Unable to Save Game in 1.11

[djr5899]

I bought a new laptop this week that has a NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2060 graphics card (big improvement from the Intel Graphics chip in old laptop).  I loaded Steam and KSP on the new laptop.  For the most part everything has been running fine, however, I have run into 2 issues, and I'm not sure if they are related.

1. I am unable to Save the game during a mission.  When I press Escape, it brings up the menu to Save/Load/Resume etc.  I can press Save, and type in a Savegame name, but when I press enter, nothing happens and the game appears to freeze.  It never saves no matter how long I let it sit there.  If I hit Escape key, it will bring me back to the game and I can keep playing, however, I cannot Save.  In fact, on my last mission, I was able to complete the mission without the extra save point, and when my craft landed on Kerbin, I could not Recover Vessel, and I could not choose Tracking Station or Space Center from the menu.  Click on any of those options...nothing happens.  It seems something is putting the game in a state where the menus stop working.
2. I'm using the same craft type when this happens.  I can go on some missions with this craft (or slight variant) and never see the issue.  Other times, using this craft I run into the problem.  One thing I have noticed is that, when the Save issue is happening, I think I am also seeing an RCS issue with the MK1-3 Command Pod.  I always disable the RCS thrusters on the pod, but, I have noticed that when I see the Save/Menu problem, it usually starts when I am attempting to dock a lander back to the return pod.  My waiting return pod usually just has an Engineer in it, and the lander that is attempting to dock to it has a Pilot and Scientist (this is career mode).  As the lander gets closer to the return pod, I notice that the RCS thrusters give the appearance that they are firing, even though they are disabled and there is actually no thrusting force occurring.  Visual effects of RCS is only thing occurring (you can see it in the screenshot below as I am about to land on Kerbin, and you can see that RCS is Disabled on the MK1-3 Command Pod).  Toggling RCS off and on at the Command Pod level does nothing...the visual element remains.

Only mods I have loaded are KER and [X] Science continued.  I had 1.11 loaded on my old laptop, and I never saw the Save Game or the RCS thruster problem.  I'm a bit stumped.

 

[Serenity]

14 minutes ago, djr5899 said:

1. I am unable to Save the game during a mission.  When I press Escape, it brings up the menu to Save/Load/Resume etc.  I can press Save, and type in a Savegame name, but when I press enter, nothing happens and the game appears to freeze.  It never saves no matter how long I let it sit there.  If I hit Escape key, it will bring me back to the game and I can keep playing, however, I cannot Save.  In fact, on my last mission, I was able to complete the mission without the extra save point, and when my craft landed on Kerbin, I could not Recover Vessel, and I could not choose Tracking Station or Space Center from the menu.  Click on any of those options...nothing happens.  It seems something is putting the game in a state where the menus stop working.

If you hit Alt+F12 and hit ''Clear input lock'' does it work when it gets stucked?

Does Quicksave F5 work?

Edited January 3, 2021 by Boyster

[CirrusifiedEquili]

4 hours ago, Boyster said:

If you hit Alt+F12 and hit ''Clear input lock'' does it work when it gets stucked?

Does Quicksave F5 work?

I've also experienced this bug, and can confirm that quicksaving and quickloading does not work.

[VoidSquid]

Not the first time I'm reading people having issues with loading/saving in KSP 1.11.0, see for example here 

Maybe you want to file a bug report here

https://bugs.kerbalspaceprogram.com/projects/ksp/issues

Edited January 3, 2021 by VoidSquid

[djr5899]

Thanks for the suggestion.  I've removed the 2 mods I have and I am still able to reproduce the issue.  To me, it does appear to be directly related to the RCS thrusters on the MK1-3 Command Pod appearing as though they are active.  When landed on the Mun, I was able to save.  When attempting to rendezvous with the MK1-3 craft, I was able to save when I had an intercept but was not within visual range of the craft.  As soon as I got into visual range, where I could see RCS thrusters visually looking like they are in use, I could no longer save the game.  Tried clear input locks, which did not help.  Debug console shows a null pointer reference error.

Opening a bug report.  Thanks for all the suggestions.

[Serenity]

3 hours ago, djr5899 said:

Opening a bug report.  Thanks for all the suggestions.

Hmm this feels like it has something to do with the game pausing, like pausing everything physics etc.

I wonder if you try to do physical warp(not the normal one) maybe it gets unstucked.

Post maybe a link of the bug report so people who have same problem can upvote it/find it from this thread.

Edited January 3, 2021 by Boyster

[djr5899]

Here's the bug report I created:  https://bugs.kerbalspaceprogram.com/issues/26961

Hope it gets some upvotes, because most of my craft use the MK1-3 pod, and with this bug, the game isn't very playable for me...seeing that even if you can complete your mission without saving, there is no way to get back to the game and you have to kill the process.  Going to test with RCS enabled and see if that makes a difference.  Also going to test on my old laptop, to see if it is something with higher graphics setting or different graphics card in my new laptop.

[VoidSquid]

Unfortunately I can't give that bug report an upvote as I've reverted to 1.10.1 already after playing 1.11.0 for two hours, hence I can't reproduce the issue.

[Alberto74]

Unfortunately I just can confirm the 'unable to save' problem. In my case I was using switching between ships in a rendevou using the [] when the ships just disappeared! I still have their icon and the orbit on the map ('M') but I cannot anylonger switch to them (nothing happens when I click, if use [] the game says there are no other vessels near by). Aditionally the menus become empty for any other vessel, for example, the resources menu that shows the propellants is just empty doesn't matter to what other ship I change and I can not longer control the vessels.

I upvoted the bug djr5899 created: https://bugs.kerbalspaceprogram.com/issues/26961

I think this bug is high severe (now it's severity is low), at least for me the game became unplayable :(

Somebody downgrade its KSP version to 1.10.1. I don't know how to do that but I will investigate. Up to now, I cannot recomend to upgrade to 1.11, which it's a pitty. I was very excited about it.

[VoidSquid]

47 minutes ago, Alberto74 said:

Somebody downgrade its KSP version to 1.10.1

I do make regular backups of my whole KSP folder, just had to restore the backup, so that was a matter of minutes.

In case you need Steam for that, see here: 

In general, I highly recommend to

a) do not play directly from the KSP installation you downloaded from Steam, but copy that to another location, e.g. C:\KSP. This way, no automatic update can ruin your KSP installation.

b) make regular backups of your KSP folder, in particular when changing mods.

c) make a backup of your save games every time you start playing KSP.

 

[maddog59]

On 1/3/2021 at 6:48 PM, djr5899 said:

Here's the bug report I created:  https://bugs.kerbalspaceprogram.com/issues/26961

Hope it gets some upvotes, because most of my craft use the MK1-3 pod, and with this bug, the game isn't very playable for me...seeing that even if you can complete your mission without saving, there is no way to get back to the game and you have to kill the process.  Going to test with RCS enabled and see if that makes a difference.  Also going to test on my old laptop, to see if it is something with higher graphics setting or different graphics card in my new laptop.

I've experienced the same 'unable to save' problem, but while on EVA. And I've seen the same visual (and audio) issue with the RCS thrusters, but on a craft with an MK1 command pod.  

I upvoted your bug report and added my notes as well. 

[VoidSquid]

Happy KSP 1.11.0, everyone!

[Feellikeapple]

I also have this problem, for me I was doing an easy mün mission and when I was docking with my command module after returning from the surface, the mk3 command pod's rcs thrusters seem to be on, but not draining any monopropellant, so I continued the mission thinking its a graphics bug, then I realized I can't quick save, so I just continued to mission, and when I splashed down on kerbin, I realized I can't even recover vessel or go back to the space center, I did a couple more missions without the mk3 command pod and quick saving and recovering works just fine. so there must be some sort of issue on the mk3 command pod (p.s. I upvoted)

I have a lot of mods, but some of them are

mechjeb, ker, scatterer, tundra exploration, mk2&mk3 expansion, restock, stockalike station parts redux and waterfall

Edited January 26, 2021 by Feellikeapple

[Max Que]

Same problem here.  Any orbiter and lander combination will lock the game if you enter orbit, un-dock and land, then re-dock with your orbiter.  An Apollo style mission is not possible with this bug.

One detailed bug report describes the problem starting when the un-docking vehicle moves "under acceleration" outside of a specific (physics?) range, and then returning to the orbiting vehicle.  I tested this by entering Mun orbit with a lander docked.  The lander un-docked and landed, then returned to orbit.  At this point saves still work normally.  Once I rendezvous with the orbiter and dock the game cannot be saved. 

Hoping to find a workaround to this game-killer, I ran the test again, but after un-docking I allowed the lander to drift unaccelerated to over 3km from the orbiter before enabling engines and landing.  Once again the game cannot be saved after re-rendezvous. 

There are other ways to generate this bug.  Using Hyperedit (is asking for it, but...) and MKS, place a Malemute rover into Kerbin orbit, then into Mun orbit.  Use the Hyperedit Ship Lander to drop the rover onto the surface.  At this point you cannot save, exactly as described above.  What is odd is that the small USI rover does not have this problem.  Have not testing with the Karibou yet (what's the point?).

I do not see any mention of this being fixed for the 1.11.1 update, but I will test again under 1.11.1 (Windows 64-bit).

[Krazy1]

There appears to be a duplicate bug report for this:

#27189

Recommend reviewing that, and cross-referencing it (if you think it's the same)

Did you check your logs for a null ref like this other bug report?

[Max Que]

Yes, the log files show null ref errors.

I believe I have a work-around for this bug, and I hope this is useful in isolating this bug.  There are several ways to trigger this bug, and my testing is still on-going, but it appears that the most reliable methods to trigger this game-killer fail to trigger this bug while in Sandbox mode.   I have a KSP.log file of an instance of the bug where the first indication of a problem is:

[ERR 23:42:26.330] Input is null for field 'agent' in config node 'CONTRACT'
  at System.Environment.get_StackTrace () [0x00000] in <ad04dee02e7e4a85a1299c7ee81c79f6>:0
  at ConfigNode.AddValue (System.String name, System.String value) [0x00000] in <2afc64dea36946459d4707808bdac511>:0
  at Contracts.Contract.Save (ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <2afc64dea36946459d4707808bdac511>:0
  at Contracts.ContractSystem.OnSave (ConfigNode gameNode) [0x00000] in <2afc64dea36946459d4707808bdac511>:0
  at ScenarioModule.Save (ConfigNode node) [0x00000] in <2afc64dea36946459d4707808bdac511>:0
  at ProtoScenarioModule..ctor (ScenarioModule module) [0x00000] in <2afc64dea36946459d4707808bdac511>:0
  at ScenarioRunner.UpdateModules () [0x00000] in <2afc64dea36946459d4707808bdac511>:0
  at ScenarioRunner.GetUpdatedProtoModules () [0x00000] in <2afc64dea36946459d4707808bdac511>:0
  at Game.Updated (GameScenes startSceneOverride) [0x00000] in <2afc64dea36946459d4707808bdac511>:0
  at Game.Updated () [0x00000] in <2afc64dea36946459d4707808bdac511>:0
  at FlightDriver+<PostInit>d__34.MoveNext () [0x00000] in <2afc64dea36946459d4707808bdac511>:0
  at UnityEngine.SetupCoroutine.InvokeMoveNext (System.Collections.IEnumerator enumerator, System.IntPtr returnValueAddress) [0x00000] in <5aeafee3fea24f37abd1315553f2cfa6>:0

In every instance of bug #26961 I have encountered the string "<2afc64dea36946459d4707808bdac511>:0" always appears.

The excerpt of the log file shown above was generated without using a MK1-3 pod.  The stock MEM pod has exactly the same phantom RCS thruster glitch as has been reported with the MK1-3.

Here is a very strange detail:

The log file excerpt above was triggered by using the ship lander function in Hyperedit to place a rover onto the Mun within a few hundred meters of an already landed (conventionally landed) lander using the MEM command pod.

If I land a rover build on the MKS Malemute rover, I get the results shown above (only if in Career mode, but not in Sandbox mode).  If I land a rover based on the Akita or Karibou rovers from the same MKS mod, in Career mode, this does not happen (right away, it may happen later).  Why is the (excellent) Malemute rover different?  What is common between the MEM and MK1-3 command pods, and what is "<2afc64dea36946459d4707808bdac511>:0"?

I have run into this bug with the "<2afc64dea36946459d4707808bdac511>:0" string after re-rendezvous with an orbiting ship, also after driving a rover out of, and back into physics range of a lander, but the simplest (and fastest) method to trigger the bug is landing a MKS Malemute rover within physics range of a lander.  Using the stock Apollo style lander you will see the RCS thruster glitch as the Malumute rover is slowly being lowered to the surface.  This behavior starts before the rover touches down, and the game cannot be saved. 

This method of reproducing the bug shows some limits to its behavior such as Career mode vs. Sandbox mode, as well as different behavior under identical conditions based on different rover command pods.  Hopefully by establishing some corner-limits we can isolate and kill this Kracken.  I will work on testing the Sandbox mode work-around, mainly because there is little worse than completing something cool only to discover you cant save your work.

[Max Que]

I have run into issue #26961 in Sandbox mode.  The work-around does not actually work.

[Lucke001]

Same problem for me, this issue makes the game unplayable on KSP 1.11.1.

Same RCS visual glitches, can only Save As, cannot return to main menu or quick save pressing F5. I can resume playing but can never save or return to main menu or tracking station. Ah I can go into options though but it's irrelevant maybe?

Edited February 11, 2021 by Lucke001

[Portablejim]

I can reproduce this in a tutorial.

The main bug (unable to save) requires the DLC, but without the DLC it just results in a visual glitch.

 

Edited February 15, 2021 by Portablejim
Adding image in addition to videos.

[Portablejim]

Other threads I have found (older/newer duplicates)

 

Other posts on the internet I have found with the issue:

 

Edited February 16, 2021 by Portablejim
Adding in more links

[DeerStalker]

I encountered this bug too by going out of physics range via an EVA on Minmus and then coming back.

Workaround to save your game again: destroy the Vessel. Probably just the buggy command pod would be enough.

I did a rendezvous with my spacestation in LKO before the end of a mission, EVA the kerbals and science to the station and then let the mission-craft disintegrate in the atmosphere.

As soon as the buggy pod was destroyed I was able to save the game again.

Edited March 6, 2021 by DeerStalker
typo

[djr5899]

Curious if any mods or dev can comment further on this.  I would have thought that this issue would be a much higher priority.  It is currently set to low, and it doesn't appear that any work has been done on this since I reported the issue over 2 months ago.

I've tried adding comments to the bug report, and I see more and more users adding comments that they are seeing the issue.  I tested this out when the 1.11.1 release came out, and it wasn't fixed.  Other than that test, I haven't been able to play the game because of this bug.  I mean, obviously I can build craft without this part, but the majority of the craft in my current career relied on that part.

Any additional effort or update we could get on Bug26961 would be great.  The other similar bug, 27189, was closed and folded into 26961 from what I can see.

[maddog59]

10 hours ago, djr5899 said:

...I can build craft without this part, but the majority of the craft in my current career relied on that part.

You're referring to the Mk1-3 part as being problematic, right? I've built a ship with with one of those and used it to run several trips to the Mun and Minmus, with multiple landings and redockings there and in Kerbin orbit, and only once in the past several weeks have I encountered the problem. I ended up shutting the game down via Task Manager (I'm  on Win10, KSP 1.11.1),  and when I restarted all was well. 

Just offering this up as one more piece of the puzzle.

[djr5899]

10 hours ago, maddog59 said:

You're referring to the Mk1-3 part as being problematic, right? I've built a ship with with one of those and used it to run several trips to the Mun and Minmus, with multiple landings and redockings there and in Kerbin orbit, and only once in the past several weeks have I encountered the problem. I ended up shutting the game down via Task Manager (I'm  on Win10, KSP 1.11.1),  and when I restarted all was well. 

Just offering this up as one more piece of the puzzle.

I just loaded up the game for the first time in 2 and a half months, I am up to date on 1.11.1, and the issue still occurs.  I can reproduce it 100% of the time, and there are almost 20 people that have responded to the bug report citing the same issue.

My only question for you would be, when you have used the Mk1-3 pod on your missions, do you leave the Mk1-3 in orbit, or are you always in that command pod the entire mission.  The issue for me is 100% reproducible if I leave the Mk1-3 in orbit as my return vessel, and land on a surface with a lander pod, and come back.  Actually, you don't even have to land.  If you leave the Mk1-3 in orbit, undock a vessel from it, move 2-4km away from the Mk1-3 pod and then rendezvous back with it, I see the issue 100% of the time.  Most of the others commenting on the bug report see the same.  You get an NullReferenceException when the issue happens, and additional NREs if you try and click Space Station or Tracking Station from the menu system.

[maddog59]

18 hours ago, djr5899 said:

do you leave the Mk1-3 in orbit, or are you always in that command pod the entire mission.  

Ah, that may very well be the difference ... for my missions, the Mk1-3 is part of the lander module. I will have to try doing something like what you've described in the sandbox. And I think it has a higher or equal priority to the transfer vehicle it docks with before and after.  

Not sure if this is relevant, but I've re-used the same ship for several trips, docking it with several stations in orbits around Kerbin, Mun, and Minmus, and switching between vessels from a variety of distances.   

I'm not sophisticated enough (yet) to know to check for the NRE's you mentioned. Where do I find those?

<later>

I've been unable to reproduce the problem. I created a lander with a Mk1 Lander Can, connected with a Standard Docking Port (not Jr or Sr) to a Mk1-3 vehicle. Both ships were made with identical components (engines, tanks, RCS, guidance units, landing struts, batteries, and solar panels); the only difference was the Mk1-3 vs. the Lander can. I then cheated them into Mun orbit (~15k), undocked them, and moved them to 4 km apart. Saved the game, then took turns docking them with one or the other being the vehicle I was controlling primarily (though I did switch back and forth to make sure they stayed aligned). Then I landed the Lander, then returned it to the orbiting Mk1-3 and re-docked them. At no time did the problem appear.

I'm not sure why I'm not able to reproduce it. The only thing I can think of, based on my own experience, is to ask if you're using the most latest version of MJ2? I ask because immediately after 1.11 was released I had the same problem as you've described, but with am Mk1 command pod. I eventually chalked it up to the version of MJ2, which had not yet been updated, and it only appeared after I used it. I stopped using MJ2 until a new version was released, and have been using it extensively for the more routine tasks, and not had the problem appear.  

Edited March 15, 2021 by maddog59