spend 20000 units of Equipment to assemble it. Once built the Ranch House cannot be disassembled.

Edited October 6, 2017 by Angel-125

[Krakatoa]

12 minutes ago, Angel-125 said:

Thanks! The Ranch House is shaping up nicely. It's 12.5 meters in diameter, which is plenty big for a community center. It'll have that big meeting room in the bottom and a garden on the top floor. It's the last of the inflatable parts for the foreseeable future, and it represents a step between portable inflatable modules and the permanent konkrete structures coming in Pathfinder's Sandcastle release.

Like the Bison gondola modules, the Ranch House comes packaged in a Buckboard-sized box that you drop onto the ground. Hook up a KAS pipe or use Pathfinder’s resource distribution system, and spend 20000 units of Equipment to assemble it. Once built the Ranch House cannot be disassembled.

This may be more of a question for the BARIS thread, but since I don't use it, I don't have the expected life time as a reference. How do you see the hierarchy of permanence of your different mods? I think I saw you say MOLE was the beginner tier, and I know Pathfinder is theoretically short-mid term, but what about Bison gondo-buildings or DSEV vehicles? I'm guessing Sandcastle will be the top tier of permanence/establishment of a base on a body.

I know the new part says Ranch House, but with all the pieces around, it looks a bit like a pad-toed chibi octopus. I'm okay with this, just an observation

[Angelo Kerman]

3 minutes ago, Krakatoa said:

This may be more of a question for the BARIS thread, but since I don't use it, I don't have the expected life time as a reference. How do you see the hierarchy of permanence of your different mods? I think I saw you say MOLE was the beginner tier, and I know Pathfinder is theoretically short-mid term, but what about Bison gondo-buildings or DSEV vehicles? I'm guessing Sandcastle will be the top tier of permanence/establishment of a base on a body.

I know the new part says Ranch House, but with all the pieces around, it looks a bit like a pad-toed chibi octopus. I'm okay with this, just an observation

Yes, Sandcastle is the top tier in reliability, followed by: DSEV, Pathfinder, Heisenberg , and MOLE.

[Geschosskopf]

6 hours ago, Angel-125 said:

Yes, Sandcastle is the top tier in reliability, followed by: DSEV, Pathfinder, Heisenberg , and MOLE.

Yay, Sandcastle is still a thing   That mass-driver and Ranch House look great, too.

Does the mass-driver actually fire physical projectiles that appear on the map and can be watched in flight, or is it abstracted, an extension of the resource transfer system?

[Angelo Kerman]

3 hours ago, Geschosskopf said:

Yay, Sandcastle is still a thing   That mass-driver and Ranch House look great, too.

Does the mass-driver actually fire physical projectiles that appear on the map and can be watched in flight, or is it abstracted, an extension of the resource transfer system?

It's an abstracted extension of the resource transfer system. Physical projectiles and such would be cool but also a lot more work for a relatively small feature. I might add some special effects though...

Yeah, Sandcastle is still a thing, though it's a backburner project while I clear out my backlog, and that's taking a lot longer than originally planned. Right now I'm doing concept art, finding the right balance between part size/number of parts and part count for the final product.

The idea is, like Firma, you use building blocks to make your structures. From top to bottom: 2.5m, 5m, 10m, 20m. I'm leaning towards 5m or 10m cubes, giving you 2 stories or 4 stories, respectively. 5m would make IVAs more reasonable.

[Kosmonaut]

Fantastic job on the Ranch House, and I like the Sandcastle idea.

Good luck with your interview

[Geschosskopf]

2 hours ago, Angel-125 said:

The idea is, like Firma, you use building blocks to make your structures. From top to bottom: 2.5m, 5m, 10m, 20m. I'm leaning towards 5m or 10m cubes, giving you 2 stories or 4 stories, respectively. 5m would make IVAs more reasonable.

So, do you make the blocks in the desired position by squirting gunite through a hose, or do you have to carry them around and stack them manually?  And then is this just a shell, and the IVA and converters would be in a separate part you then put inside the shell and deploy, kinda like a pathfinder inflatable?

[Angelo Kerman]

5 hours ago, Geschosskopf said:

So, do you make the blocks in the desired position by squirting gunite through a hose, or do you have to carry them around and stack them manually?  And then is this just a shell, and the IVA and converters would be in a separate part you then put inside the shell and deploy, kinda like a pathfinder inflatable?

The idea is that you make the base/building in the VAB or SPH, then use the 3D printer to print on site. Think Extraplanetary Launchpads but with a limited printing ability that's restricted to vessels made from konkrete parts.

The Ranch House works like the Bison gondola parts; you can collapse them down to a small Buckboard-sized packing box, then haul that box to the desired site, hook it up to a KAS pipe, and assemble the building.

[Geschosskopf]

That works   Less messy than gunite.

[Angelo Kerman]

Pathfinder 1.12: Classic Stock, is now available:

Module Reconfigurations
- To improve playability, all the inflatable parts now require an Engineer to reconfigure or assemble/disassemble (it was a mix of Engineer and Scientist before).

Play Modes
- Play Mode moved to Wild Blue Tools. Look for the "WBT" button on the Space Center screen.
- Play Modes now apply to all Wild Blue mods.
- Added support for Classic Stock play mode. This is a new mode that uses resources inspired by a system proposed by NovaSilisko and HarvestR back in KSP 0.19. YOUR CURRENT GAMES THAT USE CRP ARE SAFE! For the complete list of resources in Classic Stock and to see how the various converters use them, follow this link: https://github.com/Angel-125/Pathfinder/wiki/Classic-Stock-Play-Mode

Multipurpose Colony Modules
- Deprecated the Multipurpose Colony Modules parts found in the extras folder; they're now obsolete and replaced with equivalents in DSEV:
Multipurpose Base Unit -> Mk2 Ground Hub
Multipurpose Colony Module -> Tranquility Mk2 Habitat
Homestead Mk2 -> Homestead Mk3
Stagecoach -> Junction Storage Hub

Bug Fixes & Enhancements
- Various bug fixes.
- CRP is now a separate download.
- Updated to KSP 1.3.1.
- Skill required to recycle parts reduced to level 2.
- Skill required to recycle whole vessels reduce to level 4.

Edited October 7, 2017 by Angel-125

[Angelo Kerman]

Got the Ranch House's exterior done:

[Angelo Kerman]

Today was a much deserved gaming day in KSP. Got a lot done on my save, but I did take some time to fiddle with the Ranch House IVA:

Here you can see the start of the "board room" with its 24 seats as well as the shell for the garden.

[Just Jim]

8 hours ago, Angel-125 said:

Today was a much deserved gaming day in KSP. Got a lot done on my save, but I did take some time to fiddle with the Ranch House IVA:

Here you can see the start of the "board room" with its 24 seats as well as the shell for the garden.

LOVE IT!!!!!!  

[Angelo Kerman]

More progress:

In the interest of not killing frame rates, I'm seriously considering not adding the upper floor garden. Because it will kill your frame rate to make something that looks reasonable...

[smotheredrun]

Wha.... wow!  It has been a very long time since I looked into this thread.  Love it!

3 minutes ago, Angel-125 said:

More progress:

In the interest of not killing frame rates, I'm seriously considering not adding the upper floor garden. Because it will kill your frame rate to make something that looks reasonable...

Maybe just spray paint the garden in a very Kerbally style?...  or you could add a sign reading "End user to install garden.  No warranties inferred or implied by Wild Blue Industries regarding Ranch House building performance when said garden is installed."