Is this alternate solar system possible?

[Spaceception]

@silversliver I can't wait to see the moons you make

Edited January 26, 2016 by Spaceception

[fredinno]

4 hours ago, Andem said:

I built it in universe sandbox. Earth, Mars, and Minerva are the only three capable of sustaining life as we know it. Mars cannot support humans because the greenhouse effect leads to the surface temperature being over 150 degrees, eventually boiling off the water into the atmosphere, leaving a few boiling lakes. Humans could easily live on Minerva, provided they wore their coats (-3.7 degrees on average,)! Earth is quite warm at 28 degrees, and has no ice caps. Luna could easily be terraformed, but natural liquid water lasted less than two years.

Take notes ChrisSpace. I made Luna bigger, so try that. And also, did you remove 97 percent of all the water on Venus?

3 hours ago, silversliver said:

Those aren't impact crater. I'm not sure what they are, but I'm 100% sure that they aren't craters because I completely deleted the generation of those.

The dichotomy is something that SpaceEngine can't do. Even with the use of strange parameters it's not possible to make specific localized geological features.

Once I finished the internal system (until Dres).

Don't forget comet 109P! (And the Phobos-Demios Earth Trojan system)

[Findthepin1]

4 hours ago, Andem said:

I built it in universe sandbox. Earth, Mars, and Minerva are the only three capable of sustaining life as we know it. Mars cannot support humans because the greenhouse effect leads to the surface temperature being over 150 degrees, eventually boiling off the water into the atmosphere, leaving a few boiling lakes. Humans could easily live on Minerva, provided they wore their coats (-3.7 degrees on average,)! Earth is quite warm at 28 degrees, and has no ice caps. Luna could easily be terraformed, but natural liquid water lasted less than two years.

If Mars' orbit is where it is OTL, that will almost certainly not happen. Where is Mars and how thick is the air?

[fredinno]

17 minutes ago, Findthepin1 said:

If Mars' orbit is where it is OTL, that will almost certainly not happen. Where is Mars and how thick is the air?

I read it twice, and it was a typo- he was talking about Venus, not Mars.

[Spaceception]

I made most of the inner solar system in US2, Vulcan isn't in any way stable for longer than a month, it either dissipated when I tried fine-tuning its mass, or flung out when I sped through time.

However, all other major bodies (Mercury, Venus, Earth/Luna, Mars, Bellona, and Minerva) were just fine, and fit the specifications.

[fredinno]

5 minutes ago, Spaceception said:

I made most of the inner solar system in US2, Vulcan isn't in any way stable for longer than a month, it either dissipated when I tried fine-tuning its mass, or flung out when I sped through time.

However, all other major bodies (Mercury, Venus, Earth/Luna, Mars, Bellona, and Minerva) were just fine, and fit the specifications.

That's surprising, considering Vulcan was based off IRL estimated stats for Vulcan. Try 0.20 AU, or 0.06 AU.

[Spaceception]

Just now, fredinno said:

That's surprising, considering Vulcan was based off IRL estimated stats for Vulcan. Try 0.20 AU, or 0.06 AU.

Alright. Check back in ~15 minutes.

[Spaceception]

Vulcan stats:

Mass: 9 moons

Radii: 3211 km

Gravity: : .436 gees

Temperature: 1130 c

Atm pressure: 5 atm

Orbital period: 33.3 days

Tidally locked: Yes

Magnetic field: Yes, 0.0500 gauss

Apoapsis: 31983744 km

Periapsis: 28647918 km

Eccentricity: 0.06

Inclination: 12.7

Materials:

Iron: 24.8 %

Silicate's: 75.2 %

It stayed stable for 10 years before it vanished from existence, although, that may have been because I really sped through time (I think it was several years per second) to see how long it would be stable.

Edited January 26, 2016 by Spaceception

[fredinno]

10 minutes ago, Spaceception said:

Vulcan stats:

Mass: 9 moons

Radii: 3211 km

Gravity: : .436 gees

Temperature: 1130 c

Atm pressure: 5 atm

Orbital period: 33.3 days

Tidally locked: Yes

Magnetic field: Yes, 0.0500 gauss

Apoapsis: 31983744 km

Periapsis: 28647918 km

Eccentricity: 0.06

Inclination: 12.7

Materials:

Iron: 24.8 %

Silicate's: 75.2 %

 

 

 

Vulcan is supposed to be composed of at least 70 percent metals. Is 9 moons equal to 0.07 Earths?  The apps is is too high. It must be 0.2 AU (I would hope for less than or equal to 0.18 AU) or less to be stable.

Also, is it ejecting matter, like a comet, and in a stable orbit? You should be able to see the matter ejecting, Iom pretty sure. Also, what is it ejecting? Silicates, gases, ices? You can add stuff like water to your planets to tell if you can.

 

I think this is more a limitation of the engine than the planet itself. Maybe don't speed it up more than a year/second, go shower, then come back?

Considering that the zone Vuclan is in should be stable enough for a hypothesized asteroid belthttp://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-vulcanoid-asteroid.htm

I highly doubt it is that unstable.

Edited January 26, 2016 by fredinno

[Spaceception]

Just now, fredinno said:

Vulcan is supposed to be composed of at least 70 percent metals. Is 9 moons equal to 0.07 Earths?  The apps is is too high. It must be 0.2 AU or less to be stable.

Also, is it ejecting matter, like a comet, and in a stable orbit? You should be able to see the matter ejecting, Iom pretty sure. Also, what is it ejecting? Silicates, gases, ices? You can add stuff like water to your planets to tell if you can.

It's ejecting matter like a comet, I'm very sure it's the atmosphere.

I'll update it's mass, check back in ~15 minutes (Again ).

[Spaceception]

@fredinno

New Vulcan stats (Without the list thingy):

Mass: 0.07 Earth mass, Radii 2457 km, 5.18 atm, temp, 1680 c, gravity: .463 gees, magnetic field, 0.690 Gauss, materials: Iron: (Might as well be 100 %, it's steadily rising) Silicates (Might as well be 0 %), It still has the "comet tail", Distance: .18 AU, by .21 AU. Orbital period: 32 days. Tidally locked. Looks stable.

Edited January 26, 2016 by Spaceception

[fredinno]

14 minutes ago, Spaceception said:

@fredinno

New Vulcan stats (Without the list thingy):

Mass: 0.07 Earth mass, Radii 2457 km, 5.18 atm, temp, 1680 c, gravity: .463 gees, magnetic field, 0.690 Gauss, materials: Iron: (Might as well be 100 %, it's steadily rising) Silicates (Might as well be 0 %), It still has the "comet tail", Distance: .18 AU, by .21 AU. Orbital period: 32 days. Tidally locked. Looks stable.

Can you reduce the eccentricity so the apopasis is lower than 0.20 AU- maybe at 0.19-0.17 AU. 0.21 AU makes it more likely to mess with Mercury. That's a lot of atm pressure. Try getting rid of all the silicates (or almost all) then try again. 

 

[Spaceception]

1 minute ago, fredinno said:

Can you reduce the eccentricity so the apopasis is lower than 0.20 AU- maybe at 0.19-0.17 AU. 0.21 AU makes it more likely to mess with Mercury. That's a lot of atm pressure. Try getting rid of all the silicates (or almost all) then try again. 

 

Okay.

[Spaceception]

@fredinno

New, new Vulcan stats: Same of everything, except for a few things: Orbital Period: 26 days, Distance: .16 AU by .18 AU, atm pressure: 1.27, temperature, 871 c Albedo: 35, and 100 % Iron.

50 years stable. (I would've done it for longer, but I got tired of simulating it)

Edited January 26, 2016 by Spaceception

[Andem]

@fredinno Yes, I did mean Venus, but I forgot to save the simulation , so I have to rebuild it.

 

BTW, @ChrisSpace, do you have any information about the moons' specifics?

Edited January 26, 2016 by Andem

[Spaceception]

1 hour ago, Andem said:

@fredinno Yes, I did mean Venus, but I forgot to save the simulation , so I have to rebuild it.

 

BTW, @ChrisSpace, do you have any information about the moons' specifics?

How do you save simulations?

EDIT: I figured it out, nevermind

EDIT EDIT. It didn't work halp.

Edited January 26, 2016 by Spaceception

[Andem]

I remade my best interpretation of the system, with a more details added. the result was relatively different, Mars, Earth, Luna, and Minerva are all Habitable. Mars has perpetual Ice Ages, The North pole will descend and the south will receed for half the year, vice versa the other half. it is -20 degrees on average, so make sure you're bundled up on the surface. Earth is earth, duh, but Luna can only stay habitable naturally for about a year and a half before freezing over. Minerva is -2 degrees on average, and is quite hospitable provided you have a thick coat. Now for politics! Mars comes dangerously close to earth every 5 years or so, coming within Lunas' orbit. Every 5 years a colony ship is sent to start expanding earth nations onto mars' surface. the french control most of Mars' main continent, leaving Germany, Belgium, And England to control the a majority of the small islands. local populations combat the first three colonization attempts, but are eventually wiped out by a massive french invasion force. the other nations quietly begin to grab up islands all over the planet, eventually claiming a majority of it as "Governed Territories." Much fear is present on earth, because Auroras' orbit is highly unstalbe, and common belief is that mars will push it into an orbit where Luna will slingshot it into earth. some groups suggest putting it into orbit around mars at the next approach, while other wish to blow it out of the sky. it is a source of tension between nations, as no government can agree on a potential solution, although each nation knows that it will only work as an international effort. France starts a secret program to weaponize Aurora, called Lune de Sang. construction begins, but the project is abandoned less than a month into construction. France is in svere debt, and attempts to pull off a scheme similar to the South Sea bubble, but this plan fails, and France loses control of the Martian colonies. Russian scientists toy with way's to terraform Minerva, but when Julian Delphiki becomes the first human to step foot on it's surface, they seriously begin working on the idea, using the structure of plant leaves to create artificial photosynthesis.They start the machines, and begin plans for colonies. further exploration occurs.France has invested heavily in russias' plan,hoping it will revive the dying french economy. then first contact is made with the primitive natives. the world is horrified, and russia immediately abandons the machines, eaving them to rust on minerva. Frances' economy is destroyed. The Empire falls into dissarray, reemerging as a pseudo-communist state. eh? Just an Idea...

 

--EDIT--

Minerva will remain capable of life, but the oceans will eventually freeze over and the ecosystem will collapse.

Mars is incredibly stable, good climate, perfect for human colonization. 

Venus is still a hellhole.

Vulcan's surface STILL hasn't heated up to the point where there is surface lava.

Edited January 27, 2016 by Andem

[Andem]

3 hours ago, Spaceception said:

How do you save simulations?

EDIT: I figured it out, nevermind

EDIT EDIT. It didn't work halp.

In order to locate saved simulations, go to the load simulation area, and at the top there is a small bar. click the arrow a few times and you will see "My Sims" all your saved simulations will be in that folder. 

[Spaceception]

2 minutes ago, Andem said:

In order to locate saved simulations, go to the load simulation area, and at the top there is a small bar. click the arrow a few times and you will see "My Sims" all your saved simulations will be in that folder. 

I know where that is, but i can't actually save it, the US2 site said Ctrl + s but it didn't work.

[ChrisSpace]

16 hours ago, fredinno said:

Also, should I make Phersephone based off OTL Planet X ChrisSpace.

I already have a rough draft of how to add P9 to this solar system without removing anything. I'll update the front post with it soon-ish.

12 hours ago, Andem said:

I built it in universe sandbox. Earth, Mars, and Minerva are the only three capable of sustaining life as we know it. Mars cannot support humans because the greenhouse effect leads to the surface temperature being over 150 degrees, eventually boiling off the water into the atmosphere, leaving a few boiling lakes. Humans could easily live on Minerva, provided they wore their coats (-3.7 degrees on average,)! Earth is quite warm at 28 degrees, and has no ice caps. Luna could easily be terraformed, but natural liquid water lasted less than two years.

I can immediately see how you messed up here. But first, can you show us the stats of the planets you made? Both size/mass and atmosphere related preferably.

 

Edited January 27, 2016 by ChrisSpace

[Andem]

4 minutes ago, ChrisSpace said:

I already have a rough draft of how to add P9 to this solar system without removing anything. I'll update the front post with it soon-ish.

I can immediately see how you messed up here. But first, can you show us the stats of the planets you made? Both size/mass and atmosphere related preferably.

 

I amde a few errors, which I attempted to correct in my second version. see this post:

2 hours ago, Andem said:

I remade my best interpretation of the system, with a more details added. the result was relatively different, Mars, Earth, Luna, and Minerva are all Habitable. Mars has perpetual Ice Ages, The North pole will descend and the south will receed for half the year, vice versa the other half. it is -20 degrees on average, so make sure you're bundled up on the surface. Earth is earth, duh, but Luna can only stay habitable naturally for about a year and a half before freezing over. Minerva is -2 degrees on average, and is quite hospitable provided you have a thick coat. Now for politics! Mars comes dangerously close to earth every 5 years or so, coming within Lunas' orbit. Every 5 years a colony ship is sent to start expanding earth nations onto mars' surface. the french control most of Mars' main continent, leaving Germany, Belgium, And England to control the a majority of the small islands. local populations combat the first three colonization attempts, but are eventually wiped out by a massive french invasion force. the other nations quietly begin to grab up islands all over the planet, eventually claiming a majority of it as "Governed Territories." Much fear is present on earth, because Auroras' orbit is highly unstalbe, and common belief is that mars will push it into an orbit where Luna will slingshot it into earth. some groups suggest putting it into orbit around mars at the next approach, while other wish to blow it out of the sky. it is a source of tension between nations, as no government can agree on a potential solution, although each nation knows that it will only work as an international effort. France starts a secret program to weaponize Aurora, called Lune de Sang. construction begins, but the project is abandoned less than a month into construction. France is in svere debt, and attempts to pull off a scheme similar to the South Sea bubble, but this plan fails, and France loses control of the Martian colonies. Russian scientists toy with way's to terraform Minerva, but when Julian Delphiki becomes the first human to step foot on it's surface, they seriously begin working on the idea, using the structure of plant leaves to create artificial photosynthesis.They start the machines, and begin plans for colonies. further exploration occurs.France has invested heavily in russias' plan,hoping it will revive the dying french economy. then first contact is made with the primitive natives. the world is horrified, and russia immediately abandons the machines, eaving them to rust on minerva. Frances' economy is destroyed. The Empire falls into dissarray, reemerging as a pseudo-communist state. eh? Just an Idea...

 

--EDIT--

Minerva will remain capable of life, but the oceans will eventually freeze over and the ecosystem will collapse.

Mars is incredibly stable, good climate, perfect for human colonization. 

Venus is still a hellhole.

Vulcan's surface STILL hasn't heated up to the point where there is surface lava.

1 hour ago, Spaceception said:

I know where that is, but i can't actually save it, the US2 site said Ctrl + s but it didn't work.

So the hotkey AND the manual button are nonfunctional? I don't know about that... hmm....

[ChrisSpace]

7 hours ago, Spaceception said:

I made most of the inner solar system in US2, Vulcan isn't in any way stable for longer than a month, it either dissipated when I tried fine-tuning its mass, or flung out when I sped through time.

However, all other major bodies (Mercury, Venus, Earth/Luna, Mars, Bellona, and Minerva) were just fine, and fit the specifications.

If you speed up time enough in US2, anything with a fast orbit will be flung outwards. And my simulations are showing that it would take a really really long time for Vulcan to dissipate.

2 hours ago, Andem said:

I remade my best interpretation of the system, with a more details added. the result was relatively different, Mars, Earth, Luna, and Minerva are all Habitable. Mars has perpetual Ice Ages, The North pole will descend and the south will receed for half the year, vice versa the other half. it is -20 degrees on average, so make sure you're bundled up on the surface. Earth is earth, duh, but Luna can only stay habitable naturally for about a year and a half before freezing over. Minerva is -2 degrees on average, and is quite hospitable provided you have a thick coat.

I've easily made Mars, Luna and Minerva habitable in some of my simulations. I have no idea what's going on with yours.

2 hours ago, Andem said:

Mars comes dangerously close to earth every 5 years or so, coming within Lunas' orbit.

- Facepalm -

2 hours ago, Andem said:

Much fear is present on earth, because Auroras' orbit is highly unstalbe, and common belief is that mars will push it into an orbit where Luna will slingshot it into earth. some groups suggest putting it into orbit around mars at the next approach, while other wish to blow it out of the sky.

??? Aurora is supposed to be Earth's second moon, not some kind of Aldrin cycler!

2 hours ago, Andem said:

Just an Idea...

Yeah, how about you leave that stuff to me?

2 hours ago, Andem said:

Minerva will remain capable of life, but the oceans will eventually freeze over and the ecosystem will collapse.

Mars is incredibly stable, good climate, perfect for human colonization. 

Venus is still a hellhole.

Vulcan's surface STILL hasn't heated up to the point where there is surface lava.

Like I said, I'm not having problems with Minerva, Venus or Vulcan.

[Spaceception]

1 minute ago, ChrisSpace said:

If you speed up time enough in US2, anything with a fast orbit will be flung outwards. And my simulations are showing that it would take a really really long time for Vulcan to dissipate.

I've easily made Mars, Luna and Minerva habitable in some of my simulations. I have no idea what's going on with yours.

Yeah, I figured that out, is it a bug?

I did too, maybe Andem didn't look at the front page closely enough.

[ChrisSpace]

Front post updated. Luna grew, Mars shrank, Tyche was pushed further out and Planet Nine has been added.

[Andem]

13 minutes ago, ChrisSpace said:

If you speed up time enough in US2, anything with a fast orbit will be flung outwards. And my simulations are showing that it would take a really really long time for Vulcan to dissipate.

I've easily made Mars, Luna and Minerva habitable in some of my simulations. I have no idea what's going on with yours.

- Facepalm -

??? Aurora is supposed to be Earth's second moon, not some kind of Aldrin cycler!

Yeah, how about you leave that stuff to me?

Like I said, I'm not having problems with Minerva, Venus or Vulcan.

I probably got some of the orbital parameters a little off, which would explain some of the issues With the system I am experiancing.

Aurora Is a second moon, bu Luna pulls it around into a wonky orbit (Probably just the way I set it up.)

OK, OK. Your project...

Just a question, how long have you been running your simulation? So far mine is at about 1250 yrs.

 

Also, The planets themselves were completely habitable... just not quite as habitable as when they started... 

Edited January 27, 2016 by Andem