Kerbin Mini Shuttle

[AngusJimiKeith]

Amazing. Simply awesome. Glad to see this back on track!

[zakkpaz]

I know its a bit early to say this, but have you given any thought to what you're going to make next?

i was wondering this my self. helldiver wasn't there a plan to add a lower deck to increase the crew count?

[helldiver]

i was wondering this my self. helldiver wasn't there a plan to add a lower deck to increase the crew count?

Yes the Crew deck/mission deck (I might have that backwards)....

Since I keep repeating what my plans are, I'll update the OP once we get this released.

But:

1) Space Station components (so you can build a space station) that fit the Cargo bay.

1b. Things like a Lab that is already in game but with an IVA so you can do experiments.

2) A lunar lander kit that fits the cargo bay.

2b. Will include the rover that will fit in the Lunar lander that fits in the cargo bay. So you can be in the rover, while you're in the lander, while the lander is in the cargo bay...

3) Parts requested by Nazari (namely camera's and other components).

4) Crew deck. Currently no purpose aside from looking cool. I thought Labs had to be their own part?

By priority:

1) Updated emissive in the cargo bay as well as an attachable emissive part. This makes it so you don't have to use real light parts. Emissive lights are amazing and I'm hoping folks will start adopting them in their projects.

2) Camera part. Little camera you can attach in various places. Will allow you to slave it to the MFD.

3) Everything else.

Although we have some more minor testing to do plus I want to play the game for once... I really haven't played KSP to be honest. I think I played it for a week before I started working on the KSO.

[1Revenger1]

Keep going with this, glad you guys are working on this again. It looks great!

[DisarmingBaton5]

I want to play the game for once... I really haven't played KSP to be honest. I think I played it for a week before I started working on the KSO.

Oh, you're in for a treat.

A question: If you're using RPM, why not use the cameras from RPM as well? Do they look odd with the shuttle?

[enneract]

This really looks like the best implementation of a 'prebuilt' orbiter yet. Seriously impressed.

If you want to make another part for it... some reusable way of attaching it to an IP drive, and some air intakes would be seriously useful. I'd love to be able to design a mission around sending this to another atmosphere'd planet using an IP drive, leave it in orbit, land, take off again using dual-mode engines, dock with the IP drive (or not, depending on DV requirements), and go back to kerbin.

[helldiver]

[Edit]Ignore what I said. I realized Pitch Trim had been set to 0 the whole time...

The Bad

-Today we've been tweaking the visual model, attachment points and so on. I'm just not a fan of surface attach for this. I can understand generic components, but the KSO was not meant to have its parts surface attached. We discussed having an alternate parts download so if you want the rudder and other parts as surface attachable that's fine. But the default download will have all important components Node attached. Generic components, tools, accessories, and the elevons will be surface attached.

-Feels flimsy.

-Not enough electrical power, and I think not enough fuel to be able to do a mission. However this is all easily tweaked.

The Good

-We did an outstanding job on the IVA, getting it finalized and to a point we're both happy. I'm unable to test the HUD as I always run out of electrical power. Seems something is buggy or linked to the engines being shut down or something.

-Landings are a lot more user friendly. They are just about where I want them in terms of ease. Nazari killed a lot of the buggy behavior it had earlier.

-Nazari did an outstanding job on the smoke effects. Personally I think they are perfect as they are now.

MFDs, including a functional ADI! Only thing is the speed and altitude tapes are in weird increments. Will do research later to see how we can have them show up differently (for the future). For now it's very functional and I can use it while the HUD view gets fixed. Unfortunately without power on landing, it's hard to test those two instruments.

Edited January 31, 2014 by helldiver

[K3-Chris]

Hmm is this a complete ship you just load up and use? Not sure I'm a fan of that, can you modify it to your own liking or is the shuttle one single part? Can I remove the cargo bay and put in crew? Or double the length of the cargo bay etc? Don't get me wrong, I love the look, IVA, etc, but KSP is a game about building stuff and then flying it, removing the building step and just leaving flying it doesn't really appeal to me. This is why I like most part packs, gives you more tools when building things.

[qnistNAMEERF]

[Edit]Ignore what I said. I realized Pitch Trim had been set to 0 the whole time...

The Bad

-Today we've been tweaking the visual model, attachment points and so on. I'm just not a fan of surface attach for this. I can understand generic components, but the KSO was not meant to have its parts surface attached. We discussed having an alternate parts download so if you want the rudder and other parts as surface attachable that's fine. But the default download will have all important components Node attached. Generic components, tools, accessories, and the elevons will be surface attached.

-Feels flimsy.

-Not enough electrical power, and I think not enough fuel to be able to do a mission. However this is all easily tweaked.

The Good

-We did an outstanding job on the IVA, getting it finalized and to a point we're both happy. I'm unable to test the HUD as I always run out of electrical power. Seems something is buggy or linked to the engines being shut down or something.

-Landings are a lot more user friendly. They are just about where I want them in terms of ease. Nazari killed a lot of the buggy behavior it had earlier.

-Nazari did an outstanding job on the smoke effects. Personally I think they are perfect as they are now.

http://i.imgur.com/bz93We7.jpg

MFDs, including a functional ADI! Only thing is the speed and altitude tapes are in weird increments. Will do research later to see how we can have them show up differently (for the future). For now it's very functional and I can use it while the HUD view gets fixed. Unfortunately without power on landing, it's hard to test those two instruments.

http://i.imgur.com/lDs4ykE.jpg

@ helldiver: I gotta say that IVA is damn sexy.

Anyway, as far as losing power goes, if you are just trying to debug the shuttle you can always give it a generator in the part.cfg in the mean time until you get the power drain/capacity sorted out. You can even right click on the part and toggle the generator on and off.

Add this code to the part.cfg you would like a generator applied to:

MODULE
{
	name = ModuleGenerator
	isAlwaysActive = true
	OUTPUT_RESOURCE
	{
	   name = ElectricCharge
	   rate = 10
	}	
}

As far as addons go, I second the IP drive or even an interplanetary ring of some sort and maybe something like an escape pod.

Your shuttle is amazing. Keep up the great work, guys.

[helldiver]

Yeah kind of sucks, I had a perfect track record. All shuttles recovered and no Kerbals lost.

Unfortunately on my last flight, not enough fuel for the retro burn... So now I got Resolute stuck in orbit.

It doesn't have a docking ring or connection or what ever....

How do I send up fuel to it? I can load up a fuel tank in the Dauntless and rendezvous with it. But I don't know how to transfer fuel. Would I need a mod for that?

(and yes I know I can cheat and just give myself unlimited fuel, but that's unsportsmanlike).

[Sochin]

Gently bump it down, place shuttle above the other use RCS to lower the orbit. Another way would be to install KAS, launch another shuttle RV with it and EVA a hose over and connect. That will be awkward and require very accurate station keeping.

Thirdly does the the striken shuttle have monoprop, have you tried using that to retro burn?

[helldiver]

Hmm is this a complete ship you just load up and use? Not sure I'm a fan of that, can you modify it to your own liking or is the shuttle one single part? Can I remove the cargo bay and put in crew? Or double the length of the cargo bay etc? Don't get me wrong, I love the look, IVA, etc, but KSP is a game about building stuff and then flying it, removing the building step and just leaving flying it doesn't really appeal to me. This is why I like most part packs, gives you more tools when building things.

Sounds good.

There are several parts pack like you mentioned. B9 is pretty good as well as others.

This mod probably isn't for you (and I'm not making the KSO proper into a parts pack). Although I do plan on releasing parts compatible with it and generic parts.

Going to end that discussion there since we've already gone over it and I've discussed it before. And there is nothing stopping you from just using the various pieces of it and attach it to your favorite parts pack or even the stock pieces.

I'll be updating the OP to reflect that since I'd discussed it early in the project and didn't think the thread would get this far. My apologies for not clarifying that in the OP. The KSO is in pieces but it's designed to snap together as one.

Edited January 31, 2014 by helldiver

[K3-Chris]

Going to end that discussion there since we've already gone over it and I've discussed it before.

Sorry, didn't have the stamina to read 35 pages, though I suspected it might have been mentioned before.

And there is nothing stopping you from just using the various pieces of it and attach it to your favorite parts pack or even the stock pieces. The KSO is in pieces but it's designed to snap together as one.

That's actually what I'd like it to be, if the body especially is in multiple parts you could make a longer version with twice as much cargo space, or more crew compartments etc? Or swap cargo for crew, B9 is like that really, it doesn't really fit that well with stock parts, yeah it has shape adapters but it doesn't look right mixing em with stock parts.

[Sochin]

Question, are you adding the fuel tank and boosters into the download? I know it mentions that there are numerous other launch vehicles but this has been tested with a specific set of tanks, decouplers and boosters having them would provide a good benchmark.

[helldiver]

Gently bump it down, place shuttle above the other use RCS to lower the orbit. Another way would be to install KAS, launch another shuttle RV with it and EVA a hose over and connect. That will be awkward and require very accurate station keeping.

Thirdly does the the striken shuttle have monoprop, have you tried using that to retro burn?

Ok, I forgot that the test payload that's aboard, has fuel. However, the connection does not have fuel pass-through capability.

I should have plenty of monoprop as well. Didn't think of that either. I've seen Scott Manley and videos of folks transferring fuel between stuff. Hrm.

Question, are you adding the fuel tank and boosters into the download? I know it mentions that there are numerous other launch vehicles but this has been tested with a specific set of tanks, decouplers and boosters having them would provide a good benchmark.

Yes the lifter portion is part of the shuttle now. It's balanced assuming you'll be using the KSO LRBs.

And yes you can use the EFT and LRBs in other projects. The EFT even has an engine mounting point in the bottom for other projects.

Edited January 31, 2014 by helldiver

[sorcerymon]

How is the orbiter connected to the EFT?

Have you made a your own decoupler for this, or is it just using a stock decoupler?

[qnistNAMEERF]

Yeah kind of sucks, I had a perfect track record. All shuttles recovered and no Kerbals lost.

Unfortunately on my last flight, not enough fuel for the retro burn... So now I got Resolute stuck in orbit.

It doesn't have a docking ring or connection or what ever....

How do I send up fuel to it? I can load up a fuel tank in the Dauntless and rendezvous with it. But I don't know how to transfer fuel. Would I need a mod for that?

(and yes I know I can cheat and just give myself unlimited fuel, but that's unsportsmanlike).

Once you run out of mono prop and fuel you can always have a kerbal get out and push

[The Error]

Right click on one fuel tank, alt right click on another, fuel transfer. Can only be done via structural connections or docking ports, though.

Or, of course, getting out and pushing XD

Seriously, though, awesome looking spaceship.

[helaeon]

Yeah kind of sucks, I had a perfect track record. All shuttles recovered and no Kerbals lost.

Unfortunately on my last flight, not enough fuel for the retro burn... So now I got Resolute stuck in orbit.

It doesn't have a docking ring or connection or what ever....

How do I send up fuel to it? I can load up a fuel tank in the Dauntless and rendezvous with it. But I don't know how to transfer fuel. Would I need a mod for that?

(and yes I know I can cheat and just give myself unlimited fuel, but that's unsportsmanlike).

This is when I send up another ship that does have fuel for it and use Kerbal Attachment System to hook up a winch or fuel pipe and transfer fuel that way. Rendezvous works exactly the same except you get within the reach of the pipe/winch and then set your relative velocity to zero. It is trickier than using a docking port to link things up, but it works. I would not use the winch as a tow cable because the way KAS works some odd stuff will happen with your COM that usually ends with disaster.

[Albert VDS]

Or get one of your Kerbal out and push the shuttle retrograde with your jetpack.

Don't forget to return back to the shuttle before you jetpack runs out.

[MaverickSawyer]

-Feels flimsy.

Try Kerbal Joint Reinforcement. I've noticed that my rockets and aircraft are a LOT stronger since I added it.

[skykooler]

Once you run out of mono prop and fuel you can always have a kerbal get out and push

Kerbals use the ship's monoprop for EVA fuel in 0.23. So getting out and pushing no longer works (if you could do that, you could just use the RCS a lot faster).

[K3-Chris]

Wasn't EVA supposed to use RCS fuel from the ship since .21 or something and it still doesn't?

[astropapi1]

Kerbals use the ship's monoprop for EVA fuel in 0.23. So getting out and pushing no longer works (if you could do that, you could just use the RCS a lot faster).

Unless you are living under a rock, you'll have noticed that Kerbals use their own propellant (not Monoprop), and it is refilled when they enter-exit a capsule, so it still works.

[TMS]

Wasn't EVA supposed to use RCS fuel from the ship since .21 or something and it still doesn't?

Devs decided that it made the game too interesting, so removed the feature.