Star Wars Episode VIII (8) the Last Jedi Discussion

[tater]

"Disney logic" implies that "Lucas logic" is somehow better. Given the abject mess of the prequels, and really everything about the whole universe if you pay too much (read: any) attention... I'm not sure Disney is to blame. It's an inconsistent set of stories, and the "facts" in question don't bear much attention to detail. At some point after seeing the first movie (the real one, in the theater in the 1970s) I guestimated the velocity of the X and Y wings to get to the Death Star sublight. We're talking 100s of km/s minimum (they launch with like 15 minutes until the death star can shoot, and go something on the order of an Earth-Moon distance). Min 400km/s, likely closer to 1000. Assume X-Wing is the mass of an F-15. That's hundreds of kilotons to over 2 megatons if they impact (and many impacted once close, so shields don't protect against impact).

Anyway, it's not worth getting to concerned about details, or everything breaks.

When the force was a sort of magic/religious thing, then how it appears in one vs another person doesn't matter. Regarding "lineage," I'm not sure how it matters. In a highly populous galaxy like Star Wars clearly has (every large world with possibly billions), there must be many trillions of beings, and I see no reason why all would be aware of their power. That's really besides the point to me. If the goal is a heritable "power" in a small minority of people, then both sides should be "bad" in a sense, as the system of government doesn't matter when either is entirely dependent on the leadership quality/character of their wizards.

 

11 minutes ago, Cheif Operations Director said:

 

So as far as we know Rey is a nobody. That's a Problem!

Not sure why. Intelligence is largely heritable, for example, but that doesn't mean that a set of parents who are dopes cannot have the next Newton or Einstein as a kid.

Unlikely isn't impossible, and the SW galaxy is vastly populated. Infinite monkeys with typewriters...

[Cheif Operations Director]

1 minute ago, tater said:

"Disney logic" implies that "Lucas logic" is somehow better. Given the abject mess of the prequels, and really everything about the whole universe if you pay too much (read: any) attention... I'm not sure Disney is to blame. It's an inconsistent set of stories, and the "facts" in question don't bear much attention to detail. At some point after seeing the first movie (the real one, in the theater in the 1970s) I guestimated the velocity of the X and Y wings to get to the Death Star sublight. We're talking 100s of km/s minimum (they launch with like 15 minutes until the death star can shoot, and go something on the order of an Earth-Moon distance). Min 400km/s, likely closer to 1000. Assume X-Wing is the mass of an F-15. That's hundreds of kilotons to over 2 megatons if they impact (and many impacted once close, so shields don't protect against impact).

Anyway, it's not worth getting to concerned about details, or everything breaks.

When the force was a sort of magic/religious thing, then how it appears in one vs another person doesn't matter. Regarding "lineage," I'm not sure how it matters. In a highly populous galaxy like Star Wars clearly has (every large world with possibly billions), there must be many trillions of beings, and I see no reason why all would be aware of their power. That's really besides the point to me. If the goal is a heritable "power" in a small minority of people, then both sides should be "bad" in a sense, as the system of government doesn't matter when either is entirely dependent on the leadership quality/character of their wizards.

 

No offense but it really drives me crazy when people scream that's impossible! It's called Science FICTION for a reason. I would like to mention that VTOL Technology is significant and is becoming a reality. And if a soild hits a Sheild it explodes so the X Wings would explode. Also When people say fire doesn't burn in space... Ahh!

Ok honestly if ther is a ship kilometers long and and breach on the ship takes place the air burst out like a jet right? So if a hole happens first and then a explosion inside the ship then too pressure the air inside and in Reactors and Magazines. Fire is totally plausible right? That's a honest question. 

[ChrisSpace]

On ‎16‎/‎12‎/‎2017 at 9:09 AM, Kerbal01 said:

That battle at the beginning was dope. 
Rey's parents being commoners 
R2D2 playing back the "help me obi wan kenobi" 
Leia dieing, but not quite
Luke dying, but not quite but then for real
Didn't really like the new character of Rose. 
Snoke's ship looking like a city sized B2
Snoke being cut in half 
That whole sequence i was like "what's gonna happen next!" 
Good that Kylo didn't get a redemption arc. 
Snoke felt like a useless character. This all powerful being who can force choke someone on another ship is killed without a flight.
I wanted to see more of Captain Phasma. She looked like a powerful character but shows up for like 10 minutes across two movies and then killed.

Okay, so let's recap what the fandom got right and wrong about SW8.

THEORIES THAT WERE DISPROVEN

Luke is a "grey" Jedi

Rey is a Skywalker

Rey is a Kenobi

Rey is a Palpatine

Literally everything MatPat said

Snoke is Plagueis

Snoke is Jar-Jar

Snoke is 100 Porgs in a costume

Leia dies

Anch-To is Earth in the distant future

Snoke doesn't die

Admiral Ackbar doesn't die (seriously why did that have to happen?!)

Rey loses a hand

There's a spacewalk

The Dreadnaught's flat surface is relevant to the plot

Obi-Wan's ghost shows up

Anakin's ghost shows up

THEORIES THAT WERE CORRECT

Luke is referred to as "the last jedi"

 

 

On ‎16‎/‎12‎/‎2017 at 3:56 PM, insert_name said:

Overall it was an excellent movie. the only main problem I had was them not using the other cruisers as projectiles, they could have done a lot of damage with those at lightspeed

Yeah, someone should've thought of that

On ‎17‎/‎12‎/‎2017 at 2:18 PM, _Augustus_ said:

Since when was fuel a problem, and how come the Star Destroyers can't catch up to the Resistance ship (they did it at the beginning of A New Hope with no problems)?

I suppose the resistance fleet's ship had a higher acceleration and could stay ahead longer. As for fuel, I was actually glad they finally mentioned it, although I was a little annoyed they didn't call it propellant.

Edited December 27, 2017 by ChrisSpace

[ChrisSpace]

On ‎19‎/‎12‎/‎2017 at 1:13 PM, TheSaint said:

And, sorry, Baby Groot is way cuter. He dances. Porgs just stand around, stare at you, and bleat like sheep.

[Cheif Operations Director]

21 minutes ago, ChrisSpace said:

Okay, so let's recap what the fandom got right and wrong about SW8.

THEORIES THAT WERE DISPROVEN

Luke is a "grey" Jedi

Rey is a Skywalker

Rey is a Kenobi

Rey is a Palpatine

Literally everything MatPat said

Snoke is Plagueis

Snoke is Jar-Jar

Snoke is 100 Porgs in a costume

Leia dies

Anch-To is Earth in the distant future

Snoke doesn't die

Admiral Ackbar doesn't die (seriously why did that have to happen?!)

Rey loses a hand

There's a spacewalk

The Dreadnaught's flat surface is relevant to the plot

Obi-Wan's ghost shows up

Anakin's ghost shows up

THEORIES THAT WERE CORRECT

Luke is referred to as "the last jedi"

 

 

Yeah, someone should've thought of that

I suppose the resistance fleet's ship had a higher acceleration and could stay ahead longer. As for fuel, I was actually glad they finally mentioned it, although I was a little annoyed they didn't call it propellant.

It can be used in atmosphere too and technically the fuel is stored inside a ship with an atmosphere.

The light speed thing I enjoyed because it wouldn't work with a hammerhead. What people I don't think are getting is that That huge Flag Ship just made it to the end of the Snoke ship both had Sheilds and fuel. That sort of mass at that velocity could really do that a Xwing would just explode on the side a Hammerhead would breach a big space but not cut it in half. I doubt a Imperial II could even break it in half... Its all in the mass and acceleration 

[Superfluous J]

2 hours ago, ChrisSpace said:

*porg thing*

I don't hate porgs, but I don't really find them all that endearing. They seem like more emotive tribbles. And that "oh look it's cute and looking at Chewie and all scared" moment to me seemed more like "Chewie's eating that thing's parents."

[kerbiloid]

4 hours ago, ChrisSpace said:

Luke is referred to as "the last jedi"

Star Wars s01e09: "Rey: The Jedi is Last Again".

Edited December 27, 2017 by kerbiloid

[DAL59]

5 hours ago, ChrisSpace said:

Literally everything MatPat said

Well, it was just a theory... 

5 hours ago, ChrisSpace said:

Snoke is Jar-Jar

Actually, what did happen to Jar Jar?

[tater]

8 hours ago, Cheif Operations Director said:

No offense but it really drives me crazy when people scream that's impossible! It's called Science FICTION for a reason. I would like to mention that VTOL Technology is significant and is becoming a reality. And if a soild hits a Sheild it explodes so the X Wings would explode. Also When people say fire doesn't burn in space... Ahh!

The death star isn't having X-wings collides with magical shields. They crash into the hull itself, and cause huge explosions, and break stuff on the death star in the same way they attack the towers shooting at them. If their ships have collision-proof shields, then 2 star destroyers colliding should not harm each other, or only the one with downed shields gets harmed, the other is fine.

KE is KE. They lose almost every fighter in every encounter, so just have a droid accelerate the ting as fast as possible and ram. An x-wing at 1000 km/s (certainly they are around this fast, per first movie) imparts 2.4 megatons of energy. I suppose we could figure out what must power them to get them going that fast without looking like real rockets, but then we likely assume antimatter, lol, which starts to make the KE look like chump change.

Star Wars is not science fiction, BTW. It's fantasy space opera. That's why making the force anything other than magic (or religion, same thing) was such an awful decision by Lucas. Now you have to follow all logical conclusions from that. When it's magic, it works, "because" and you move on and enjoy. You don't question the One Ring, you enjoy the story. Mitoclorians? Now I'll ask hard questions. SW should stick to the fantasy it is, there is nothing wrong with fantasy.

8 hours ago, Cheif Operations Director said:

Ok honestly if ther is a ship kilometers long and and breach on the ship takes place the air burst out like a jet right? So if a hole happens first and then a explosion inside the ship then too pressure the air inside and in Reactors and Magazines. Fire is totally plausible right? That's a honest question. 

I'm talking about total, delivered energy. Every fighter hitting is like a large atomic bomb, or a smallish hydrogen bomb (assuming they haven't slowed down to the super slow speed they fight at).

All this is now moot, as they could just get within a few km, point at the target, then engage the hyperdrive. This is now canonically a thing, too. Literally every movie going forward, when there is a big ship, I'll wonder why they don't trade a smaller ship for it, given they'll lose the smaller ship anyway.

[cubinator]

8 hours ago, Cheif Operations Director said:

k honestly if ther is a ship kilometers long and and breach on the ship takes place the air burst out like a jet right? So if a hole happens first and then a explosion inside the ship then too pressure the air inside and in Reactors and Magazines. Fire is totally plausible right? That's a honest question. 

Sure, as long as you have enough gas to combust you could have fire. It definitely would look different in a vacuum though.

[PakledHostage]

46 minutes ago, tater said:

All this is now moot, as they could just get within a few km, point at the target, then engage the hyperdrive. This is now canonically a thing, too. Literally every movie going forward, when there is a big ship, I'll wonder why they don't trade a smaller ship for it, given they'll lose the smaller ship anyway.

But Star Trek resorts to "super spiffy particles" to get themselves out of binds (and then conveniently forget about them) all the time? Why do we hold Star Wars to a higher standard?

[Cheif Operations Director]

1 hour ago, tater said:

The death star isn't having X-wings collides with magical shields. They crash into the hull itself, and cause huge explosions, and break stuff on the death star in the same way they attack the towers shooting at them. If their ships have collision-proof shields, then 2 star destroyers colliding should not harm each other, or only the one with downed shields gets harmed, the other is fine.

KE is KE. They lose almost every fighter in every encounter, so just have a droid accelerate the ting as fast as possible and ram. An x-wing at 1000 km/s (certainly they are around this fast, per first movie) imparts 2.4 megatons of energy. I suppose we could figure out what must power them to get them going that fast without looking like real rockets, but then we likely assume antimatter, lol, which starts to make the KE look like chump change.

Star Wars is not science fiction, BTW. It's fantasy space opera. That's why making the force anything other than magic (or religion, same thing) was such an awful decision by Lucas. Now you have to follow all logical conclusions from that. When it's magic, it works, "because" and you move on and enjoy. You don't question the One Ring, you enjoy the story. Mitoclorians? Now I'll ask hard questions. SW should stick to the fantasy it is, there is nothing wrong with fantasy.

I'm talking about total, delivered energy. Every fighter hitting is like a large atomic bomb, or a smallish hydrogen bomb (assuming they haven't slowed down to the super slow speed they fight at).

All this is now moot, as they could just get within a few km, point at the target, then engage the hyperdrive. This is now canonically a thing, too. Literally every movie going forward, when there is a big ship, I'll wonder why they don't trade a smaller ship for it, given they'll lose the smaller ship anyway.

The  Star Destroyers colliding might have actually only been on the surface. When you see it touch then it just vaporizes at once the whole ship in length is the initial burst of fire so I doubt it even went into the surface. The second possibility is the sheilds in that sector can't hold up against a star Destoyer 

[tater]

3 hours ago, Cheif Operations Director said:

The  Star Destroyers colliding might have actually only been on the surface. When you see it touch then it just vaporizes at once the whole ship in length is the initial burst of fire so I doubt it even went into the surface. The second possibility is the sheilds in that sector can't hold up against a star Destoyer 

If the shields can be overcome by KE, then they can be overcome by KE. We could calculate the energy of a Star Destroyer running into another one at a couple km/hr, and compare that energy to a small craft at 1000 km/s. We will find v² dominates.

That's the problem with thinking too much about it, it breaks everything, and SW was started as space opera, not SF, which is attentive to the general rule "break as few laws of physics as possible."

The first SW movie was pretty important to me as a kid, I loved it. I still do (I hate the rebooted, altered version, however---Han shot first!). It was perfect for what it was. I know everyone loves Empire, and I also think it's good, and I understand why it's good, but it's not "important" to me just because it wasn't as, well, different as SW was. SW was completely novel. Jedi I hated because of the muppets. Of all the movies made after Jedi, I think Rogue One is the best, indeed, it might be my favorite SW movie, period. It's nice to look at, has a tight plot, good characters for an ensemble war movie... I really liked it (we just saw it on netflix the other day after seeing VIII).

 

4 hours ago, PakledHostage said:

But Star Trek resorts to "super spiffy particles" to get themselves out of binds (and then conveniently forget about them) all the time? Why do we hold Star Wars to a higher standard?

We don't, that's why Star Trek is also awful SF. Not just the fact they they have a plot device that is frequently solved by a "______-genic field" manipulation, but the consistency problem that they FORGET that they invented it the next time a problem presents itself that they could easily solve if they literally remembered what happened last week. They had a sheild mod that allowed them to drive through a star, as I recall. How many times were they subsequently disabled by a craft delivering less energy than a sun, lol?

EDIT: Assume 40 million metric tons for a SD (from a website). At 6 m/s (a little over 20 kph), a star destroyer delivers some 0.17 kilotons of energy to a target. Compared to an X-wing at cruising speed from yavin 4 to the death star delivering 2.4 megatons of energy. A single x-wing at that velocity is vastly more damaging than a SD colliding with another.

Edited December 27, 2017 by tater

[Cydonian Monk]

4 hours ago, kerbiloid said:

Star Wars s01e09: "Rey: The Jedi is Last Again".

Episode 9: The Will of the Force. 

You can bank on it. (Because the last jedi died, so we have to have a reading of his will.... And then scatter his ashes* on the beach or on Tatooine or something. “Luke was a good jedi, and a good man. He was one of us....”)

 

* Burn his robe and/or terminator hand, I guess?

Edited December 27, 2017 by Cydonian Monk

[Cheif Operations Director]

I'm not sure I want to see the next episode right now

[tater]

3 minutes ago, Cydonian Monk said:

Episode 9: The Will of the Force. 

You can bank on it. (Because the last jedi died, so we have to have a reading of his will.... And then scatter his ashes* on the beach or on Tatooine or something. “Luke was a good jedi, and a good man. He was one of us....”)

 

* Burn his robe and/or terminator hand, I guess?

 

They could redo the scene from The Big Labowski where they scatter Donny's ashes, lol.

[GoSlash27]

7 hours ago, 5thHorseman said:

I don't hate porgs, but I don't really find them all that endearing. They seem like more emotive tribbles. And that "oh look it's cute and looking at Chewie and all scared" moment to me seemed more like "Chewie's eating that thing's parents."

I would've eaten it just on principle. #ScrewYouStupidPorg

Best,
-Slashy

[kerbiloid]

Jedis are gone.

Spoiler

All hail Jadis!

Spoiler

 

[ProtoJeb21]

5 hours ago, DAL59 said:

Actually, what did happen to Jar Jar?

He screwed up again, got kicked out of the Imperial Senate, and became a clown on Naboo. 

[Superfluous J]

5 hours ago, DAL59 said:

Actually, what did happen to Jar Jar?

He served his plot point and everybody hated him so much they were afraid to include him in another scene long enough to write him out of the story.

[DAL59]

2 hours ago, tater said:

 

4 hours ago, PakledHostage said:

But Star Trek resorts to "super spiffy particles" to get themselves out of binds (and then conveniently forget about them) all the time? Why do we hold Star Wars to a higher standard?

We don't, that's why Star Trek is also awful SF. Not just the fact they they have a plot device that is frequently solved by a "______-genic field" manipulation, but the consistency problem that they FORGET that they invented it the next time a problem presents itself that they could easily solve if they literally remembered what happened last week. They had a sheild mod that allowed them to drive through a star, as I recall. How many times were they subsequently disabled by a craft delivering less energy than a sun, lol?

Star Wars, unlike Trek, is all about combat.  While trek should do the same, its even more important to have some consistency in a space combat movie, else theres no reason for anything to happen or not happen.  They don't need a death star if they could just ram a planet at hyperspeed. 

[Cheif Operations Director]

1 minute ago, DAL59 said:

Star Wars, unlike Trek, is all about combat.  While trek should do the same, its even more important to have some consistency in a space combat movie, else theres no reason for anything to happen or not happen.  They don't need a death star if they could just ram a planet at hyperspeed. 

What nobody is taking into account with that scene is that the ship that rammed the Snoke ship is KILOMETERS LONG! At the speed of light. It isn't a Xwing it's a Capital Ship it was actually the resistance headauarters after The StarKiller Base Battle.I mean the Snoke ship is that got rammed is 1/3 the size of the original Death Star. Remember the scene in the force awakens when they show Death Star I then II then StarKiller Base. It wouldn't work against star killer Base. It would barely dent the surface just cause a crater. If I have to destroy a ship and it's 15 kilometers long and I ram it at the speed of light with a 3 kilometer long ship what do you think will happen. Forget Ionization, Radiation, Think about the shockwave of the air the Armories, the explosions from magazines and fuel. This is significant. The kinetic energy alone would destroy it. Also both the sheilds are online at full power to they are repelling and pulling after they were breached. It's 100% scientifically plausible. Now if your asking why didn't a cruiser in Endor ram the Executor or a Death Star II it's because their pilots were already inside. And near the reactor so destruction was near. Besides that according to Battlefront II a ship had crashed inside the hanger. It wasn't realistic they couldn't evacuate in time. The Battle of Yavin would be the same remember "The Empire doesn't consider a one man fighter to be any real threat or they would have a tighter defense." The Death Star I was a capital ship killer and could destroy any capital ship. Likewise If Death Stars II weapons we operational then so were the turbo lasers. And the rebels also had a fleet engaged they couldn't turn their deflectors. Almost any time people were saying they could have rammed would result in unnessicary death. Why sacrifice a capital ship with thousands when a few fighters could do the same thing. They also have a budget unlike the empire. Can you name one time where it would be the best course of action that wouldn't result in unnessicary death. At Ryloth Anakin did the same thing just not at light speed because he didn't need too and so HE COULD ESCAPE! Please name one time where it would be a better course of action. 

[PakledHostage]

I don't know... You guys obviously know more about all the backstories and other minutiae of Star Wars than I do. But from my layman's perspective, The Last Jedi was worth my $12 and 3 hours of my time. There are a lot of crappy movies out there that leave me checking my watch incessantly, hoping that they will soon be over, but TLJ wasn't one of them. Sure it wasn't a great movie and if you think about it too hard afterwards you could even describe it as disappointing, but it was entertaining in the moment. I've been a casual Star Wars fan since the first trilogy came out in the 70's/80's and I (along with everyone else) have suffered through some sequels that weren't much more  than stinking piles of cow manure since then, but IMHO, TLJ wasn't in that class.

[tater]

1 hour ago, DAL59 said:

Star Wars, unlike Trek, is all about combat.  While trek should do the same, its even more important to have some consistency in a space combat movie, else theres no reason for anything to happen or not happen.  They don't need a death star if they could just ram a planet at hyperspeed. 

This is circular, and why you either treat it as fantasy and don't argue it's consistent, or you make sure all the writing is consistent.

If you have powerful sublight drives that allow going planetary distances in sunday drive time frames, then every single spacecraft is a deadly weapon. You also don't need a death star to kill planets. Slap drives on asteroids, and use those.

 

51 minutes ago, Cheif Operations Director said:

What nobody is taking into account with that scene is that the ship that rammed the Snoke ship is KILOMETERS LONG! At the speed of light. It isn't a Xwing it's a Capital Ship it was actually the resistance headauarters after The StarKiller Base Battle.I mean the Snoke ship is that got rammed is 1/3 the size of the original Death Star. Remember the scene in the force awakens when they show Death Star I then II then StarKiller Base. It wouldn't work against star killer Base. It would barely dent the surface just cause a crater. If I have to destroy a ship and it's 15 kilometers long and I ram it at the speed of light with a 3 kilometer long ship what do you think will happen. Forget Ionization, Radiation, Think about the shockwave of the air the Armories, the explosions from magazines and fuel. This is significant. The kinetic energy alone would destroy it. Also both the sheilds are online at full power to they are repelling and pulling after they were breached. It's 100% scientifically plausible. Now if your asking why didn't a cruiser in Endor ram the Executor or a Death Star II it's because their pilots were already inside. And near the reactor so destruction was near. Besides that according to Battlefront II a ship had crashed inside the hanger. It wasn't realistic they couldn't evacuate in time. The Battle of Yavin would be the same remember "The Empire doesn't consider a one man fighter to be any real threat or they would have a tighter defense." The Death Star I was a capital ship killer and could destroy any capital ship. Likewise If Death Stars II weapons we operational then so were the turbo lasers. And the rebels also had a fleet engaged they couldn't turn their deflectors. Almost any time people were saying they could have rammed would result in unnessicary death. Why sacrifice a capital ship with thousands when a few fighters could do the same thing. They also have a budget unlike the empire. Can you name one time where it would be the best course of action that wouldn't result in unnessicary death. At Ryloth Anakin did the same thing just not at light speed because he didn't need too and so HE COULD ESCAPE! Please name one time where it would be a better course of action. 

At the speed of light, a grain of rice has infinite mass. I'd not think too much about it. The bottom line is that the cruiser was small compared to the larger ship. The asteroid Icarus is 1.4km, and masses about 100,000,000 tons. That's on the order of star destroyers, of which the Empire has a gajillion. They can easily make hyperdrives for them, and can accelerate them.

Even at "just" 100 km/s, a small fraction of what SW fighters can do, that asteroid then has 12,300,000 megatons of energy ( ~10²² J, that's about an order of magnitude lower than the Chicxulub event (dinosaur killer asteroid)).

Nothing about shields is scientifically plausible, BTW. All energy needs to go somewhere. Shields absorb energy? Then the ship must radiate that energy.

 

 

My take:

The sad thing about this movie was the failure to really go in a different direction. Having set up the tyranny of the Force as a thing (a finite number of people with exceptional skills are flatly better than regular people, and are destined to rule over the rest, one way or another), I really wanted to see Kylo (great character, actually, the best part of the last 2 movies) and Rey take over.

Imagine that. Take Kylo at face value, but have him convince her to reassemble the empire and rule as decent leaders. Neither switches "sides". They compromise, Kylo is right, it's all BS. Now there is a 3-way civil war with the rebellion (or whatever they changed the name to) on one side, and elements of the First Order as another side. The Empire fragments, and you can follow different arcs of people. In that case, you let Finn not believe that Rey is with Kylo, and have him sacrifice himself so the Rebellion can escape. What's her name then fights on for her sister and unrequited love. Rey tries to convince them that the Empire is so screwed up that they need to force a new peace via their force-strength for a better tomorrow, and there's tons of fighting all over, and all the sides are muddled. Kylo and Rey would sometimes do "bad" things, legitimately seeking a real end to conflict, the Rebels would start looking sometimes as legitimate, other times as terrorists, and the First Order with their full military capability would give the new Empire some serious problems, and might under Hux be an unremittingly hateful bunch of ideological monsters. There's a lot they could have done with some imagination.

Edited December 27, 2017 by tater

[Cheif Operations Director]

5 minutes ago, tater said:

This is circular, and why you either treat it as fantasy and don't argue it's consistent, or you make sure all the writing is consistent.

If you have powerful sublight drives that allow going planetary distances in sunday drive time frames, then every single spacecraft is a deadly weapon. You also don't need a death star to kill planets. Slap drives on asteroids, and use those.

 

At the speed of light, a grain of rice has infinite mass. I'd not think too much about it. The bottom line is that the cruiser was small compared to the larger ship. The asteroid Icarus is 1.4km, and masses about 100,000,000 tons. That's on the order of star destroyers, of which the Empire has a gajillion. They can easily make hyperdrives for them, and can accelerate them.

Even at "just" 100 km/s, a small fraction of what SW fighters can do, that asteroid then has 12,300,000 megatons of energy ( ~10²² J, that's about an order of magnitude lower than the Chicxulub event (dinosaur killer asteroid)).

Nothing about shields is scientifically plausible, BTW. All energy needs to go somewhere. Shields absorb energy? Then the ship must radiate that energy.

 

 

My take:

The sad thing about this movie was the failure to really go in a different direction. Having set up the tyranny of the Force as a thing (a finite number of people with exception skills are flatly better than regular people, and are destined to rule over the rest, one way or another), I really wanted to see Kylo (great character, actually, the best part of the last 2 movies) and Rey take over.

Imagine that. Take Kylo at face value, but have him convince her to disassemble and rule as decent leaders. Neither switches. They compromise. Now there is a 3-way civil war with the rebellion (or whatever they changed the name to) on one side, and elements of the First Order as another side. The Empire fragments, and you can follow different arcs of people. In that case, you let Finn not believe that Rey is with Kylo, and have him sacrifice himself so the Rebellion can escape. What's her name then fights on for her sister and unrequited love. Rey tries to convince them that the Empire is so screwed up that they need to force a new peace via their force-strength for a better tomorrow, and there's tons of fighting all over, and all the sides are muddled. Kylo and Rey would sometimes do "bad" things, legitimately seeking a real end to conflict, the Rebels would start looking sometimes as legitimate, other times as terrorists, and the First Order with their full military capability would give the new Empire some serious problems, and might under Hux be an unremittingly hateful bunch of ideological monsters. There's a lot they could have done with some imagination.

500 years ago we could order something from the other side of the world and get it in a week. My point is that Energy Technology is unexplored. The sheilds could be some form of magnets and plasma I don't know nor care. Also you say their megaton stuff about X wings or capital ships if it's Xwing your wrong. Your wrong because Like saying if Apollo Craft hit the moon a nuke would go off it just would happen like that.

Light hits earth and doesn't blow it up and it's traveling at the speed of light too so mass does matter.

Im talking about the kinetic energy of impact + the velocity the mass of that ship at a normal cruising speed would Destoyer a lot of the Flagship (Snokes ship) The Lightspeed part would drive the ship like Swiss cheese THEN after its stopped the sheer Kinetic force would be like the Death Star. So mass does matter I the whole event because upon impact IT NOT IN LIGHTSPEED ANYMORE

I'm I right?

If not please given me your logic