BSC: Albatross 3 - And the winner is...

[I_Killed_Jeb]

sirine having twice the votes of mcirish? i call shenanigans.

[antbin]

so a question for you master plane builders, how do you get long wings to stay stiff? i can build ssto's pretty quickly and easily but they as a rule can't have more than 2-3 rectangular structural wings because of mega flex issues, and struts dont' seem to help me much

Yeah, it's tricky. You can't use struts that are flat-packed close to the wing. You need a tall fuselage (like the mk3s) or a vertical "spine" fin to fasten the wing struts to, so they form a nice tall triangle. That can handle a lot of stress before snapping.

If you put struts that are almost parallel to the wing, the tension / compression stresses in the strut get too high and the wing will detach. Kind of like if you bend corrugated cardboard.

[I_Killed_Jeb]

Yeah, it's tricky. You can't use struts that are flat-packed close to the wing. You need a tall fuselage (like the mk3s) or a vertical "spine" fin to fasten the wing struts to, so they form a nice tall triangle. That can handle a lot of stress before snapping.

If you put struts that are almost parallel to the wing, the tension / compression stresses in the strut get too high and the wing will detach. Kind of like if you bend corrugated cardboard.

Hilarious that Kerbals have successfully constructed more complex rocketry than NASA but have not figured out properly cantilevered wings and need to rely on Wright Flyer level strutted wings

[Xeldrak]

While I, too wonder who all these anonymous voters for sirine are - please refrain from any accusations and keep calm. It's just a challenge for a pc-game.

[briansun1]

you know you can set the vote to public veiw...

[Octagon]

Oh my... My plane get to the finals... I could never expect... Well, although I like my plane:D I must admit that I'll not be voting on it this time. Now I need to discover which of them is more "Stock"...

EDIT: And what is next??? Hypersonic jets, SSTOs, cargo planes, rockets...

Edited November 5, 2013 by Octagon

[Blaster]

It was a tough decision, but I still put my vote for the Albatross 18, because GusTurbo wins KSP. Simply that. Haters gonna hate.

[Sirine]

Craft file here.

Changes, replace the JetEngine with TurboJet. Add 8Ram Intake x2, and a FL-T200 Fuel Tank, and a Rockomax rocket engine. (And a docking port for the K-prize rules).

Well, this just to show that "The Albatross" are able to go to space. (SSTO)

Below image heavy (77 pic), I have my "The Albatross" modified a bit and send it to LKO, and back to KSC in 1 piece.

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Edited November 6, 2013 by Sirine

[Ekku Zakku]

Thanks Sirine for crashing my phone twice with your post XD such little RAM couldn't handle all those pictures lol. Doesn't matter that you changed your craft though, we can only vote on what you entered (not to mention, I don't even know how the one you entered even got so many votes...).

[Sirine]

Thanks Sirine for crashing my phone twice with your post XD such little RAM couldn't handle all those pictures lol. Doesn't matter that you changed your craft though, we can only vote on what you entered (not to mention, I don't even know how the one you entered even got so many votes...).

Sorry for that dude. Well, Its almost certain that your "Ensoku" get the 1st place. I'm just fighting for my 2nd place.

Well, the plane change is for the "show-case" on how versatile it can be, so, I might get a vote or 2 for that.

Well, congratulation on your winning.

I don't even know how the one you entered even got so many votes...

I "ask" friends to vote for me. That all. They are all KSP forum-er, In fact, you might want to ask the OP to public the voter. I'm actually would like to say "thank you" for those who voted me, and I don't really know who are they, cause I'm asking too much of them that I personally don't remember who.

[Ekku Zakku]

Sorry for that dude. Well, Its almost certain that your "Ensoku" get the 1st place. I'm just fighting for my 2nd place.

Well, the plane change is for the "show-case" on how versatile it can be, so, I might get a vote or 2 for that.

Well, congratulation on your winning.

I don't even know how the one you entered even got so many votes...

I "ask" friends to vote for me. That all. They are all KSP forum-er, In fact, you might want to ask the OP to public the voter. I'm actually would like to say "thank you" for those who voted me, and I don't really know who are they, cause I'm asking too much of them that I personally don't remember who.

Ah, I see XD the benefits to having friends I suppose, popularity helps! Perfectly legal, but still a bit outside the spirit of the challenge imo~

I'm still flabbergasted that my plane has done so well, I never really expected to win a BSC challenge, much less on my first go. I'm gonna have to try a lot harder to win in future challenges though, I'm sure! The competition is tough XD

[Sirine]

Ah, I see XD the benefits to having friends I suppose, popularity helps! Perfectly legal, but still a bit outside the spirit of the challenge imo~

I'm still flabbergasted that my plane has done so well, I never really expected to win a BSC challenge, much less on my first go. I'm gonna have to try a lot harder to win in future challenges though, I'm sure! The competition is tough XD

Yes, friends did helps a lot.

The BSC challenge winning scenario are unpredictable. That makes it so popular.

However you did build a very stable plane. Bravo on that. Did you fly "Frank I"? If not, you should try.

[Xeldrak]

Well, sadly it semms like I can't set the poll to public once it is in place.

Asking friends to vote for you is of course in absolute compliance with the rules and Guidelines I have written down under the BSC: Challenge Guidelines. After all this has allways been about how many People you can come up with, that vote for your design because you are their friend, right? It's not like I wrote something like, say:

Be so kind and reward me by caring for the stuff I've written. Vote for the craft that will make a good stock craft, with the features described above, not the best looking one or the cooles one or the one by you friend.

[Sirine]

@Xeldrak

After for so many days. It seems that your are a immature guy that do not forget and forgive. Okay, hater gonna hate.

I believe this is what started (in between you and me.)

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/50790-BSC-Ravenspear-Mk-1-And-the-winner-is?p=667162&viewfull=1#post667162

And your reply seems calm.

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/50790-BSC-Ravenspear-Mk-1-And-the-winner-is?p=667493&viewfull=1#post667493

But after I posted this...

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/50790-BSC-Ravenspear-Mk-1-And-the-winner-is?p=667576&viewfull=1#post667576

You started to "hate" me. Even though, there are many times that I've apologies.

I'm here to make friends, not enemy.

However, my patience are running out. If you continue to against me on everything.

You will only let others to think that, you are "a narrow stingy kid".

[mcirish3]

Well Xeldrak, I don't know. I would be mad as heck about the results of this build off, when both second and third place are in violation of the rules. Usually when you treat people as adults they act like adults. That is how it usually is, however, in this case it would seem that nearly 50% of the voters are ignoring the rules. Not sure what methods you have for enforcement but might be time to tighten up the rules on the next challenge. They may call you a jerk but you can just point to this challenge and say, "sorry, you're the idiots who who spoiled it for everyone else".

[Rhomphaia]

The Albatross

While I can appreciate the design aesthetic I'm not a fan of the stepped wings and upside down fuselages. Also has reaction wheels which I don't think any low altidute plane should need

While I don't feel that an albatross replacement needs perfect controls they should be consistent and in this entry they are rather unpredictable. so I could not even get it to point in the direction I intended to travel.

The Nose up tendency becomes very pronounced as fuel drains and it is uncontrollable in an empty glide.

Ahlbetossed IVb

Looks the part, but turbojets and vtol does not really fit the albatross. Also has reaction wheels.

Tail strike hazard on (horizontal) take off, lost the central engine. Flies fairly well

Albatross 18

Looks good but not very albatrossy. reaction wheels

Tail strike can take out half the plane. Flies well but does not have much ability to pitch up when gliding making it tricky to land.

fuel does not drain from side tanks. not particularly long range

Diamond Flyer

Looks good, but more a ravenspear than an albatross. No description. Reaction wheels and stacked intakes.

Flies well.

Ensoku

Like this, no reaction wheels and circular intakes. looks quite albatrossy. Clever rudder placement.

Flies and glides very well when full of fuel.

CoM will shift behind CoL when it empties, though fuel ducting does delay this until last tanks. While SAS can mostly handle it, there is a noticable nose up when maneuvering which can make precision landing difficult.

Condor

And here I thought I was going big when I built the Pelican, Love it. Could have used an action group for the ladder.

Fuel ducting is a problem here, some symmetrically placed parts were probably repositioned after fuel lines were placed and the fuel lines failed to connect properly, making the fuel flow slightly asymmetric. Lots of control surfaces give it a slight infiniglide effect especially when empty

All in all after a more detailed test of the finalists, I should probably change my vote to the Ensoku. However I will stick with the Condor since I dont feel it is getting the love it deserves as the only suitable albatross replacement other than the Ensoku to make it to the finals.

[Sirine]

@Rhomphaia

Thanks for the test flight. Appreciated your commend.

[ethan829]

@Xeldrak

After for so many days. It seems that your are a immature guy that do not forget and forgive. Okay, hater gonna hate.

I believe this is what started (in between you and me.)

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/50790-BSC-Ravenspear-Mk-1-And-the-winner-is?p=667162&viewfull=1#post667162

And your reply seems calm.

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/50790-BSC-Ravenspear-Mk-1-And-the-winner-is?p=667493&viewfull=1#post667493

But after I posted this...

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/50790-BSC-Ravenspear-Mk-1-And-the-winner-is?p=667576&viewfull=1#post667576

You started to "hate" me. Even though, there are many times that I've apologies.

I'm here to make friends, not enemy.

However, my patience are running out. If you continue to against me on everything.

You will only let others to think that, you are "a narrow stingy kid".

Seems a bit less like Xeldrak can't forgive and more like you can't handle losing. Also you're ignoring the fact that you violated the guidelines outlined.

[Sirine]

Seems a bit less like Xeldrak can't forgive and more like you can't handle losing. Also you're ignoring the fact that you violated the guidelines outlined.

Please be more specific. I hate grey area.

[briansun1]

Seems a bit less like Xeldrak can't forgive and more like you can't handle losing. Also you're ignoring the fact that you violated the guidelines outlined.

also seems like he/she dosen't know that just becasue you type "don't hate me" makes it okay

[Sirine]

I've already apologize. And what the hack is this related to you. Imo.

[briansun1]

*heck

and it is related becase your not really following the spirt of this competition. There will always be grey areas so just find a way to deal with it.

[ethan829]

Please be more specific. I hate grey area.

I don't think I was unclear. You've conveniently ignored the fact that the voting guidelines state not to just vote for your friend's plane, which you apparently convinced plenty of people to do. If your plane can't win honestly then it doesn't deserve to.

Edited November 6, 2013 by ethan829

[antbin]

you love the gray line, I merely walking on it. I can tell that you are under-pressure...

seems that you are against me on everything. I have nothing to say anymore.

Just ignore me as always. Thanks.

It seems that your are a immature guy

You started to "hate" me.

Passive aggressive narcissism.

[bSC:]Make something

convince yourself that it is "the best replacement", and

try to promote it, and

let other agree with you.

and hope that the vote will favor you.

Reminds me of Conan's "What is best in life?" line.

We're just a bunch of nerds on an internet forum fooling around with a single player video game. Outside is a much nicer place! (I have been there, and that's my excuse for not reviewing contestants yet! )

[Xeldrak]

Well, it looks like there are several people that agree with my point of view. Therefore, Sirine shall have his third place (well, poll closes in ~3 hours) and be happy with a award he got by telling friends to vote for him. Seriously, I don't have the nerve for any more bickering - my hope was, that if I treat everyone mature, they would behave mature. But it seems like it still have to do something to enforce the rules...

When this challenge is done, I'll add a Unsportsmanlike conduct clause to the rules, allowing me to ban people from this compedition of hand out penalties as I see fit. Please note, Sirine, that if I were a "immature guy that do not forget and forgive", I would implement these rules NOW. But you shall have your award - to be honest, I'd pin it to your signature if I could. Also the final votes will be public from now on.

@antbin: I've been at the local tax office today - the place outside not nicer....

Edited November 6, 2013 by Xeldrak