[1.12.x] Near Future Technologies (September 6)

[TheSaint]

Just in time for the weekend!

[tsaven]

Sorry for a dumb question, but NFProps = NFPropulsion?  Wouldn't that have its own release package?

[DStaal]

8 minutes ago, tsaven said:

Sorry for a dumb question, but NFProps = NFPropulsion?  Wouldn't that have its own release package?

Props is a variety of IVA props he's using among all his mods.  Technically it has it's own package somewhere I think, but it's a separate thing than the Propulsion, which is an engine package.

[Pthigrivi]

Woop! Thanks Nertea! Also is there a reason NFLV's big tanks have a max skin temp of 1200? I've been tweaking the cfgs up to help with stage recovery. 

[radonek]

Hey, I've got a possible bug here. Clicking engine stab in VAB/SPH will throw "InvalidOperationException: Cannot get volume before parent has been linked" into log and tab switching breaks down (tab buttons react to click but parts panel  is frozen). Same issue with structural tab. I shuffled mods around a bit until I found out that removing Near Future Spacecraft and Near Future Construction makes problem disappear. Anyone else encountered this?

[Streetwind]

@radonek We're going to need more info than that. It could be a cross-mod problem, and you just happened to find one of two or more mods involved in it. For example, can you reproduce this in a fresh install, either with a copy of your modlist, or only NF mods on their own? And what version (game and NF packs) are you using anyway?

[radonek]

I'm diggining into it right now. So far I can tell that removing all mods except NearFuture and B9PArtSwitch does not help. Neither does using spacedock package instead of CKAN. There is one difference however in package - distributed  modulemanager is 2.8.1 while I have 2.7.4. Bad thing is that using that 2.8.1 makes KSP fall on  abort() during startup. Will dig some more…

Update: removing other mods fixed problem with newer modulemanager.  Will try to bisect to failing mod next, but that is a different matter. My problem with NearFuture seems to be  bad dependency in CKAN package and I gather this is not Nerteas doing.

Edited October 29, 2017 by radonek
updated

[Frag2000]

** UPDATE ... THE ELECTRIC ENGINES WERE FOUND IN THE NODES UNDER THE ION PROPULSION BRANCH. SORRY FOR THE CONFUSION !! **

 

Hi Nertea,

I installed all mods of this thread and I REALLY enjoy those so far. I have a glitch though and I looked around to get this resolved without any success.

I have the community tree as recommended and all your mods from this thread are at the latest release. All objects do appear in the community tree (at the R&D Center) but the engines contained in the "Near Future Propulsion" are not. those are the only parts that are not showing up. Any hint on what could be wrong"

Here is the log file in the following "spoiler" section ... Also let me know if you want me to provide any other info.

 

[Gargantuan browser-destroying log file removed by moderator]

Edited October 30, 2017 by Frag2000
Gargantuan browser-destroying log file removed by moderator

[Snark]

11 minutes ago, Frag2000 said:

Here is the log file in the following "spoiler" section ... Also let me know if you want me to provide any other info.

Hi @Frag2000,

Just a note that I've snipped the log from your post.  Pasting ginormous text files like that into a post can really bring people's browsers to their knees, especially if they're on a mobile device.  Unfortunately, putting it in a spoiler section doesn't help-- the browser loads the contents even if the person browsing doesn't expand the spoiler.

Posting log files can definitely be a useful thing to do... just don't paste the content here in the forums, is all.  Instead, post it to some third-party site (there are loads of free ones out there on the internet), and then post a link to it here.

Thank you for your understanding.

[Streetwind]

18 hours ago, radonek said:

My problem with NearFuture seems to be  bad dependency in CKAN package and I gather this is not Nerteas doing.

Yeah, we don't support CKAN installations because with it, NF becomes kind of a mess. Due to the way it is distributed - split into various sub-packs, each with optional components, some with inter-dependencies, some with common resources that must not be duplicated, etc - you end up making between two and four CKAN entries out of every single pack. There's six Near Future packs, and if they all update because a new KSP version is out, then may or may not have to update none, some, or all of the various entries. And then there's the fact that some of the stuff used in Near Future (like the props package) is used in other mods Nertea makes, so there's need to split and inter-link things even further... Even if someone is dedicated to keeping it maintained, there is a constant potential for mistakes.

So, yeah. Please make it easier for yourself and just download the zip.

 

8 hours ago, Frag2000 said:

All objects do appear in the community tree (at the R&D Center) but the engines contained in the "Near Future Propulsion" are not. those are the only parts that are not showing up.

Did you add the tech tree mod to an existing save? That sometimes causes issues. CTT is usually (>95% of all cases) fine with it, but I would never discount the possibility.

If you start a career from scratch, do the parts still not show up?

[Frag2000]

17 hours ago, Snark said:

Hi @Frag2000,

Just a note that I've snipped the log from your post.  Pasting ginormous text files like that into a post can really bring people's browsers to their knees, especially if they're on a mobile device.  Unfortunately, putting it in a spoiler section doesn't help-- the browser loads the contents even if the person browsing doesn't expand the spoiler.

Posting log files can definitely be a useful thing to do... just don't paste the content here in the forums, is all.  Instead, post it to some third-party site (there are loads of free ones out there on the internet), and then post a link to it here.

Thank you for your understanding.

Yep those make sense ... my bad.

 

9 hours ago, Streetwind said:

 

Did you add the tech tree mod to an existing save? That sometimes causes issues. CTT is usually (>95% of all cases) fine with it, but I would never discount the possibility.

If you start a career from scratch, do the parts still not show up?

** UPDATE ... THE ELECTRIC ENGINES WERE FOUND IN THE NODES UNDER THE ION PROPULSION BRANCH. SORRY FOR THE CONFUSION !! **

 just updated the Propulsion mod to the 1.3.1 release. Unfortunately, I did not check before if the previous version of the mod was showing in the tree. The community tree was set on my clean install 2-3 weeks ago (also latest release).

So as I said, all you components are showing off, but only the Propulsion ones are not. I tried to start a new game ... same issue. I guess the new engines should be in the node "Improved Nuclear Propulsion", "High Efficiency Nuclear Propulsion" and so on?

 

Edited October 30, 2017 by Frag2000

[Nertea]

On 10/29/2017 at 7:04 AM, radonek said:

I'm diggining into it right now. So far I can tell that removing all mods except NearFuture and B9PArtSwitch does not help. Neither does using spacedock package instead of CKAN. There is one difference however in package - distributed  modulemanager is 2.8.1 while I have 2.7.4. Bad thing is that using that 2.8.1 makes KSP fall on  abort() during startup. Will dig some more…

Update: removing other mods fixed problem with newer modulemanager.  Will try to bisect to failing mod next, but that is a different matter. My problem with NearFuture seems to be  bad dependency in CKAN package and I gather this is not Nerteas doing.

Indeed, that 2.7.4 MM will probably break a lot of things. CKAN sucks. 

1 hour ago, Frag2000 said:

So as I said, all you components are showing off, but only the Propulsion ones are not. I tried to start a new game ... same issue. I guess the new engines should be in the node "Improved Nuclear Propulsion", "High Efficiency Nuclear Propulsion" and so on?

 

That's not the case, none of the engines are nuclear. They should be in the Electric Propulsion branch... have you looked there?

[Frag2000]

35 minutes ago, Nertea said:

Indeed, that 2.7.4 MM will probably break a lot of things. CKAN sucks. 

That's not the case, none of the engines are nuclear. They should be in the Electric Propulsion branch... have you looked there?

I feel like an idiot! I am so used to look at the top of the tree in the propulsion branch than I did not consider that they could be somewhere else in that big tree. Yes I found those ... I will edit my post to update.

Really sorry about the confusion and thank you very much for the explanation!

[Nertea]

On 10/28/2017 at 2:58 PM, Pthigrivi said:

Woop! Thanks Nertea! Also is there a reason NFLV's big tanks have a max skin temp of 1200? I've been tweaking the cfgs up to help with stage recovery. 

Are you sure you have the latest version (post 1.1.2)? There was a temperature issue corrected here. Otherwise, I haven't touched the skin temperatures, just left them at defaults, same as stock tanks. 

19 minutes ago, Frag2000 said:

I feel like an idiot! I am so used to look at the top of the tree in the propulsion branch than I did not consider that they could be somewhere else in that big tree. Yes I found those ... I will edit my post to update.

 

No problem, glad it was easily resolved :). 

[Pthigrivi]

4 minutes ago, Nertea said:

Are you sure you have the latest version (post 1.1.2)? There was a temperature issue corrected here. Otherwise, I haven't touched the skin temperatures, just left them at defaults, same as stock tanks. 

Ah, maybe that was it. I'll see how they do with the new version.

[radonek]

12 hours ago, Streetwind said:

Yeah, we don't support CKAN installations because with it, NF becomes kind of a mess. Due to the way it is distributed - split into various sub-packs, each with optional components, some with inter-dependencies, some with common resources that must not be duplicated, etc - you end up making between two and four CKAN entries out of every single pack. There's six Near Future packs, and if they all update because a new KSP version is out, then may or may not have to update none, some, or all of the various entries. And then there's the fact that some of the stuff used in Near Future (like the props package) is used in other mods Nertea makes, so there's need to split and inter-link things even further... Even if someone is dedicated to keeping it maintained, there is a constant potential for mistakes.

So, yeah. Please make it easier for yourself and just download the zip.

I prefer CKAN precisely because it makes my life easier, thank you very much. I understand why you don't like hassle with packaging, but some kind soul took good care of NF for which I am grateful.

[WakabaGyaru]

Hello,

Could you please give me the link to FarFutureTechnologies mod? I honestly tried to google it, but found nothing. Sorry, if I'm blind and can't find an obvious thing. But KSP shows me the following: https://imgur.com/thEUjb4 and "Download" button brings me here...

[Cebi]

@WakabaGyaru Go to the Nert's Dev Thread click on here in the first post and you will be redirected to the last post with a relevant download link.

[Nertea]

7 hours ago, WakabaGyaru said:

Hello,

Could you please give me the link to FarFutureTechnologies mod? I honestly tried to google it, but found nothing. Sorry, if I'm blind and can't find an obvious thing. But KSP shows me the following: https://imgur.com/thEUjb4 and "Download" button brings me here...

There was a bug with version 1.0.2 of NFLV that labeled it in that dialog as Far FutureTechnologies. So that thing should say "Near Future Launch Vehicles", for which there is a link in this thread.

 

[WakabaGyaru]

29 minutes ago, Nertea said:

There was a bug with version 1.0.2 of NFLV that labeled it in that dialog as Far FutureTechnologies. So that thing should say "Near Future Launch Vehicles", for which there is a link in this thread.

 

Thank you! This fixed the problem.

[aluc24]

@Nertea, I would like to report a bug. Sometimes a Reactor Core from NF Electric overheats during high time warp, although it is perfectly fine in low time warp or real-time. I only noticed it with MX-0 so far. I usually use a single small radiator panel to cool it, and it's enough, even when the reactor is at 100% output. But as soon as I warp, it overheats and shuts down.
Also, sometimes when I warp (with reactor output lowered to work around this bug), I get a message saying "A producer of electric charge has incoherent behavior at high warp speed. Unload the vessel before warping".  This message comes from Kerbalism addon. It only does this for NF reactors, all other electricity sources work fine.

 

Is this a known bug? Is there a fix?

[Streetwind]

9 hours ago, aluc24 said:

Sometimes a Reactor Core from NF Electric overheats during high time warp, although it is perfectly fine in low time warp or real-time. I only noticed it with MX-0 so far. I usually use a single small radiator panel to cool it, and it's enough, even when the reactor is at 100% output. But as soon as I warp, it overheats and shuts down.

"Sometimes" is not a useful qualifier, I'm afraid  

Can you find a scenario where this reliably happens? Ideally in an install without deeply invasive overhaul mods like Kerbalism?

[aluc24]

29 minutes ago, Streetwind said:

"Sometimes" is not a useful qualifier, I'm afraid  

Can you find a scenario where this reliably happens? Ideally in an install without deeply invasive overhaul mods like Kerbalism?

Well, it happens every time, to be exact, when the MX-0 is set to high output, and the time warp is at the max. It is very likely that interaction with Kerbalism or some other mod causes this problem. But I have more than 60 addons running, so testing which one it is would be very tiresome. Likely Kerbalism. I can report this to Kerbalism thread, but I think the author would say that the overheating issue is on NF's end.

[Streetwind]

Yeah, cross-mod interactions are hard to nail down. What I find most puzzling is why this happens to the MX-0, but apparently not the others? Or have you only tested the MX-0?

[aluc24]

21 minutes ago, Streetwind said:

Yeah, cross-mod interactions are hard to nail down. What I find most puzzling is why this happens to the MX-0, but apparently not the others? Or have you only tested the MX-0?

I haven't tested it yet. I'm doing career, and MX-0 is perfect for these ion probes. It's likely that the issue persists with other reactors. I will test it in sandbox mode later today. Anyway, none of the addons I use have anything to do with modifying thermal mechanics. At least as far as I know. So I'm not sure what causes this problem, or how to track it down. My game loads 10-15 minutes, and there are 60 of these addons, so, you know