When Did KSP2 Get IVA's?

[Bej Kerman]

Why is this controversial? Is it not the marketing team's job to keep in mind people will infer things that are not literally said? If the marketing team keeps showing IVAs done with a frankly stupid workaround and has to keep posting "these aren't actually IVAs" they're doing a crap job and should stick to demonstrating things that are implemented already.

Edited December 8, 2023 by Bej Kerman

[Buzz313th]

3 minutes ago, Scarecrow71 said:

If you follow the steps that IG laid out, then yes, the camera will be from inside the cockpit and flying from inside it will be simulated.

Move the camera to a view so that it appears from inside the cockpit

People who play games know what the term means.  If they don't a simple Google search or forum/discord question gets the answer

Really?  Come on.  It's the currently active camera.

Like 2 above, people who game know this.  If you don't, ask on the forums or discord and you'll get the answer in rather short order.

Again - really?  You know what first person view is, and you know the game is centered around sentient beings called Kerbals.

I fail to see why this statement is a problem.

As stated above - if you game, you should know.  If you don't, then ask.

It's only cryptic because you are making it so.  They stated pretty much what you said they should, but they used different wording than you'd prefer.  I don't know how else to put it.

Your a biased observer.  Ask someone else to look at those two twitter posts that knows nothing about KSP2 and enough about gaming to recognize the word "Clipping".  

I believe that both of those posts are purposely riding a fine line that is fraudulent marketing practice.  

Ask yourself this....

Were both of these two twitter posts targeting KSP players, or the general public?   If your answer is, "The General Public", then ask yourself as the "Marketing Director" of KSP2, why wouldn't your disclaimer be written to inform and communicate better to the general public?

There is a clear pattern here.

 

[Buzz313th]

And one thing I completely missed, which kinda shows the true intent of that twitter post...

The video header states...

"Try this in the 0.2 update next month"

What exactly do they mean by, "Try this in the 0.2 update next month?"  Can't we already move the camera into the model and "hack" an IVA view now?  Do we need version 0.2 to do this?  Or can I just load up KSP2 right now and get that same view?

I can do it now..  Without version 0.2.  So if this is the case, then what exactly in that video are they showing that 0.2 will allow us to do that is not already possible?

This is why I am so frustrated.  I see the writing on the wall. I believe there is more effort trying to "Con" then to produce.

 

Edited December 8, 2023 by Buzz313th

[Scarecrow71]

15 minutes ago, Buzz313th said:

Your a biased observer.  Ask someone else to look at those two twitter posts that knows nothing about KSP2 and enough about gaming to recognize the word "Clipping".  

No, I'm not.  In fact, multiple people in this thread have stated pretty much what I said.  And as far as talking to someone who knows nothing about KSP?  As I mentioned, a simple Google search or asking here and/or on Discord would get them the answer.  (And, tbh, if I'm talking to someone who isn't knowledgeable about gaming or KSP and the topic of clipping comes up, they are going to ask me, and I'm going to tell them.)

17 minutes ago, Buzz313th said:

I believe that both of those posts are purposely riding a fine line that is fraudulent marketing practice.  

I disagree.  And so do a lot of other people in this thread.

17 minutes ago, Buzz313th said:

Ask yourself this....

Were both of these two twitter posts targeting KSP players, or the general public?   If your answer is, "The General Public", then ask yourself as the "Marketing Director" of KSP2, why wouldn't your disclaimer be written to inform and communicate better to the general public?

I'm not asking myself that question because I'm neither the person who wrote them, nor am I the person they are targeting with them.  I also read them and understood EXACTLY what was meant in them.  Take them at face value, not some hidden meaning that doesn't exist.

[Buzz313th]

4 minutes ago, Scarecrow71 said:

No, I'm not.  In fact, multiple people in this thread have stated pretty much what I said.  And as far as talking to someone who knows nothing about KSP?  As I mentioned, a simple Google search or asking here and/or on Discord would get them the answer.  (And, tbh, if I'm talking to someone who isn't knowledgeable about gaming or KSP and the topic of clipping comes up, they are going to ask me, and I'm going to tell them.)

I disagree.  And so do a lot of other people in this thread.

I'm not asking myself that question because I'm neither the person who wrote them, nor am I the person they are targeting with them.  I also read them and understood EXACTLY what was meant in them.  Take them at face value, not some hidden meaning that doesn't exist.

I could pick apart your reply above, but I'm not going to do it..  mostly, because, You or anyone else reading this thread is not the target demographic for those two twitter posts...

To further justify my opinion on this topic, please see this reply I just posted....

 

 

Edited December 8, 2023 by Buzz313th

[Scarecrow71]

5 minutes ago, Buzz313th said:

What exactly do they mean by, "Try this in the 0.2 update next month?"  Can't we already move the camera into the model and "hack" an IVA view now?  Do we need version 0.2 to do this?  Or can I just load up KSP2 right now and get that same view?

I can do it now..  Without version 0.2.  So if this is the case, then what exactly in that video are they showing that 0.2 will allow us to do that is not already possible?

This is why I am so frustrated.  I see the writing on the wall. I believe there is more effort trying to "Con" then to produce.

I'm not at a loss for words, but pretty close.  I feel like you are looking for something to be wrong, or off, or hidden.  You are looking for ill intent or willful maliciousness.  And none exists.  At least, none that I can see.

Just take their words at face value for now.  "Try this in the 0.2 update next month".  Can you do it now?  Yes.  That doesn't mean they are being deceitful by telling you to try it with the next update.  So what does it mean?  Try it in 0.2.  Period.  Full stop.  Try it in 0.2.  Doesn't mean you can't do it now, or not to try it now.  Just to try it in 0.2.  Anything beyond that is simply you looking for a hidden meaning that doesn't exist.

And what writing on what wall?  Why do you feel we are being conned when everything over the past 2 months has been geared specifically towards getting 0.2 out?  The game is getting onto the right track (even if it took some time), the devs are communicating again, and we're getting inside looks at what is coming.  Granted, 0.2 could drop and it could be really bad.  But it could also be really good.  Give it a chance.  Let it at least drop before throwing dirt on its coffin.

[Buzz313th]

2 hours ago, Scarecrow71 said:

I'm not at a loss for words, but pretty close.  I feel like you are looking for something to be wrong, or off, or hidden.  You are looking for ill intent or willful maliciousness.  And none exists.  At least, none that I can see.

I respect your faith and loyalty..

2 hours ago, Scarecrow71 said:

Just take their words at face value for now.  "Try this in the 0.2 update next month".  Can you do it now?  Yes.  That doesn't mean they are being deceitful by telling you to try it with the next update.  So what does it mean?  Try it in 0.2.  Period.  Full stop.  Try it in 0.2.  Doesn't mean you can't do it now, or not to try it now.  Just to try it in 0.2.  Anything beyond that is simply you looking for a hidden meaning that doesn't exist.

How about, "Try this in KSP2"?

Again, I appreciate your loyalty

2 hours ago, Scarecrow71 said:

And what writing on what wall?  Why do you feel we are being conned when everything over the past 2 months has been geared specifically towards getting 0.2 out?  The game is getting onto the right track (even if it took some time), the devs are communicating again, and we're getting inside looks at what is coming.  Granted, 0.2 could drop and it could be really bad.  But it could also be really good.  Give it a chance.  Let it at least drop before throwing dirt on its coffin.

Yes I do feel that you are being conned.   I also have a tremendous amount of respect for the small community that is left here and still shows the loyalty that I believe is not deserved.  I am not Anti IG, but I am a diehard when it comes to opposing corporate greed. 

I once had the faith and hope you all have..   And to prove it..  here is one of my first posts on the KSP2 release state...

 

 

Edited December 8, 2023 by Buzz313th

[Bej Kerman]

Imitating the upcoming IVA feature as if it's gonna be in 0.2 is 100% misleading and I'm not sure where the "it's only deceitful if the lie is explicit" attitude people have is coming from. A message can be sent through inference and there's a reason the history of cinema isn't just characters telling the meaning of the story into the camera. I think it's completely daft to think the marketing team is in the clear just because there's no outright explicit lies in the tweet. It's still misleading and built to trick people into thinking IVA is going to be in 0.2. It sure as hell tripped me for a second when I saw the tweet.

[Guest]

23 hours ago, Bej Kerman said:

Why is this controversial?

Because people are not here for KSP2, but for the sake of pointlessly arguing. And so, on both sides, there's a complete lack of good faith. Nobody here is really interested about the supposedly misleading marketing, it's just flaming at the edge of the forum rules, hoping to goad "the other side" into crossing the line first.

Edited December 9, 2023 by Master39

[Buzz313th]

44 minutes ago, Master39 said:

Because people are not here for KSP2, but for the sake of pointlessly arguing. And so, on both sides, there's a complete lack of good faith. Nobody here is really interested about the supposedly misleading marketing, it's just flaming at the edge of the forum rules, hoping to goad "the other side" into crossing the line first.

I am here regarding the thread topic.  I honestly thought that there were IVA's in the upcoming 0.2.0.

Cheers

 

Edited December 9, 2023 by Buzz313th

[Kerbart]

1 hour ago, Master39 said:

Because people are not here for KSP2, but for the sake of pointlessly arguing.

[Bej Kerman]

1 hour ago, Master39 said:

Because people are not here for KSP2, but for the sake of pointlessly arguing. And so, on both sides, there's a complete lack of good faith. Nobody here is really interested about the supposedly misleading marketing, it's just flaming at the edge of the forum rules, hoping to goad "the other side" into crossing the line first.

When people are literally tricked into thinking IVAs are a thing soon and the official account has to make several  clarifications, it's not "supposedly" misleading. It is  misleading.

[Buzz313th]

10 minutes ago, Bej Kerman said:

When people are literally tricked into thinking IVAs are a thing soon and the official account has to make several  clarifications, it's not "supposedly" misleading. It is  misleading.

This concept is so revealing that it's impossible for me to understand how anyone can not consider it misleading.

[Kerbart]

8 minutes ago, Bej Kerman said:

When people are literally tricked into thinking IVAs are a thing soon and the official account has to make several  clarifications, it's not "supposedly" misleading. It is  misleading.

The golden rule in marketing: perception is reality.

Intercept has a history of posting picture that technically don't promise a feature but just "happen" to be interpreted by the players as such, time after time after time. I find it incredibly hard to believe that a subsidiary of a major gaming company (that spends a significant amount on marketing efforts) is doing that consistently by accident. It's also standard practice (source: I used to work in marketing, closely involved with media releases) to evaluate anything really carefully before publishing to ensure it doesn't communicate a message you don't want it to communicate (note my deliberate avoidance of the phrase "wrong message") with multiple parties looking at it and giving their feedback.

To be fair, this image seems to be an "honest mistake" in not clarifying it's just a pretty picture up front. But when the release of FS is less than two weeks away it's reasonable to interpret it as a FS picture, and not clarifying that is amazingly, yes unbelievable shortsighted. It is telling that the Tweet gets interpreted as "yet another example of posting misleading images" and IG should do some serious introspection on why they got that reputation and how to get rid of it.

[Buzz313th]

14 minutes ago, Kerbart said:

But when the release of FS is less than two weeks away it's reasonable to interpret it as a FS picture, and not clarifying that is amazingly, yes unbelievable shortsighted. It is telling that the Tweet gets interpreted as "yet another example of posting misleading images" and IG should do some serious introspection on why they got that reputation and how to get rid of it.

It's two tweets that have presented this "IVA" image.  Not just one, so they made the same mistake twice?

And then there is this.....

23 hours ago, Buzz313th said:

The video header states...

"Try this in the 0.2 update next month"

What exactly do they mean by, "Try this in the 0.2 update next month?"  Can't we already move the camera into the model and "hack" an IVA view now?  Do we need version 0.2 to do this?  Or can I just load up KSP2 right now and get that same view?

I can do it now..  Without version 0.2.  So if this is the case, then what exactly in that video are they showing that 0.2 will allow us to do that is not already possible?

 

[Bej Kerman]

11 minutes ago, Kerbart said:

It's also standard practice (source: I used to work in marketing, closely involved with media releases) to evaluate anything really carefully before publishing to ensure it doesn't communicate a message you don't want it to communicate (note my deliberate avoidance of the phrase "wrong message") with multiple parties looking at it and giving their feedback.

A recurring theme I see in this thread is that the people who interpreted the tweets as Intercept hinting at IVA in 0.2 are the ones being blamed for reading too deep, and not Intercept's marketing team for not accounting for this. I appreciate this bit of your reply because it emphasizes that subtext doesn't just exist in the heads of people looking at promo material.

Hidden messages didn't just stop existing when yall stopped taking the English classes that were meant to teach you how to read beyond what is literally written down on a page or shown in media.

1 minute ago, Buzz313th said:

The video header states...

"Try this in the 0.2 update next month"

What exactly do they mean by, "Try this in the 0.2 update next month?"  Can't we already move the camera into the model and "hack" an IVA view now?  Do we need version 0.2 to do this?  Or can I just load up KSP2 right now and get that same view?

I can do it now..  Without version 0.2.  So if this is the case, then what exactly in that video are they showing that 0.2 will allow us to do that is not already possible?

It's pretty clear to me now they made it to be read as "try IVA in 0.2" and used the docks as a convenient little excuse to point at if people dare to look at the subtext that exists here.

[Gargamel]

Since this has been shown to be camera clipping, continuation of this discussion beyond that is moot.