Realism Overhaul Discussion Thread

[viktor19]

But how do RCS engines consume the fuel? Do they use capillaries?

Monopropellant, usually hydrazine for simplicity and reliability (we don't have that problems in RO), is stored inside a pressurized container (service module or probe core in RO). On command, valve opens and fuel flows over the catalyst. With catalyst, fuel rapidly decomposes and produces net thrust.

[NathanKell]

They use either bladder tanks (to separate the propellant from the pressurant) or funky surface-tension based things that keep propellant near the feedlines.

[Cleric2145]

Can you paste in the contents of your ModuleManager.Physics file? Sounds like you may not have the right settings there.

Sorry for the absence of reply. I was away from a computer for two weeks.

dragMultiplier = 8
dragCubeMultiplier = 0.1
angularDragMultiplier = 2
liftMultiplier = 0.036
liftDragMultiplier = 0.015
bodyLiftMultiplier = 18
aeroFXScalar = 0.00004
aeroFXDensityExponent = 0.7
aeroFXStartThermalFX = 2.5
aeroFXFullThermalFX = 3.5
aeroFXExponent = 4.0
thermalMaxIntegrationWarp = 100
spaceTemperature = 4
solarLuminosityAtHome = 1360
solarInsolationAtHome = 0.15
convectionDensityExponent = 0.5
convectionVelocityExponent = 3.0
convectionFactorSplashed = 5000
fullConvectionAreaMin = -0.1
fullToCrossSectionLerpStart = 0.8
fullToCrossSectionLerpEnd = 1.5
machConvectionStart = 2
machConvectionEnd = 4.0
machConvectionExponent = 3
turbulentConvectionStart = 100
turbulentConvectionEnd = 400
turbulentConvectionMult = 25
machTemperatureScalar = 7.5
machTemperatureVelocityExponent = 0.75
partEmissivityExponent = 4
radiationFactor = 1
convectionFactor = 1.1
newtonianConvectionFactorBase = 4.0
newtonianConvectionFactorTotal = 1.0
newtonianDensityExponent = 0.5
newtonianVelocityExponent = 1.0
conductionFactor = 5
internalHeatProductionFactor = 0.025
aerodynamicHeatProductionFactor = 1.0
standardSpecificHeatCapacity = 800
skinSkinConductionFactor = 0.06
skinInteralConductionFactor = 0.25
shieldedConductionFactor = 0.01
DRAG_TIP
{
	key = 0 1 0 0
	key = 25 1 0 0
}
DRAG_SURFACE
{
	key = 0 0.02 0 0
	key = 0.85 0.02 0 0
	key = 0.9 0.0152439 -0.07942077 -0.07942077
	key = 1.1 0.0025 -0.005279571 -0.001936768
	key = 2 0.002083333 -2.314833E-05 -2.314833E-05
	key = 5 0.003333333 -0.000180556 -0.000180556
	key = 25 0.001428571 -7.14286E-05 0
}
DRAG_TAIL
{
	key = 0 1 0 0
	key = 0.85 1 0 0
	key = 1.1 0.25 -0.02215106 -0.02487721
	key = 1.4 0.22 -0.03391732 -0.03391732
	key = 5 0.15 -0.001198566 -0.001198566
	key = 25 0.14 0 0
}
DRAG_MULTIPLIER
{
	key = 0 0.5 0 0
	key = 0.85 0.5 0 0
	key = 1.1 1.3 0 -0.008100224
	key = 2 0.7 -0.1104858 -0.1104858
	key = 5 0.6 0 0
	key = 10 0.85 0.02198264 0.02198264
	key = 14 0.9 0.007694946 0.007694946
	key = 25 0.95 0 0
}
DRAG_CD
{
	key = 0.05 0.0025 0.15 0.15
	key = 0.15 0.0225 0.3 0.3
	key = 0.25 0.0625 0.5 0.5
	key = 0.35 0.1225 0.7 0.7
	key = 0.45 0.2025 0.9 0.9
	key = 0.55 0.3025 1.1 1.1
	key = 0.65 0.4225 1.3 1.3
	key = 0.75 0.5625 1.5 1.5
	key = 0.8 0.66 2.3775 2.3775
	key = 0.85 0.8 2.733777 2.733777
	key = 0.9 0.89 1.1 1.1
	key = 1 1 1 1
}
LIFTING_SURFACE_CURVES
{
	LIFTING_SURFACE
	{
		name = Default
		lift
		{
			key = 0 0 0 1.965926
			key = 0.258819 0.5114774 1.990092 1.905806
			key = 0.5 0.9026583 0.7074468 -0.7074468
			key = 0.7071068 0.5926583 -2.087948 -1.990095
			key = 1 0 -2.014386 -2.014386
		}
		liftMach
		{
			key = 0 1 0 0
			key = 0.3 0.5 -1.671345 -0.8273422
			key = 1 0.125 -0.0005291355 -0.02625772
			key = 5 0.0625 0 0
			key = 25 0.05 0 0
		}
		drag
		{
			key = 0 0.01 0 0
			key = 0.3420201 0.06 0.1750731 0.1750731
			key = 0.5 0.24 2.60928 2.60928
			key = 0.7071068 1.7 3.349777 3.349777
			key = 1 2.4 1.387938 0
		}
		dragMach
		{
			key = 0 0.35 0 -0.8463008
			key = 0.15 0.125 0 0
			key = 0.9 0.275 0.541598 0.541598
			key = 1.1 0.75 0 0
			key = 1.4 0.4 -0.3626955 -0.3626955
			key = 1.6 0.35 -0.1545923 -0.1545923
			key = 2 0.3 -0.09013031 -0.09013031
			key = 5 0.22 0 0
			key = 25 0.3 0.0006807274 0
		}
	}
	LIFTING_SURFACE
	{
		name = BodyLift
		lift
		{
			key = 0 0 0 1.975376
			key = 0.309017 0.5877852 1.565065 1.565065
			key = 0.5877852 0.9510565 0.735902 0.735902
			key = 0.7071068 1 0 0
			key = 0.8910065 0.809017 -2.70827 -2.70827
			key = 1 0 -11.06124 0
		}
		liftMach
		{
			key = 0.3 0.167 0 0
			key = 0.8 0.167 0 -0.3904104
			key = 1 0.125 -0.0005291355 -0.02625772
			key = 5 0.0625 0 0
			key = 25 0.05 0 0
		}
		drag
		{
			key = 0 0 0 0
		}
		dragMach
		{
			key = 0 0 0 0
		}
	}
	LIFTING_SURFACE
	{
		name = SpeedBrake
		lift
		{
			key = 0 0 0 0
		}
		liftMach
		{
			key = 0 0 0 0
		}
		drag
		{
			key = 0 0.01 0 0
			key = 0.3420201 0.06 0.1750731 0.1750731
			key = 0.5 0.24 2.60928 2.60928
			key = 0.7071068 1.7 3.349777 3.349777
			key = 1 2.4 1.387938 0
		}
		dragMach
		{
			key = 0 0.35 0 -0.8463008
			key = 0.15 0.125 0 0
			key = 0.9 0.275 0.541598 0.541598
			key = 1.1 0.75 0 0
			key = 1.4 0.4 -0.3626955 -0.3626955
			key = 1.6 0.35 -0.1545923 -0.1545923
			key = 2 0.3 -0.09013031 -0.09013031
			key = 5 0.22 0 0
			key = 25 0.3 0.0006807274 0
		}
	}
}

[Sharkman Briton]

Not sure if this question fits here but I'll ask anyway: Does SMURFF make engines just as useful in terms of getting into orbit in RSS was RO does?

[NathanKell]

Ok, that looks ok...

Sharkman Briton: Yep. Though you're better off asking on the SMURFF thread, not the "thing you use instead of SMURFF" thread

[Teilnehmer]

I’d like to have some throttlable hypergolic radial engines. Which mod could you recommend?

[kmwright5]

Can't upgrade buildings in career mode! I just install ckan. So thankful for that getting made. I used that to install Real Solar System and Realism Overhaul. Everything works great except the buildings. Anyone know what this could be?

[federicoaa]

Hi. I noticed that remote tech and scansat show charge consumption in units/s instead of watts. Is there an easy way to add a config file to modify this?

[NathanKell]

Nope, that would be in the plugins.

[Sharkman Briton]

Help finding the 'clues'?

[boosters++]

Hi everyone - I was wondering what the relevant differences are between restartable and non-restartable engines.

For example, if I wanted to mod an existing engine in-game to make a new restartable version, what else should I change about the engine to make that improvement plausible? For example: increased mass, etc.

[Sharkman Briton]

Sorry, I have no clue about that, just wanted to say I hope someone can answer it.

[Phineas Freak]

To all people that made the Solar System experience real for KSP! There is no way that i can manage to even try and play stock - sized KSP again...

Keep up the good work lads!

And something that Rothank over at the RP-0 thread motivated me to post since i have been working on it for a while. It is not perfect by any way and there are many things left for improvement...

Spoiler

 

(Images are a courtesy of Kronal Vessel Viewer)

Edited May 21, 2016 by Phineas Freak

[NathanKell]

Phineas Freak, those are some truly awesome recreations!

boosters++: Depends on the engine. Pressure-fed hypergolics are fairly simple, you just get a set of valves capable of being opened and closed multiple times. So cost and a tiny bit extra mass. For pump-fed engines it's rather more complex.

[Sharkman Briton]

Any places I should go 'egg hunting'? Apart from the great lake flying.

[SegmentationViolation]

I know real reaction wheels have less torque and spin up, but does it make sense that in RO a reaction wheel with nothing attached floating in free space is not capable of producing any visible rotation at all? I would appreciate it if you try launching only a command module and hyper-edit it into orbit and try it out and let me know if you can rotate it, by itself, with nothing attached.

[Rabada]

I know real reaction wheels have less torque and spin up, but does it make sense that in RO a reaction wheel with nothing attached floating in free space is not capable of producing any visible rotation at all? I would appreciate it if you try launching only a command module and hyper-edit it into orbit and try it out and let me know if you can rotate it, by itself, with nothing attached.

Reaction wheels work fine for me. Which command module did you try this with? If I recall correctly Realism Overhaul removes the reaction wheels from the stock command modules and you have to add a seperate reaction wheel part.

[NathanKell]

Correct.

Also, even as they are they're still quite OP compared to reality. We underestimated the current draw significantly.

[SegmentationViolation]

Oh, I didn't know about the separate reaction wheel parts. I will have to look for them tonight. I was using RC-L01 control module. While Im here, can you tell me if RO affects microwave transmission, and if so could you point me to any info about how?

Thanks a lot!

[Svm420]

Have you all considered semi saturable reaction wheels? It does allow fully saturable reaction wheels as well, though if you go that far you'll want persistent rotation so you don't lose torque when engaging time warp. It can even be configured to allow torque recovery with a special module that is added to Rws. The module, a derivative of ModuleRCS will drain RCS fuel and electricity, also entirely configurable via a cfg file, to simulate spinning down with RCS though doing so doesn't impart forces on the vessel it just allows torque recovery for resource expenditure. I know I couldn't use RWs without the mod they truly are magic otherwise

[NathanKell]

Svm420: It's one of RO's recommended mods, actually.

[Motokid600]

So when the time comes for my next RSS/RO play through I want to try something different. Instead of using the fuel tanks as they are I want to make my own. Separate fuel and oxidizer tanks using procedural parts housed in a procedural fairing acting as the walls.

What I want to know is what is the absolute easiest way to calculate the fuel to oxidizer ratio for a given engine or cluster of engines. With so many engine and fuel combinations... Where do I even start?

Also what's the best way to go about making sure the dry mass is correct or... Realistic I want to say. Because I'm not necessarily going to go for replicas. If that's the case I can just look up how much fuel they used and the dry mass. But for custom builds I'm worried I wont be able to get the dry mass right with the procedural fairing walls and the inner tanks them selves.

For starters what's a good utilization setting for when I'm building the inner tanks? 99%?

[davidy12]

What Easter eggs are in rss?

[Hattivat]

Also what's the best way to go about making sure the dry mass is correct or... Realistic I want to say. Because I'm not necessarily going to go for replicas. If that's the case I can just look up how much fuel they used and the dry mass. But for custom builds I'm worried I wont be able to get the dry mass right with the procedural fairing walls and the inner tanks them selves.

For starters what's a good utilization setting for when I'm building the inner tanks? 99%?

You will have to experiment and compare your results with real-world examples. My guess would be: Balloon tanks at ~95% utilization.

[NathanKell]

Yeah, I'd second hattivat here, but even that might not be enough, fairing walls can be heavy.