What did you do in KSP1 today?

[Julien Kerman]

Finally, I unlocked better solar panels, so I could do a manned moon fly-by.

Valentina is happy

Then I launched a new probe with more science experiments to Venus:

 

I also built two probes for Mars. The first one (on the picture) ran out of fuel, but the second one got an encounter and is going to arrive in about 250 days.

[Triop]

Today, we repainted our T-50.

Thanks to @DoctorDavinci for the camo mod, very cool.

[Jett_Quasar]

Added an updated version of the Astromech droid to my Star Wars Hangar

 - Jett

[regex]

I've been cleaning up the alarms list and thinking about future plans. All of the nuclear tugs have been safely brought back to Kerbin, most by very wide margins of delta-V, save for one that barely had enough fuel.

Multnomah transferred to Jool and made a correction burn to bring it into Tylo SOI. I'll refine that further once we get into Jool SOI for a proper capture and to bring us into Laythe SOI.

We need an engineer and another pilot on Klamath, and a scientist stationed at Dres, and the upcoming Dres window provides that opportunity. Fortunately we have a system taxi parked at Kerbin station (little more than a collection of docked ships and crew that I haven't bothered to bring back planetside) so I don't have to launch anything more than a crew shuttle. Refueling one of the tugs will allow us to bring an additional life support slug to Dres so I don't have to worry about them for awhile.

Looking forward, our outer system probe is almost to Urlum and I'm hoping it has enough power to at least make a correction burn and gather science. Overall this save is heading towards the outer system and a lot of time-warping, the frenzied activity of the earlier game will probably subside into individual missions. Looking forward to that, it's kind of boring just managing braking burns and refueling runs.

[NISSKEPCSIM]

Hi guys! Now, I am currently testing out concepts for a reusable 1st rocket stage using FMRS, and here's my dilemma: I've tried SpaceX style, and I don't have enough for a boost-back RTLS. (I don't want to change my base expendable rocket so much that it's unrecognisable)

I tried adding huge shuttle-like wings and sea floats to the booster, to land it into the ocean for a safe splashdown and recovery. But, my fuel tank kind of... I experienced a rapid unplanned disassembly, to say the least. And, also, the floats stick out so much that, if it were a real rocket, they would be sheared off during ascent.

So, right now I'm toying around with ESA Adeline-style concepts, but I'm also looking for alternatives. I took a look at the ULA's Vulcan, but they don't specify on how they're going to recover it - so I would like some suggestions for other reusable 1st stage please!

[Jett_Quasar]

I've also uploaded an updated version of my Lambda Class Imperial Shuttle to my Star Wars Kerbal-X hangar... enjoy!

 - Jett

[TheEpicSquared]

1 minute ago, NISSKEPCSIM said:

Hi guys! Now, I am currently testing out concepts for a reusable 1st rocket stage using FMRS, and here's my dilemma: I've tried SpaceX style, and I don't have enough for a boost-back RTLS. (I don't want to change my base expendable rocket so much that it's unrecognisable)

I tried adding huge shuttle-like wings and sea floats to the booster, to land it into the ocean for a safe splashdown and recovery. But, my fuel tank kind of... I experienced a rapid unplanned disassembly, to say the least. And, also, the floats stick out so much that, if it were a real rocket, they would be sheared off during ascent.

So, right now I'm toying around with ESA Adeline-style concepts, but I'm also looking for alternatives. I took a look at the ULA's Vulcan, but they don't specify on how they're going to recover it - so I would like some suggestions for other reusable 1st stage please!

You could always land on a droneship. Or just slap parachutes to the stage. For some designs, I like to put something like the small delta wings with control surfaces just behind the empty CoM, and add some RCS or an SAS module to orient the stage for reentry. If the stage is going fast enough, the small wings will have no problem generating enough lift to fly the stage, even though they're small. If you can manage to fly it close to the water (~30 meters) until the booster naturally stalls, and then  deploy a drogue chute or four, the stage should survive impact.  

[DarkOwl57]

Been working hard and strong on KASA's atmospheric fighters. Tomorrow it'll be the space fighters and then whatever else I can think of.

 

 

[NISSKEPCSIM]

3 minutes ago, TheEpicSquared said:

You could always land on a droneship. Or just slap parachutes to the stage. For some designs, I like to put something like the small delta wings with control surfaces just behind the empty CoM, and add some RCS or an SAS module to orient the stage for reentry. If the stage is going fast enough, the small wings will have no problem generating enough lift to fly the stage, even though they're small. If you can manage to fly it close to the water (~30 meters) until the booster naturally stalls, and then  deploy a drogue chute or four, the stage should survive impact.  

Yeah, the thing is... my booster has absolutely enormous wings to counter the lift of my Dyna-Soar shuttle, which is primarily what I'm going to be launching from this booster. I'm thinking I'll use a mix between Adeline and ULA's Vulcan - the 1st stage's main engine(s) separate, with small wings, re-enter, deploy a parafoil / paraglider wing, and then fly back to the runway on Juno jets.

[TheEpicSquared]

1 minute ago, NISSKEPCSIM said:

Yeah, the thing is... my booster has absolutely enormous wings to counter the lift of my Dyna-Soar shuttle, which is primarily what I'm going to be launching from this booster. I'm thinking I'll use a mix between Adeline and ULA's Vulcan - the 1st stage's main engine(s) separate, with small wings, re-enter, deploy a parafoil / paraglider wing, and then fly back to the runway on Juno jets.

If the first stage booster already has enormous wings, couldn't you use those to fly the entire stage back to the runway? 

Edited June 3, 2017 by TheEpicSquared

[NISSKEPCSIM]

Just now, TheEpicSquared said:

If the first stage booster already has enormous wings, couldn't you use those to fly the entire stage back to the runway? 

Meh. When the fuel is drained and the stage separated, the centre of lift is in front of the centre of mass. So it stalls front first. I doesn't perform well during descent, no matter whether you're hypersonic or subsonic. And believe me, I tried making it fly - the seaplane float booster still flies like a dog and flips during descent. So I think Adeline-Vulcan cross it is.

[Triop]

1 hour ago, Jett_Quasar said:

Added an updated version of the Astromech droid to my Star Wars Hangar

 - Jett

How's IO-U1 doing ?

[Bornholio]

5 minutes ago, NISSKEPCSIM said:

Yeah, the thing is... my booster has absolutely enormous wings to counter the lift of my Dyna-Soar shuttle, which is primarily what I'm going to be launching from this booster. I'm thinking I'll use a mix between Adeline and ULA's Vulcan - the 1st stage's main engine(s) separate, with small wings, re-enter, deploy a parafoil / paraglider wing, and then fly back to the runway on Juno jets.

 

There is a nice set of deployabe wings for boosters, I prefer using airbrakes, Large ones on the bottom, small ones up top.  Do you have a good gimble motor on the bottom?

Remeber to make the Yaw/Pitch turn on.

Edited June 3, 2017 by Bornholio

[TheEpicSquared]

1 minute ago, NISSKEPCSIM said:

Meh. When the fuel is drained and the stage separated, the centre of lift is in front of the centre of mass. So it stalls front first. I doesn't perform well during descent, no matter whether you're hypersonic or subsonic. And believe me, I tried making it fly - the seaplane float booster still flies like a dog and flips during descent. So I think Adeline-Vulcan cross it is.

You could move the wings lower I guess. Oh well, do what you think is best.  

[NISSKEPCSIM]

1 minute ago, Bornholio said:

There is a nice set of deployabe wings for boosters, I prefer using airbrakes, Large ones on the bottom, small ones up top.  Do you have a good gimble motor on the bottom?

I'm playing career mode, and I haven't unlocked them yet.

1 minute ago, TheEpicSquared said:

You could move the wings lower I guess. Oh well, do what you think is best.  

They were already so low that the booster had a flat bottom... oh well, I tried. 

[Jett_Quasar]

8 minutes ago, Triop said:

How's IO-U1 doing ?

Smashingly!

 - Jett

[Triop]

3 minutes ago, Jett_Quasar said:

Smashingly!

 - Jett

Just feed him nuts and bolts, he loves it.

Edited June 3, 2017 by Triop

[Bornholio]

22 minutes ago, NISSKEPCSIM said:

I'm playing career mode, and I haven't unlocked them yet.

/sigh FAR then make your upper less draggy.

On to realistic goals, anything you can do to reduce the drag cube count up top is your best bet. place things inside cargo bay and make sure all the parts are properly mounted so they deduct the cube count from the attached parts inline. Of course the dominant aero is the shape of those wings.  Can you "Deploy" control surfaces to counter the rotation or is it universally flippy.  Maybe use a longer low power burn until 15km keep it below local mach.

Or Weld all of it you can and edit the drag.

Edited June 3, 2017 by Bornholio

[NISSKEPCSIM]

1 minute ago, Bornholio said:

/sigh FAR then make your upper less draggy.

On to realistic goals, anything you can do to reduce the drag cube count up top is your best bet. place things inside cargo bay and make sure all the parts are properly mounted so they deduct the cube count from the attached parts inline. Of course the dominant aero is the shape of those wings.  Can you "Deploy" control surfaces to counter the rotation or is it universally flippy.  Maybe use a longer low power burn until 15km keep it below local mach.

I'm kind of reluctant to install FAR right now, because I've only just perfected my Dyna-Soar shuttle's aerodynamics so that it won't suffer the dihedral effect. And, because those SXT seaplane floats come in 1.25m long segments, and the stock aerodynamic engine calculated more drag with a larger part count, my previous recoverable booster concept suffered a lot of drag. However, I have now decided to use an Adeline-Vulcan cross.

[CatastrophicFailure]

1 hour ago, NISSKEPCSIM said:

Hi guys! Now, I am currently testing out concepts for a reusable 1st rocket stage using FMRS, and here's my dilemma: I've tried SpaceX style, and I don't have enough for a boost-back RTLS. (I don't want to change my base expendable rocket so much that it's unrecognisable)

I tried adding huge shuttle-like wings and sea floats to the booster, to land it into the ocean for a safe splashdown and recovery. But, my fuel tank kind of... I experienced a rapid unplanned disassembly, to say the least. And, also, the floats stick out so much that, if it were a real rocket, they would be sheared off during ascent.

So, right now I'm toying around with ESA Adeline-style concepts, but I'm also looking for alternatives. I took a look at the ULA's Vulcan, but they don't specify on how they're going to recover it - so I would like some suggestions for other reusable 1st stage please!

Take the SpaceX thing a bit farther and park a boat out in the ocean? I forget, are you stock or RSS?

[qzgy]

1 hour ago, NISSKEPCSIM said:

Hi guys! Now, I am currently testing out concepts for a reusable 1st rocket stage using FMRS, and here's my dilemma: I've tried SpaceX style, and I don't have enough for a boost-back RTLS. (I don't want to change my base expendable rocket so much that it's unrecognisable)

I tried adding huge shuttle-like wings and sea floats to the booster, to land it into the ocean for a safe splashdown and recovery. But, my fuel tank kind of... I experienced a rapid unplanned disassembly, to say the least. And, also, the floats stick out so much that, if it were a real rocket, they would be sheared off during ascent.

So, right now I'm toying around with ESA Adeline-style concepts, but I'm also looking for alternatives. I took a look at the ULA's Vulcan, but they don't specify on how they're going to recover it - so I would like some suggestions for other reusable 1st stage please!

You could do a stratolaunch style thing, where a plane carries up the rocket to be launched, saving some money on a reusable "first stage"

Or do what I did, and make a two stage to orbit, with the bottom able to glide to a splashdown or even return, if you leave enough fuel, as its pretty much an airplane

[Zeiss Ikon]

1 hour ago, NISSKEPCSIM said:

Hi guys! Now, I am currently testing out concepts for a reusable 1st rocket stage using FMRS, and here's my dilemma: I've tried SpaceX style, and I don't have enough for a boost-back RTLS. (I don't want to change my base expendable rocket so much that it's unrecognisable)

I tried adding huge shuttle-like wings and sea floats to the booster, to land it into the ocean for a safe splashdown and recovery. But, my fuel tank kind of... I experienced a rapid unplanned disassembly, to say the least. And, also, the floats stick out so much that, if it were a real rocket, they would be sheared off during ascent.

So, right now I'm toying around with ESA Adeline-style concepts, but I'm also looking for alternatives. I took a look at the ULA's Vulcan, but they don't specify on how they're going to recover it - so I would like some suggestions for other reusable 1st stage please!

Look at my entries in the Mass Fraction Challenge reboot.  I built an SSTO rocket that could launch around 16% payload to orbit, then added landing legs on one side and parachutes on the other (plus a probe core and a couple fuel cells), and had a recoverable booster that could land successfully on either land (as long as it was reasonably flat) or sea with zero damage, with very little mass fraction penalty (above 12% still with recovery).  The recovery part of this ought to work for any spent booster, and if you can be sure of water landing (as with a first staging launching from KSC) you could leave off the landing legs.  If you stage the parachutes to arm at staging you could leave off the probe core (and its power source) as well; the booster will stabilize engines first (assuming no fins), and will slow enough for parachute deployment well before impact.  As I recall, it took six parachutes aft, and two forward, to lower a Twin Boar with orange tank attached at a reasonable tilt angle -- you may need to experiment with this.

No, parachutes don't have the cachet of wings -- but they're cheaper, carry far less mass penalty, and they work.

[Bornholio]

Just now, Zeiss Ikon said:

Look at my entries in the Mass Fraction Challenge reboot.  I built an SSTO rocket that could launch around 16% payload to orbit, then added landing legs on one side and parachutes on the other (plus a probe core and a couple fuel cells), and had a recoverable booster that could land successfully on either land (as long as it was reasonably flat) or sea with zero damage, with very little mass fraction penalty (above 12% still with recovery).  The recovery part of this ought to work for any spent booster, and if you can be sure of water landing (as with a first staging launching from KSC) you could leave off the landing legs.  If you stage the parachutes to arm at staging you could leave off the probe core (and its power source) as well; the booster will stabilize engines first (assuming no fins), and will slow enough for parachute deployment well before impact.  As I recall, it took six parachutes aft, and two forward, to lower a Twin Boar with orange tank attached at a reasonable tilt angle -- you may need to experiment with this.

No, parachutes don't have the cachet of wings -- but they're cheaper, carry far less mass penalty, and they work.

Except he has a pretty Dynasoar that needs the big wings already for drag offset. Its just hard to balance all the force both wet and dry in four different modes.

[Zeiss Ikon]

1 minute ago, Bornholio said:

Except he has a pretty Dynasoar that needs the big wings already for drag offset. Its just hard to balance all the force both wet and dry in four different modes.

Oh. 

Then you'd have to install a few drogues to open on staging, to slow the stage enough for the mains to deploy with "deploy when safe".  Otherwise, nose first, it might not slow down enough, soon enough.  With a water landing, you'd still avoid damage to the fins once you get the parachute quantity/distribution sorted out.

[Jouni]

My Tylo crew was still in orbit, so I needed something to get them back home. I chose an improved version of my crew recovery ship from 1.2.

Spoiler

 

It still doesn't look exactly right.

 

At least the parachutes are now properly balanced.