Following "The Martian" Route

[BebopRebop]

I've been playing the realism overhaul mod lately and have been enjoying it immensely. I'm about to go for a moon landing, but have been looking forward more to a manned Mars mission. I went looking for a map of Mars (to find inspiration for landing sites) and found Mars Trek. Then I saw that they have the route taken in The Martian (or at least their interpretation of it). The terrain looks interesting enough, so I've decided that would be my Mars mission.

So now I'm looking for any tips on the best way to do this in the least number of launches. Naturally it has to be done with a rover, preferably with a lab attached. I'm thinking of having an ascent vehicle land beforehand and having supply drops along the way for life support. To get there, I'm thinking either have the crew land in the rover or have the rover land earlier and the crew follow in a dedicated descent module (for safety).

Is there any simpler way to get all this stuff there or are multiple launches the easiest? Should I scrap the supply drops and just stuff it all in the rover? Am I forgetting anything?

[UnusualAttitude]

Hi there! Fellow RSS player here. First of all: I'm impressed by your idea. This would be a pretty cool challenge... also, thanks for the Mars Trek info, I didn't know about that and it might come in useful to me.

Here is my advice, based on my fairly limited experience of RSS (I recently got my first robotic rovers down on Mars).

-Forget "the least number of launches", unless you are using mod engines that allow you to launch hundreds of tonnes into LEO. As you may have already realised, things get pretty huge in RSS very quickly, particularly if you are using life support mods and want to take some crew accommodation with you. This is gonna take as many launches as it takes.

-Yes, I would send the rover and the crew descent module separately, for safety and realism. Be aware that precision landings on Mars are difficult. Can you drive your rover to meet your crew's landing site remotely? Are you using Remote Tech, and if so, will you have coverage on the Red Planet? Are you using signal delay?

-Landing a rover with a Lab on Mars sounds pretty ambitious to me, although it may certainly be possible. But why don't you leave it in orbit? Mk2 parts make for much better, nicer-looking rovers (see my lunar rover below). If you really want a Mk2 Lab, Suicidal Insanity's mod has one, albeit with more limited capabilities.

-Finally, before you do anything, I would run a few rover tests on the Martian surface using hyperedit. I have had many problems with rovers sinking through the surface on the Moon and on Mars. This may or may not have been fixed in 1.1 (I'm still on 1.0.4 for the moment). It would be a shame if you planned your mission and got everything down on Mars, only to be frustrated by this...

The best of luck to you!

Regards, UA.

PS: you do realise that 3,200km is a long way, right? That is nearly a double Kerbin circumnavigation. I'm looking forward to be seriously impressed if you can pull this off!

Edited May 13, 2016 by UnusualAttitude

[Majorjim!]

Wheels are broken ATM and do not work in RSS at all I believe.

[BebopRebop]

11 minutes ago, Majorjim said:

Wheels are broken ATM and do not work in RSS at all I believe.

I'm still using 1.0.5 for RO, so I should hopefully be unaffected by the 1.1 wheels. Unless this is a different wheel problem with RSS.

33 minutes ago, UnusualAttitude said:

Hi there! Fellow RSS player here. First of all: I'm impressed by your idea. This would be a pretty cool challenge... also, thanks for the Mars Trek info, I didn't know about that and it might come in useful to me.

Thanks! I realize it's a long route, but I'm planning on working on it little by little over a long period and possibly using AutoRove for the boring parts if I can get it for 1.0.5.

38 minutes ago, UnusualAttitude said:

-Forget "the least number of launches", unless you are using mod engines that allow you to launch hundreds of tonnes into LEO. As you may have already realised, things get pretty huge in RSS very quickly, particularly if you are using life support mods and want to take some crew accommodation with you. This is gonna take as many launches as it takes.

-Yes, I would send the rover and the crew descent module separately, for safety and realism. Be aware that precision landings on Mars are difficult. Can you drive your rover to meet your crew's landing site remotely? Are you using Remote Tech, and if so, will you have coverage on the Red Planet? Are you using signal delay?

-Landing a rover with a Lab on Mars sounds pretty ambitious to me, although it may certainly be possible. But why don't you leave it in orbit? Mk2 parts make for much better, nicer-looking rovers (see my lunar rover below). If you really want a Mk2 Lab, Suicidal Insanity's mod has one, albeit with more limited capabilities.

-Finally, before you do anything, I would run a few rover tests on the Martian surface using hyperedit. I have had many problems with rovers sinking through the surface on the Moon and on Mars. This may or may not have been fixed in 1.1 (I'm still on 1.0.4 for the moment). It would be a shame if you planned your mission and got everything down on Mars, only to be frustrated by this...

Thanks for the tips, I'll definitely check in to using hyperedit for surface testing, unless there's a way to do it with the KCT simulator. Signal delay won't be an issue since I'm not using RT (it doesn't want to work right), but precision landings are my main concern, mostly for the supply drops.

My rover is based on one I used for Duna, which had a lab. The main reason for putting it on the rover is that I was under the impression it gave a science boost to have the lab on the surface of a planet. I also considered putting it at the bottom of the ascent module and leaving it behind when I launched. It would depend on how much time the crew could stay there before a launch window opened, I suppose.

[Enorats]

Personally I've never understood why they landed the ascent vehicle before the crew got there. Shouldn't the ascent vehicle also double as the descent vehicle since it has to have crew capacity and land anyway?

[NotaKlutz-42516]

Playing KSP in RSS? You are very skilled. I might try that sometime

[Guest]

22 minutes ago, Enorats said:

Personally I've never understood why they landed the ascent vehicle before the crew got there. Shouldn't the ascent vehicle also double as the descent vehicle since it has to have crew capacity and land anyway?

The Martian is based on the Mars Direct mission proposal: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars_Direct

In it it states:

Quote

Once there, a series of chemical reactions (the Sabatier reaction coupled with electrolysis) would be used to combine a small amount of hydrogen (8 tons) carried by the Earth Return Vehicle with the carbon dioxide of the Martian atmosphere to create up to 112 tonnes of methane and oxygen. This relatively simple chemical-engineering procedure was utilized regularly in the 19th and 20th centuries,^[8] and would ensure that only 7% of the return propellant would need to be carried to the surface of Mars

 

[StahnAileron]

10 minutes ago, Enorats said:

Personally I've never understood why they landed the ascent vehicle before the crew got there. Shouldn't the ascent vehicle also double as the descent vehicle since it has to have crew capacity and land anyway?

@Enorats It's stated (in the book at least; movie may have been less obvious) that the MAV is sent before hand due to fuel requirements. It more fuel efficient to land an "empty" vessel and produce the fuel in-situ for launching than carry all that fuel with it. It takes fuel to carry fuel (the rocket paradox). Even more so on an atmospheric planet where areobraking helps. (The space shuttle didn't use any fuel other than the de-orbit burn when landing.) Mars has a thinner atmosphere, sure, but it's still something. So the MAV is launched and landed first. It's essentially fuel depleted when it lands. It spends the next however long manufacturing fuel for the ascent in the future. This is why it's landed first.

@BebopRebop On topic now: Are you planning on essentially recreating "The Martian" scenario? Since I just mentioned it, are you going to drop an ISRU-powered ascent stage as well? I'm assuming you want to retrieve the crew once you're done with the roving, no?

[cubinator]

It doesn't need any supplies as long as there's a bag of potatoes.

[BebopRebop]

@StahnAileron I guess in a very loose way it'll be like The Martian, but mostly I'm just using the route (this is basically an interplanetary road trip). The hardware will be whatever works out best and won't necessarily be the same. I wasn't planning on using the ISRU because I think it isn't affected by real fuels and still just produces liquidfuel and oxidizer. I'm hoping I can transport and land a fully fueled MAV at the Schiaparelli Crater.

I'm also considering using a spaceplane style descent vehicle, if possible, in order to hopefully have more control and get closer to the rover. Mostly I just like the idea of it, but it might be getting a little too ambitious.

[StahnAileron]

Hmm... How is your KSP installation set up? RSS and RF; any other mods of note? Since you're using rover, Angel-125's Buffalo system comes to mind as a viable mod to use. Or are you sticking to a relatively stock-ish experience?

[Enorats]

Ah, I see. Didn't know it was producing fuel during the time between landing and the crew arriving and using it to ascend. That makes sense.