Soviet Outer Planets Probes

[Kerbalsaurus]

I cannot for the life of me find any concepts or proposals for outer planet probes by the Soviet Union. I know in Mars Horizon the probe used is the Tsiolkovsky I&II probes, but I can't fin any information about them beyond Mars Horizon, so I frankly sometimes think they made it up. Does anybody know any concepts/proposals?

[tater]

They had a few Mars orbiters/flyby craft that didn't fail (most failed). They never attempted anything past Mars.

 

[kerbiloid]

Proposals (without actual design):

http://www.astronautix.com/u/ur-700.html

Quote

• MAK Mars Automated Complex
• Mars Automated Soil Return
• Jupiter orbiter
• Jupiter flyby to achieve a solar sounding mission - the gravity of Jupiter would put the probe into a three year orbit with a perihelion of 0.2 AU to study the sun
• Saturn probes
• Manned Mars flyby
• Manned Mars/Venus flyby, with manned observation of the Sun, Mars, Venus, and Mercury
• Piloted Mars orbiter
• Mars surface expedition
• Resolve 'national economic and military problems' as recommended by NII-4 MO
• Support of the MKBS earth orbital station: piloted and general reconnaissance; inspection and destruction of enemy satellites; strike of designated points on the surface
• OPDS - Orbital Supply and Operations Station consisting of multiple modules (evidently as a replacement for the MKBS)
• Launch of new military equipment (directed energy and radiation weapons) on heavy satellites
• TPOKS - Heavy piloted orbital station equipped with quantum optical generators, for use in defense and attack from space, defense from earth-space weapons, annihilation of enemy ASAT's and ABM's, destruction of ICBM's in ascent phase
• STSSR - heavy stationary satellite system. This would consist of two satellites in geosynchronous orbit, which would jam enemy radio systems over the entire earth. Their true purpose would be disguised using 'maskirovka' techniques to make them seem to be civilian television satellites
• KPUS - Geosynchronous space strategic control and communication point to direct space military operations
• KSTSS - Heavy stationary commercial communications satellite. The KPUS and KSTSS would be placed in orbit by one launch of the UR-700.
• Direct broadcast Stationary Orbit Communications Satellite
• TKA - Heavy spacecraft for space combat. The problem of space defense would be solved by a constellation of such spacecraft in two to three orbital planes

 

(Btw, about the actual significance of the flagplanting in the Space Race, and the real objectives.)

[DDE]

1 hour ago, Kerbalsaurus said:

Tsiolkovsky

That one was a solar probe with a Jupiter gravity assist.

I guess the alternative designation is "Ju-S", which is as obvious as ever. Launch vehicle is Proton with a Shtorm hydrolox fourth stage.

At some point this was also entertained under the program name Zeus, along with a more direct Mercury probe named Hermes. I'm also seeing references to "program of program" studies like Galactica and Prognosis, but none of them ever came close to even sketching hardware.

Edit: Anatoly Zak indicates that Tsiolkovsky was to/could also include a Jupiter descent vehicle, and Lavochkin had begun putting together an appropriate centrifuge in the early 1990s.

https://www.russianspaceweb.com/spacecraft_planetary_plans.html

Edited December 27, 2023 by DDE

[kerbiloid]

8 hours ago, DDE said:

That one was a solar probe with a Jupiter gravity assist.

 

8 hours ago, kerbiloid said:

Jupiter flyby to achieve a solar sounding mission - the gravity of Jupiter would put the probe into a three year orbit with a perihelion of 0.2 AU to study the sun

 

Now they have found each other.

8 hours ago, DDE said:

I guess the alternative designation is "Ju-S", which is as obvious as ever. Launch vehicle is Proton with a Shtorm hydrolox fourth stage.

The name sounds very Chelomeish.

Ju-S, like a Junkers bomber.

IS (satellite destroyer) like the WWII tank name.

IS/US (IS and belonging to it recon sats) sats like [isus], "Jesus".

RKKA (the first tier of the Almaz station project) like RKKA "Peasant-Worker Red Army".
RKKB as the next tier of RKKA.

https://ru-m-wikipedia-org.translate.goog/wiki/Интегрированный_оборонно-наступательный_океаническо-сухопутно-космический_комплекс?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=ru&_x_tr_pto=wapp

And so on.

Edited December 28, 2023 by kerbiloid

[Kerbalsaurus]

Why did the Soviets not take the outer planets so seriously? Is it because, much like their lunar program, they didn’t see it helping them militarily? There are the proposals, but these proposals, are, well, just that. They never got off of paper, and even today Roscosmos hasn’t sent out an outer planets probe. Of course Russia has other issues at the moment, but it’s weird how a nation that prides itself in space achievements hasn’t gone beyond Mars (purposefully).

Edited December 28, 2023 by Kerbalsaurus

[kerbiloid]

9 minutes ago, Kerbalsaurus said:

Why did the Soviets not take the outer planets so seriously?

Should they?

The Voyagers have sent the photos, the whole idea of the outer planets was clear, more photos of the gas clouds and frozen dirt worthn't the money they would take from the thin state budget.

Also, it was a lack of vacuum-proof electronics, so the soviet space tech was using pressurized command pods, which limit the active existence with months or in the best case a couple of years without servicing (pressure replenishment).

Also, good photos of frozen dirt needs good cameras, and the best thing to test them on, are small details of the US bases on Alaska and Greenland, so they were actively doing it without sending the cams to Jupiter.

Venus and Mars were another thing. First, they need a short-term flight. Second, the propulsion/energetical unit was designed by the military Lavochkin bureau, so it was also a test of an offensive/defensive space tech.

Edited December 28, 2023 by kerbiloid

[DDE]

54 minutes ago, Kerbalsaurus said:

Why did the Soviets not take the outer planets so seriously?

Longevity of electronics, as said above, was a known problem, and remains a known problem. Notice also the use of an on-paper upper stage, and, today, the well-known reticence to increase Roscosmos funding while demanding they do more with less. Hell, the announcement of a Luna-27-2 backup was already a surprising reversal of old policy.

[RCgothic]

5 hours ago, kerbiloid said:

 

Also, it was a lack of vacuum-proof electronics, so the soviet space tech was using pressurized command pods, which limit the active existence with months or in the best case a couple of years without servicing (pressure replenishment).

And now I know why soviet probes often incorporated spherical hulls. I really should have realised they were pressure vessels before now.

[kerbiloid]

8 hours ago, DDE said:

the announcement of a Luna-27-2 backup was already a surprising reversal of old policy.

They have bought the equipment for the wholesale price. So, no choice but to build two.