To all the people that constantly whine "CHEATURRR" on KSP Youtube videos...

[Sleipnir]

....please just stop. If you are reading this and have ever done it, it is not cool, it is rather effing annoying. This is a Sandbox game where everyone can play as they please, use mods and parts that they please. I see it countless times on many Youtube videos, especially on Scott Manley's, where whiners argue how mechjeb, quantum struts or other parts/mods are "OP" and then crying cheater and calling these mod users bad players etc etc. Srsly nobody -snip- cares about how good you are without those mods, and how everyone else should play the game the way you want them to.

This is a serious pet peeve of mine. If you are against using mods and going all stock that is absolutely fine, but stop trying to force your ways on others, especially calling them names, "bad" players and/or cheater. This is a Sandbox game, there is no winning or losing, its just an open world where you can do whatever the frigg you want, and if someone decides to use mods and super "OP" parts in their world just let em be, doesn't make them a better or worse player than you are in anyway.

I am convinced that the majority of KSP players worldwide AND on this forum are open minded and respectful to other players and their play styles and who don't do these kinds of things, but still I just wanted to put this out there in case a "straggler" does run across this and hopefully will change his/her ways of badmouthing us "OP No skill" mod users.

*end of rant*

Thank you ladies and gentlemen for reading.

PS: If this has ever been posted about before my apologies, but I needed to say it (again)

Edited May 13, 2013 by KasperVld

[SecondGuessing]

I like it most when people try to call Scott Manley a cheater and a noob for using mechjeb. Everyone else just replies 'type KSP Manley-mode moon landing into the search bar'.

[dharak1]

I don't like mechjeb, I don't. People claim "Well Apollo 11 used autopilot" Yes it did, but on a computer as powerful as a calculator not as powerful as a high end PC. Also a few Apollo missions had to turn off autopilot near landing. But my point is the fun in KSP is piloting. I don't care how tedious it gets. I think my dislike of mechjeb comes from when it ruined my first mun landing. I made a basic rocket and told it to go there and it was done. No fun or heart pounding landings like the real thing. I NEVER whine cheater but i don't care if people do.

[Specialist290]

I just want the arguments to stop.

[SpaceGremlin]

I don't understand why people argue about how to play a single player sandbox game. Just do what is most fun for you let others enjoy it in their own way.

[Holo]

It's youtube comments. Do you seriously, actually expect even a modicum of intelligence?

[Reavermyst]

Calling someone a cheater in a sandbox game is just silly. Sandboxes are meant to be played the way you want to play it. But sadly you're going to have your idiot try-hard gamers scream about "proper play" in an EARLY DEVELOPMENT BUILD, because god forbid you get creative and discover bugs to help the game's development process go more smoothly.

[PDCWolf]

Right now, all arguments are pointless. The real thing will show up as soon as there is career mode (thank god devs don't want to include achievements, just imagine "the madenings" that will bring) where using mechjeb or any other autopilot could be considered cheating.

[Temstar]

I just want the arguments to stop.

It goes both ways though. Fair enough purist shouldn't be all in your face about weather using mods and particular autopilots are kosher or not, but on the other hand some mechjeb users are getting a bit too evangelical these days. Too often I see new players come onto the form and ask questions like "how do I dock?" "how do I do precision landing?" "how do I aerobrake?" "how do I do interplanetary transfer" and the first answer would be "just use mechjeb!"

[NeoMorph]

I don't like mechjeb, I don't. People claim "Well Apollo 11 used autopilot" Yes it did, but on a computer as powerful as a calculator not as powerful as a high end PC. Also a few Apollo missions had to turn off autopilot near landing. But my point is the fun in KSP is piloting. I don't care how tedious it gets. I think my dislike of mechjeb comes from when it ruined my first mun landing. I made a basic rocket and told it to go there and it was done. No fun or heart pounding landings like the real thing. I NEVER whine cheater but i don't care if people do.

Ummm... no they didn't. All they did when they went "Manual" was turn on Mechjeb Translatron mode and pointed the landing computer to miss a crater. It was still landed under computer control. The AGC may have had the power of a calculator but mechjeb doesn't do half the things that the AGC could do. Because it was specialised. Hell, they wove (like a carpet) the programs (yeah, I kid you not) into memory. See Here - When I was looking up the info on the AGC for my hardware interface for KSP I was gobsmacked at what the thing could do with such crude hardware.

Nobody called Neal Armstrong a cheater for using the AGC after all... so if he can use a computer to set up his burns then I can too. You still have to tell Mechjeb what you want it to do if you are using it right. "Garbage In, Garbage Out".

Personally I think the MechJeb haters are the ones who don't know how to use it because some of the garbage I hear about how 1.9.8 could auto dock for you and how it ruined the game was nothing like what the thing could actually do. It COULDN'T auto dock. It could help you make rendezvous by giving you the information that is actually lacking in the node system is all.

Bah... sorry... The "Apollo had to be landed manually" is an urban myth and still people don't realise, even with Google.

For an insight into what was "manual" about the Armstrong's landing read this -> http://www.doneyles.com/LM/Tales.html - It will show you that using Mechjeb is closer to the real thing than core KSP is.

At MET 102:43:20 (430 feet) Armstrong flicked a spring loaded toggle switch with his left hand, entering the rate-of-descent mode (P66). Now the computer controlled the spacecraft's thrust to maintain a rate-of-descent (Sound much like the Translatron eh?) commanded by the ROD switch. A flick upward slowed the descent by one foot per second; a flick downward increased the descent rate by the same amount. Using the joystick, Armstrong tilted the LM to null out horizontal velocity and bring the LM to a safe area for touchdown. After some "possibly spastic" control motions because dust kicked up by the exhaust plume distorted his perception of translational velocity, at MET 102:45:40, Armstrong landed the spacecraft safely in the Sea of Tranquility.

Edited May 13, 2013 by NeoMorph

[razark]

But but but but...

Everyone who doesn't play exactly like me IS cheating!

[Holo]

We're all forgetting the KSP is a game, not a NASA Management Tycoon, and hence you can play it however you want. You don't have to replicate was NASA does with space missions.

[leax256]

I don't like mechjeb, I don't.

Your opinion is yours, I however hate docking...I just can't do it right, 2 hours and i might get one thing docked. However Mechjeb supports docking autopoilet and you can have multiple things docking at once.

[lobsterbark]

If you're a engineer person, you need mechjeb. If you're a pilot person, you don't need mechjeb. I'm an engineer person.

[Nickbomfy]

There's an unfortunate streak of elitism amongst people that rail against the use of mechjeb/mods and/or use only stock components. I suppose it can't be helped, you're going to see that with any game and those types of people and their arrogant mentalities are just poison to the community (and new players) since as as far as they're concerned: "If you don't play like us you only have your inferior skills to blame, because obviously you would if you could."

Personally, I found mechjeb really useful as a tool for teaching me how to fly better, rather than try to fumble my way through and just end up frustrated. The more practice I had with playing the game, watching what the computer was doing, and performing flights, I started using the automatic functions less to the point now that I've come to use it for the information displays (not to mention flying better by hand and eye better than the computer's ability.)

[Fredonia]

It's youtube comments. Do you seriously, actually expect even a modicum of intelligence?

This. I can only hope that it's a very loud .1% of the world's population...

To be on topic:

I have no idea how you can cheat in a sandbox game. Play it however you want. I don't have time for chest-thumping elitists...

[NeoMorph]

If you're a engineer person, you need mechjeb. If you're a pilot person, you don't need mechjeb. I'm an engineer person.

I like this quote... But I'm a pilot person who needs the flight data to see what is happening... so I'm a engineering pilot person lol.

[Jm419]

I like this quote... But I'm a pilot person who needs the flight data to see what is happening... so I'm a engineering pilot person lol.

Mechanical engineering student here who doesn't use Mechjeb.

Still, just because I don't doesn't mean anyone else shouldn't. It just means I'm better.

Ok, ok, I kid. I had you there for a second, though, right?

[Holo]

I like this quote... But I'm a pilot person who needs the flight data to see what is happening... so I'm a engineering pilot person lol.

I engineer and then pilot things completely stock. What does that make me?

[Deltac]

I engineer and then pilot things completely stock. What does that make me?

A masochist

[_Aramchek_]

If you're so tired of the "debate", why bring it up by making this thread?

It's fairly obvious this thread is only going to create more drama.

[CatastrophicFailure]

There's an unfortunate streak of elitism amongst people that rail against the use of mechjeb/mods and/or use only stock components. I suppose it can't be helped, you're going to see that with any game and those types of people and their arrogant mentalities are just poison to the community (and new players) since as as far as they're concerned: "If you don't play like us you only have your inferior skills to blame, because obviously you would if you could."

Personally, I found mechjeb really useful as a tool for teaching me how to fly better, rather than try to fumble my way through and just end up frustrated. The more practice I had with playing the game, watching what the computer was doing, and performing flights, I started using the automatic functions less to the point now that I've come to use it for the information displays (not to mention flying better by hand and eye better than the computer's ability.)

I'll second this & throw my own two noob cents in. Likewise, for me mechjeb is a wonderful learning tool. I'm a very visual person, that's what drew me to KSP in the first place from Orbiter. I need to see things to fully understand them. Mechjeb lets me see how things like efficient maneuver nodes should look, rather than me pulling random tags until I just happen to get it right. The delta v estimates are great tools too, sure it's funny as hell when you get ALMOST there then run out of fuel, but now I've just wasted how many hours on a rocket that don't work, and time is a precious commodity for me (I don't have nearly enough, Lord help me if they ever port KSP to the iPad!). Likewise with docking, I CAN dock freehand, done it enough times, but for me it's something that's tedious and not very entertaining. Mechjeb saves me time there that I'd rather spend enjoying something else in the game. But I've already found I prefer to do rendezvous by hand since mechjeb tends to be horribly inefficient there.

Unfortunately it's really no surprise to find people hating over something so silly. It's human nature. Just watch Survivor, put any group of people together and the very first thing they do is create an "us" and a "them."

[Holo]

If you're so tired of the "debate", why bring it up by making this thread?

It's fairly obvious this thread is only going to create more drama.

There's a relevant XKCD for everything. Even this very MechJeb thread.

[Sleipnir]

If you're so tired of the "debate", why bring it up by making this thread?

It's fairly obvious this thread is only going to create more drama.

I never said I was tired of any debate. Fail. Reread my post properly before you reply to save yourself from embarrassment.

There's a relevant XKCD for everything. Even this very MechJeb thread.

This is not a mechjeb only thread, and I never said I was against drama yet creating it myself. Fail. Reread my post properly before you reply to me.

[Sleipnir]

I like it most when people try to call Scott Manley a cheater and a noob for using mechjeb. Everyone else just replies 'type KSP Manley-mode moon landing into the search bar'.

I just want the arguments to stop.

Calling someone a cheater in a sandbox game is just silly. Sandboxes are meant to be played the way you want to play it. But sadly you're going to have your idiot try-hard gamers scream about "proper play" in an EARLY DEVELOPMENT BUILD, because god forbid you get creative and discover bugs to help the game's development process go more smoothly.

Right now, all arguments are pointless. The real thing will show up as soon as there is career mode (thank god devs don't want to include achievements, just imagine "the madenings" that will bring) where using mechjeb or any other autopilot could be considered cheating.

We're all forgetting the KSP is a game, not a NASA Management Tycoon, and hence you can play it however you want. You don't have to replicate was NASA does with space missions.

There's an unfortunate streak of elitism amongst people that rail against the use of mechjeb/mods and/or use only stock components. I suppose it can't be helped, you're going to see that with any game and those types of people and their arrogant mentalities are just poison to the community (and new players) since as as far as they're concerned: "If you don't play like us you only have your inferior skills to blame, because obviously you would if you could."

Personally, I found mechjeb really useful as a tool for teaching me how to fly better, rather than try to fumble my way through and just end up frustrated. The more practice I had with playing the game, watching what the computer was doing, and performing flights, I started using the automatic functions less to the point now that I've come to use it for the information displays (not to mention flying better by hand and eye better than the computer's ability.)

This. I can only hope that it's a very loud .1% of the world's population...

To be on topic:

I have no idea how you can cheat in a sandbox game. Play it however you want. I don't have time for chest-thumping elitists...

I agree with all of you