[DEVTHREAD] Deep Space Exploration Vessels

[Angelo Kerman]

i don't think that i installed it wrong... but my attach points do not look anything like the ones in the video you provided...

I'll have a patch posted shortly. Meanwhile, here are the attach nodes for the Spindle:

node_stack_top = 0.0, 1.45, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 2

node_stack_hub = 0.0, 0.307, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 2

node_stack_torque = 0.0, -0.755, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 2

node_stack_bottom = 0.0, -1.45, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 2

[Angelo Kerman]

Ok latest patch to 0.3.8 is now up. This should fix the spindle issue, and it fixes an issue with the Supernova's fuel consumption during timewarp.

Get the latest version here.

[billbobjebkirk]

Here's another thing you might want to look at for inspiration: http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=31983.0

[Angelo Kerman]

Oh neat! Thanks for the link.

[Angelo Kerman]

Here's what I'm working on next:

This provides the truss assemblies for the Discovery-K and NAUTILUS-K when the mod is installed stand-alone. Config files will hide the trusses and port when Near Future Construction is installed (which gives you a better selection of parts to play with).

Edited March 12, 2015 by Angel-125

[Angelo Kerman]

Still working on the docking port, it's getting there though. Last night I conducted a successful docking. Now I just need to add some radial attachment meshes so you get some infrastructure when attached to other parts. Then the hexagonal truss segments and port will be done. I also found some new inspiration from Atomic Rockets:

This is the Bimodal NTR. I figure I can use stock LV-N modded to include a power generator, since its performance is about right. I could also give it a LANTR mode for higher thrust but lower ISP. My Homestead module will fit the bill of Transhab, and I'd just need a saddle truss and smaller tank to fit inside- Near Future Construction's 3.75m hydrogen tank will fit perfectly as the aft tank as would the Kerbodyne S3-14400. Perhaps the saddle truss accommodates a big orange tank and is akin to an exposed MK3 cargo bay...

Edited March 14, 2015 by Angel-125

[kiwiak]

Cenryfuge looks nice!

[Angelo Kerman]

Cenryfuge looks nice!

Thanks! It was a royal pain in the butt to figure out until Master Tao pointed me in the right direction. The artwork is mine but the concept comes from Zoidinfuser and Sirkut. It uses Infernal Robotics along with a plugin I created to smooth out the spin up and slow down.

I'm on a truss assembly kick, and today I finished up the HexPort and just got a 3.75m docking ring figured out. No images yet but I'm also working out the saddle truss. It will accommodate 3.75m fuel tanks, so it is slightly larger in diameter than the tanks themselves.

Edited March 16, 2015 by Angel-125

[TheSuperintendnt]

Beautiful mod you have going here! But I do have one question on the SuperNova, I'm a tad confused on its stats as your graphic(which I am aware is outdated) indicates a very different set of stats to what I see in game. So whats the correct ones? (I do have NearFuture installed)

EDIT: Just to be clear, the thrust numbers in-game are Plasma: 150 and Hydrogen: 600 vs your graphic Plasma: 600 and Hydrogen: 1800.

Edited March 15, 2015 by TheSuperintendnt

[Angelo Kerman]

Beautiful mod you have going here! But I do have one question on the SuperNova, I'm a tad confused on its stats as your graphic(which I am aware is outdated) indicates a very different set of stats to what I see in game. So whats the correct ones? (I do have NearFuture installed)

EDIT: Just to be clear, the thrust numbers in-game are Plasma: 150 and Hydrogen: 600 vs your graphic Plasma: 600 and Hydrogen: 1800.

Apologies, the stats on that graphic are quite out of date. Here's an updated graphic:

I've been pretty busy making parts for the mod that I haven't been keeping the promo images up to date. Here's what I did this weekend:

I also added in the radial bracing to the HexPort, and the saddle truss:

I'm not sure about the direction with the saddleback truss so it's on hold for now while I work on an ArcJet RCS thruster. Once the thruster is done, you'll have everything you need to build the Discovery-K!

[Sampa]

you seem to be getting very good at building mods

[TheSuperintendnt]

~snip

Indeed, I guess they were, though I'm not sure about the current stats. What was the reasoning for such a major change? It just seems...underpowered compared to other engines (heat concerns, shear size and special fuel and such). I'm sure you have a good reason (possibly realism).

On a side note, is it possible to scale the Centrifuge Hub up? It would be nice/convenient to have one for 3m at least (basically big enough that 2m parts can be used for arms) and it fits larger tanks/modules.

If there is a way of doing it with config edits, I'm willing/enjoy messing with configs I just need a point in the right direction.

[Mecripp]

Angel-125 have you seen this thread by BahamutoD http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/76841-%28RSS-RO%29-Constellation-Essentials-v1-3-1-Trusses-Engines-Adapters-%28Apr21%29 maybe some parts you can use.

[Angelo Kerman]

you seem to be getting very good at building mods

Thanks! I think I'm definitely hitting my stride and figuring out what for me makes a good part- and getting to improve my 3D art skills too. Building the mods has also challenged me to use Photoshop to make good promo images.

Indeed, I guess they were, though I'm not sure about the current stats. What was the reasoning for such a major change? It just seems...underpowered compared to other engines (heat concerns, shear size and special fuel and such). I'm sure you have a good reason (possibly realism).

On a side note, is it possible to scale the Centrifuge Hub up? It would be nice/convenient to have one for 3m at least (basically big enough that 2m parts can be used for arms) and it fits larger tanks/modules.

If there is a way of doing it with config edits, I'm willing/enjoy messing with configs I just need a point in the right direction.

I rebalanced the engine after reading more about the fusion engine in NASA's Discovery II paper. In the paper, the fusion engine that the Supernova is based upon has a thrust of 67kn and an isp of 35,000sec(!). It is heavier than the Supernova, requires more power to start, and the heat rejection is pretty similar. It was also designed for continuous thrust, which doesn't work well in KSP. So the Supernova is more in line with the NASA counterpart but accounts for KSP's game limitations. I'm not sure if it's underpowered. Compared to stock it has better ISP than the stock ion engine and far more thrust, and that's in NTR mode. ISP is through the roof in pulsed plasma mode as well. I'm building the mod with stock in mind (and yes, I know that many people install a ton of mods, myself included). So if the engine doesn't stand up to engines in other mods you use, then by all means please feel free to edit the config files.

As for the larger centrifuge, I'll have to think about how to make that work. Maybe I can keep the Spindle and create a larger hub that lets you attach 2.5m parts. That would reach the goal with only one additional part instead of three, and the 2.5m hub would be distinct enough in the catalog to be recognized as different than the current hub.

Angel-125 have you seen this thread by BahamutoD http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/76841-%28RSS-RO%29-Constellation-Essentials-v1-3-1-Trusses-Engines-Adapters-%28Apr21%29 maybe some parts you can use.

Thanks for the link. I noticed that over the weekend after doing more research on the Copernicus. I'm kind of torn between finishing the saddle and shelving it, and that mod is another point in the direction of shelving it. Also, one of my design approaches to mods is to not clutter the parts catalog. I have a lot of mods installed, and I don't like the clutter... That's why if you have Near Future Construction installed, the hexagonal trusses will be hidden. Anyway, I figure that the new stock Mk3 cargo bays serve the purpose of the truss. And while it doesn't look the same as a truss, it is Kerbal Space Program, and things are going to look different. If I keep the truss then it has to offer something unique and/or useful to make it worthwhile.

Once I finish up the ArcJet RCS Thruster and fix a couple of bugs in Multipurpose Colony Modules, I'll be back to the M.O.L.E. for a bit, then back here to work on other pieces needed for the NAUTILUS-X. I wish I could move faster on part creation but these things take awhile (and most of my free time when I'm not with my girlfriend) to do right.

Edited March 16, 2015 by Angel-125

[TheSuperintendnt]

1)improve my 3D art skills

2)Supernova

3)centrifuge

4)Copernicus

1) Indeed, you have created some high quality and stock-a-like parts and packs! (heh, I really need to learn how to use Blender! )

2)Ah ok that's what I figured, I knew it was better then the other engines but that was a major rebalanced you did . As you suggest, I'm going to tinker with the config, something that feels 'right'. (It seems more balanced then a lot of engines I've seen, (i.e Kplus's Fusion Torch for example) )

3)Darn so it isn't simple, though I don't quite understand what your thinking is on a larger Hub, could you elaborate?

4)I wouldn't shelve your version yet, I don't at the moment have many suggestions, but perhaps it could be multifunction (i.e change texture), so it has the 'saddle' look, a 'cage' look(fully encompassing), and a 'bay' look(with doors that open, slide/clam) all looks can have toggle-able solid sides. It could then fill many roles and not just be a Copernicus look-alike! Not sure if you were planing on doing the engine, as I'm not completely 'in the know' as they say on the 'real' one as well as what your plans for such were.

[Angelo Kerman]

1) Indeed, you have created some high quality and stock-a-like parts and packs! (heh, I really need to learn how to use Blender! )

2)Ah ok that's what I figured, I knew it was better then the other engines but that was a major rebalanced you did . As you suggest, I'm going to tinker with the config, something that feels 'right'. (It seems more balanced then a lot of engines I've seen, (i.e Kplus's Fusion Torch for example) )

3)Darn so it isn't simple, though I don't quite understand what your thinking is on a larger Hub, could you elaborate?

4)I wouldn't shelve your version yet, I don't at the moment have many suggestions, but perhaps it could be multifunction (i.e change texture), so it has the 'saddle' look, a 'cage' look(fully encompassing), and a 'bay' look(with doors that open, slide/clam) all looks can have toggle-able solid sides. It could then fill many roles and not just be a Copernicus look-alike! Not sure if you were planing on doing the engine, as I'm not completely 'in the know' as they say on the 'real' one as well as what your plans for such were.

With the centrifuge, what I might do is make a longer hub that takes up the entire length of the spindle. That would provide enough room to attach a 2.5m diameter part.

I will have to think about the truss more, it's a matter of fitting in with existing parts in stock but also offers something unique or fills a gap, like the 3.75m docking ring. Hm, maybe the truss has a built-in decoupler...

as for the Copernicus engines, there's a variety of different nuclear engines out there and I think the LV-N is getting ignored. Its performance is comparable to the Copernicus engine, and I have an idea about how to add the bimodal capability. A little MM sleight of hand combined with a brayton radiator...

Edited March 16, 2015 by Angel-125

[TheSuperintendnt]

I've discovered that the entire centrifuge system is 'Tweakscale-able', though it does have its limits, if 'tweaked' above 3.75 it seems to jam. I don't know the reason for that limit, I was just testing, figured if Tweakscale works on IR parts maybe it would on this.

Also (thanks to my tweakscale testing) I can tell you a 2.5m part will not fit inside the current Spindle, however if you make the new hub a larger diameter and full Spindle length it might work. However even after scaling the system to 3.75m it still barely fits a 2.5m part, I suspect this is due to the scale (1.25 to 2.5 is 2x, but 2.5 to 3.75 is only 1.5x), a full length hub and Tweakscale would make it work. The remaining flaw is there is no room for a torque ring, I assume you did have an idea for this, possibly having 2 counter-rotating centrifuges or let the SAS/RCS deal with it? I think it would be possible to add the the rescaling to the parts natively, and the hub could probably use the 'change texture' trick so then there wouldn't technically be any new parts.

The second thing I've run into is the radiators explode as soon as the Supernova's reactor starts, I have also noticed that the SystemHeat resource never changes, but I do get the standard "Overheat" bar on the engine. I should note I do have NearFuture installed and its radiators seem to prevent the "Overheat" bar from showing but I still don't see any heat.

The last think I wanted to mention was that I can't find the Hexport, I enabled your HexTruss parts (love these things, more then the NF ones) but I cant find the file for the Hexport, nor can I find the 3.75m docking ring. My assumption on these parts is they are still in-dev and thus you haven't released them yet.

[Angelo Kerman]

I've discovered that the entire centrifuge system is 'Tweakscale-able', though it does have its limits, if 'tweaked' above 3.75 it seems to jam. I don't know the reason for that limit, I was just testing, figured if Tweakscale works on IR parts maybe it would on this.

Also (thanks to my tweakscale testing) I can tell you a 2.5m part will not fit inside the current Spindle, however if you make the new hub a larger diameter and full Spindle length it might work. However even after scaling the system to 3.75m it still barely fits a 2.5m part, I suspect this is due to the scale (1.25 to 2.5 is 2x, but 2.5 to 3.75 is only 1.5x), a full length hub and Tweakscale would make it work. The remaining flaw is there is no room for a torque ring, I assume you did have an idea for this, possibly having 2 counter-rotating centrifuges or let the SAS/RCS deal with it? I think it would be possible to add the the rescaling to the parts natively, and the hub could probably use the 'change texture' trick so then there wouldn't technically be any new parts.

The second thing I've run into is the radiators explode as soon as the Supernova's reactor starts, I have also noticed that the SystemHeat resource never changes, but I do get the standard "Overheat" bar on the engine. I should note I do have NearFuture installed and its radiators seem to prevent the "Overheat" bar from showing but I still don't see any heat.

The last think I wanted to mention was that I can't find the Hexport, I enabled your HexTruss parts (love these things, more then the NF ones) but I cant find the file for the Hexport, nor can I find the 3.75m docking ring. My assumption on these parts is they are still in-dev and thus you haven't released them yet.

Radiators exploding... Ok, do you deploy the radiators before starting the fusion reactor? I haven't seen your issue before. SystemHeat will always be low to nothing if the radiators don't explode and do their jobs.

i have noticed that the spindle will need to be resized to host a larger hub that supports 2.5m attached parts. For now, what I do is attach 1.25m arms that end in 2.5m parts. See the pictures in the album for an idea

HexPort hasn't been released yet, expect an update by tomorrow. Didn't realize that the hex trusses were part of the current release. Heh. Oh well, they will be officially released soon.

Edited March 18, 2015 by Angel-125

[FreeThinker]

Your models look really nice.

Btw, I was wondering why is the Fusion engine has a maximum heat output of 1800 MW while NASA technical reports quotes the thermal power is 7895 MW.

Edited March 18, 2015 by FreeThinker

[TheSuperintendnt]

Ok so I tried adding more radiators, started with 2 then 10 then 20, every time the reactor reaches 100% charge, all of the radiators glow red for a millisecond and explode, any ideas?

Oh so that's the story with the Hexport , ok confirms my assumption, also yay new parts! On a side note as mentioned before I really like your truss pieces, they are actually proper even-sided hexagonal prisms!

[FreeThinker]

This is the Bimodal NTR. I figure I can use stock LV-N modded to include a power generator, since its performance is about right. I could also give it a LANTR mode for higher thrust but lower ISP. My Homestead module will fit the bill of Transhab, and I'd just need a saddle truss and smaller tank to fit inside- Near Future Construction's 3.75m hydrogen tank will fit perfectly as the aft tank as would the Kerbodyne S3-14400. Perhaps the saddle truss accommodates a big orange tank and is akin to an exposed MK3 cargo bay...

I think it would be easiest if you used KSPI Part Modules. I modifled the Thermal Noozles to accept multiple nozzles for a single Reactor. Also the reactor no longer has to be directly connected to the noozle. It could technically be connected by a docking port ..

[Angelo Kerman]

Ok so I tried adding more radiators, started with 2 then 10 then 20, every time the reactor reaches 100% charge, all of the radiators glow red for a millisecond and explode, any ideas?

Oh so that's the story with the Hexport , ok confirms my assumption, also yay new parts! On a side note as mentioned before I really like your truss pieces, they are actually proper even-sided hexagonal prisms!

I will have to take a look tonight and see if I can reproduce the problem. The Supernova is designed to need ten radiators and the need to be fully deployed.

@FreeThinker: the way I set up the reactor, most of the heat is rejected via the engine exhaust. The NASA paper says that the ship only deals with a portion of the total heat produced as well. For gameplay reasons I decided that you only deal with 1200mw of heat that isn't dumped through the exhaust when running at full power.

As for KSPI, this mod is designed to run stand-alone but also work with Near Future Technologies. There won't be KSPI support out of the box but you could certainly change things by modifying the config files. The Supernova probably matches up closest with that conic fusion engine.

Edited March 18, 2015 by Angel-125

[Angelo Kerman]

Well, I cannot reproduce the exploding radiators problem.

Steps to reproduce:

Create ship with 1 Supernova and 10 of the Graphene radiators.

Add enough batteries to start the Supernova.

Launch the ship

Extend all 10 radiators

Start the Supernova. Wait for the reactor to fully charge and start idling.

Expected result: radiators don't explode.

Actual result: radiators don't explode.

I did a lot of changes so it may be that the release version has the exploding radiators. Make sure that you install all of DSEV's contents.

After looking at the Spindle, I think that the best way to support radially attached 2.5m parts (aside from using extension arms) is to build a 3.75m version.

Edited March 19, 2015 by Angel-125

[Angelo Kerman]

Get the latest version here.

Be sure to completely remove the existing DSEV directory!

0.3.9A: It's Not A Jungle Gym

- Added the Hexagonal Truss. The truss segment is based on the design from NASA's Discovery II paper and is sized the same as a Near Future Construction's Octo-truss by Nertea to accommodate octo-standard 1.875m by 4m truss payloads.

- Added the Half-sized Hexagonal Truss. It is based on the design from NASA's Discovery II paper and can accommodate 1.875 by 2m truss payloads.

- Added the HexPort hexagonal docking port. It is compatible with the Clamp-O-Tron Sr. Thank you for the tips, sumghai and nil2work!

NOTE: MM configs hide the hex truss, half-hex truss, and HexPort if Near Future Construction is installed since NFC has a much better selection of parts. Delete the MM_Hex.cfg file in the DSEV folder if you still want to use them.

- Added the 3.75m docking ring.

- Added the WB-2 MHD Fusion Reactor.

- Added the RT-4 ArcJet Reaction Control Thruster. It's like a Place-Anywhere 7, but it uses LiquidFuel (LiquidHydrogen if Near Future Propulsion is installed)- and a lot of power.

- Tweaked resource densities for Glykerol and FusionPellets. Thanks Nertea for the new values!

- Parts now support Community Tech Tree if installed.

Edited March 19, 2015 by Angel-125

[Angelo Kerman]

Ok, found and fixed a couple of bugs that prevented the HexPort from working properly. Get the latest here.

By the way, any MiniAVC experts out there? I tried to get Mini AVC to work but had no luck.