[Min KSP: 1.12.2] Pathfinder - Space Camping & Geoscience

[shdwlrd]

In regards to dropping MKS/USI-LS support, Are you dropping all support for it or will you keep basic support for it? What I mean by basic support is the chuckwagon, ponderosa, and casa, modules will still be able to hold the resources necessary for MKS/USI-LS.

[Angelo Kerman]

33 minutes ago, shdwlrd said:

In regards to dropping MKS/USI-LS support, Are you dropping all support for it or will you keep basic support for it? What I mean by basic support is the chuckwagon, ponderosa, and casa, modules will still be able to hold the resources necessary for MKS/USI-LS.

Resources will still be around, but no tying into the distribution system, or trying to balance Equipment with MaterialKits, or using special converters. It is simply too much work for me to maintain for a mod that I don't use.

[rasta013]

10 hours ago, shdwlrd said:

In regards to dropping MKS/USI-LS support, Are you dropping all support for it or will you keep basic support for it? What I mean by basic support is the chuckwagon, ponderosa, and casa, modules will still be able to hold the resources necessary for MKS/USI-LS.

 

9 hours ago, Angel-125 said:

Resources will still be around, but no tying into the distribution system, or trying to balance Equipment with MaterialKits, or using special converters. It is simply too much work for me to maintain for a mod that I don't use.

Angel shouldn't be expected to keep up this support since we as a community can provide it for ourselves.  He's written the template system that makes it super simple to add whatever we feel like with simple config files.  I would much rather see him concentrating his effort on making WB better than trying to make sure someone else's mod works.

I, for one, at least will be writing my own configs/templates (as needed) for USI-LS but MKS is meaningless to me when I'm using WB parts.  Angel's chain is more fun IMHO and uses EPL which I also use.  This is a perfect example of what I mean.  RoverDude is no longer going to offer support for the most widely used and longest running off-planet construction mod (EPL) and the community is expected to pick up the slack if we want it to continue working.  

Why should we expect Angel to do anything differently?

Edited March 8, 2017 by rasta013

[vardicd]

@Angel-125 I just want one little piece of clarification, with you dropping MKS/USI support {Which I'm fine with, no complaining here} Do you have any reason to suspect that your mods and MKS/USI are going to conflict if we use them together? I'm using both systems in my play through, using MKS to represent the construction style and progress of one kerbal nation, and your pathfinder / buffalo / MOLE to represent a competing kebal nation. I don't have major parts from the 2 systems working together, there might be a few 'adapter' pieces I use inter - changeably but I keep the mods basically separate. I'm just wondering if I should expect the odds of unexpected Kraken attacks to increase if I keep using the mods separately, but in the same install?

I hope that makes sense?  

[Angelo Kerman]

1 hour ago, vardicd said:

@Angel-125 I just want one little piece of clarification, with you dropping MKS/USI support {Which I'm fine with, no complaining here} Do you have any reason to suspect that your mods and MKS/USI are going to conflict if we use them together? I'm using both systems in my play through, using MKS to represent the construction style and progress of one kerbal nation, and your pathfinder / buffalo / MOLE to represent a competing kebal nation. I don't have major parts from the 2 systems working together, there might be a few 'adapter' pieces I use inter - changeably but I keep the mods basically separate. I'm just wondering if I should expect the odds of unexpected Kraken attacks to increase if I keep using the mods separately, but in the same install?

I hope that makes sense?  

Short answer is no conflicts. The systems run independently. For example, MKS uses MaterialKits to inflate modules and change configurations while Pathfinder uses Equipment- originally RocketParts before I realized that I was treating it as five times denser than it actually is. Since I've been using RocketParts/Equipment since before there even were MaterialKits, that's what I'm sticking with.

You can still find the MM_MKS patch in ModuleManagerPatches, it is renamed with a .txt extension. But I cannot guarantee that it provides the right mass ratios, converters, and the like.

[vardicd]

9 minutes ago, Angel-125 said:

Short answer is no conflicts. The systems run independently. For example, MKS uses MaterialKits to inflate modules and change configurations while Pathfinder uses Equipment- originally RocketParts before I realized that I was treating it as five times denser than it actually is. Since I've been using RocketParts/Equipment since before there even were MaterialKits, that's what I'm sticking with.

You can still find the MM_MKS patch in ModuleManagerPatches, it is renamed with a .txt extension. But I cannot guarantee that it provides the right mass ratios, converters, and the like.

That's fine I'm not interested in trying to adapt them to work together, or be compatible. or anything like that, as long as I know they aren't going to try actively trying to sabotage each other, {except when they need to for my particular in game story reasons.  } I'm happy.

[Angelo Kerman]

12 minutes ago, vardicd said:

That's fine I'm not interested in trying to adapt them to work together, or be compatible. or anything like that, as long as I know they aren't going to try actively trying to sabotage each other, {except when they need to for my particular in game story reasons.  } I'm happy.

No worries, I don't believe in sabotaging another mod, even when I don't like it.

[shdwlrd]

20 hours ago, Angel-125 said:

Resources will still be around, but no tying into the distribution system, or trying to balance Equipment with MaterialKits, or using special converters. It is simply too much work for me to maintain for a mod that I don't use.

Thanks for clarification Angel-125.  Fair enough. I do understand your unwillingness to try to balance something that changes with almost every update. It gets old very quick. It's no biggie for me to write/copy-paste a MM patch to add whatever I need into the different parts. I just didn't want to try to figure out the whole resource switching thing using MM. And thank you for this excellent mod, it very quickly became one of my must haves in my mod list.

[Angelo Kerman]

58 minutes ago, shdwlrd said:

Thanks for clarification Angel-125.  Fair enough. I do understand your unwillingness to try to balance something that changes with almost every update. It gets old very quick. It's no biggie for me to write/copy-paste a MM patch to add whatever I need into the different parts. I just didn't want to try to figure out the whole resource switching thing using MM. And thank you for this excellent mod, it very quickly became one of my must haves in my mod list.

Glad you like the mod. It's a lot of work to put it together and maintain, but it's worth it IMO. I'm still open to a pull request for MKS support, but if not, that's ok too. I just can't be the one to maintain it, I've got a lot of projects on my plate.

[smotheredrun]

3 hours ago, Angel-125 said:

{Snip} I've got a lot of projects on my plate.

Are you trying to get a record?  I think there are close (lost count) to 100 mods being developed or maintained by you and maybe 3 or 4 other modders/maintainers.  Cheers and foamy adult beverages for the lot of you!

Edited March 9, 2017 by smotheredrun

[Angelo Kerman]

8 hours ago, smotheredrun said:

Are you trying to get a record?  I think there are close (lost count) to 100 mods being developed or maintained by you and maybe 3 or 4 other modders/maintainers.  Cheers and foamy adult beverages for the lot of you!

Nah, more like 7 mods total, 6 if you don't count the Buffalo, which is part of Pathfinder and only a separate mod as a courtesy.

[SmarterThanMe]

The "Research Soil Analysis" and related experiments have come with this mod, yeah?

How do you do them? Checking the experiment for details hasn't helped me here.

[Angelo Kerman]

8 hours ago, SmarterThanMe said:

The "Research Soil Analysis" and related experiments have come with this mod, yeah?

How do you do them? Checking the experiment for details hasn't helped me here.

Pathfinder's science system works a bit differently than the stock system where you have specialized parts for the experiment. In the Pathfinder Geology Lab, there is an Experiments tab. In there, you can load an experiment into one of the research slots and then perform the experiment. Here is a video of how MOLE's science system works, which is very similar:

Note that in the case of Pathfinder, you load the experiment into the lab after launch, and you don't need to transfer the experiment back home to reap the rewards.

[stk2008]

Hi there I am having a terrible time trying to figure this out but managed to tie it down to one of your mods and I think its pathfinder.

I have a contract to do this mission

 

http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/96104530582435286/C44EB0D93DB5E6C9B12EE7ED8FB1C062C03ACCBC/

 

But this is one of the very first missions given to me on a new game.

Now I see no ice cream in the VAB etc etc LOL what on earth do I need to do please help

 

thanks

[Angelo Kerman]

4 minutes ago, stk2008 said:

Hi there I am having a terrible time trying to figure this out but managed to tie it down to one of your mods and I think its pathfinder.

I have a contract to do this mission

 

http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/96104530582435286/C44EB0D93DB5E6C9B12EE7ED8FB1C062C03ACCBC/

 

But this is one of the very first missions given to me on a new game.

Now I see no ice cream in the VAB etc etc LOL what on earth do I need to do please help

 

thanks

Please see the above post. You can perform the ice cream study using either MOLE, the DSEV D2 lab, or the Doc Science Lab. In the case of the Doc Science Lab, you'll want to create the ice cream experiment after deploying the Doc.

[Freshmeat]

Sorry to bother you, but what is the requirement and procedure for turning a buckboard into a generator? I instantly fell in love with the one in the Watney lab. So far I have looked into the Reconfigure Storage menu using an engineer (sand box mode).

[Angelo Kerman]

1 hour ago, Freshmeat said:

Sorry to bother you, but what is the requirement and procedure for turning a buckboard into a generator? I instantly fell in love with the one in the Watney lab. So far I have looked into the Reconfigure Storage menu using an engineer (sand box mode).

Just like with the Doc, you simply reconfigure the storage. it takes an Engineer and some Equipment.

[Freshmeat]

We are talking 1000 L Buckboard containers like the one in the video below?

I bumble a bit about in the video, but I hope it shows what I am doing clearly enough to tell where I mess up. The craft is a lander with an equipment buckboard on one side, and a LFO on the other side. Bill can change the LFO buckboard to a battery, but I see no option for generator in the menu.

KSP.log and output_log.txt

Savegame

The savegame is done in sandbox on a clean install with KAS 6.3, KIS 1.4.3, Pathfinder 1.7.0 and the accompanying CCK, CRP and MM. The craft is the autosave.

Edited March 11, 2017 by Freshmeat
Embedding

[Foxbat]

(I have looked for this particular issue on this & other forum threads but cannot find it.  Apologies if I am just bad at searching the forum).

After the last two patches, checking settings on the KSC screen shows "default" where I had previously selected "simplified" mode.  I change it back, restart KSP and the mod still shows "default".  Am I missing a step?  Reverting back to a previous version of Pathfinder keeps my desired settings but then I miss out on the fixes and updates.  Any help is sincerely appreciated.

Thank you very much for this mod and the hard work you do to keep it going!

UPDATE - While researching another question, I found an entry on how to drill down through ESC - SETTINGS - DIFFICULTY and adjust the mod that way.  Works great!

Edited March 12, 2017 by Foxbat
SOLUTION FOUND

[Angelo Kerman]

1.7.5: Shipbreakers is now available!

Part Scrapping

This release introduces the ability to scrap individual parts- and if you're skill is high enough, entire vessels- and salvage some Equipment in the process. You'll need a kerbal with the RepairSkill (Engineers have it) to perform the operation. The amount of Equipment recycled depends upon the mass of the part/vessel and the skill of the kerbal. A level 3 kerbal can scrap individual parts, while a level 5 kerbal can scrap entire vessels. For safety reasons, you  cannot scrap a part or vessel that has crew aboard. Simply right-click on a part to scrap the part or vessel.

When you scrap parts and vessels, any resources it contains can be distributed to any nearby containers participating in Pathfinder's resource distribution system. The container must be within 50 meters of the part scrapping kerbal, and the participating container must have resources you're interested in set to either Share or Consume. So if you want to recover resources from the part, then be sure to turn on resource distribution for your storage containers. You can always scrap a part regardless of distance to an available container.

Bug Fixes
- Restricted the number of contracts that are offered and/or active.
- Fixed a situation where experiments weren't registering as completed.
- Contracts won't be offered until you've orbited the target world and have unlocked the proper tech tree.
- Contracts that must be returned to the homeworld must be landed or splashed.

***

@Freshmeat: The Buckboard 1000 can't become a generator; only the Buckboard 2000 and Buckboard 3000.

Edited March 12, 2017 by Angel-125

[Sudragon]

Salvaging recoups equipment...not rocket parts?

[Angelo Kerman]

12 hours ago, Sudragon said:

Salvaging recoups equipment...not rocket parts?

Correct. If that is not to your liking, you can change the ModuleManager patch. MM_Part.cfg. Equipment is more useful post-deployment because all templates require it to reconfigure the part and use it for repairs. RocketParts are used for new construction, but only if you have EL installed, unless you are making a Sandcastle base, which needs Konkrete. You won't be making a Sandcastle base until I get the parts done though...

[Freshmeat]

18 hours ago, Angel-125 said:

@Freshmeat: The Buckboard 1000 can't become a generator; only the Buckboard 2000 and Buckboard 3000.

Thanks. I tried with the 1000 and 6000, but was pretty certain the error was on my side. Works like a charm.

[Sudragon]

7 hours ago, Angel-125 said:

Correct. If that is not to your liking, you can change the ModuleManager patch. MM_Part.cfg. Equipment is more useful post-deployment because all templates require it to reconfigure the part and use it for repairs. RocketParts are used for new construction, but only if you have EL installed, unless you are making a Sandcastle base, which needs Konkrete. You won't be making a Sandcastle base until I get the parts done though...

Thanks for the location. I'm running

SSTU, which uses Rocket Parts for inflating it's inflatables.

MOLE etc, which use equipment for reconfigurables.

MKS, which has some parts i like (DERP!) but has side effects,

And Extraplanterary Launchpads. 

I'm thinking of trying to write a patch to get EL to run on material kits and specialised parts, without MKS

[Angelo Kerman]

38 minutes ago, Sudragon said:

Thanks for the location. I'm running

SSTU, which uses Rocket Parts for inflating it's inflatables.

MOLE etc, which use equipment for reconfigurables.

MKS, which has some parts i like (DERP!) but has side effects,

And Extraplanterary Launchpads. 

I'm thinking of trying to write a patch to get EL to run on material kits and specialised parts, without MKS

Originally I used RocketParts too, but I mistakenly treated them as a 1-liter resource instead of a 5-liter resource, so all my tanks were holding 5x more than they should. Hence, about a year ago I switched to Equipment, which is  5x denser than RocketParts per liter of volume. MKS uses MaterialKits, but interoperability between MKS and Pathfinder wasn't a concern for MKS. Whatever, I've used Equipment long enough now that it's established and not gonna change as the default resource. If you want Pathfinder to use MaterialKits, you can do so with a MM patch. Each template has a name field, so you can do:

@PATH_INDUSTRY[BrewWorks,CropWorks,Ironworks,Nukeworks]
{
	@requiredResource = MaterialKits
	@requiredAmount = 5000
}

@PATH_INDUSTRY[Solarflare,HotSprings,ClaimJumper]
{
	@requiredResource = MaterialKits
	@requiredAmount = 7500
}

@PATH_HABITATION[Pigpen,Blacksmith,GeoLab,PonderosaHab]
{
	@requiredResource = MaterialKits
	@requiredAmount = 1500
}

@PATH_SCIENCE[DocScience,Sunburn,Watney]
{
	@requiredResource = MaterialKits
	@requiredAmount = 3000
}

@GREENHOUSE[Prairie]
{
	@requiredResource = MaterialKits
	@requiredAmount = 1500
}

If you want to switch Pathfinder's parts over to use MaterialKits. You can do something similar for MOLE's parts. One of these days, I might rewrite WildBlueTools to automatically calculate the required resource units based upon the template's specified mass (or part mass if absent), and then have a default resource (Equipment in my case) to handle all reconfiguring/inflating/etc. That would be easier than specifying the required resource and required amount in each template, and make it easier to reconfigure as desired. Pathfinder's motto has been "It's your game, your choice" right from the start, but right now you have to work at it if you want to change what resource to use to reconfigure stuff.

Edited March 13, 2017 by Angel-125