sdj64

The Ultimate Jool 5 Challenge!

1027 posts in this topic

Okay so on the topic of clipping. The intent of the rule is obviously to prevent stuff like this from being submitted, but what's the consensus on things like these?

http://i.imgur.com/JKv6Kz4m.png http://i.imgur.com/rINp4rCm.png http://i.imgur.com/kt5xwsD.png

Please tell me they're okay, or at least close! I assure you that there's nothing clipped in addition to what's visible here, just a bit of "mushing" tanks so the thing fits where it needs to.

Oh come on, on the first picture your pod is full of fuel, and on the bottom there are also a lot of fuel clipping. The nukes could be close but you can move them more out so they don't clip at all.

On the third you also have the pods to be full of fuel. I'm sure the fist and last are way too much!

In real life you can't push fuel tanks into each other neither. ;)

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Oh come on, on the first picture your pod is full of fuel, and on the bottom there are also a lot of fuel clipping. The nukes could be close but you can move them more out so they don't clip at all.

On the third you also have the pods to be full of fuel. I'm sure the fist and last are way too much!

In real life you can't push fuel tanks into each other neither. ;)

This. There is such a thing as "aesthetic clipping". There is also such a thing as "the game lets me overlap enough tanks to get twice as much fuel in the same space as stock intent, so why not lol?

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Hey im attempting the challenge. Im featuring the entire process on My youtube channel www.youtube.com/user/FTWG4M3RS The first episode is out now

- - - Updated - - -

Hey im attempting the challenge. Im featuring the entire process on My youtube channel www.youtube.com/user/FTWG4M3RS The first episode is out now

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May I use Porkjet's Stock Fuel Switch? it let's you fill tanks with LF or LFO, depending on your needs. I think it should be stock. Secondly, what about Porkjet's Atomic Age? Also, how about Kerbal Joint Reinforcement? It "glues" certain parts together and slows the physics on craft load, preventing Kraken attacks.

Edited by waterlubber

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I have one question about the 3ed level. Are you allowed to bring more than 5 kerbals on the mission, and land more than one of them on each moon? Aslong as you have 5 kerblas that each go to one moon.

For example can i have 5 sientists that go to one moon each and one pilot that pilots all the moon landings?

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I have one question about the 3ed level. Are you allowed to bring more than 5 kerbals on the mission, and land more than one of them on each moon? Aslong as you have 5 kerblas that each go to one moon.

For example can i have 5 sientists that go to one moon each and one pilot that pilots all the moon landings?

Ziv's original text refers to training five crew "to land" on each moon as there "wouldn't be time" to train one Kerbal for all five moons. That was written long before Kerbals could have specific roles so while it could now be read strictly to require five pilots, having five scientists specialised for each moon is an interesting twist that I would have thought everyone would be happy with. Especially as a probe core could be doing all the flying!

I'm pretty sure you can take more Kerbals than are required if you want to. It's more mass to drag around to give them each somewhere to sit, after all. Generally if something makes a mission harder, it'll be considered okay.

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ok, Then I will try for the "JEBEDIAH'S LEVEL" instead, as I anyway have tried to make the mission about getting as many science points as possible.

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May I use Porkjet's Stock Fuel Switch? it let's you fill tanks with LF or LFO, depending on your needs. I think it should be stock. Secondly, what about Porkjet's Atomic Age? Also, how about Kerbal Joint Reinforcement? It "glues" certain parts together and slows the physics on craft load, preventing Kraken attacks.

Stock fuel switch at first seems like a no-brainer, but it does improve the fuel tank ratios of stock parts (see part of my reasoning on dis-allowing Procedural Parts a few pages back). Until we actually get such a function in stock, I would say no.

The nuclear lightbulb in Atomic Age is too overpowered, so Atomic Age is not allowed.

Use Kerbal Joint Reinforcement if your computer can't handle loading your ship. There was some discussion about it on the old Jool 5 challenge, and Ziv said that part of the challenge is building a ship that doesn't fall apart using the stock system. I won't ban it, but try to see if your ship works without it.

I have one question about the 3ed level. Are you allowed to bring more than 5 kerbals on the mission, and land more than one of them on each moon? Aslong as you have 5 kerblas that each go to one moon.

For example can i have 5 sientists that go to one moon each and one pilot that pilots all the moon landings?

Yes, of course you can bring multiple Kerbals to each moon. ElWanderer is right, the rule was invented before Kerbals had pilot, scientist, and engineer roles. I did a Jool 5 mission in 0.24.2 that included 10 Kerbals and two landing on each moon, so level 2 and 3 at the same time.

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Welp, then a complete transfer stage redesign for me. At least I get KJR. What if I manually adjust the tank fuel so it's stock?

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I have one question about the 3ed level. Are you allowed to bring more than 5 kerbals on the mission, and land more than one of them on each moon? Aslong as you have 5 kerblas that each go to one moon.

For example can i have 5 sientists that go to one moon each and one pilot that pilots all the moon landings?

At least in the old challenge, I confirmed that it is legal not only to bring extra Kerbals, but also to bring extra ships, satellites, and stations and even leave Kerbals in there as long as enough Kerbals do the mission and come back to meet the challenge requirements (e.g. for Jeb's level, at least one Kerbal lands on each moon and returns to Kerbin during the mission).

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This is my next project. I'll be doing this freestyle, not following the rules at all. Real Fuels, maybe even KSPI, and as such, this won't be an official entry, just an excuse to show off. I'll also have to break rule 9 so my ships don't blow up at the first sign of atmosphere.

But when you consider why I'm doing this, it seems perfectly reasonable.

EDIT: Do I need separate kerbals for each moon of Jool? Might want to add that to the rules.

Edited by Whovian

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Welp, then a complete transfer stage redesign for me. At least I get KJR. What if I manually adjust the tank fuel so it's stock?

You mean with config file editing? No, don't do that either. You can use the tweakable to take out the oxidizer, or use Mk3 or Mk2 liquid fuel tanks.

This is my next project. I'll be doing this freestyle, not following the rules at all. Real Fuels, maybe even KSPI, and as such, this won't be an official entry, just an excuse to show off. I'll also have to break rule 9 so my ships don't blow up at the first sign of atmosphere.

But when you consider why I'm doing this, it seems perfectly reasonable.

EDIT: Do I need separate kerbals for each moon of Jool? Might want to add that to the rules.

Go ahead. As far as I know nobody ever did this challenge on an upscaled Kerbin system. The number of Kerbals requirement varies from level to level and it's already in the rules in the "Levels of Winning" section. But since you are already going your own way, bring as many or as few Kerbals as you want :)

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I took the challenge (third level) a couple of times before 1.0, although I was only ready to post my 2nd attempt (a much lighter version of my 1st) just a few days before 1.0 was due for release, so I missed the cutoff date for the old challenge.

I'm sure I'll take a crack at it again with a version of my 2nd attempt design, modified for 1.0

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Is KJR allowed

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Only if you need it, e.g your computer is too slow to handle wobbliness.

I just got struck by the NaNovirus, unfortunately, and now have to figure out what to do. But so far my Jool-5 is going well!

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How does the capsule not overheat on final reentry with 7k delta-v to bleed off? Why use heat shields at all?

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How does the capsule not overheat on final reentry with 7k delta-v to bleed off? Why use heat shields at all?

I'm waffling between three strategies to deal with this. Either attach a heatshield, set periapsis to 68Km and slow down on multiple orbits, first enter LKO before deorbiting, or orbit in Kerbin's SOI and send up a shuttle of some sort to bring the crew down. I'll re-read the rules, but I don't think we're required to de-orbit the actual expedition ship.

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I may be wrong, but from my understanding you'd have to take your deorbit shuttle along for the whole ride. :(

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Is KJR allowed

Read the OP, there a list of allowed mods.

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I'm waffling between three strategies to deal with this. Either attach a heatshield, set periapsis to 68Km and slow down on multiple orbits, first enter LKO before deorbiting, or orbit in Kerbin's SOI and send up a shuttle of some sort to bring the crew down. I'll re-read the rules, but I don't think we're required to de-orbit the actual expedition ship.

You don't have to de-orbit your whole mothership or even your crew quarters, you can send up a shuttle to get them from LKO if you want. I'll put a rule in for it. I feel like this could be part of the "unlimited launches to LKO" rule so it's okay.

I just got struck by the NaNovirus, unfortunately, and now have to figure out what to do. But so far my Jool-5 is going well!

I got hit by one of these in my AAP challenge. What I did was go into my persistent file and change all the NaN's to zeroes. Using the find-replace feature helps so you don't miss any. Hope this helps you.

Read the OP, there a list of allowed mods.

Well, I forgot to add KJR to the list so it's a valid question. Even though I did make a ruling on it a page back.

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How does the capsule not overheat on final reentry with 7k delta-v to bleed off? Why use heat shields at all?

I'm not sure this is directed at me, but I have a feeling it is...

Anyways, I think my Jool-5 return capsule survived the 7 km/s reentry for two reasons:

1. I had extra mass in the batteries and ion engine to conduct heat into. Essentially, they acted like ablative shielding.

2. The batteries provided extra drag to help slow down the capsule.

I'm not sure if the capsule would have survived without this; I've yet to test it.

Also thanks to sdj64 for reviewing my entry! Although somewhat late, +rep will be delivered.

Also also also, I'd hate to be nit-picky, but you made a typo in my name. Its "Stratzenblitz75" not "Stratenblitz75".

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Oh come on. Now I have to do this mission AGAIN. Ah well., I suppose I'd better get to work. *Walks away whistling happily*

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Go ahead. As far as I know nobody ever did this challenge on an upscaled Kerbin system. The number of Kerbals requirement varies from level to level and it's already in the rules in the "Levels of Winning" section. But since you are already going your own way, bring as many or as few Kerbals as you want :)

Okay, I just calculated the amount of delta-v required ...

62 km/s for the mothership ...

I don't think I'll be doing this in a scaled-up system anytime soon. I'm not just gonna sit here and take this kind of abuse.

Also may I dispute the ruling regarding PParts in the OP? Some of us use only procedural fuel tanks and get rid of all the others in order to save RAM.

EDIT: Derpity. There's reasoning behind the ruling in the thread. Perhaps just forbid specific uses of it? I think I'll be able to go without it for this challenge, so a no's fine.

Edited by Whovian

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Just realized the fairing in what I'm hoping will be my entry clips slightly with the decoupler:

8YLNaSFl.png

It's so little clipping it let me do it without any sort of cheating. Is this okay?

Also, if I send it up slightly empty and send up other ships to transfer fuel to it in LKO before leaving Kerbin's SOI, does that count as a refueling mission or assembly in Kerbin orbit? And the refueling mission can be unmanned, correct?

Edited by Whovian

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