[20.x]BobCat Ind. Release

[Tommygun]

Hi Bobcat,

I'm using and enjoying the DEMV Mark 2, and noticed a minor incompatibility with the Engineer plugin:

The fuel in the cargo tank doesn't count towards the Engineer delta-V calculations, either in VAB or during flight. The fuel quantity shows up correctly, though, and it all gets used.

This was under 0.17, with the current build of DEMV and Engineer.

Thanks again. She's a real beauty!

That delta-V calculation problem is an known issue with the Engineer plug-in and not the DEMV.

When you design rockets with side drop off tanks the delta-V calculation problem shows up there too.

The program only calculates delta-V when there is both an engine and fuel associated in the same stage.

If you drag the fuel icon to the same engine stage, then it will do the calculations with that fuel tank.

Edited September 27, 2012 by Tommygun

[Vigilante-Saint]

What mods did you use for those engines?

Some type of ion engine?

Yeah, it's the ion engines/batteries/solar panels from the Mechanical Mouse Industries Satellite Pack. Not that I used those for the actual landing because the thrust is too low but they're good for getting from A to B

[ramy]

That's why i put 6 engines. the thrust is low as you said, but they worked fine and are not heavy so the rover is very stable.

The idea of getting anyplace with one piece and returning safe excites me. it is All in One. This craft goes everywhere except jool, moho due to low trust and sun gravity and to the sun (Kerbol)

Edited September 28, 2012 by ramy

[6677]

The fuel tank is very weak on the demv mk2

[Alephzorg]

Mine can drive 80m/s that's not 80km/h. But still Jeb is happy to drive a race cart

80m/s = 288km/h... Pretty fast I would say.

[CrashnBurn]

Had a little spare time and decided to make it fly again. This time I had something a bit more practical in mind. I downsized the stock aerospikes (keeping them balanced to the stock parts, no overpowered super-parts here) and downsized Novasilisko's Radial Flange from the Novapunch Pack (Yes, I have permission from Nova and Tib)

These two engines are a little heavier (plus the weight of the flanges also adds a bit of weight) and have a little less combined thrust than a single stock aerospike which you could stick on the bottom node, but this preserves the look and ground clearance. I increased the Isp by 2.5% to 400 to balance the extra weight and drag. I think it looks very nice on the DEMV and is very well balanced to the stock parts. This won't get you to orbit with the onboard fuel, but add a tank or two and it could, although it's intended to allow suborbital moves while exploring the new planets.

I had to allow fuel cross feed on the chassis to let fuel to flow from the cargo pod, but otherwise all it takes is "stick 'em on and fly". Although it takes a while to get up speed, it flies extremely well and is stable enough for a "hands off" take off.

If you all like it, I'll see if Bobcat would let me publish them here or include them in his mod. (With credit to the original authors of the parts, of course)

[TheLancerDeuce]

Very neat mod. Wish there was more then 1 payload to stick in the back though.

[segaprophet]

Supersonic Labs is proud to announce the release of Pretorian DEMV Mk II LRM - a groundbreaking new delivery system designed for the award-winning Pretorian DEMV rover platform from BobCat Industries.

Pretorian DEMV Mk II LRM is precision engineered for fuel economy, stability and ease of use. The interplanetary transfer stage doubles as a landing stage, eliminating the need to carry extra engines or bulky parachutes. The system has enough fuel budget to facilitate a fully powered landing to Duna surface, ensuring pinpoint landing accuracy. A built in Rendezvous Calculator module guarantees an optimal mission profile.

Usage Guidelines, Read Carefully! - MechJeb 1.9.3 currently has difficulties landing with user-inputted coordinates on Duna surface. Instead, fly to within several radial degrees before desired landing zone and use "Land" option. Interplanetary transfer fuel stage must be ejected shortly before landing to ensure safe deployment of DEMV rover platform.

Download - Pretorian DEMV Mk II LRM (KSP 0.17), DEMV required, MechJeb required, Protracter - Rendezvous Calculator required

Edited September 29, 2012 by segaprophet

[andrew8098]

cool vehicles but im concerned about the use of the Bobcat name and nearly identical logo to the Bobcat Company. I like the concept of one day Bobcat developing space vehicles, but with everyones concern on here about getting permission for using others work, i just thought id bring this up.

[segaprophet]

cool vehicles but im concerned about the use of the Bobcat name and nearly identical logo to the Bobcat Company. I like the concept of one day Bobcat developing space vehicles, but with everyones concern on here about getting permission for using others work, i just thought id bring this up.

-----

segaprophet cool idea

- I took that as a go ahead from BobCat, so I proceeded under Creative Commons attribution guidelines. I feel that I'm simply putting a little more polish on the derivative designs users have already posted in this thread. If BobCat has any problems, I'm totally open to communication. Also, I've taken every opportunity to show that the rover design is not mine, just the delivery system. This includes a credit in the title graphic as well as a direct link in the first line of the copy. Also, our respective company typefaces are incredibly different and hard to confuse for one another.

In any case, anyone who is dim enough to think the rover design is mine (and doesn't look at my notes to visit BobCat's thread and download DEMV) will quickly find that their .craft file doesn't work at all.

No one on the KSP forums is actually selling a real product, so intellectual property doesn't really come into it, even though I'm acutely aware that I should make sure people know BobCat did the rover. To that end, I purposely did not include any DEMV data files with my .craft file, hence DEMV LRM does not include any original work by BobCat, just a software call for his original data.

I'm just trying to help more people deploy BobCat's incredible rover. Argument defused?

Edited September 29, 2012 by segaprophet

[segaprophet]

Hmm, still, I suppose I should ask BobCat now . . Is it OK with you if I market my fake delivery platform for your excellent but still fake rover? Just to the get formalities out of the way.

[BobCat]

segaprophet

You misunderstood. this post

cool vehicles but im concerned about the use of the Bobcat name and nearly identical logo to the Bobcat Company. I like the concept of one day Bobcat developing space vehicles, but with everyones concern on here about getting permission for using others work, i just thought id bring this up.

Was not addressed to you. I wrote it because of the similarity with this company BobCat www.bobcat.com. ))))

And your Lander are very good, and I'm not against their use and publish.

[segaprophet]

Awesome, let's roll with it. So everyone knows, LRM stands for "long range mission", primarily referring to the specific load bearing characteristics and configuration of the launch and interplanetary transfer stages.

Edited September 29, 2012 by segaprophet

[Beowolf]

That delta-V calculation problem is an known issue with the Engineer plug-in and not the DEMV.

When you design rockets with side drop off tanks the delta-V calculation problem shows up there too.

The program only calculates delta-V when there is both an engine and fuel associated in the same stage.

If you drag the fuel icon to the same engine stage, then it will do the calculations with that fuel tank.

No, I double-checked and mine is a different problem. The DEMV cargo tank is not included in the Engineer delta-v calcs, period.

It's easy enough to demonstrate: New ship, use DEMV cockpit. Add DEMV Chassis and Cargo Tank. Add Engineer device and stick an engine on the bottom.

Note delta-V is zero, and it's all in 1 stage. Remove Cargo Tank and drop a stock fuel tank onto the chassis, and delta-v is now correctly calculated. Add the cargo tank again (leaving the stock fuel tank attached), and Engineer correctly reports extra fuel, weight, and change to TWR, but delta-V is still based on only the stock tank.

It still could be the Engineer plugin's problem, of course. I can't think of any way to tell short of digging through source code.

Edited September 29, 2012 by Beowolf

[Beowolf]

cool vehicles but im concerned about the use of the Bobcat name and nearly identical logo to the Bobcat Company. I like the concept of one day Bobcat developing space vehicles, but with everyones concern on here about getting permission for using others work, i just thought id bring this up.

Wow, you're right. I'd noticed the name, but not the logo. When you add in the logo, IMO Bobcat Company will be legally required to send a "cease and desist" letter as soon as they notice. In the US, if you don't legally defend your trademarks, you can lose them.

That's all that will happen, but I still recommend changing the logo to something totally unlike Bobcat Company's right away. Why put their legal staff to the trouble?

/IANAL

[Elladril]

Thanks for this great mod!

Sorry if I'm retarded, but I have a question.. is there a way to set a parking brake? It keeps rolling away on me lol.

[deadshot462]

Elladril - Try pressing "B" to set parking brake, an indicator should show up on the staging list. This was on the last version I played so not sure if it's still the case.

[TG_bigboss]

I have a question. I was just testing out on Kerbal since its my first time using the cart mod and urs as well and well when i launch the wheels are stuck in the ground and then boom i go flying in the air and all of it breaks apart! When i bump into things as well it just breaks. I have a feeling the strengths need to be bumped up a little =)

Edited September 30, 2012 by TG_bigboss

[BobCat]

Wow, you're right. I'd noticed the name, but not the logo. When you add in the logo, IMO Bobcat Company will be legally required to send a "cease and desist" letter as soon as they notice. In the US, if you don't legally defend your trademarks, you can lose them.

That's all that will happen, but I still recommend changing the logo to something totally unlike Bobcat Company's right away. Why put their legal staff to the trouble?

ok.

1. BobCat Logo has been changed, my is not a copy of what you can make sure. BobCat Company and BobCat ind. have diferetnt logo.

2. BobCat Company have trademark. I do not sell anything, do not spend promotions and speak on behalf of their company. Only on its own. My logo, its no trademark. (see USA trademark law)

3.The only thing that can make a Bobcat Company, is to send me a warning that they are not happy, I'm using a similar logo and name them.

If they really do, and my addons hurt someone's feelings, then yes, I'll change the logo on the other. And while everything remains in place.

regard BobCat )))

[Moon]

The back of the DEMV falls off way to easily, it falls off if I hit a small bump and it looks goofy when driving around with it - all my landings on the Mun and Minimus ended up without a back because it falls off

[TheCardinal]

The back of the DEMV falls off way to easily, it falls off if I hit a small bump and it looks goofy when driving around with it - all my landings on the Mun and Minimus ended up without a back because it falls off

I noticed that too. Use some struts to tie the cargo down, that helps most of the time.

[Lazurkri]

So when can we expect to see the little "scout" chopper thingie?

[BobCat]

I noticed that too. Use some struts to tie the cargo down, that helps most of the time.

This and some other bug will be fixed in the next patch.

So when can we expect to see the little "scout" chopper thingie?

After passing all tests

[JustinS222]

Hey Bobcat you have been having problems with internals right? Well C7 just did a post about modding and he talks about internals a bit. He said in the post he will get further in depth on a later post.

[BobCat]

O rly ? where?