[KSP v1.1.3] Stock Bug Fix Modules (Release v1.1.3b.1 - 10 Jul 16)

[Gordon Dry]

Not sure if it's because of this but I never had it before.

I got masses of
 

Spoiler

Infinity or NaN floating point numbers appear when calculating the transform matrix for a Collider. Scene hierarchy path "probeCoreOcto/SYprobe3m/SYprobe5m/SYplate7m2mX7/batteryBankLarge/xenon-25-1/IONRCSBlock/model/IONRCSBlock/block/Block_001"
 
(Filename:  Line: 171)

but I didn't recognize it then I SHIFT-clicked to move the whole vessel up in VAB, the game crashed.

I'll try it without ModuleControlSurfacePlus.dll the next time (FAR).

 

Edit:

turning off / removing the dll fixed the issue

Edited May 23, 2016 by Gordon Dry

[Claw]

15 hours ago, dave1904 said:

is there a way of disabling the control surfaces in a vacuum like in 1.05? I cant seem to find and option or have you left it out?

I removed that option in the most recent release. It was causing some issues for a few folks, so I've removed it for the time being.

 

2 hours ago, tater said:

Is there a way to make landing legs not explode if you bump into them on EVA?

That's actually backwards from what I usually hear. Not the exploding part...but that kerbals usually ragdoll when touching a leg or wheel.

We are looking at the wheels and landing legs. Unfortunately it's looking like a unity upgrade will be needed. There were some fundamental changes to the way PhysX and Unity handle wheels, and the downside is that they are a bit less flexible than they used to be.

 

1 hour ago, Gordon Dry said:

Change the StockBugFixPlusController from .cfg to .xml or something

Possibly. I'll have to add that to the list of things to look into.

 

6 minutes ago, Gordon Dry said:

Not sure if it's because of this but I never had it before.

Please do let me know if you track it down. I certainly don't want to be causing any crashes.  

[funk]

I've an issue which might be related to the bodylift fix or the LY-35 landing gear.

Issue: When entering the atmosphere from space, the LY-35 landing gear creates somehow weird bodylift and negative drag even high in atmosphere. The gears cannot be deployed. In space all is working fine.

Workaround: Quicksave -> Quickload... helps sometimes and the gears can be deployed. Maybe I'm paranoid, but it seems to be related to the orientation of the craft.

How is determined if the gears are blocked?

I haven't had this issue in 1.1, yet. Clipping shouldn't be a problem, because of tests and on other crafts clipped wheels don't have this issue atm.

Log doesn't show any errors. If I can help to investigate, anyone tips where to start?

Edited May 23, 2016 by funk

[Claw]

8 minutes ago, funk said:

I've an issue which might be related to the bodylift fix or the LY-35 landing gear.

Well, the body lift fix only forces the game to reload the body lift. It's really not doing any fiddling behind telling the game "hey, you forgot to load this."

But aside from that, I agree that the lift lines are looking waaaay off. Is that landing gear the root of the craft? (I ask because the root of the craft has some special considerations for drag cubes.)

Also, that's looking like all stock parts. Can you upload the craft?

[funk]

12 minutes ago, Claw said:

Well, the body lift fix only forces the game to reload the body lift. It's really not doing any fiddling behind telling the game "hey, you forgot to load this."

But aside from that, I agree that the lift lines are looking waaaay off. Is that landing gear the root of the craft? That's looking like all stock parts. Can you upload the craft?

craftfile

The landing gear isn't the rootpart.

Edit: the craft is still work in progress, so there might be some issues by design .

Edited May 23, 2016 by funk

[tater]

7 hours ago, Claw said:

IThat's actually backwards from what I usually hear. Not the exploding part...but that kerbals usually ragdoll when touching a leg or wheel.

We are looking at the wheels and landing legs. Unfortunately it's looking like a unity upgrade will be needed. There were some fundamental changes to the way PhysX and Unity handle wheels, and the downside is that they are a bit less flexible than they used to be.

EVA, bump into gear... you'll rag doll, all right, after the gear explode and send you tumbling away from the craft at 50 m/s.

If this is a unity problem they should not have "upgraded," it has me not playing at all since I discovered this.

Edited May 23, 2016 by tater

[Ruedii]

I found the symmetry highlighting very useful.

However, if it's too much work to port over, don't bother.  I can live without it and it's not a high priority.

I would rather see a tweak-able added to control radial flap behavior.

[Claw]

3 hours ago, Ruedii said:

I would rather see a tweak-able added to control radial flap behavior.

I've already put a toggle in there that allows you to flip direction individually. So you can place via symmetry and toggle them the way you'd like.

[tater]

Looks like the kerbal-landing leg interaction is limited to Linux/MacOS.

[Ser]

Since we just have got our mods slowly rise from the ash, hail the new Unity update

Claw, it seems like EVA ejection bug is back. Is it in the scope of your fixes or should I try to implement it myself as a separate one?

 

[Tarheel1999]

21 hours ago, tater said:

Looks like the kerbal-landing leg interaction is limited to Linux/MacOS.

Nope. Happens to me on Win10

[Ruedii]

On 5/23/2016 at 0:47 PM, Claw said:

I've already put a toggle in there that allows you to flip direction individually. So you can place via symmetry and toggle them the way you'd like.

They still deploy in symmetry?

[Claw]

4 hours ago, Ruedii said:

They still deploy in symmetry?

Yes, but the direction can be changed both for the entire group and individuals.

[Rushligh]

just though i'd let you know; your lifting surface patch seem to interfere with a ton of other mods

[Ruedii]

9 hours ago, Claw said:

Yes, but the direction can be changed both for the entire group and individuals.

Thanks.

On to the next question, can you add a function to adjust wheels to increase the maximum damper multiplier in the damper tweak and add steering multiplier and steering response time adjusters?   This would make wheels a LOT more usable, especially on small vehicles.

[Deimos Rast]

On 5/26/2016 at 11:22 PM, Rushligh said:

just though i'd let you know; your lifting surface patch seem to interfere with a ton of other mods

You should probably be a little more specific. I've run this with a ton of other mods with no lift issues in particular (under stock aero).

@Claw

Any chance for an even simpler explanation of the below RSAS tweakables? I'm probably just being dense, but fiddling with the values in game made little difference, except during a blazing reentry, when I absolutely needed SAS to hold retrograde, and it was definitely not the time be fiddling (I set them all to the lowest values thinking it would tamp things down a bit, but it freaked out when it couldn't reach the retrograde marker due to air resistance). Anyway, much appreciated.

Cheers.

         -- The "Plus" tweakable options are available in the right-click menu of the first pod/probe core.
          -- "Min Response" sets the lowest reaction response from the RSAS ("how far" is the initial move)
          -- "Min Clamp" sets the lowest clamp value (how much reaction) as the RSAS nears it's target.
          -- "Threshold" sets the angular speed where clamp and response values start to adjust.

 

[StevieC]

This mod seems to be conflicting with KIS & KAS, rendering them virtually unusable.

[Gryphon]

8 hours ago, StevieC said:

This mod seems to be conflicting with KIS & KAS, rendering them virtually unusable.

Which part of it, and with what symptoms? This mod is actually a collection of smaller modlets. For example, I am using GameSettingsPlus and PilotRSASFix.

In the KIS thread, you said:

On 5/26/2016 at 2:05 PM, StevieC said:

I can't add parts from Angel-125's Buffalo parts-pack to inventory, nor can I add any of the DMagic Orbital Science parts to inventory anymore either. In the case of the Buffalo parts-pack that's a serious problem 'cuz one of its touted features is that you can put its "JetWing" into inventory, and now I can't do that anymore.

Is that the symptoms you are referring to?

[StevieC]

that is precisely the issue I am referring to. I want to use the Body Lift modlet but still use KIS and KAS

[Gordon Dry]

Could it be that the ModuleControlSurfacePlus conflicts with AmpYear TurnBooster and/or MechJeb ?

[Claw]

If you guys could post log snippets, that would help out a lot. It's hard to tell what might be happening without them, but with them it's (usually) pretty quick.

On 5/29/2016 at 2:34 AM, Deimos Rast said:

Any chance for an even simpler explanation of the below RSAS tweakables?

Sure.

When the craft is bumped from it's target orientation or the target changes (the blue line above), the SAS has a certain amount of "reaction" that it tries to do. That's indicated by the starting slope of the curves above (red, green, and black). That initial "how much to try to correct" is essentially controlled by the "Min Response." It's important to note that even if you made the Min Response something really high, it wouldn't necessarily make the SAS "stronger." The same amount of authority (torque, RCS, etc) is there. It's just how fast it initially gets applied. So turning Min Response down can make smaller craft less jittery, because the SAS is less aggressive about the correction.

"Min Clamp" controls how much the SAS is allowed to wiggle around as it's getting close to the target. This sort of acts like a "you can make corrections, but not toooo much" when it's close to the target. Thereby (hopefully) limiting overshoots for the target, and reducing oscillations/bouncing around.

The "Threshold" number is a setting that checks angular speed (how fast the thing is turning) for when to start applying the RSAS dynamic adjustments. Above this speed, the stock SAS "rules" apply. Below that, the RSAS fixes begin to tune the SAS values to help dampen down vibrations and bouncing due to SAS. There are still some cases where it doesn't help. Namely single MK1 pods (or pod with very few parts) because there's an error in the stock code that this modelet can't get to.

Hopefully that helps.

 

On 5/26/2016 at 10:26 PM, Ruedii said:

can you add a function to adjust wheels to increase the maximum damper multiplier in the damper tweak and add steering multiplier and steering response time adjusters?

Damper is probably pretty easy, but I'll have to look into the steering. The steering is stored as a curve, so it can be a little trickier to manipulate via tweakable.

 

3 hours ago, StevieC said:

that is precisely the issue I am referring to. I want to use the Body Lift modlet but still use KIS and KAS

If you just want the body lift modlet, you can delete everything else except the BodyLiftFix.dll. This particular fix does not require the stock plus controller (or anything else in the download). It would probably also help me out if you have a log snipped of the issue.

[Deimos Rast]

2 hours ago, Gordon Dry said:

Could it be that the ModuleControlSurfacePlus conflicts with AmpYear TurnBooster and/or MechJeb ?

ControlSurfacePlus as far as I know, is just tweakables for ailerons/spoilers and such for planes (or if not, it's limited to them).

AmpYear's TurnBooster, I believe, is limited to Reaction Wheels only. As JPLRepo mentioned, it feeds more power to the RX Wheel, increasing its strength.

MechJeb does not, I do not believe, touch control surfaces, mainly gimbals, RCS, and RX Wheels. It might though, not 100% on this one, but unlikely. I know most atmospheric pilots use a PID tuner over MechJeb (e.g. Kramax or Pilot Assistant).

Without more details, I would offer a tentative: No.

[fourfa]

2 hours ago, Claw said:

"Min Clamp" controls how much the SAS is allowed to wiggle around as it's getting close to the target. This sort of acts like a "you can make corrections, but not toooo much" when it's close to the target. Thereby (hopefully) limiting overshoots for the target, and reducing oscillations/bouncing around.

Wouldn't hurt to use the term 'hysteresis' here, that's the precise term you'd use in engineering control systems.  I had to read the explanation here to get what "clamp" meant

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hysteresis#Control_systems

[Crzyrndm]

6 hours ago, Deimos Rast said:

MechJeb does not, I do not believe, touch control surfaces, mainly gimbals, RCS, and RX Wheels. It might though, not 100% on this one, but unlikely. I know most atmospheric pilots use a PID tuner over MechJeb (e.g. Kramax or Pilot Assistant).

1) MJ operates on the same basis (PID controller(s)) as Pilot Assistant. PA just uses a few more of them (because 18 months ago I found that a single controller didn't give the smooth & precise behaviour I wanted) and is manually tuned (I prefer to have some interaction with the control setup, even if flight is automated)
2) Neither MJ (AFAIK) or PA interact directly with any part that controls vessel orientation. They just give control inputs to the vessel which are then interpreted appropriately by control surfaces/gimbals/RCS/reaction wheels.

[Bishop149]

 

On 5/29/2016 at 5:54 PM, StevieC said:

This mod seems to be conflicting with KIS & KAS, rendering them virtually unusable.

I can confirm this, I can't put parachutes into KIS containers, trying triggers an NRE.

I pinned this mod down as the source of an this issue, I'm guessing because it edits the stock parachutes.

Issue persists even if all the stock plus options are disabled.