(OLD) The Ultimate Jool-5 Challenge:land Kerbals on all moons and return in one big mission

[MiniMatt]

Progress slowed thanks to right-click bugs appearing since 0.24.1 but workaround is possible.

LAYTHE IS COMPLETE!

Spent laythe module will now spend eternity orbiting Laythe. There are worse graveyards.

The ion tug got it's first outing in bringing the lander module back to the mothership. And yep, as everyone has noted, it's... too damn slow Well, it's not a complete write off - I think there may be merit in the idea, but needs tweaking. That said, this time it was only tugging the couple of tons of core lander module - pulling the whole Tylo package is going to be... interesting.

Orbital docking manoeuvres (in the dark) are completed such that tug is now back on it's dock and the core lander module has pulled out two of the main mothership engines (which will now proceed on four nukes), flipped them around so they're pointing in the right direction, re-docked because I got orientation wrong and the ladders don't line up, then parked the whole revised lander at the front of the ship. Jeb stored his science and took a seat in the hitchhiker can; Bill will take the hotseat for Vall.

Minor snag, in it's new Vall friendly configuration the lander can't extend it's solar panel without fouling fuel tanks, meh, there's a couple of static panels on there too, it'll be fine

Ready for departure to Vall, the mothership now (sans laythe module) reckons it has ~7000dv available, it now masses 174 tons with 208 parts.

EDIT: In orbit around Vall! 540dv escape burn from Laythe to Vall, 35dv mid journey correction burn, 240dv capture around Vall & 12dv correction to bring the periapsis down to just inside the "in space near" zone. Which adds up to ~830dv, yet mothership now reporting ~6000dv available for a total cost of ~1000dv. Still, within my finger in the air guestimates.

Notes: I've brought too much RCS fuel. The Laythe reconfiguration was possibly the most docking intense part of the journey and so far I've used all of 7 units of RCS fuel out of 908. Weight savings can be made here. Also put the mobile lab closer to where the science gear docks - EVA transfers are a pain.

Edited July 25, 2014 by MiniMatt

[Cmdr. Arn1e]

They're HOME!

in a nice 630 x 630Km orbit, and now I'm sending up some specialist recovery vehicles for each of the 2 parts being returned to KSC - the Mobile Processing Lab (Returner vehicle already on-route to rendezvous, has a single Poodle engine, 4x Heavy Landing Gear, and a special MonoProp Tug for the top with 4x Drogue 'chutes to help slow it down so neither the Science Jr. or nosecone and barometer assemblies drop off! There are already 4 radial 'chutes on the MPL itself, but want to be absolutely sure NOTHING will go wrong with returning this hard-earned science!!!)

The Crew Quarters return ship is going to be... um... interesting... I'm thinking of trying to get that crew transfer spaceplane going to get them back, then I will get to re-use the Crew Quarters in the future

BIG Update coming up over the weekend (Should hopefully be the final report!)

[MiniMatt]

They're HOME!

WOOHOO! Congratulations Eagerly awaiting update

[MiniMatt]

Landed on Vall!

Kinda.

First landing was not *entirely* as planned and let's just say the takeoff was spectacular So, ahem, another quicksave used for the subsequent, more successful, landing.

Both landings were horribly inefficient however. Lazy "I've landed on hundreds of moons" attitude, far too steep (partly in order to land in daylight) an entry and Friday evening vodka consumption led to around 1,700dv just to land. Thankfully, lander has another 1,300 to go but Tylo won't be so forgiving....

edit: for sake of clarity, worth noting that landing was supposed to be vertical. Screenie above demonstrates a *mere* 90 degree deviation....

Edited July 25, 2014 by MiniMatt

[Cmdr. Arn1e]

[snip]

Both landings were horribly inefficient however. Lazy "I've landed on hundreds of moons" attitude, far too steep an entry and Friday evening vodka consumption led to around 1,700dv just to land. Thankfully, lander has another 1,300 to go but Tylo won't be so forgiving....

I think I may have found where you went wrong!

Drinking always makes gaming... um.. 'interesting' lol... especially for the bits you need to try and concentrate on!

At least you managed to land right way up... I've managed to forget to control from the right place so many times (and had to F9 because of it) I'm sure some of my crew didn't know if they were coming or going half the time

[MiniMatt]

I think I may have found where you went wrong!

Drinking always makes gaming... um.. 'interesting' lol... especially for the bits you need to try and concentrate on!

I think you might be on to something. For the purposes of further scientific endeavour I can confirm that drunk docking is similarly entertaining. So the Vall lander somehow managed to expend all 3,000dv landing, taking off, and *almost* docking with the mothership. Thankfully the little-ion-tug-that-could was on hand to rescue. I'm coming round to that little fella. He's a good'un.

Vall is done!

Refuelling the lander resulted in the mothership being reduced to 5,700m/s dv. After Bill deposits the science we'll be ready to depart to Tylo. It's probably best approached sober. So, for tonight, adieu.

Edit: Arrived at Tylo! 140m/s burn from Vall, followed by 100m/s capture. Bob's taking the hotseat for Tylo. He looks nervous.

Edit 2: So the ion tug has finally met it's match in the form of the 47 ton Tylo lander configuration. After prolonged burning and over 1000 units of xenon I've only really succeeded in halving (if that) the mothership's apoapsis. So scratched that plan, lowered periapsis down to 20km instead, going to come in very fast and very low, attempt a full thrust horizontal suicide burn. On the night side. I forgot to include landing lights. :gulp:

Edit 3: I hate Tylo Horizontal suicide burn looks viable, and given how tight fuel looks to be shaping up it looks like it's the only approach that I can make from this orbit.

First attempt: fire ascent nukes and descent skipper at full thrust at 1 minute prior to 20km periapsis. This timing turned out to be bang on *perfect*, bringing me down to about 100m/s at 1000m from the surface. Slight gravity misjudgement led to my final descent accelerating far quicker than thought. Bob died.

Second attempt: Going ok! 7m/s descent just 300m to go - and then the skipper ran out of fuel; nukes were insufficient to hold aloft the full mass & I wasn't quick enough to undock the descent stage before we hit the ground at 40m/s. Bob survived. The ship didn't.

Third attempt: Disabled docking port crossfeed midway through the burn to ensure skipper had enough fuel. In final seconds of landing I couldn't quite find balance point of thrust in time. Most of the craft survived. The important bits, however, did not.

Fourth attempt: Textbook. Apart from the landing. Misjudged last moment before contact (landing lights would have been really helpful) & didn't kill thrust in time. Toppled over.

Fifth attempt: As per the fourth. Being on the night side is really hurting. Toying with idea of orbiting till periapsis is in daylight. Also increasingly worried about lander design - SAS is insufficiently strong to keep the lander upright if some rather shallow angles or lateral forces are present on contact.

Sixth & seventh attempt: As per the fourth and fifth. Going to orbit a few months till daylight and make next attempts where seeing the ground is possible.

Gagghhh! Orbiting my way into daylight is not an option. Seems my elliptical orbit is aligned with the sun, such that the periapsis is always in the dark...

Eighth attempt: Experimented with timing of suicide burn. Was not a successful experiment.

...

Fifteenth attempt: LANDED! Took a quicksave at the final moments of an otherwise successful burn allowing for repeated attempts at the troublesome final stage. 380 units of fuel left, allowing for a full ascent stage and 20 units of fuel left in the descent to give a teensy initial boost.

Edit 4: Jeez, taking off is troublesome too?! Tylo really hates me Undocked the spent descent stage a couple of seconds into flight as it ran out, then pointed at 45 degrees and hoped it would be plain sailing from there on. Gravity had other plans as she dragged my now puny 1.2TWR back into the ground

Edit 5: Finally in a nice 70km circular orbit around Tylo! 3000m/s ascent stage was just sufficient, though it did look a little dicey at one point. Of course now I need to tug out to the mothership - which means first taking the tug back to mothership to refuel, before going to collect Bob. As the lander now weighs a mere 8.5 tons it shouldn't be too onerous.

Edit 6:

...which means first taking the tug back to mothership to refuel, before going to collect Bob. As the lander now weighs a mere 8.5 tons it shouldn't be too onerous.

I was so wrong. That little ion tug did ok at Laythe and Vall. But at Tylo it's woeful. I must have spent ninety minutes doing 30 seperate burns to get the lander back up to the mothership. But the good news is: Tylo is now done! Bad news: slight design flaw means my lander won't fit on the mothership now the Tylo descent stage has gone (nukes crash into sides). So had to break up the lander into it's constituent modules again and use the tug (again) to dock them at either end of the ship where they will fit.

Now lighter, but since filling up the lander the mothership reports ~5,500dv (incidentally think previous reports were likely off as ion engine was activated and Engineer was likely counting that too). Talking of ion engines - I've now burnt through 4346 units of xenon gas. At 0.the 48/s burn rate of my single ion engine that's 9000 seconds spent operating that engine - that's TWO AND A HALF HOURS

Edited July 26, 2014 by MiniMatt

[Norcalplanner]

I have a couple questions about the Jool-5 Kethane challenge for Ziv, or anyone else who thinks they know the answers.

I'm finalizing the design of my ship, and would appreciate clarity on a few rules and points items. Questions are:

1. Is minor part clipping OK? I have some 1.25m stacks that clip a tiny bit, and I've rotated the RTGs more for aesthetics than anything else. Would this violate the "no clipping" rule? I can unrotate the RTGs and put in some cubic octagonal struts to remove the clipping, but the design won't look as clean.

2. Do Kerbals left in orbital stations around Joolian moons count as Kerbals left behind for points? Right now the plan is to leave manned mini space stations around each moon, but I could modify my plan to turn the stations into ground bases if needed.

3. Is landing on the LV-Ns and not using landing struts considered "cheating"? My lander rests directly on the LV-Ns without standard landing struts. I know that it's gamey and unrealistic, but the part has a maximum impact tolerance of 12 m/s, and has worked well in testing.

4. As a single 1800 ton launch without any refueling, would it be eligible for the low mass challenge? I know that it would come in last, but Jeb can be a bit of a glory hound.

Any assistance and/or clarification would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance. I've posted a few images to show what I'm talking about

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[MiniMatt]

Ziv is obviously the arbiter of such things but personally (if I'm seeing those screens right) the level of clipping you've got going on there is extremely benign, don't confer a game advantage, don't look unrealistic, and don't hinder third parties' understanding of how your ship hangs together.

Again, Ziv is naturally the arbiter, but I think most, when they say "no part clipping", generally mean the sort of clipping only doable with the alt-f12 debug menu, clipping engines wholly inside fuel tanks, or fuel tanks inside other fuel tanks, or hiding components completely.

Re landing on nukes, I personally consider any landing one walks away from to be fine, however that may be achieved There was a time we didn't even have landing legs in KSP....

[MiniMatt]

And Pol is now done!

Such a relief after Tylo. Rookie Richnie took the helm for this one and performed flawlessly. Ish.

Took 99m/s to escape from cursed Tylo. Another 78m/s correction to arrange an encounter with Pol, and a further 5m/s correction later on. Forgot to screenshot the Pol capture burn, but from memory it was just shy of 400m/s to put us in a 114km/18km elliptical around Pol.

Having to do the docking shuffle to re-arrange the lander (thanks to my design oversight mentioned above) is a pain, but Richnie, flushed with so much POWAH at his disposal, belted down to Pol's surface, promptly fell over on the low gravity bounce, but managed, by disabling the rear RCS thrusters, to right himself via judicious expenditure of monopropellant. Taking off was again such a refreshing change after Tylo - managed to take off right into an intercept and dock (after the accursed shuffle) with the mothership.

Mothership now reports 4,878m/s delta-v remaining to take us to Bop and then home!

Edit: Arrived at Bop! 114m/s escape from Pol, 304m/s inclination change, further 102m/s mid journey tweak (I'm getting lazy with planning intercepts now I know I've fuel to waste) then 30m/s capture around Bop. Mothership reports 4320dv available. Thompnie is strapped in for the final Joolian landing.

Edit 2: Bop is done! Did the "Bop Bounce" upon landing and flopped onto my side, just as with Pol - that lander really is too tall. This time RCS wasn't quite enough to right the lander against Bop's fractionally stronger gravity. Luckily however, a horizontal sliding takeoff was possible without explosively losing parts Docking shuffle complete, science loaded into lab, and spent 2.2dv taking mothership down into a lower orbit to collect "in space near" science I forgot to do on first arrival.

All Kerbonauts are now back in the hab or lab modules. Having transferred remaining lander fuel back into the mothership, we now have 4835 dv to take us home. We could, at this stage, ditch the lander engine module, the core lander module, and the ion tug, saving at least 7 tons and granting us more delta-v. But as fuel reserves look ample we'll avoid littering up the system, and bring the whole lot home. Vessel masses 92.9 tons, with 168 parts.

Edited July 28, 2014 by MiniMatt

[Ziv]

I have a couple questions about the Jool-5 Kethane challenge for Ziv, or anyone else who thinks they know the answers.

I'm finalizing the design of my ship, and would appreciate clarity on a few rules and points items. Questions are:

1. Is minor part clipping OK? I have some 1.25m stacks that clip a tiny bit, and I've rotated the RTGs more for aesthetics than anything else. Would this violate the "no clipping" rule? I can unrotate the RTGs and put in some cubic octagonal struts to remove the clipping, but the design won't look as clean.

2. Do Kerbals left in orbital stations around Joolian moons count as Kerbals left behind for points? Right now the plan is to leave manned mini space stations around each moon, but I could modify my plan to turn the stations into ground bases if needed.

3. Is landing on the LV-Ns and not using landing struts considered "cheating"? My lander rests directly on the LV-Ns without standard landing struts. I know that it's gamey and unrealistic, but the part has a maximum impact tolerance of 12 m/s, and has worked well in testing.

4. As a single 1800 ton launch without any refueling, would it be eligible for the low mass challenge? I know that it would come in last, but Jeb can be a bit of a glory hound.

Any assistance and/or clarification would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance. I've posted a few images to show what I'm talking about

http://imgur.com/a/8vXkW

1. putting an RTG laying half into a tank or something is okay. What is absolutely against the rule is to clip tanks, engines and pods into each other. So the main thing that the ship should have the same volume as the parts all together. So minor clipping for aesthetics is okay.

2. good question! I have added points for remaining in orbit, which is less than if landed.

3. hmm, it's not against the rule but I think it's not elegant. And too dangerous!

4. hehe, no... the low-mass challenge is about optimizing the ship at the extremes for low mass. People scanning that section will look for low-mass solutions. But I think an Expedition Style entry is absolutely a really nice shiny glory already!

[Norcalplanner]

1. putting an RTG laying half into a tank or something is okay. What is absolutely against the rule is to clip tanks, engines and pods into each other. So the main thing that the ship should have the same volume as the parts all together. So minor clipping for aesthetics is okay.

2. good question! I have added points for remaining in orbit, which is less than if landed.

3. hmm, it's not against the rule but I think it's not elegant. And too dangerous!

4. hehe, no... the low-mass challenge is about optimizing the ship at the extremes for low mass. People scanning that section will look for low-mass solutions. But I think an Expedition Style entry is absolutely a really nice shiny glory already!

Ziv,

Thanks for the answers.

OK, so I'll leave the RTGs and stacks as is - there's no advantage other than an aesthetic one.

Thanks for the clarification on leaving guys in orbit.

It's extremely inelegant, but then again, danger is my middle name. If one of the LV-Ns goes kaboom due to an overly enthusiastic landing, I'll have to jettison the opposite engine and try to carry on with a lower TWR.

Expedition only it is.

Ship should be launched and on its way later tonight.

[Cmdr. Arn1e]

SCIENCE! Returned - it's over 8,000!

Not breaking any records, I know, except personal ones - and this smashed my previous best by a long way!

Just got to get my Pilots back now... oversight of forgetting parachutes on this section means a creative and unusual return-craft, but it's all part of the fun! Final Report (hopefully) tomorrow

[Norcalplanner]

KABOOM (the Kerbal Administration for Big Overpowered Orbital Machines) is proud to present their latest ship, the Milne. This ship will be attempting the Kethane variant of the Jool-5 Challenge.

1979 tons, 580 parts, and initial TWR of 1.78 sitting on the launchpad

335 tons, 374 parts, and TWR of 0.48 when departing LKO for Jool

9 brave Kerbals are making the trip, 5 of whom have volunteered to stay behind in the Jool system

1 launch, no refueling before leaving LKO

This is in my new 0.24 career save. The only mods being used are MechJeb, Editor Extensions, and Kethane. The old version of KW Rocketry is still installed, but no KW parts are used in this ship.

Key design concepts and considerations for this ship:

1. Atomic power. LV-Ns and RTGs are used as much as possible in the design.

2. Fewer stages. When departing from LKO the Milne consists of two main stages, rather than the four main stages of KABOOM’s previous effort, the Jool Explorer.

3. No Kessler syndrome. If all goes according to plan, no empty fuel tanks or other debris will be jettisoned into space during the trip.

4. Two or more roles for major systems. Most major systems have at least two roles to play during the trip. For example, the kethane scanning probes are fitted with LV-Ns, and are oriented and attached to the Milne so that the LV-Ns can serve as part of the drive section during flight, rather than simply being dead weight.

5. Stock parts. All parts, with the exception of MechJeb and a few pieces of kethane equipment, are stock. I wanted to challenge myself a bit, and see how far I can go without any significant mods.

6. Better names. The previous Jool Explorer had generic names for its parts, such as the tanker section and the lander. In keeping with the Milne’s name, all designations are taken from A.A. Milne’s classic Winnie the Pooh books. The two main parts are Pooh Bear (the lander) and Eeyore (the tanker). Parts of Eeyore can undock and become their own craft, with designations of Kanga, Roo, Piglet, Christopher Robin, Tigger, and Alexander Beetle. The lifter, doing all the work of pushing Pooh and company into orbit and then crashing back down to Kerbin, is Rabbit.

7. It’s all about Pooh Bear. Pooh Bear is the heart of the Milne, and consists of almost 100 tons of KABOOM’s best engineering efforts. A stout and helpful craft, Pooh Bear is equipped with 8 LV-Ns and 4 LVT-30s, and serves as the main drive section of the Milne when docked to Eeyore. When undocked, it’s a 2-man universal SSTO lander. It can function as a tug, reconfiguring Eeyore’s modules as needed. When carrying Owl (the mobile lab), it’s a science gathering machine. When landed, it’s a kethane miner with two drills and a converter, so it can refuel itself as long as it lands on a kethane deposit. When carrying the Hunny Pot (a supplemental 18-ton fuel tank), it functions as a tanker that can bring more than 40 tons of fuel back to Eeyore per trip, at least when returning from Pol, Bop, or Vall. When carrying the supplemental hitchhiker (as it will on the trip home) it’s a roomy interplanetary craft with two seats per kerbal.

8. Some efficiency has been sacrificed in favor of playability. The design uses fewer larger parts when possible to reduce part count and lag, even though it comes with a mass penalty (such as using a few Z-4K batteries instead of dozens of massless Z-400s). Both Pooh Bear and Eeyore are fitted with reaction wheels. To reduce burn times, the fully assembled Milne has 12 LV-Ns and 4 LVT-30s. TWR is 0.23 in nuclear mode, and 0.48 if the LVT-30s are also fired up.

9. We’re going to leave a presence behind. Much of Eeyore can undock and become multiple independent craft. If everything goes according to plan, the Milne will leave manned fuel depots in equatorial orbits around every moon, a kethane scanner/science satellite in polar orbits around four of the moons, and a small science satellite around Jool itself.

10. Modular design. There are lots of docking ports, allowing multiple configurations for both Pooh and Eeyore. The five orbital fuel depots can be docked together to make one large station instead of 5 small ones.

11. Rockets only. KABOOM is focused on rockets. No planes, rovers, boats, or jet engines are included in the Milne’s design.

12. Future-friendly. Putting fuel depots in orbit around each moon, each with room for three more kerbals, should aid in future Jool exploration and colonization efforts.

13. Nobody is stranded. Each manned fuel depot has enough Delta V, thrust, and parachutes to make it successfully back to Kerbin. They can also land and become minimalist ground bases on every moon except Tylo.

14. Real-life testing. No hyperedit advance testing at the actual locations, only a few reverts and a real launch with testing on and around Kerbin, the Mun, and Minmus. Although the test launch cost 1.1 million funds, 25% of that was recovered from many of the parts landing near KSC.

15. A smaller ship. The previous Jool Explorer was 860 tons when it departed LKO. The Milne is 335 tons, less than half the weight. In spite of this, the new ship will be leaving behind a much larger presence in the Jool system.

16. Minimal landing gear. This may be a bit gamey, but Pooh Bear has only been fitted with a few landing struts for stability, with the bulk of the weight resting directly on the 8 LV-Ns instead. The ship’s design made it difficult to attach enough struts to support a 100 ton ship, and the LV-Ns have an impact tolerance of 12 m/s, rather than the usual 6 or 7 for most parts. Testing shows that it works - with half a load of fuel on board, Pooh Bear landed at Kerbin on flattish ground at 8 m/s without incident. It was also able to drill and fully refuel on the Mun while carrying the Hunny Pot (its heaviest and most unstable mode) on a 15 degree slope, also without incident.

Chapters will be posted as they occur -I'll update my sig once I have enough for a real gallery.

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Edited July 28, 2014 by Norcalplanner

[Cmdr. Arn1e]

and DONE!

Quick overview, as unfortunately I have a storm overhead at the moment making upload of final screenshots to photobucket fail miserably...

SCIENCE: 8974 - as already noted, a personal best

Thoughts: I wish I had planned certain stages much better, and that I had not gone with a Skipper powered Mothership - all in all, I think the most time was spent coming up with a decent Fuel Tanker, then sending multiple of them to refuel the main stage. If I had known how much fuel would be consumed, I would have asked Ziv a LOT earlier if I could switch the motherships engines out for Nuclear!

Apart from that, the only leg I had to replace a Lander for was Tylo; as most people know, Tylo is a harsh mistress, except for use as an orbital base point... if I retry this (and I probably will!) then I will have my mothership park there first and then use a tug to ferry the Laders to their destinations and back.

If anything, the Bop and Pol Landers were both WAY overpowered, and on the next one I'm considering using Ions... which might even save me tugging them out and back, and add more experience to the newer members of the crew...

Some background info:

KSP Version: 0.23.5 all the way through - as .24 was released as I was trying to finish, I switched to a non-steam backup of my game, resulting in the delay to the final mission report.

Mods: Kerbal Alarm Clock, MechJeb. part-way through I did install KAS with the intention of using it to make some over-powered Tanker Tugs, but was abandoned because 1) I had to figure out how to use it and 2) someone mentioned it would demote my entry to an honourable mention/Mixed Solution (I'm really hoping I qualify for the Jebediah Level, but up to Ziv of course!) Mods that didn't seem to work: Crew Xfer (Think I should have used Crew Manifest, but meh, too late now)

Launches: 8 initial launches, followed by FAR too many for refuelling, surprisingly it only took 3 iterations of the Tylo lander before I got one that worked (kinda) right, 2 Launches per Lander (1st Lander, then Transfer Stage).

Final writeup to follow, I will post the link (Will replace this last line with it, unless someone posts before I get it up!)

[MiniMatt]

The fully authorised 7 part novella, available by mail order and all good book stores is linked below:

There & back again - A Jool 5 Tale

(under the Eye of Kraken's all seeing gaze)

Chapter 1 - Mission & Launch

Chapter 2 - Jool arrival & Laythe

Chapter 3 - Vall

Chapter 4 - Tylo and why we hate Tylo

Chapter 5 - Pol. It's so pointy

Chapter 6 - The Bop Bounce

Chapter 7 - Home & Epilogue

Challenge specific extracts

Started in version 0.24.0, brief, buggy spell in the middle on 0.24.1, finished in version 0.24.2.

In LKO the complete vessel massed 229.8 tons, with 234 parts.

It was launched with a single launch, no refuelling trips were needed at any stage (indeed, packed way too much fuel, over 3,400dv remaining upon entering Kerbin system)

Only mod used was Kerbal Engineer Redux.

Total science gathered was 17,291, minus 525 for that gathered at the Sun, equals 16,766 at Jool (transmitted a few crew/eva reports early)

Total cost at launchpad was ~840,243.1 funds (that's in 0.24.1 prices, launch under 0.24.0 had fractionally different pricing)

Mothership delta-v breakdown

Kerbin - Jool: 2012dv

Jool - Laythe: 143dv

Laythe - Vall: 827dv

Vall - Tylo: 240dv

Tylo - Pol: 582dv

Pol - Bop: 550dv

Bop - Jool: 16dv

Jool - Kerbin: 1363dv

Total Mothership dv expended: 5,733dv

Now obviously, for future missions, I'll add at least 10% wiggle room to that total, plus at least another 700 to account for my seemingly lucky Kerbin return. And need to account for fuel taken by lander refuelling that's not seperately staged. Also need to account for mass that might be ditched along the way, such as at Laythe & Tylo. But future missions should be a lot better optimised.

It was immensely enjoyable.

Apart from Tylo.

We hate Tylo.

Edited July 30, 2014 by MiniMatt

[Ziv]

Okay, here is my Low-mass entry with a 9.983 tons ship which also made an almost Grand Tour with landing on all the other bodies too, except Eve.

Yes, on Duna and on Moho too! With an ion lander which had only 0.97 TWR at Duna!

Here's the full story...:

---

all the images of the mission:

(http://imgur.com/a/Oevfg#6)

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Edited July 31, 2014 by Ziv

[Ziv]

Ziv: Congratulations, you have finished the JOOL-5 Low-mass Challenge with 9.983 tons and with landing on Eeloo, Dres, Duna, Ike, Mun, Gilly, Moho and Minmus too, and with collecting 26213.8 science points! Well done!

Yeah, Ziv, thanks a lot! This challenge was awesome!

[Ziv]

The fully authorised 7 part novella, available by mail order and all good book stores is linked below:

There & back again - A Jool 5 Tale

(under the Eye of Kraken's all seeing gaze)

Chapter 1 - Mission & Launch

Chapter 2 - Jool arrival & Laythe

Chapter 3 - Vall

Chapter 4 - Tylo and why we hate Tylo

Chapter 5 - Pol. It's so pointy

Chapter 6 - The Bop Bounce

Chapter 7 - Home & Epilogue

Challenge specific extracts

Started in version 0.24.0, brief, buggy spell in the middle on 0.24.1, finished in version 0.24.2.

In LKO the complete vessel massed 229.8 tons, with 234 parts.

It was launched with a single launch, no refuelling trips were needed at any stage (indeed, packed way too much fuel, over 3,400dv remaining upon entering Kerbin system)

Only mod used was Kerbal Engineer Redux.

Total science gathered was 17,291, minus 525 for that gathered at the Sun, equals 16,766 at Jool (transmitted a few crew/eva reports early)

Total cost at launchpad was ~840,243.1 funds (that's in 0.24.1 prices, launch under 0.24.0 had fractionally different pricing)

Mothership delta-v breakdown

Kerbin - Jool: 2012dv

Jool - Laythe: 143dv

Laythe - Vall: 827dv

Vall - Tylo: 240dv

Tylo - Pol: 582dv

Pol - Bop: 550dv

Bop - Jool: 16dv

Jool - Kerbin: 1363dv

Total Mothership dv expended: 5,733dv

Now obviously, for future missions, I'll add at least 10% wiggle room to that total, plus at least another 700 to account for my seemingly lucky Kerbin return. And need to account for fuel taken by lander refuelling that's not seperately staged. Also need to account for mass that might be ditched along the way, such as at Laythe & Tylo. But future missions should be a lot better optimised.

It was immensely enjoyable.

Apart from Tylo.

We hate Tylo.

MiniMatt: Congratulations, you have finished the JOOL-5 on Jebediah's Level!

Wow, that's a really odd looking lander! The sole solar panel on top of the plane looks funny! And using that part for all the landing is really ... unique. I liked as you checked the ladder alignement, nice foreseeing one!

Yeah, I thought the ion tug will be a bad idea for the large Tylo lander... it was just enough for the Laythe one too. I experimented a lot with ion before my big Low-mass almost Grand Tour mission so I knew this will coming. I warned you!

And that was a nice solution after Tylo as you redocked the lander in parts...

That was a funny (and drunken) mission and a well written mission log, well done!

Thank you for participating!

[Jasonden]

.

Okay, here is my Low-mass entry with a 9.983 tons ship

Wow, dude -- awesome! Your designs and execution are exquisite. I love the landing legs and structure that you built from cube struts. But holy my goodness, what was your part count in the end? You may have set a record for lowest mass/parts ratio ever in a functional vessel

[Norcurion]

I'm speechless ZIV.

The lander with those 3 slightly diverted solar panels on each side is the single most well thought and beautiful thing i've ever seen in KSP. It looks alien.

Edited July 31, 2014 by Norcurion

[Stratzenblitz75]

Wow Ziv, this is simply incredible...

Now if you don't mind, I'm just going to gush about it...

[gush]

HOLY **** THIS IS AMAZING. I mean, less than 10 tons from Kerbin's SURFACE on a grand tour! MIND-BOGGLING!

And your designs actually look good (unlike mine lol)! Your ion lander is especially beautiful. The way you used those cubic struts and solar panels, its a work of art!

You even landed an ion lander on Duna with a TWR of less than 1 and without a parachute. Just. INCREDIBLE.

In addition, your introduction/setup for the mission was quite clever. I especially enjoyed your launch tower contraption.

The hyper optimization is REAL. I can't think of a single way to improve your design, its near perfection.

Seriously, this has to be one of the most impressive missions I have ever seen in KSP.

Fantastic work!

[/gush]

Now excuse me while I hopelessly attempt to remove my jaw from the floor.

[Oafman]

Under 10 tonnes??!

I don't even.....I mean.... I take more than 10t of monopropellant on most of my missions!

[Norcalplanner]

Really elegant, Ziv. Gamey as all heck with the massless parts as most low mass craft are, but very elegant.

[Ziv]

Thanks guys!!

Wow, dude -- awesome! Your designs and execution are exquisite. I love the landing legs and structure that you built from cube struts. But holy my goodness, what was your part count in the end? You may have set a record for lowest mass/parts ratio ever in a functional vessel

Yeah, I think it was 370 parts on the launchpad!

And your designs actually look good (unlike mine lol)! Your ion lander is especially beautiful. The way you used those cubic struts and solar panels, its a work of art!

You even landed an ion lander on Duna with a TWR of less than 1 and without a parachute. Just. INCREDIBLE.

In addition, your introduction/setup for the mission was quite clever. I especially enjoyed your launch tower contraption.

Thanks for the gush!! Yeah, I think I had some inspiration from your ion lander too (...yeah, it looks similar!). I started to design my Low-mass mission in March with the same idea (one ion lander/drive) and I was at about less than 8 tons already then chicknblender posted his 5.822 tons entry which looked unbeatable to me (except lithobraking instead of parachute at the end, but doing the same without parachute wouldn't be elegant).

so I had to find a new goal for myself, so came the idea to make most of the additional landings under 10 tons... and what I really liked about your lander design is that the solar panels are parallel so if you are on an equatorial orbit/landing (as you are 99% of the time) then they can turn to the sun at max efficiency and without blocking each other. So I used the same technique.

I decided that 6 panels are enough and a lot of batteries can hold the maximum thrust when the panels are not at 100%. In fact, I had about 300 m/s on the dark side too from the batteries.

And my mission plan was to skip Eve and Duna, because I have made some experimental landing attempt at Duna and it seemed impossible. But during the fuel planning I always added 10-20% to the steps, just to be sure. And when I arrived to Duna I have decided that I have enough fuel to get back to the spare fuel at Kerbin after a Duna landing too...

so I made about 15-20 landing attempt until I found the best initial fuel amount because too much made the lander too heavy and unable to slow before touchdown, too little made the landing sure but getting back to the ship impossible... I also had to find the best trajectory which use the most of the fine aerobraking in the atmosphere and the best vertical decent speed which can be stopped just at the peak of the mountain. It was big fun and a huge achievement at last when I was able to get back to orbit and also to dock with the main pod again!!! This meant that I can call this mission an almost Grand Tour!

And yeah, I enjoyed building the initial pictures for the mission too... there is an "easter egg" in them too

Really elegant, Ziv. Gamey as all heck with the massless parts as most low mass craft are, but very elegant.

Yess, as always! Thanks!

Edited August 1, 2014 by Ziv

[JayKay]

My 600 tonne ship is an embarrassment compared to just over 9 tonnes, but what the heck. This is my submission:

Flight of the Raven (Since everyone else is going to Jool...)

I'm not sure it meets all the criteria, but I did land 2 kerbals on each of Jool's moons without a resupply mission. Hold onto your processors, there are a lot of pictures.

JK