Duna VS Laythe - What is more base-worthy?

[Benie]

So I have Duna Base Alpha setup. It's not much. Just a Sphere Launchpad that is self-powered, my rovers, and 3 habitation modules.

But since going to Laythe and coming back to Duna... I want to move the base to Laythe.

So the discussion, Duna to me is just a big, dead red rock. Laythe looks like a tropical paradise that 95% of the surface is water (could be 98%, but.. ehh, not good with Math), while being bathed in Jool's high radiation, which also helps the temp stay nice even due to being so far away from the Sun.

I understand that Duna, though being a "dead red rock", also has a sentimental value, with the fact it looks sort of like Mars and the whole NASA thing and blah blah blah. There's nothing really to do on Duna anymore. Found all the anomalies.

I'm sure this isn't the first discussion about "where's the better place to put a base". So here's another one. And to be honest, I want to hear your guys opinions.

[Kerbface]

Laythe. Floating base with jetskis. Yeah.

[magnemoe]

Do both, main downside with the launchpads is that my bases grows to large and crashes the game.

Feel an pretty desperate need for an 64bit KSP version.

[espm400]

Personally I'm a Duna kind of guy... If only for the dV requirements. I've put a lot more stuff down there in a much shorter timespan than on Laythe. Given, Laythe looks nicer IMO, but with the amount of dV required to get there, plus the radiation (which would kill you without adequate protection), I still prefer Duna. Not to mention that rescue missions to Duna are a damn-sight easier, which I had to put into practice back in .19. Long story short; I was doing a supply drop to a base I had (with six Kerbals on board) and mis-judged my trajectory when jettisoning my initial braking stage. Well, didn't it just plow right into my base (RIP two Kerbals). Thankfully two were in a different module that was rolling down a hill afterwards and the other two were in a rover, but needless to say, I had to get them home. That's a long wait on Laythe.

[Kimberly]

Duna is far easier to run missions to and from, but Laythe is a more easily habitable planet. If you can give your colony on Laythe a decent degree of self-sufficiency (e.g. through Kethane mining), then Laythe becomes a lot more attractive than Duna, which like you say is basically a "dead rock". The radiation isn't a big issue if you build your base underwater, which is entirely possible with mods.

[stupid_chris]

Laythe is far from being a warm paradise. It's planned to add strong volcanic activity on the surface, and really, the temperatures, are really low, usually under 0deg celcius.

Personally, I don't like Laythe at all. To me it's just a boring ball of water, kinda sad.

Duna too is kinda sad. There's some nice scenery, but it's at really select places. It's okay I guess. Although if I was to set up a base on Laythe, it would be really small and yeah, I'd tend to set a big scientific base on Duna though.

That's just me though, I probably have a highly unpopular opinion.

[espm400]

Laythe is far from being a warm paradise. It's planned to add strong volcanic activity on the surface, and really, the temperatures, are really low, usually under 0deg celcius.

Personally, I don't like Laythe at all. To me it's just a boring ball of water, kinda sad.

Duna too is kinda sad. There's some nice scenery, but it's at really select places. It's okay I guess. Although if I was to set up a base on Laythe, it would be really small and yeah, I'd tend to set a big scientific base on Duna though.

That's just me though, I probably have a highly unpopular opinion.

I wouldn't really call it unpopular, just kind of depressing... If Duna or Laythe ain't your destination of choice, what is? Sure our selection of planets may improve slightly in the future, but frankly, those are our two best options at the moment...

[Ben88]

My big problem I've had with large bases is the fact that when you approach it with another ship it tends to lock the game up or start "hitching" as it loads each individual ship or base that's within range. Although I'm sure this will change in the future as the game gets 64bit support.

Duna is a fun place to set up a base, Laythe takes a lot more work but has some nice scenery.

[stupid_chris]

I wouldn't really call it unpopular, just kind of depressing... If Duna or Laythe ain't your destination of choice, what is? Sure our selection of planets may improve slightly in the future, but frankly, those are our two best options at the moment...

I love Vall, if I had a base to build, I'm heading there first for sure. Duna is also a nice place to explore, although it's not my favourite planet, it does have it's exploration interest, and it's relatively easy to move across it's surface.

[Merinsan]

The real question is, why do you need to choose?

Set up a base on both!

Duna is a great place for a base to stop at on the way to outer planets. If you've got Kethane, or when the future resources come, you can run a mining operation there to have a refueling depot in orbit.

Laythe is a great place for holidaying at. Endless beaches, and beautiful blue oceans. Just remember to pack your lead lined suit.

Putting a base on Vall is a little better than Laythe, since it'd make a good launch pad for interstellar missions (if they ever happen) and it has a decent gravity. Bop or Pol would be much better in terms of delta-v, but the reduced gravity is not good for the little green men.

[The Destroyer]

Duna is awesome and because Ike is in a geosynchronus orbit, it can be a very good view. Plus, you can jetpack there. It also has less lag!

Laythe is Epic and has an amazing view, but has a lot of Delta-v requirement, escecially with my bad luck of ending up in a retrograde orbit. Has more lag, can't use jetpack, mostly is just ocean and hard to find a good land base with all those hills.

That's my opinions, decide which one you like.

Some more choices:

Eve is also good with it's cool purple atmosphere. Just forget saving kerbals, they are there for permanant bases.

Gilly is my favourite planet. I would visit it more if it were just a wee bit easier to get to (very tiny SOI)

It's great because it hardly has any gravity, such fun.

Plus, you can land with nuclear engines on it... or even RCS!

Moho.... I find it takes a lot of Delta-V and have only gotten a flyby. So IDK

Eeelo: Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay far out. Not really interesting to me.

Dres: Quite interesting, it has a very neat canyon.

Vall: It's lovely for rovers and bases

Bop: This is a nice place to "visit"

Pol: Unkown.

Edited July 20, 2013 by The Destroyer

[Tw1]

Why not both? Limited time maybe.

Duna is easier too get to, and has less gravity and atmosphere. It's also closer to the sun.

It's cold, and has none-to minimal in situe oxygen and water. It may have dust storms, and lack magnetic fields, if it is like Mars. It seems to be geologically dead, lacking techtonics or active volcanoes. But we never know.

Laythe is harder to get to, more atmosphere and about twice the gravity. It's a little less cold, (from. Memory), and has oxygen in the atmosphere, and water is likely present in its oceans. It is likely to be volcanicaly active, so chose your location on an island that doesn't look like a recent volcano.

It also looks like it could have techonic activity, a slight risk. Magnetic field levels are unknown, but it is within Jool's radiation belt which could pose a risk.

Laythe has resources on site that could help sustain the base, Duna does not. But Duna is a lot more convenient to get to.

Both have radiation risks, but it'd still be safer than being in space for the same amount of time. Laythe has more gravity to fight on the way up, but the oxygen allows jets to be used, and you can land easily with parachutes. Longer term, higher gravity may be more healthy.

I reckon both have pretty cool scenery. You can jump higher on Duna, but on Laythe you can go swimming in your space suit.

Pretty well matched in my view.

Edited July 20, 2013 by Tw1

[spikeyhat09]

Duna. larythe is cool and easy to get to, but it takes forever to timewarp and the delta v requirements are huge. building a duna base is 85% as awesome and you can build it quickly in comparison.

[spikeyhat09]

Why not both? Limited time maybe.

Duna is easier too get to, and has less gravity and atmosphere

Laythe is harder to get to, more atmosphere and about twice the gravity

you are wrong on that front, my friend. Jool is one of the easiest planets to reach because of its enormous gravity well. also the higher atmosphere makes for stronger aerobraking and more effective parachutes

[Aladran]

Duna, more fun with rovers And I don't know why I like her moon, big in the sky, easy to get there, nice opportunity for refueling stations if you are using kethane.

[Tw1]

you are wrong on that front, my friend. Jool is one of the easiest planets to reach because of its enormous gravity well. also the higher atmosphere makes for stronger aerobraking and more effective parachutes

True, but there's still a higher delta V cost, and it's almost a year to get there, compared to two months.

[espm400]

you are wrong on that front, my friend. Jool is one of the easiest planets to reach because of its enormous gravity well. also the higher atmosphere makes for stronger aerobraking and more effective parachutes

Another thing that you have to remember is for those of us using Deadly Re-entry, aerobraking is a dangerous, if not suicidal game. Not to mention that when it gets implemented, re-entry heat is something we're all going to have to deal with.

As I said earlier, Laythe is nice to look at and has O2, but if you want a colony, stick with the red planet.

[Brotoro]

So, for those of you who DO use Deadly Reentry, does a Jool aerobraking destroy a ship? Does it do so if you use a more gentle aerobraking in multiple steps? Is it a matter of not having good heat shields yet, or is a ship toast no matter how you try to aerobrake at Jool?

I certainly enjoy my world so far with no aerodynamic heat damage, but I try to think ahead a little (which is why I include token heat shields and avoid direct-to-Laythe aerobrakings) so I'm keen to know. But not keen enough to implement Deadly Reentry myself.

[espm400]

So, for those of you who DO use Deadly Reentry, does a Jool aerobraking destroy a ship? Does it do so if you use a more gentle aerobraking in multiple steps? Is it a matter of not having good heat shields yet, or is a ship toast no matter how you try to aerobrake at Jool?

I certainly enjoy my world so far with no aerodynamic heat damage, but I try to think ahead a little (which is why I include token heat shields and avoid direct-to-Laythe aerobrakings) so I'm keen to know. But not keen enough to implement Deadly Reentry myself.

Truth be told, I can't speak for Jool itself. I haven't been there since I started my new save with DRE and IonCross Crew Support (which also happened to be two days before the announcement of .21). I do know that before I started said save, I had a mission in transit to Duna, and even in the thin atmosphere of that red sphere, my ship died a rather quick death on my original aerobrake profile. Extrapolating from that, coupled with the various Mercury and Gemini inspired missions (DRE actually gave me incentive to do sub-orbital flights...), Jool's dense atmo just seems like a death sentence. As I've mentioned in other threads, I'm staying in the Kerbin system until .21 drops. Perhaps someone who has a bit more experience with DRE can either confirm or refute my thoughts here...

[Levelord]

I personally run a floating Laythe base mainly because I can use jet engines there, which means I have a greater ability to explore the surrounding areas without having to worry about fuel and sitting around for hours on end to reach a destination on wheels.

[espm400]

I personally run a floating Laythe base mainly because I can use jet engines there, which means I have a greater ability to explore the surrounding areas without having to worry about fuel and sitting around for hours on end to reach a destination on wheels.

Huh... Never seen a floating base before. Gotta say it looks pretty damned good.

[Benie]

I'm actually thinking of a floating base. Actually two bases. One for boats, the other for the main base which will be sitting on one of the islands. But with the fact Laythe's oceans are huge, finding a relativity-flat area on the many islands, is hard.

Why I'll be using an Airship to get around, just for fun. Just need to learn how to anchor properly. Flying isn't the problem.

Edited July 20, 2013 by Benie

[ComradeGoat]

Personally I'm a Duna kind of guy... If only for the dV requirements.

Duna is indeed easier to get to. All sorts of lower complexity.

However, launch windows to Jool happen about twice as often.

[ComradeGoat]

I personally run a floating Laythe base mainly because I can use jet engines there, which means I have a greater ability to explore the surrounding areas without having to worry about fuel and sitting around for hours on end to reach a destination on wheels.

I have two questions about this, which looks amazing, btw!

How do you manage water landings in spaceplanes? Presumably vertically and then letting them tip forward once you've landed?

Having done that, how do you take off again? I've tried doing takeoff runs in water and it ... ends badly.

[bsalis]

How do you manage water landings in spaceplanes?

With vertical lifting jets.

As for my 2c on a base. It depends what you want. Personally I think Laythe is better since you can explore by plane, and having a base serves a purpose as a place to refuel planes.