The Kurburgring Lap

[Colonel Cbplayer]

4 minutes ago, Azimech said:

I have drift cars, all of the muscle cars I've built are capable of drifting, just not like the Japanese like it. It's all about finding a balance and using some tricks like braking or reversing while keeping the jets spinning, using Boost Flaps to suddenly change the balance helps as well. Spring/damper settings, the right CoM and downforce etc. No reaction wheels nor changing grip values while driving are needed.

For more info, check these cars. You'll notice they all have their own distinct personalities.

https://kerbalx.com/Azimech/77I--1968-Mustang-Fastback-v11
https://kerbalx.com/Azimech/77I--1969-Camaro-SS-v11
https://kerbalx.com/Azimech/77I--1971-Challenger-RT-12
https://kerbalx.com/Azimech/77I--1969-Charger-RT-40

1st: has 8 wheels, wrong wheels

2nd: has 8 wheels, wrong wheels

3rd: has 8 wheels, wrong wheels

4th: has 8 wheels, wrong wheels

None of those cars turn as sharply as you need for these corners anyway

totally can be done without reaction wheels

[Azimech]

Just now, Colonel Cbplayer said:

1st: has 8 wheels, wrong wheels

2nd: has 8 wheels, wrong wheels

3rd: has 8 wheels, wrong wheels

4th: has 8 wheels, wrong wheels

None of those cars turn as sharply as you need for these corners anyway

totally can be done without reaction wheels

I didn't enter them in the race. They are muscle cars aimed at recreating the roadholding of the cars of 50 years ago. You talked about drifting and that it wouldn't be possible without reaction wheels. I've proven you otherwise. And as you will see, we are perfectly capable of racing and setting good times even with the wheels you deem unworthy.

[Colonel Cbplayer]

Just now, Azimech said:

I didn't enter them in the race. They are muscle cars aimed at recreating the roadholding of the cars of 50 years ago. You talked about drifting and that it wouldn't be possible without reaction wheels. I've proven you otherwise. And as you will see, we are perfectly capable of racing and setting good times even with the wheels you deem unworthy.

You haven't shown me drifting with only 4 TR LR wheels 

[DarkOwl57]

20 minutes ago, Azimech said:

For more info, check these cars. You'll notice they all have their own distinct personalities.

Oh don't I know it. In fact, from what I've driven, all of your cars have a distinct personality. The Amsterdam GT is the most temperamental of the lot, with a crazy, almost impossible amount of speed combined with little high-speed grip (In the OTTAC I compared it to a pit bull; getting grip and refusing to let go). The Can-Am and the Lambo is kind of like a celebrities kid; Growing up in the spotlight, everyone heaping nothing but predictions of a good future, etc. The Indycar is the amazing, perfect, can-do-no-wrong of 77l. I'd go on, but I'd probably derail the thread

[LABenterprises]

I'm currently working out the rules for a new car related challenge that will test cars based on looks, performance, fun, and flexibility, I Plan on calling it the best player's car challenge. The main Idea of the challenge would be to find the car that puts a smile on someones face like no other.

Edited September 19, 2017 by LABenterprises

[Azimech]

13 minutes ago, Colonel Cbplayer said:

You haven't shown me drifting with only 4 TR LR wheels 

That would take some time, find the right setup with a new car is a lot of work.

And even my old Charger can be fast and it was never built as a racer. I stripped 4 of the wheels, lowered ride height, stripped the interiour (still way to heavy), gave the wheels a 5deg. camber and did a 1:15 on the track. With four Juno's.

[DarkOwl57]

7 minutes ago, LABenterprises said:

I'm currently working out the rules for a new car related challenge that will test cars based on looks, performance, fun, and flexibility, I Plan on calling the best player's car challenge. The main Idea of the challenge would be to find the car that puts a smile on someones face like no other.

So we've got one challenge based on looks, one challenge based on performance, and one challenge based on..... uh... what's this one based on again? So far all I'm getting is a "No custom designs allowed" kinda vibe

[DoctorDavinci]

7 hours ago, Azimech said:

KSP electrical vehicles can be compared more with electric wheelchairs than a Tesla.

Nah, my electric wheelchair is faster than any electric powered KSP vehicles

5 minutes ago, DarkOwl57 said:

So we've got one challenge based on looks, one challenge based on performance, and one challenge based on..... uh... what's this one based on again? So far all I'm getting is a "No custom designs allowed" kinda vibe

The disqualification process basically consists of if the OP likes you or your car ... nothing more, nothing less

[LABenterprises]

2 minutes ago, DarkOwl57 said:

So we've got one challenge based on looks, one challenge based on performance, and one challenge based on..... uh... what's this one based on again? So far all I'm getting is a "No custom designs allowed" kinda vibe

I plan on allowing people to design their cars using whatever method they want, the only real rule so far is that the parts used in designs will have to be stock but textures won't matter. 

[Colonel Cbplayer]

I don't think Azimech gets the point that the submission is a drifting meme instead of one of trying to get the best time.

Also, love you for saying that was easy. You just downplayed all my hard work I put into that dumb car

[Azimech]

2 minutes ago, Colonel Cbplayer said:

I don't think Azimech gets the point that the submission is a drifting meme instead of one of trying to get the best time.

Also, love you for saying that was easy. You just downplayed all my hard work I put into that dumb car

Ah, no, I did not get that. I haven't watched Anime since 1993. If you know this challenge is about racing, than why invest all that time in a "drifting meme"?

If there's one thing about racing I do know: drifting is slower than driving straight. Also, more power for acceleration is fine but when you have to brake or go through corners all that extra mass isn't doing any good. That's why I think at some point 18 or 20 Juno's isn't going to prove to be much better than 6, 8 or 12 on a short, low speed circuit like this one.

So my intention was not to downplay your effort. And as a drifter it does have qualities. I am also curious to see what else you can build.

[Slam_Jones]

On 9/18/2017 at 4:59 PM, prgmTrouble said:

You could reasonably come up for a script which indexes each part's identifier and destroys non-indexed links, but I am not familiar with code languages that deal with this (perl?)

I actually made a program in visual studio a year or so ago which parses craft files and lists each individual part. Maybe if I tinker with it a bit (and do a fair bit of research) I can modify it to also show each part connection, and flag those with connections to non-existent parts. 

Seems easier than doing it by hand with a spreadsheet

If successful, I'll see if I can upload the program somewhere for public use.

 

Edit: Moving forward on this, my program is now able to identify and list parts and part links in separate boxes.  Next step, allowing it to cross-reference the lists and point out links that do not correspond to a part.

 

Edit 2: (Putting this here to avoid any derailing) As I type this, my program is enthusiastically combing through a 1200+ part craft file all on it's own, scrolling back and forth and verifying that each item in the Links box also appears in the Parts box.  Next step is allowing it to copy the part-less Links to a third box, so that the user may fix it by hand, then seeing what parts of the code I can modify to speed up the process.  I'm not confident in letting the program alter the actual craft files yet

 

Edit 3: All essential functions are now, well, functional.  Admittedly, it's not particularly quick, as high part counts increase time taken almost exponentially: as it is, it checks nearly the ENTIRE parts list per link... regardless, it is still several magnitudes quicker than doing so by hand.  Going through some testing with a few downloaded crafts.  Semi-Final test is a purposefully corrupted craft file with missing parts.  Final test is fixing my broken craft file

If it can find all the broken links, then it is basically done and ready for compiling.  Hoping for the best!

Edited September 20, 2017 by Slam_Jones
Grammar & Updates

[He_162]

15 hours ago, TheGuyNamedAlan said:

can you put in a section for electric cars that only uses battery power

 

The top speed of all electrically powered cars is the same essentially, due to the motor limit, making all electric cars capable of the same lap time, so there is no point.

13 hours ago, Colonel Cbplayer said:

Here is my submission with the meme car AE86

https://streamable.com/kouo3

Follows all the rules you say
4 wheels

18 junos

made 90% out of aero parts

Looks like a real life sport car (from the 80s)

(from the in-game timer) lap time 1:20

Do I get extra points for drifting?

I'll put the time up, congrats, you'll be in the "anything goes" category.

9 hours ago, DarkOwl57 said:

Hmmmmm..... Just realized... This sounds suspiciously familiar to.....

 

....... Naw, surely not. I mean.... Yeah, no way this is the same.. right?

It's not, this thread was started due to a rivalry between car replicator's in KerbalX, and as such, I started a forum thread for anyone else who want's in on it. The rules for my challenge are also much more specific.
 

 

7 hours ago, Azimech said:

I have drift cars, all of the muscle cars I've built are capable of drifting, just not like the Japanese like it. It's all about finding a balance and using some tricks like braking or reversing while keeping the jets spinning, using Boost Flaps to suddenly change the balance helps as well. Spring/damper settings, the right CoM and downforce etc. No reaction wheels nor changing grip values while driving are needed.

For more info, check these cars. You'll notice they all have their own distinct personalities.

https://kerbalx.com/Azimech/77I--1968-Mustang-Fastback-v11
https://kerbalx.com/Azimech/77I--1969-Camaro-SS-v11
https://kerbalx.com/Azimech/77I--1971-Challenger-RT-12
https://kerbalx.com/Azimech/77I--1969-Charger-RT-40

Which is too bad ... look what it did to my Charger!

This seriously should be made stock. And I'm willing to help in the future. Those brown wheels don't really do it for me.

 

I'll allow painted paint if I can have a second person verify the car can make that lap time (or within 1 - 2 seconds) after downloading the car and confirming there are no ulterior winning factors. (mods)

7 hours ago, Colonel Cbplayer said:

1st: has 8 wheels, wrong wheels

2nd: has 8 wheels, wrong wheels

3rd: has 8 wheels, wrong wheels

4th: has 8 wheels, wrong wheels

None of those cars turn as sharply as you need for these corners anyway

totally can be done without reaction wheels

Wheel rules were changed, and you don't need 8 wheels to drift.

7 hours ago, Colonel Cbplayer said:

You haven't shown me drifting with only 4 TR LR wheels 

You're starting to get on my nerves a little, watch yourself, you could have spent that whole time just making a quick body with wheels to determine if it's possible to drift, and yet you continue to argue and claim AZIMECH of all people is lying to you.

Oh, and the other wheel type is allowed.

7 hours ago, DarkOwl57 said:

So we've got one challenge based on looks, one challenge based on performance, and one challenge based on..... uh... what's this one based on again? So far all I'm getting is a "No custom designs allowed" kinda vibe

I'm gonna have to ask you to stop being so negative about my challenge, you know very well what it's about, and why it's here. You impose a looming darkness over it like it is something you hate with your very soul.

If the goal is to get my challenge off topic, or to derail my thread, then instead of making yourself look bad, call a moderator and have him look it over, and have him determine if it is "too similar" to yours.

7 hours ago, DoctorDavinci said:

Nah, my electric wheelchair is faster than any electric powered KSP vehicles

The disqualification process basically consists of if the OP likes you or your car ... nothing more, nothing less

No. It really doesn't.

5 hours ago, Slam_Jones said:

I actually made a program in visual studio a year or so ago which parses craft files and lists each individual part. Maybe if I tinker with it a bit (and do a fair bit of research) I can modify it to also show each part connection, and flag those with connections to non-existent parts. 

Seems easier than doing it by hand with a spreadsheet

If successful, I'll see if I can upload the program somewhere for public use.

 

Edit: Moving forward on this, my program is now able to identify and list parts and part links in separate boxes.  Next step, allowing it to cross-reference the lists and point out links that do not correspond to a part.

Wonderful!


For those wondering how I will be judging your cars, here is how they were judged, and how they always will be judged:
-Does it follow the rules for the normal rules? Yes/No?
-If no, then does it follow the rules for "anything goes?" Yes/No?
-If no, then does it follow the rules for "Anything and Everything?" Yes/No?
-If no, it is not admitted.

STRICTLY ENFORCED. If you have a vehicle that does not fit the rules, you will not have a entry.

I will not deal with the following:
Trolls
Thread derailers
Complainers
Accusers

If you have an issue with how I judged the craft you submitted, please send me a private message as to prevent from derailing my thread, and if we cannot resolve the issue, then the craft will not be submitted, or even downloaded for review.

[DoctorDavinci]

@He_162 - Not trying to derail your thread nor complain, nor accuse, nor troll, nor derail with this post .... I just thought the racers in here would like this

Ever want to change those crappy looking stock wheels to something with a little more pizzaz

 

[Colonel Cbplayer]

Because my last post was not good enough for Azimech I redid the entire thing, rebuilt the car, and did the lap time again with a new time.

https://streamable.com/c19fb

No reaction wheels

Only 12 Juno engines

Ingame time from engine start (0:26) to finish (1:43)

Lap time 1:17

I can lower the lap time because I spun out a few times but I have been attempting for an hour now and I am happy with that time. 

 

[EpicSpaceTroll139]

Has anybody else been having problems with tiny, invisible ridges in the terrain of the KSC causing tires to pop? I've been trying to get down a lap time (looks like I could get around 1:10, maybe slightly less with current setup), but there's apparently some ridge/ line between the SPH and the Mission Control that keeps blowing out my front tires. 

(screenshot taken immediately after tire popped)

When put in super-slow motion, I can see the car actually drop a couple centimeters as it falls from the ridge, then the front tires pop. The front tires aren't significantly stressed before this happens, so I don't think the problem is my car design....

Not exactly sure what to do about this...

 

Edited September 21, 2017 by EpicSpaceTroll139

[prgmTrouble]

I get the same effect, not sure of the cause though.

[He_162]

20 hours ago, Colonel Cbplayer said:

Because my last post was not good enough for Azimech I redid the entire thing, rebuilt the car, and did the lap time again with a new time.

https://streamable.com/c19fb

No reaction wheels

Only 12 Juno engines

Ingame time from engine start (0:26) to finish (1:43)

Lap time 1:17

I can lower the lap time because I spun out a few times but I have been attempting for an hour now and I am happy with that time. 

 

Congratulations!
 

 

1 hour ago, EpicSpaceTroll139 said:

Has anybody else been having problems with tiny, invisible ridges in the terrain of the KSC causing tires to pop? I've been trying to get down a lap time (looks like I could get around 1:10, maybe slightly less with current setup), but there's apparently some ridge/ line between the SPH and the Mission Control that keeps blowing out my front tires. 

(screenshot taken immediately after tire popped)

When put in super-slow motion, I can see the car actually drop a couple centimeters as it falls from the ridge, then the front tires pop. The front tires aren't significantly stressed before this happens, so I don't think the problem is my car design....

Not exactly sure what to do about this...

 

I have had this problem, I have experienced it very rarely though.
 

[LABenterprises]

13 hours ago, EpicSpaceTroll139 said:

Has anybody else been having problems with tiny, invisible ridges in the terrain of the KSC causing tires to pop? I've been trying to get down a lap time (looks like I could get around 1:10, maybe slightly less with current setup), but there's apparently some ridge/ line between the SPH and the Mission Control that keeps blowing out my front tires. 

(screenshot taken immediately after tire popped)

When put in super-slow motion, I can see the car actually drop a couple centimeters as it falls from the ridge, then the front tires pop. The front tires aren't significantly stressed before this happens, so I don't think the problem is my car design....

Not exactly sure what to do about this...

 

I've run into this plenty of times, most recently with my Bolt. You should be able to fix this by softening up the springs and dampers and it also helps to try to avoid these areas of the track.

[Mukita12]

F1 Car Allowed right?

[DarkOwl57]

Thinking about joining... I'm thinking maybe LMP1-type car; maybe a go-kart though knowing my skills

[DoctorDavinci]

1 hour ago, Mukita12 said:

F1 Car Allowed right?

I was disqualified for entering an F1 car so no, F1 is not allowed 

[Azimech]

I've seen it with a few LAB cars and others, very high spring/shock settings are the cause of the popped tires. Either lower spring or shock.

Edit: ah, LABenterprises already gave the answer.

 

 

Edited September 21, 2017 by Azimech

[Slam_Jones]

On 9/19/2017 at 11:55 AM, Slam_Jones said:

I actually made a program in visual studio a year or so ago which parses craft files and lists each individual part. Maybe if I tinker with it a bit (and do a fair bit of research) I can modify it to also show each part connection, and flag those with connections to non-existent parts. 

Seems easier than doing it by hand with a spreadsheet

If successful, I'll see if I can upload the program somewhere for public use.

-snip-

Good news!  My program is functional and helped me fix my broken car!  Huzzah!

Now, I just need to work on my lap times.  I can get about 1:30, but that would put me solidly at last place... hopefully with some wheel tuning I can work that down to 1:10ish.  As it is, I usually end up going between tremendous understeer, to alarming oversteer and subsequent roll-overs... and everything in between

I did have a question, though: is it all right to rig up some of my Junos to action groups so I can enable/disable them to help with acceleration and stopping?    (Edit: I'll probably rig up some boost flaps as suggested on the next page to the action groups instead.  Will increase part count, but at least it will be comparable to other vehicles in the challenge!)

Edited September 21, 2017 by Slam_Jones

[DoctorDavinci]

59 minutes ago, Slam_Jones said:

I did have a question, though: is it all right to rig up some of my Junos to action groups so I can enable/disable them to help with acceleration and stopping? 

Thing is the Juno's have a spool up/down time which will affect the thrust if you shut the engines off

I recommend you use @Azimech's boost flap kraken tech to block the thrust from the juno's when you don't want thrust from them .... basically put 2 elevons on opposite sides of the junos and turn off the control inputs in the right click menu (yaw, pitch and roll) then set the 'deploy' to an action group (set the deploy directions up so that both elevons deploy towards each other so as to block the thrust)

You will still see the smoke trail but you car won't get any thrust if the elevons are deployed

Edited September 21, 2017 by DoctorDavinci