Devnote Tuesday: "Point sharp end towards space"

[Franklin]

exciting notes, last few weeks' have been bangers. the next couple updates are gonna be somethin

[StrandedonEarth]

Further to making the "Engineer's Report" be generated on demand via button-press: Call it a "Critical Design Review" or "Flight Readiness Review" and charge a few roots for it, maybe by mass or part count or some funtion of both! The "Engineer's Report" can be the basic KER-type readout of TWR, dV, and burn time per stage. Want to find out if your 500kroot JoolTour monster is missing something? Shell out another 20k for an FRR!

[Paulestrada]

I love KSP, and for me is the best game, but I think Squad rushed their decision to release the game in the next update.

I think it will be a good idea to make a final "beta" update containing all the final features, and let the community test them, We will give feedback to improve those features, and make the KSP 1.0 more polished.

Hope Squad is doing the right thing.

Paul.

[Sidereus]

Interestingly, KER includes a setting to reduce the update frequency on more modest processors. Adjusting this made a noticeable difference on my old potato-PC, the simulation code can be non-trivial for complex craft on weaker machines.

Yeah....KER causes massive lag on my computer when I try to use the O-10 monopropellant engine. I guess it really doesn't like dealing with something that has essentially infinite thrust...

[NoMrBond]

Yeah....KER causes massive lag on my computer when I try to use the O-10 monopropellant engine. I guess it really doesn't like dealing with something that has essentially infinite thrust...

If you turn off its physicsless flag, do you still get the lag?

[boredAnswerGuy]

Real-time engineering checks may be inappropriate while the vehicle is unfinished.

If engineering checks are performed on a continual basis, the first part placed will trigger a huge list of warnings. Almost none of these warnings will go away until the vehicle is nearly finished. Virtually every engineering check except for the final check will have been a waste.

Consider that every sentence is grammatically incorrect until the final word is written. Every word is misspelled until the final letter is written. Proof-readers check finished manuscripts. They do not watch the writer type and scrutinize his or her every keystroke.

The engineering check feature certainly would have helped me avoid at least one failed launch, and such failures are costly in career mode. I think that the basic idea is good and helpful, but constant checking may not be a good choice.

Edited February 12, 2015 by boredAnswerGuy

[Padishar]

Yeah....KER causes massive lag on my computer when I try to use the O-10 monopropellant engine. I guess it really doesn't like dealing with something that has essentially infinite thrust...

No, this is because there is a bug in KER making it spam stuff to the output_log.txt constantly. This should have been fixed in the latest version (1.0.15.0) but it appears that it may not have been so there will probably be another release very soon.

[monstah]

My complaint on the automatic engineer's report wasn't mainly about the lag, but about the annoyance. I'm imagining the Kerbal Paper Clip, Spode forbid.

I know trust Squad knows better, but, just in case... please, no!

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Another thing: what I love the most about KER, currently, is not the DV readings themselves, but the nice configurable HUDs.

THOSE ARE AWESOME.

REALLY.

[Robotengineer]

My complaint on the automatic engineer's report wasn't mainly about the lag, but about the annoyance. I'm imagining the Kerbal Paper Clip, Spode forbid.

I know trust Squad knows better, but, just in case... please, no!

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Another thing: what I love the most about KER, currently, is not the DV readings themselves, but the nice configurable HUDs.

THOSE ARE AWESOME.

REALLY.

You don't want Delty the Delta-vee calculator?

[Renegrade]

Just adding my voice here to the "I use docking mode" chorus. It's actually rather useful. I hope these changes don't ruin it (they don't sound like they would, but you never know)....

(also worried about chase cam changes, but I've already created a thread for that)

[JimmyAgent007]

I also use docking mode. For docking even! Never heard of there being a lack of people using it.

[klgraham1013]

I don't use docking mode.

[Norpo]

I don't use docking mode.

Nor do I, I don't even know what it does.

[Robotengineer]

I don't use docking mode.

I've used it for building 2 wheeled segway rovers. That's about it.

[FlowerChild]

Well is that realistic? Would Jool's atmosphere REALLY bring the efficiency to zero?

No no, not at all realistic, and that wasn't what I was going for with it either (as Stormweaver mentioned it's about gameplay constraints in the case of BTSM, not realism). Was just providing a syntax example of how you can edit the curves, not suggesting you should use those particular numbers.

Realism doesn't always equate to harder, and I tend to be more inclined towards progression and challenge than realism. Having engines cut out in the atmosphere of Eve for example may not be at all realistic, but it does make for some interesting gameplay, and is roughly analogous to the difficulties one would experience in exploring Venus.

I also think that what is more or less realistic is often a matter of perspective with games. For example, with the above is it more realistic for engines to behave as they would at the specific atmospheric pressure of Eve, or is it more realistic for them to behave as one would expect in the analogue to Eve (Venus), in the consensus reality? Is it more realistic to have a delta V display because earth scientists would have one, or less realistic because we have to deal with far fewer problems than earth scientists would in other regards, so the increase in difficulty of not having one makes the overall experience more realistic by bringing it closer to the difficulty level of the real thing?

To me anyways, it's not always clear what makes things more or less realistic as a result, especially when you're dealing with something in relation to a whole other whack of abstractions already within the game, so I just go for whatever makes things more interesting and fun

Edited February 12, 2015 by FlowerChild

[cantab]

Regarding Eve, don't assume the surface pressure will stay the same! Squad could well increase it to something more akin to Venus, to retain the challenge of launching from it.

Heck, while it doesn't seem very likely, it's possible the size of planets and orbits will change too.

[FlowerChild]

Regarding Eve, don't assume the surface pressure will stay the same! Squad could well increase it to something more akin to Venus, to retain the challenge of launching from it.

Heck, while it doesn't seem very likely, it's possible the size of planets and orbits will change too.

Yup, I'm not making any assumptions about where things are going in the future, but given we don't know, I think the current values act as our only common frame of reference to talk about things

However it's handled, I do think having the impact of pressure beyond 1 atm on engines makes for a more interesting game and would be a cool addition to the thrust corrector that Squad is putting in.

Edited February 12, 2015 by FlowerChild

[Wjolcz]

Further to making the "Engineer's Report" be generated on demand via button-press: Call it a "Critical Design Review" or "Flight Readiness Review" and charge a few roots for it, maybe by mass or part count or some funtion of both! The "Engineer's Report" can be the basic KER-type readout of TWR, dV, and burn time per stage. Want to find out if your 500kroot JoolTour monster is missing something? Shell out another 20k for an FRR!

Thats actually pretty cool idea. I would like to pay some extra monies to someone who could calculate all this stuff for me. Those kerbal scientist arent paid in candies after all, are they?

E: On the chase cam topic: if the new mode just gets added then its fine. If the old one's getting changed then it kinda sucks. Its mandatory if you want to dock in space without bumping into your station.

Edited February 12, 2015 by Veeltch

[NoMrBond]

Its mandatory if you want to dock in space without bumping into your station.

Yes it would be nice to keep the existing Chase cam mode as well

Maybe call the existing one Fixed Chase and the new one Vector Chase or something? Those doesn't exactly roll off the tongue there, but I'm sure someone can come up with a better names for them

[CaLVin-K]

Further to making the "Engineer's Report" be generated on demand via button-press: Call it a "Critical Design Review" or "Flight Readiness Review" and charge a few roots for it, maybe by mass or part count or some funtion of both! The "Engineer's Report" can be the basic KER-type readout of TWR, dV, and burn time per stage. Want to find out if your 500kroot JoolTour monster is missing something? Shell out another 20k for an FRR!

I don't think this would be a good idea. This would make it disproportionately harder to use for those who need it most, new players, who are unlikely to have spare funds lying around to take advantage of this.

What I think it should be is a button up at the top that is optional to select, however when you press launch a window would pop up informing you of this option, maybe with an arrow pointing at the engineers report button, the window would include a brief description of what the engineers report does and recommends new players take advantage of it, as well as an option to ignore it and launch anyway. The window should also include a "don't remind me again" button similar to what happens the fist time you use physics time warp. If you don't select this button then the reminder should pop up every time you hit launch.

[Sidereus]

If you turn off its physicsless flag, do you still get the lag?

I haven't tried it. I don't use it often, and occasionally it's fun to exploit. I just turn off KER until I need to know my dV.

No, this is because there is a bug in KER making it spam stuff to the output_log.txt constantly. This should have been fixed in the latest version (1.0.15.0) but it appears that it may not have been so there will probably be another release very soon.

It may have been fixed. I haven't tried using it since I installed 1.0.15.0.

ETA: I just went back over the change notes, since it notified me that there was new version out when I launched the game (1.0.15.2) and I went to download it. They did supposedly fix it in 1.0.15.0. 1.0.15.2 apparently fixes a mistake in some of the resource mass calculations that was introduced in 1.0.15.0

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Just adding my voice here to the "I use docking mode" chorus. It's actually rather useful. I hope these changes don't ruin it (they don't sound like they would, but you never know)....

(also worried about chase cam changes, but I've already created a thread for that)

I also use docking mode. For docking even! Never heard of there being a lack of people using it.

I don't use docking mode.

I used to use docking mode, until I figured out that it's just as easy to use the translate buttons in staging mode, once I'd figured them out. Maybe easier...sometimes when things are really misaligned, it's easier for me to get them back in alignment with staging mode because I don't have to constantly flip between translate and rotational modes (which sometimes causes me to forget which mode I'm in, screwing things up even more ).

Edited February 13, 2015 by Sidereus

[federicoaa]

If you are going to create a new character to show the engineer reports (like werner in the archives) please please call him Klipo Kerman XD

[Bill Phil]

If you are going to create a new character to show the engineer reports (like werner in the archives) please please call him Klipo Kerman XD

What about Scott? It's a double reference!

[Sidereus]

What about Scott? It's a double reference!

Heh. I second this.

I'm a little surprised how well known Scott Manley is. Yesterday I was watching Hank Green's

video where he tries to land on the Mun. He was doing poorly and lamented about what Scott must think about his piloting skills. XD

[KerbMav]

What about Scott? It's a double reference!

Oh yes please!