Stock BDA dogfighters 1.2 (youtube)

[goduranus]

Triops says each plane can have up to 6 missiles between Sidewinders and AMRAAMs

[drtricky]

8 minutes ago, goduranus said:

Triops says each plane can have up to 6 missiles between Sidewinders and AMRAAMs

The deed has been done. 5 missiles per aircraft.

[KenjiKrafts]

Here is the HEI-45 a super agile and nimble interceptor, it's kitted out with two 30mm GAU Cannons, and 4 AARM missiles to back that up! It's Flare and Chaff equip and comes with two EMF jammers to break those pesky locks. 

 

[keptin]

@goduranus Ok, another Micro redesign. The Micro AIV: https://u66999462.dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/66999462/Micro AIV.craft

 

Also, just another note. Since positioning is so important to the match, and the AI does wacky stuff, best of 3 matches would probably remove some victory randomness. Though, I understand that it's 3x the work.

Edited June 25, 2017 by keptin

[goduranus]

Won't do best out of 3 because this isn't a tournament. Don't have the patience for that.

[goduranus]

The Dorito(upgrade) vs HEI-45:

HEI and Dorito both has poor missile ejection settings that cause them to occasionally blow themselves up.

Spoiler

The HEI got mauled during missile exchange, seemingly because it's G-limiter is set too low so it couldn't pull hard enough to evade effectively.

 

Edited June 26, 2017 by goduranus

[goduranus]

Dorito(upgraded) vs F-10 Striker 

Spoiler

F-10 Strikers often turn too hard and lose too much speed to fly effectively. A F-10 and a Dorito were destroyed off camera, that I suspect were due to collisions with their own missiles. The Doritos gained an advantage in the gun fight and won the match.

 

[KenjiKrafts]

43 minutes ago, goduranus said:

The Dorito(upgrade) vs HEI-45:

HEI and Dorito both has poor missile ejection settings that cause them to occasionally blow themselves up.

  Reveal hidden contents

The HEI got mauled during missile exchange, seemingly because it's G-limiter is set too low so it couldn't pull hard enough to evade effectively.

 

God, I got hammered, idk why the HEI-45 didn't use it's full maneuverability? It can pull 32G turns and do a 180 without stalling, but there it was like a slug, i'll make an new fighter  

[goduranus]

The AI pilot part is set to a maximum of 10Gs. Maybe having two AI pilots is causing problems as well.

Edited June 26, 2017 by goduranus

[keptin]

7 hours ago, KenjiKrafts said:

God, I got hammered, idk why the HEI-45 didn't use it's full maneuverability? It can pull 32G turns and do a 180 without stalling, but there it was like a slug, i'll make an new fighter  

I pitted the HEI-45 against the Micro AIV and it didn't fare well. It'd make a great supersonic bomber, but it might be too heavy for a dog fighter. You're welcome to download the Micro AIV above to test it against your new design.

[Joseph Kerman]

No one said you cannot spam jammers

[V7 Aerospace]

Wait, is BD A working in the latest version?

I'd like to have a go, I've had a few jets sitting around for ages that I'd like to finally test against something.

[goduranus]

BDA 0.2.1.0 works for KSP 1.2

BDA 0.2.1.1 works for KSP 1.3

BDA 0.2.1.2 seems to be bugged

Edit: What if we add some more design possibilities to spice things up? If you build with restrictions you get to deploy more planes?

 

So, base = 2 planes

+1 plane for no missiles

+1 plane for no guns

+1 plane for using no countermeasures and ECM

+1 plane for using only Junos

 

So you could deploy up to 6 planes with a plane that relies on melee combat, but maybe 5 slow missile boats or 4 gunfighters can be actually competitive against 2 fully equipped planes.

Edited June 28, 2017 by goduranus

[drtricky]

@goduranus I hate to say this, but I heard jammers only work at ranges over 10 km or beyond. Any closer, and they're just dead-weight.

[goduranus]

@drtricky Ok I tested this some more, ECM is very useful, what the wiki said about 10km and beyond is not true, with some configurations you can make a plane immune to AMRAAMs beyond at about 6km or less.

Edited June 28, 2017 by goduranus

[Eidahlil]

Interesting idea with the numbers advantage. Let's try it out. (Also no need for melee planes, you can use bombs! )

http://kerbalx.com/juzeris/Gunfrid

Also, is there a leaderboard? I lost track of which is the coolest plane now.

Spoiler

I was looking at the Su-47 while making it, but then the nose got replaced for some reason I no longer remember, and now it looks like an ugly child of Su-47 and MiG-15.

 

Edited June 28, 2017 by Eidahlil

[goduranus]

It says not the craft you're looking for.

Here's the crafts so far, I don't have a solid method but I am thinking of having new submissions fight the rank 3 plane to replace it or be eliminated. Eliminated planes that are updated can be entered again to fight rank 3. Current rank 1-3 can be upgraded and keep their spot, and the author can ask for a match with the above ranked plane or let it be until challenged.

• ADFX-01 Morgan, beaten MicroA up mk3 to and the original Dorito
• MicroA variants, beaten all except Morgan
• Dorito upgrade, beaten all except MicroA and Morgan
• F-10 Striker currently eliminated until author updates
• F-2 Badger currently eliminated until author updates
• HEI  currently eliminated until author updates because it seems to have problems with AI settings

Next up would be a match between the most recent MicroA and Dorito variants, with the winning fighting the Morgan

Edited June 28, 2017 by goduranus

[drtricky]

1 hour ago, goduranus said:

@drtricky Ok I tested this some more, ECM is very useful, what the wiki said about 10km and beyond is not true, with some configurations you can make a plane immune to AMRAAMs beyond at about 6km or less.

Interesting. Does this involve orienting the jammers in certain directions?

[goduranus]

@drtricky, it seems to need a plane with a very small profile to get a small radar cross section, with 2-3 jammers you can force the enemy to dodge by having your AMRAAMs' actives lock onto them before their AMRAAMs can lock onto you with actives, this breaks the command guidance and cause their first missile salvo go dud.

First match with experimental outnumbering rules, The Dorito(upgrade) vs Gunfrid

Gunfrid deploys +2 planes by having no missiles or countermeasures.

Bad luck for the Dorito, first match I ran a Dorito got exploded by its own missile, so I reloaded and ran again, and once again a Dorito got exploded by its own missile. This makes me think it's some sort of design flaw(the orientation you attached the missile and its ejection speed and ejection timer settings)

 

Edited June 28, 2017 by goduranus

[drtricky]

34 minutes ago, goduranus said:

Bad luck for the Dorito, first match I ran a Dorito got exploded by its own missile, so I reloaded and ran again, and once again a Dorito got exploded by its own missile. This makes me think it's some sort of design flaw(the orientation you attached the missile and its ejection speed and ejection timer settings)

In the 10 rounds I ran my plane, self-detonation only happened once. I think it really is nothing more than sheer bad luck.

But regardless, I've updated my plane so that all the missiles will eject downwards (relative to the aircraft). It's the same thing, but with different missile arrangement. It's technically heavier because it has two more missile racks, but I honestly don't think the slightly increased weight, or the more reliable missiles would've made a difference in the last fight.

Edited June 28, 2017 by drtricky

[goduranus]

Looks like trading missiles to get more planes might be the way to go.

Micro AIV vs Gunfrid

Spoiler

Gunfrids dodge all missiles without any use of countermeasures, and proceed to best MicroAIV in the gunfight

 

[goduranus]

Morgan vs Gunfrid

Spoiler

Wow, looks like countermeasures are overrated, a well designed plane can dodge all missiles without them

 

[keptin]

That's a pretty drastic change in the rules. I'd say that calls for a completely new design.

[goduranus]

Morgan modified vs Gunfrid

Ditched the countermeasures on the Morgan in an attempt to counter @Eidahlil's superior numbers, also swapped Vulcans for GAUs, changed weapons manager settings so missiles are harder to dodge.

https://kerbalx.com/goduranus/ADFX-01-Morgan-D

Spoiler

2 Gunfrids lost in the initial missile salvo turned the odds in favor of the Morgan, with another Gunfrid lost to a missile sometime afterwards. The Morgan won the match with a gun kill.

 

[goduranus]

Missile Slowboat, +3 planes https://kerbalx.com/goduranus/MissileSlowboat

+1 No guns,

+1 No Countermeasures or ECM

+1 Junos only

Missile Slowboat takes on the Dorito:

Seems like older designs are not coping too well with the new outnumbering rules, might need a new thread so new rules are in the opening post

 

Edited June 29, 2017 by goduranus