Jump to content

[1.2] Procedural Fairings 3.20 (November 8)

e-dog

By e-dog
in KSP1 Mod Releases

 Share

Recommended Posts

klesh

klesh

Posted
Posted (edited)

NathanKell says it's not possible. Hmm. but you did it... Alright pal, what manner of trickery are you using! :sticktongue:

I've found a problem at the get-go. For starters I've been using the big floating node above to connect to the bottom of the rocket bell in the upper stage.

In your example, you say "place your payload into the floating top node." I don't have a payload, just trying to cover the engine bell. I've been connecting the bell to the floating node. When I de-couple, it stays connected.

If I connect it to the big node in the center at the base of the interstage fairing, I can reduce the radius (the fairing shape gets large around the bell), but it too stays connected upon de-coupling.

Pic 2, it does look like that.

Pic 3, yes yes and yes.

Pic 4, 5, 6 yes.

Pic 7, no.

Edit: The only way I can seem to achieve this is to put a stock TR-2V on the bottom of the bell first, then do everything as normal. It's as if the decoupler in the fairing isn't doing anything?

Edited by klesh
Link to comment
Share on other sites
klesh

klesh

Posted
Posted
klesh, please read all my post: you need KJR, then it does work. I am presuming that Kowgan has KJR installed.

Sorry, I was presuming maybe Kowgan new something you didn't about this. I'll try adding KJR (thanks for linking it), and report back.

So, the design is sound, its just going to work as expected with that mod then. Right. Good!

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Kowgan

Kowgan

Posted
Posted

I don't use KJR, or any other joint-reinforcement-y type of mod.

- - - Updated - - -

When I de-couple, it stays connected.

(...)

Edit: The only way I can seem to achieve this is to put a stock TR-2V on the bottom of the bell first, then do everything as normal. It's as if the decoupler in the fairing isn't doing anything?

Are you placing the fairings on the base as well? If you don't (and whatever is connected to the upper node is literally floating when you test launching), the decoupling system won't work. That's the only situation I've seen where the top node won't decouple.

According to the Interestage Fairing Adapter config file, "adapter2.cfg", there IS a decoupler there on that node.

MODULE
{
  name = ModuleDecouple
  ejectionForce = 0
  explosiveNodeID = top1
}
}

So, only if you're not placing the fairings on the adapter and let the "payload" (I mean, anything on top of the fairings, really.) float over there, the decouple staging won't do nothing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
klesh

klesh

Posted
Posted (edited)
I don't use KJR, or any other joint-reinforcement-y type of mod.

- - - Updated - - -

Are you placing the fairings on the base as well? If you don't (and whatever is connected to the upper node is literally floating when you test launching), the decoupling system won't work. That's the only situation I've seen where the top node won't decouple.

According to the Interestage Fairing Adapter config file, "adapter2.cfg", there IS a decoupler there on that node.

MODULE
{
  name = ModuleDecouple
  ejectionForce = 0
  explosiveNodeID = top1
}
}

So, only if you're not placing the fairings on the adapter and let the "payload" (I mean, anything on top of the fairings, really.) float over there, the decouple staging won't do nothing.

Yes, of course. After you reduce the nodes to one, I put one fuselage fairing on the one node left on the fairing base side, and viola, there is my cylindrical fairing.

Here's potentially the issue. There is nothing attached to the floating node. I attach that to the bottom of the engine bell and thats it. Pictures of this look just like yours, I'll make a sketch in a little while that maybe shows it better.

http://i.imgur.com/QIpW6dL.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/ckefEsf.jpg

From there, I lower the height till the bottom of the bell is just above the fairing base. I then extend the "extra height" until it it touches the top of the rocket engine.

http://i.imgur.com/BBbIfIl.jpg

Reduce nodes to 1. Add fairing.

http://i.imgur.com/F3ljy3b.jpg (I do it 2x on this rocket, once above the solid booster, and once for the 3rd stage with the orange tank)

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Kowgan again.

Edited by klesh
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Kowgan

Kowgan

Posted
Posted

Alright, I've followed your steps, as per images, and found myself able to replicate your issue.

After some fiddling around, I've found the problem, and it's pretty weird: It happens when you're building your craft from top to bottom. That means, when the root part is above the interestage adapter.

The solution is to simply, either start building the craft from below, or use the New Root tool (4) to set a new root on your vessel, before launch.

Also, make sure to leave some space between the fairing's edge and the engine bell. They can get stuck pretty easy; so either increase the Top (recommended), or decrease the Extra Height, so they don't clip through.

Now, ask me what's causing that. I have not. A. Single. Clue.

Either way, I hope that fixes your issue. Good luck, have fun and post results. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites
klesh

klesh

Posted
Posted

Either way, I hope that fixes your issue. Good luck, have fun and post results. :)

Wow, that is quite strange isn't it? You guys build your rockets from the bottom? I always start mine from the "pods" category and go from there. In this case it was a satellite, and the corresponding rocket below it.

Anyway, I used the re-root tool, selected the AV-8 Winglet at the bottom, then the solid booster such that I believe the booster is now my root. I rebuilt both fairings to remove the TR-2V decouplers and start anew. Followed the usual build-out steps, and wouldn't you know it works almost exactly as expected when I launch!

Indeed the cup stays on the jettisoned stage, and it decouples just fine. It works almost correct with the one exception that SAS turns off everytime I decouple a stage. The SAS is in the probe core and functions normally at liftoff, but then I get the orange disengaged message when I stage.

http://i.imgur.com/0ZUDV61.jpg

I simply press T again and it turns back on, but it's not ideal right. I suppose that is an affect of the re-rooting? I never ever use that tool, so I don't know if that's a common thing. Did yours do that?

If this is too many posts on the issue, feel free to PM me and we can continue there. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Kowgan

Kowgan

Posted
Posted

I always start mine from the pod as well. But for some reason, everytime I tested this feature, I've started from what's under the adapter.

Yes, the SAS thing probably has to do with the rerooting, but I didn't notice that happening while flying manned vehicles. Anyway, this is probably somehow broken, and these steps are just a workaround until we get an official fix. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Falcon Coupe

Falcon Coupe

Posted
Posted

I'm back after my trip away and have had a chance to do some testing. I did have the interstage connected to the wrong point, so I fixed that.

But then I couldnt add an engine to the center node, I made up another rocket and I could use the center node on it. Anyone have any suggestions to fix that?

I also got rid of the launch clamps, they were tearing things apart. Rocket was much happier to just sit on the engines.

My rockets were still breaking on the pad though, turns out it was the connection between the conic and cylinder procedural tanks breaking, even with 24 struts on each join. I might have to ask about that on the thread for that mod.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
NathanKell

NathanKell

Posted
Posted (edited)

EDIT:

Post redacted, MasterTao pointed out (and I just verified) that at some point recently, the behavior changed such that the decoupler is no longer fake.

However, if you use an interstage without fairings, then the joint on the floating node will not be created and thus the interstage will decouple as soon as flight loads.

Ok, let me try explaining this one more time.

:)

Here is how the procedural interstage works.

1. It has three stack nodes, we'll call them bottom, top, and floating.

2. It has some number of surface nodes, where one attaches fairings or shrouds.

3. It has a fake decoupler in the floating node. That decoupler is there only so that MJ/KER do not get confused. It will not break the joint between the interstage part and whatever is attached to the floating node.

4. When you decouple the fairings, however, those joints are broken. This is how one actually 'decouples' the interstage from whatever one attaches to the floating node.

If you attach something to the top or bottom node, you need to add your own decoupler. If you attach something to the floating node, but do not intend to decouple the fairings (or use the fuselage shrouds, which do not decouple), you need to add your own decoupler.*

On the contrary, if you have something attached to the floating node, and you decouple the fairings, you will decouple that floating node, even if the 'fake decoupler' attached to it is not staged until later.

*How KJR modifies things: KJR turns the 'fake' decoupler into a real decoupler, which means when you stage that fake-decoupler-attached-to-the-floating-node, KJR will itself will break the joints, which means you can decouple the interstage away from whatever was attached to the floating node without decoupling the fairings.

e-dog, I think you really need to add something like the above to the OP, it is *not* immediately clear.

Edited by NathanKell
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Forty21112

Forty21112

Posted
Posted

So, uhh, I've downloaded this mod and apparently, the fairings don't even detach from the base. This makes my payload stay IN the fairing rather than out of it.

I'm ready to provide info when someone is willing to help out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Forty21112

Forty21112

Posted
Posted

Actually, I'm using the ones at the Aerodynamics, problem is, they don't "pop-out" as forcefully compared to 0.24.2's fairings.

I did some tests, one in orbit and one in atmosphere.

The ones in atmosphere detached, but only fell straight down. I expected a slight arc or something.

The ones in orbit didn't even detach AT ALL.

I'd post screenshots, but I'm dealing with CTDs and whole lot of other stuff.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
BudgetHedgehog

BudgetHedgehog

Posted
Posted
I did some tests, one in orbit and one in atmosphere.

The ones in atmosphere detached, but only fell straight down. I expected a slight arc or something.

The ones in orbit didn't even detach AT ALL.

Are you using the 64bit version of KSP? Have you tried installing Claws Radial Decoupler Bug fix? Because it sounds like something's messing with the decoupling module and those are the first things that spring to mind.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Forty21112

Forty21112

Posted
Posted
Are you using the 64bit version of KSP? Have you tried installing Claws Radial Decoupler Bug fix? Because it sounds like something's messing with the decoupling module and those are the first things that spring to mind.

Well, I'm using 32 bit, and would you happen to have a link? I can't seem to find it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
 Share
Go to topic listing
×
×
  • Create New...