B9 5.0 pre-release (with download)

[Niv200]

Anyone help I cant change the tank types/ wheels, etc, (cant click the buttons of the parts, they dont appear!)

[Rayder]

Windows 7 Ultimate x64

Intel Core i7 4790k 4 Ghz

8 GB RAM

KSP v0.24.2.559

32-bit RAM usage, taken at the main menu.

3.23 GB - Standard

1.62 GB - Basic

1.31 GB - Aggressive

Sometimes the game will crash going into the VAB. This does not seem to happen running either texture plugin, so I suspect that this crash is due to hitting the RAM limit. But this has been discussed already so I thought it would just be handy to have the numbers here, if they havn't already.

So far I havn't run into any major problems. x64 seems to crash during load, but it's crashing on a squad part so I don't know what's going on there. It's already been stated that x64 is unstable at best, so I'll leave it at that. The part switching works fine. Fuel tanks swap properly and so do the textures.

The IVAs are really great. The buttons and switches look great and animations are really nice. I like the smooth button press and switch flip, particularly the backlights. It will be really great to eventually fly a ship entirely from IVA. But until there's an easy way of integrating manoeuvre nodes into the IVA, that probably won't happen.

I have no idea how I'll integrate the HX parts, but it will take a lot of creativity on my end. They look great.

Bac9, Taverius and Chris,

Whether or not people say it here, the community really appreciates the hard work that goes into mods - particularly intensely detailed ones like B9. Some people forget how much work goes into these projects, particularly when you're devoting your own free time into it. It's really impressive what you have achieved so far and I'm super excited to see the finished product in 5.1.

So keep up the good work. It's great to have people who are so dedicated to these projects, because otherwise we would be stuck with stock KSP

[K3-Chris]

32-bit RAM usage, taken at the main menu.

3.23 GB - Standard

1.62 GB - Basic

1.31 GB - Aggressive

Sometimes the game will crash going into the VAB. This does not seem to happen running either texture plugin, so I suspect that this crash is due to hitting the RAM limit. But this has been discussed already so I thought it would just be handy to have the numbers here, if they havn't already.

Yeah it's high, though to be fair we have way to more parts than stock does, at higher fidelity, you still get lowered RAM usage if you use ATM and set the configuration to not reduce texture quality, because ATM forces textures to be compressed properly, and as said -force-opengl added to a shortcut drops another 1GB.

And obviously B9 is a very large grab-bag of parts, not everyone will want to use all of it, some people don't use IVAs, they can safely remove the spaces folder, some might not want to use the spaceplane stuff and instead use the HX fusilages, can remove most of the pack, or you might only want the spaceplane part, can remove the HX folder, we don't want to split the pack into multiple downloads because that's confusing and kinda dilutes the pack as a whole.

So far I havn't run into any major problems. x64 seems to crash during load, but it's crashing on a squad part so I don't know what's going on there. It's already been stated that x64 is unstable at best, so I'll leave it at that.

I wish that other guy would take the hint, if 64bit works for you great, but we can't help you if it doesn't, might have nothing to do with our mod or the mods we rely on or the game for that matter, might just be unity deciding it'd rather not work right now.

The part switching works fine. Fuel tanks swap properly and so do the textures.

Tav spent an inordinate amount of time making sure it would, he's quite the trooper.

The IVAs are really great. The buttons and switches look great and animations are really nice. I like the smooth button press and switch flip, particularly the backlights.

Thanks, I've spent hundreds of hours on them, though obviously at least partially to use them myself, I make content I want to use and release it for others to use as well.

It will be really great to eventually fly a ship entirely from IVA. But until there's an easy way of integrating manoeuvre nodes into the IVA, that probably won't happen.

Do you have MJ? the MFDs have MJ integration, you can make, execute, modify nodes (it's a bit clunky but it works). Can also use the Smart A.S.S etc. Some people might not like MJ but I'm not aware currently of another way to tie the MFDs to maneuver nodes etc. And I think you can kinda role-play the map screen as being an MFD if that makes sense, IVA + Map should work for "IVA only" missions without MJ.

I have no idea how I'll integrate the HX parts, but it will take a lot of creativity on my end. They look great.

Yeah Bac9 has been working on those since before 4.0 release I think, I really like them and they'll be great for more ambitious projects, when assembling huge spacecraft in orbit I always end up with way too many parts, HX can really cut that down.

Though the sheer size and un-aerodynamic shapes might require you to use another mod like EL to build and assemble the parts in orbit, and the high cost is likewise a way to gate the parts to later game.

Bac9, Taverius and Chris,

Whether or not people say it here, the community really appreciates the hard work that goes into mods - particularly intensely detailed ones like B9. Some people forget how much work goes into these projects, particularly when you're devoting your own free time into it. It's really impressive what you have achieved so far and I'm super excited to see the finished product in 5.1.

So keep up the good work. It's great to have people who are so dedicated to these projects, because otherwise we would be stuck with stock KSP

Thanks for those kinds words, they help a lot, gotten pretty bummed in this thread recently mostly having basic KSP mod installation questions (most of which OP answers already...) and not actually being about the mod itself.

Anyone help I cant change the tank types/ wheels, etc, (cant click the buttons of the parts, they dont appear!)

You've most likely misplaced the firespitter plugin, did you just copy B9 from the archive and nothing else? Can't do that, only optional folder is the deprecated one.

Edited August 28, 2014 by K3|Chris

[Rayder]

I've kinda tried to stay away from MechJeb. Although it's really convenient I don't particularly like having it done for me. It feels much more rewarding to do it yourself. Now there is the debate between realism vs KSP as in real life, you will probably have a lot of automatic control and computer guidance. So it really depends on how you perceive things.

I could always just set my own limits, and use MechJeb only if I'm doing IVA roleplay stuff. I might end up just using mechjeb again anyway. I was playing on a DMP server which required it so I've kinda been getting into it again.

The curious thing with x64 was that the first time I loaded it with B9 v5.0 it worked, and was running at 2.5 GB. I was never able to reproduce that, so I'm guessing maybe B9 didn't fully load for some strange reason. I've never had my KSP so overloaded that x64 would provide any benefit, so I mostly ignore it. I posted that bit about the crash just for community awareness, in case someone else has that issue.

Can't wait to have IVAs for the other cockpits too. One thing is, the S3 supersonic cockpit really needs a camera. It doesn't have great forward visibility so a camera would be really handy.

[cy-one]

Thanks for those kinds words, they help a lot, gotten pretty bummed in this thread recently mostly having basic KSP mod installation questions (most of which OP answers already...) and not actually being about the mod itself.

I can completely second what Rayder said there, both from a "consumer" point of view and as a modder (although not in KSP and in absolutely without doubt and/or any way, shape or form to that magnitude you guys are modding here, wow).

You're doing great work and I'm very, very (add a few verys to your heart's content) glad that this mod is "back" :3

[Shadowzdestroyer]

so is this a mod that asdds some cool big thrusters?

[K3-Chris]

I've kinda tried to stay away from MechJeb. Although it's really convenient I don't particularly like having it done for me. It feels much more rewarding to do it yourself. Now there is the debate between realism vs KSP as in real life, you will probably have a lot of automatic control and computer guidance. So it really depends on how you perceive things.

I could always just set my own limits, and use MechJeb only if I'm doing IVA roleplay stuff. I might end up just using mechjeb again anyway. I was playing on a DMP server which required it so I've kinda been getting into it again.

While I understand where you're coming from I think a lot of people don't realize that MJ primarily displays information and gives you tools to process that information, you never need ask it to do anything for you, though the temptation might be hard to handle with the button to execute that manouver node is right next to the stuff you need to make it, you can lock out MJ modules like Smart A.S.S. if you want and then MJ can't control the vessel for you, just give you information. And obviously it's now integrated into the career mode so it's initially just very basic information, actual control stuff comes 3/4~ down the tree etc.

I quite like the "challenge" of manually controlling everything in a new career save, but frankly I've been playing KSP for long enough to make some of that time spent manually pointing the craft towards a maneuver node marker a bit tedious, I like using MJ to perform tasks I tell it, but I take manual control at times to be more efficient, I can dock using less RCS than MJ can, I prefer to fly spaceplanes using stocks' SAS etc.

Can't wait to have IVAs for the other cockpits too.

They're all getting IVAs, and some current IVAs are due for an overhaul (S2, Mk2) but it takes an inordianate amount of time to make them, problem is that 90% of my time making IVAs I spend re-loading the game database to see if my changes in unity line up with the in-game sight-lines and clear the kerbals massive heads etc, if I had a unity asset "puppet" kerbal that had the right dimensions, shape and was placed 1:1 where a kerbal is compared to the seat transform and had a camera on it in the right place I could turn to look around I could boost my productivity 10 fold.

One thing is, the S3 supersonic cockpit really needs a camera. It doesn't have great forward visibility so a camera would be really handy.

You didn't see the new S3 model?

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Coming in "5.1" collab between me and Tav, all B9 cockpits/pods/whatever have inbuilt cameras, (well the ones with proper B9 IVAs do, and the rest will) but I want good forwards visibility anyway, Mk2 and S2 are getting modified to improve visibility as well, S2 I'll only really have to move the floor, kerbals, props and geometry attached to the floor up to make the kerbals look out through the window instead of looking up at it (external model unchanged), Mk2 needs a bit more of a radical treatment, I need to raise the front kerbal's seat a bit, raise the canopy along with him and make the front of the canopy glass instead of metal.

Also wow just found a picture of the Mk2 IVA from 4.0:

Compare with 5.0:

(Click for full size)

Admitedly the texture quality difference is due to much lower ATM settings, but man...

Edited August 28, 2014 by K3|Chris

[Rayder]

Ah, I guess I didn't see that. I just based that observation on the download. You'll have to forgive me as I havn't read the whole thread. There's been almost 60 pages of discussion in the last week alone.

I've thought about it more and decided I'll probably end up using mechjeb again. As you said it can be used in IVA and as well I can use RemoteTech with less headaches controlling probes out in deep space. Which now I can conveniently launch because we have a new B9 version on the way

I've always wondered why that on the Mk2 parts, why the shielding texture is different on some parts than on others. The cockpit, nosecone and the bicouplers have a smooth texture, where the tanks and such have a tiled texture.

[K3-Chris]

I've always wondered why that on the Mk2 parts, why the shielding texture is different on some parts than on others. The cockpit, nosecone and the bicouplers have a smooth texture, where the tanks and such have a tiled texture.

Because Bac9 drew those tiles, by hand, you can re-use them on simpler shapes but more complex geometry you can't just wrap the tiles around and have it look good.

These 2 pictures should show what I mean:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/2f/Thermal_protection_system_inspections_from_ISS_-_Shuttle_nose.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3e/634813616_6957ab3307_o.jpg

See all those complex patterns? Yeah... We're not willing to just apply a generic tiling pattern to the parts bac9 haven't had time to do, I have other tasks in my lap but I'd like to so something halfway between bac9's completely hand-drawn approach and a more "simple" texture, take his hand-drawn patterns and apply them to parts in different sections, then join them up using more manual bits in between if that makes sense.

[MrUberGr]

Where could I get the latest version of this mod? I can only find a repack on curse, that, if you trust comments, is terrible.

[K3-Chris]

Where could I get the latest version of this mod? I can only find a repack on curse, that, if you trust comments, is terrible.

... The first post? next to the large "Download" text?

[UAL002]

Chris, or anyone else, should the 64 linux work with no issues like everything else that doesn't work on 64 win? I just ignore that statement nowadays unless it specifically says Linux as I usually have no issues. Awesome work BTW cant wait to dive back in.

[K3-Chris]

Chris, or anyone else, should the 64 linux work with no issues like everything else that doesn't work on 64 win? I just ignore that statement nowadays unless it specifically says Linux as I usually have no issues. Awesome work BTW cant wait to dive back in.

Should work fine, but none of us are *nix users as far as I'm aware, but B9 is established plugins + art assets, I don't see why it wouldn't work, and yeah mentally add "windows" to all "x64 is a minefield" stuff.

[MrUberGr]

... The first post? next to the large "Download" text?

I assumed it would lead me to the 25th of March version! Thanks.

[Rayder]

We're not willing to just apply a generic tiling pattern to the parts bac9 haven't had time to do, I have other tasks in my lap but I'd like to so something halfway between bac9's completely hand-drawn approach and a more "simple" texture

OK that makes sense. I didn't realise they were actually unfinished textures.

[CattyNebulart]

Chris, or anyone else, should the 64 linux work with no issues like everything else that doesn't work on 64 win? I just ignore that statement nowadays unless it specifically says Linux as I usually have no issues. Awesome work BTW cant wait to dive back in.

Works perfectly fine in 64 bit nix for me.

And yay for B9. Love the pack and I like the new switchable fuel tanks.

[The Space Man]

Felt like part welding a big cube. At 37247 tons i've absolutely no idea how to get it to orbit

[Grease1991]

*giggle*

To the person having issues with B9-a/SP+. They run fine for me in x86 even using parts together from both mods. with Another gig and a half of mods on top of those two.

Glad I could give you some lolz

[Taverius]

absolutely no idea how to get it to orbit

You an' me both ...

[K3-Chris]

Felt like part welding a big cube. At 37247 tons i've absolutely no idea how to get it to orbit

Cheating? Ask danny?

[Guest]

Whackjob would know how to orbit it.

[Gaalidas]

More boosters!!! It'll reach orbit if it kills us... and it will.

[How2FoldSoup]

An MHD/MPD (same thing) thruster uses magnetic fields to accelerate an ionized fluid (plasma). VASIMR is a traditional thermal rocket, using an RF emitter as a heat source instead of a chemical reaction, and using shaped magnetic fields as a virtual nozzle instead of a physical element.

In thermal rockets, ISP is dictated by combustion chamber temperature. The higher your temperature, the higher Mach number you can aerodynamically expand your exhaust up to. It's variable specific impulse because for a given electrical energy input, you can vary the temperature of the "combustion" chamber, more mass at lower temperature for high thrust, or less mass at higher temperature for high ISP.

MPD's do not use any source of chemical reaction. They ionize gas to plasma states in a very similar way to vasimr. It's semantics in how it's actually done using a RF antennae or a cathode/anode voltage potential. I promise that MPD's will also use magnetic fields as a virtual nozzle because if the plasma of either engine were to touch walls of the engine very bad things would happen. The difference between the two, as you said, is how the gas is is ionized. If you want to continue to discuss the engines let's move it to PM's because this is very OT for the b9 thread.

I didn't see a response to my last question so I am just stating that some sort of tailcargo door for the S2W body would be awesome, or some other method(maybe a cargobay with a floor that lowers down like an elevator) to bring cargo to the ground from these planes. I'm sure it's on your radar already and please don't let it get in the way of a 5.0 release.

[K3-Chris]

some sort of tailcargo door for the S2W body would be awesome

I can't visualize how that would look and work.

or some other method(maybe a cargobay with a floor that lowers down like an elevator) to bring cargo to the ground from these planes.

We've mulled ideas like that, problem is that you can't granularly control animations, if we made something like that it would extend a certain distance at a set speed, there are a host of issues with that, can be too short for the landing gear/legs and you don't get proper access, or it's too long and you beach yourself in a weird way and break something if you tip or put strain on something you didn't expect to. We've had talks about this as you can tell.

What I do have considered more serious is a HL cockpit variant that opens like a C130 galaxy, I think that'd work nicely, though it's somewhat ludicrous on a spaceplane...

I'm sure it's on your radar already and please don't let it get in the way of a 5.0 release.

Obviously not, 5.0 is in last polishing phase, we're not going to add features let alone whole new sets of parts at this point.

[How2FoldSoup]

I can't visualize how that would look and work.

We've mulled ideas like that, problem is that you can't granularly control animations, if we made something like that it would extend a certain distance at a set speed, there are a host of issues with that, can be too short for the landing gear/legs and you don't get proper access, or it's too long and you beach yourself in a weird way and break something if you tip or put strain on something you didn't expect to. We've had talks about this as you can tell.

What I do have considered more serious is a HL cockpit variant that opens like a C130 galaxy, I think that'd work nicely, though it's somewhat ludicrous on a spaceplane...

Obviously not, 5.0 is in last polishing phase, we're not going to add features let alone whole new sets of parts at this point.

The only way I've thought about it feasibly working would be to have the side "wide" edges opening out horizontally with some sort of ramp extending from the bottom(or perhaps lowering down as the underside of the tail). If I could 3d(or draw at that rate) model at all I would try and make a rough mockup to make it more clear. I've seen an example of it some where in a real plane, I'll try and find that picture to post it here. I understand it's a tough problem and I appreciate that you guys have spoken about it.

I would think the C130 hinging cockpit would have the same problems as a taildoor. As far as the elevator idea goes I always imagined it being used in tandem with some sort of infernal robotics functions, where you can choose how far to lower it. I see how that could raise issues on uneven terrain and it was more of a shot in the dark in the first place. I've tried making my own ramps that fold out using IR with an upsidedown cargobay but to no avail.

Edit: Maybe something like this

or

Edited August 28, 2014 by How2FoldSoup