[Request] scaled back KCT

[theJesuit]

I wish there was a simple KCT.  Don't get me wrong as I like its awesome choices and modability, but not the issues like KK connections.

Anyway.  Please hear me out for a simple more stockish feel.

Basically the game goes to pad and then timewarps (possibly manually) to the build time when the ship appears.  If there is anything on the pad then yes,  explosions happen.

Tie this into a KAC alarm so that launch goes to pad, but adds an alarm so that you can do other stuff before coming back.

Crew are assigned and not available when the craft is bwing built as they are 'training' for the mission

Length of construction is based on size of VAB or SPH against say number of parts.

When the KAC alarm goes the craft appears on the goto the pad.

No science stuff unless the same style.  No build points. No faster for multiple ships.

EDIT from below:

The launch button doesn't go to pad, but instead just generates the KAC alarm. The craft then doesn't spawn until the KAC alarm is triggered in which case the craft appears when KAC offers you a 'go to craft'.  This would allow for multiple builds even on multiple pads, either MH or KK.

Crew are assigned to craft when craft are 'launched' and so won't be available for other builds. Rational being that they are training for the mission.

Thoughts?

Edited February 17, 2019 by theJesuit
Spelling, Grammar, and more stuff from below

[Tyko]

It's a cool idea. Depending on how detailed you wanted to get it could be faked pretty easily just using KAC.

You could assign a number of days based on the cost of the rocket - just for argument lets say 1 day per 1000 kerbucks. When you've built your rocket, figure out how many days then just add a KAC alarm called "launch my new rocket".

Since rolling out to the pad only takes a couple of days you could skip the whole "whoops! I accidentally left another rocket on the pad" because that wouldn't happen anyways...

Edited January 6, 2019 by Tyko

[theJesuit]

Could be @Tyko.  But don't want to fudge! Too easy to cheat. Was hoping someone with know how and awesomeness could code it. 

With KAC, the Launch button adds the KAC alarm but the craft doesn't appear.

By not having craft appear on the launch pad until the alarm goes off means that you can have multiple builds at the same time.  By ignoring alarm delays the launch.

It seems it would work the MH launch sites as is without the KCT fudging I've had to do in the past as well.

Peace.

[theJesuit]

I was also wondering whether the Contract Configurator could be manipulated to do this as well... 

Perhaps if someone new how to manipulate CC really well...

Launch vessel... then as launch from VAB occurs, it triggers an automatic(maybe) contract that also despawns the vessel only to respawn on launchpad at the determined time with correct kerbals of course.

But the initial concept still stands.  Maybe utilising the spawn despawn code from CC?

Anyone have thoughts of willingness to pick it up?

Peace.

[BlkBltChemie]

I really like the suggestions you have made here especially in regards to the crew not being available due to mission training.  I do like the research and building upgrade times of KCT, but agree with you on dropping the build point system.  Maybe it was my settings (KCT default), but after completing the tech tree, I could build vessels so fast it felt like it defeated the purpose of the mod and it just became a matter of timewarping so at that point I actually uninstalled KCT.

I liked playing with KCT but often found the interface to be a little clunky and I think the scaled-down description you propose here would definitely give a more stock-alike feel.  A slimmer KCT without the rollout and reconditioning (maybe we can just assume they are built into the construction time) would really streamline the feel of things and potentially eliminate some of the problems with alternate launch sites since you would just be able to launch when ready.  I never tried omitting those in the KCT settings.

Have you tried BARIS?  It also has a construction time mechanic that is both an alternative and compatible with KCT.  It takes a different approach in that you hire workers (tied to VAB/SPH level) but does not have rollout/reconditioning just integration (actual building time).  The mod does also include random events and launch failures, but @Angel-125 did an excellent job designing the settings to make it very customizable and easy to enable and disable whichever features you want or don't want.  To be honest, I have not tried using it with alternate launch sites, however, so I cannot comment on how it handles that.

[theJesuit]

5 hours ago, BlkBltChemie said:

I really like the suggestions you have made here

Cheers, just need someone to make it a reality!

I haven't tried BARIS, well when it was first released but before all the stuff that was added.  I'll need to look at it now.  Thanks for the heads up.

I have reached out to one dev but they weren't keen as they don't play with KCT.  So hoping someone might want to pick it up to run with it.

Peace.

[theJesuit]

Well @BlkBltChemie, I tried BARIS again.  Looks fun but so many options. 

In playing around, it wasnt entirely intuitive with the bay loading and such.  Basically, with no part failures, it automates the KAC alarm setting to NOT LAUNCH rocket till this date... but with some other mechanics too. But you can still launch the full craft immediately if you accidentally hit Launch which breaks the immersion.   KCT deals with this (apparently in a hacky kind of way).

My hope is that the mod would spawn the craft on the launchpad when KAC alarm triggers...

Peace.

[Angelo Kerman]

16 minutes ago, theJesuit said:

Well @BlkBltChemie, I tried BARIS again.  Looks fun but so many options. 

In playing around, it wasnt entirely intuitive with the bay loading and such.  Basically, with no part failures, it automates the KAC alarm setting to NOT LAUNCH rocket till this date... but with some other mechanics too. But you can still launch the full craft immediately if you accidentally hit Launch which breaks the immersion.   KCT deals with this (apparently in a hacky kind of way).

My hope is that the mod would spawn the craft on the launchpad when KAC alarm triggers...

Peace.

I recall trying to get BARIS to be a good neighbor to KCT but don’t remember where I left off. I think the aim was to get out of the way and defer BARIS’ vehicle integration in favor of KCT. The idea being that KCT already provides vehicle integration of a sort, so BARIS should consider it done when KCT says your vehicle is ready. When I have more time I will review that area of the code to see where I left off.

 I would love a better way to integrate with the stock launch button but at the time I couldn’t figure out how. Ideally that code would get out of the way for other mods too..

Edited January 16, 2019 by Angel-125

[TicTac]

I would be interested in making a light KCT mod, but I don't have any experience in either modding ksp or coding with c#...  So it would take me a while just to get going. 

I'm going to have some more free time than usual over the next couple of weeks, so I may take a stab at it.  I'll update here with how things go. 

[theJesuit]

Just had another thought... 

What if each part had a resource:  Like one unit of buildTimer.  Then, launch clamps only are able to stage when buildTimer is at zero and they consume the resource slowly. More parts means more to consume.  Make the lauchclamps expensive so that launch clamp spam isn't a thing.

Or, instead use an additional part that consumes the resource, but make it so that you would be able to use only one of them.  Like the modular launchpad things that then are also required to ignite big engines like ullage.

Peace.

[TicTac]

My gut tells me that it will be easier and probably simpler / less error prone to delay launching using the game time than to add resource to a craft and have it drain on the pad.  My first attempt would probably be similar to KCT, where clicking launch in the VAB adds your ship to a queue and it's then able to be launched once its timer runs out.

The goal for me, and from what I can tell in this thread for you guys, is to make it up to date with ksp and to strip it down to the bare essentials - ships take time to build and roll out based on their complexity (cost), and this process gets faster as the VAB and SPH are upgraded. Possibly the same system for research, at least as an option.  This way there is less complexity, and hopefully it's easier to maintain.

I would also try to make as many things optional as possible, so you can say disable rolling out after building, or make research instantaneous. But again, with no experience modding ksp this is a shot in the dark for me.