[1.12.X] Tantares - Stockalike Soyuz and MIR [26.0][18.12.2023][Soyuz Revamp Again]

[biohazard15]

Aaaah, I cannot do this rocket. I dislike it (The whole Saturn family to be honest).

Which is a shame, since you have fleshed out the plan for it so well... I do feel sorry.

I could see a Centaur being a cool small project, but it would be an upper stage without a rocket.

So I have to rule out making this (for now).

Well, that's really bad, since that 6xRL-10s with their hexagonal heat shield look really cool.

Is there anything we can do to change your mind? You did Lunar Module's descent stage already...

On the subject of PMs, I do regret doing the V2 entirely - I get a ton of private messages requesting German things of a particular era (How's that for a euphemism?).

I might re-model it to be closer to an R2 type thing, which would be a fine reason to rescale it!

http://puu.sh/icJpN/15cd374740.jpg

I do agree a little that the current V2 is far too large. For a sounding rocket it shouldn't tower so greatly.

And, of course - the 0.9375m diameter needs a slight increase in catalog.

WRT V-2 - I've wrote a small plan on re-making it into a "true" sounding rocket, with service bay and chutes, and posted it about a month or two (or three?) ago.

I am a little pre-occupied making silly ZX-spectrum esque games at the moment

Mainly just an excercise in manipulating 2D arrays, file handling and whatever.

And my day-job now is providing strange pillow setups and shopping for food, so I am bored.

http://puu.sh/icJ6t/0761668046.png

Before anyone points it out, I know the colour depth here is too advanced for the ZX, more like a Nintendo Famicom, or one of the more expensive home PC systems.

But, I can't live without shading.

[Beale]

No Saturn I? You hate the whole Saturn family? May Wherner Von Braun cast you into the darkest part of Hell you monster!

Nah, I'm not that mad.

On a more serious note, How harddo you think it would be to model a Saturn I or IB? I have Wings3D on my computer now, and I've figured out a little bit of how it works, I might try and make it myself.

If you want it done right, you do it yourself.

No amount of apology or forgiveness can repair what you've said about the Saturn family. Von Braun is not pleased.

Not sorry!

On a more serious note, if you would like to give the Saturn rockets an attempt yourself!

The shape of the Saturn 1, 1B first stages are really quite complex, though I don't think a huge difficulty to model with some patience. I'd be willing to lend a hand there

It's mainly the unholy mountain of darkness that is balancing and texturing that puts me off this kind of project.

I'd recommend starting with the 1B and modelling from top to bottom (The second stage fuel tank and J2 engine are - kinda - simplistic).

Best of luck if you try this, and I'll be watching you

Well, that's really bad, since that 6xRL-10s with their hexagonal heat shield look really cool.

Is there anything we can do to change your mind? You did Lunar Module's descent stage already...

WRT V-2 - I've wrote a small plan on re-making it into a "true" sounding rocket, with service bay and chutes, and posted it about a month or two (or three?) ago.

Et tu, Beale...

I must say that I HATE THAT PIXEL TREND. No, seriously - I hate it. Everytime I see another "8-bit old-school pixel-graphic game" in Steam (and there are plenty of them!), I wanna puke on my keyboard. Come on, folks - it's 2015, not a goddamn 80's! All these pixelated things that you call "old-school", "fuzzy", "warm" and such - they looked such because the then-era hardware simply couldn't render good graphics!!! And if you're intentionally do that in 2015... well... gosh, you're a weirdo.

To change my mind... Not much, sorry. I've never had a huge interest in these rockets. I can't work on something I just don't dig. And the bigger prestige the rocket carries, the higher people's expectations, it's a little stressful sometimes.

I must have missed that V2 config, or forgotten it. My apologies.

Any chance you could dig it up? Perhaps it is more relevant now than ever.

On the pixel stuff - believe me I'm on your side. It's a very cynical way to stylize a game, to capture a very particular type of customer who eats anything retro. If you catch me trying to sell this, please hit me with a shovel until I stop moving.

Mainly this is just a bit of fun and a technical exercise!

For something I would sell (After a drastic code cleanup and a few bug fixes), I use polygons, shaders - the whole toolbox eh!

Edited June 5, 2015 by Beale

[biohazard15]

I must have missed that V2 config, or forgotten it. My apologies.

Any chance you could dig it up? Perhaps it is more relevant now than ever.

Can't find it, so I'll try to recreate it

Basically, the idea was to split V-2 nosecone into three parts:

(from top to bottom)

- Parachute

- Probe core, reaction wheels and batteries

- Service bay (heat-resistant), where you can mount scientific instruments, just like stock service bays

EDIT

Come to think of it, you can merge service bay and probe core - unless it would break something.

Edited June 5, 2015 by biohazard15

[Urist]

Can't find it, so I'll try to recreate it

Basically, the idea was to split V-2 nosecone into three parts:

(from top to bottom)

- Parachute

- Probe core, reaction wheels and batteries

- Service bay (heat-resistant), where you can mount scientific instruments, just like stock service bays

EDIT

Come to think of it, you can merge service bay and probe core - unless it would break something.

Wouldn't the parachute be another new size (0.45M?)

If it were separated.

[Beale]

Can't find it, so I'll try to recreate it

Basically, the idea was to split V-2 nosecone into three parts:

(from top to bottom)

- Parachute

- Probe core, reaction wheels and batteries

- Service bay (heat-resistant), where you can mount scientific instruments, just like stock service bays

EDIT

Come to think of it, you can merge service bay and probe core - unless it would break something.

Thanks

This sounds good, the service bay (if we assume it is cylinder) would make it a bit more R2 alike

Edited June 5, 2015 by Beale

[kenbobo]

I've been having a blast with the V-2 parts. I made my own version- the V9.

Apologies about the reflectivness, it seems to be a problem with the exporter.

[passinglurker]

Wouldn't the parachute be another new size (0.45M?)

If it were separated.

not really we don't have to fit a kerbal inside so it can be super flat if need be. we just make the core a .9m cone and cut it off at the .625 diameter point. then put a nose cone chute above and a straight cylinder service bay below and you are golden.

oh and beale don't forget to separate the winglets from the engine for aero purposes

[WDZOrangeJuice]

I don't know if this is solved, but whenever I try to extend the Soyuz's satellite dish, it wouldn't extend (in VAB).

I did it manually (outside VAB) and the option isn't there, so I don't know if it is a plugin interfering with it or something else is happening.

I used a different antennae (the V-RE "Needle" Rendezvous Antenna), and it was able to work, so I don't know what is going on.

Also, I deleted parts of the pack (the ones I won't use) so my catalog isn't cluttered, resulting in the antennae that worked to not have a texture, but when I had the full mod pack, the antennas (with the exception with the V-RE) didn't want to extend both in the VAB and in-flight.

[Chadley123]

Where can I find the tweak scale config? I tried clicking the link provided, but it brought me to a dropbox 404 page.

[curtquarquesso]

Where can I find the tweak scale config? I tried clicking the link provided, but it brought me to a dropbox 404 page.

Ugh. Sorry. Not sure why it does that. Updating now.

[Chadley123]

Thanks for the quick reply! I really enjoy your craft files, by the way. Real professional work right there.

[T'Flok]

For something I would sell (After a drastic code cleanup and a few bug fixes), I use polygons, shaders - the whole toolbox eh!

http://puu.sh/icMDC/16ee6ab497.jpg

For all I know, this could be called "Solar Control I: Mystery of the Monoliths".

Anyway, once again others are wanting more parts into the mod while I'm like "uh, guys. There's still IVA work to be done for existing crew containers". So yeah, my question is how is the progress with IVAs so far? You have no pressure from me to worry about, just curious is all.

[Beale]

I've been having a blast with the V-2 parts. I made my own version- the V9.

Apologies about the reflectivness, it seems to be a problem with the exporter.

-SF-

Quite sci-fi

How would you feel about a V2 resize, if you are using it like this?

oh and beale don't forget to separate the winglets from the engine for aero purposes

Of course

I used a different antennae (the V-RE "Needle" Rendezvous Antenna), and it was able to work, so I don't know what is going on.

Also, I deleted parts of the pack (the ones I won't use) so my catalog isn't cluttered, resulting in the antennae that worked to not have a texture, but when I had the full mod pack, the antennas (with the exception with the V-RE) didn't want to extend both in the VAB and in-flight.

There's potential problems if you delete individual parts, rather than entire craft folders Ex:

• Delete "SALYUT" - Okay!
  
• Delete "Vega_Crew_A" - Probably bad!
  

Still, I don't think that's the problem. Do you use remote tech? Afaik, these antenna don't actually have patches yet (oops).

For all I know' date=' this could be called "Solar Control I: Mystery of the Monoliths".

Anyway, once again others are wanting more parts into the mod while I'm like "uh, guys. There's still IVA work to be done for existing crew containers". So yeah, my question is how is the progress with IVAs so far? You have no pressure from me to worry about, just curious is all. [/quote']

Well, I was looking for a name

Don't worry about IVAs, the Soyuz OM interior is being done slowly, as are the Salyut interiors. But, as you know - they are quite laborious.

Edited June 5, 2015 by Beale

[_Augustus_]

Beale, do you think that you will do Pressurized Mating Adapters?

[curtquarquesso]

Thanks for the quick reply! I really enjoy your craft files, by the way. Real professional work right there.

Much appreciated! Let me know what you like about them, and what you'd like improved.

Well, an hour or so turned into all night. Preview for my next video is now finished. Enjoy.

Additionally... Prospero/Telstar... Wow...

Edited June 5, 2015 by curtquarquesso

[NasaSpace101]

I've been a bit quiet here lately, so what's been happening?

[pTrevTrevs]

I've started researching material for the Saturn 1 and 1B. Unfortunately, I am having some trouble finding good orthographic projections of the smaller Saturns. If anyone has any material that could be useful for modeling, please, give it to me. I need it.

EDIT: What size would be the best for the Saturn 1? 2.5 meters seems to be the accepted size for the Apollo CSM in KSP, so it could be 3.75 meters. I saw someone mention 3.125 meters as well, although that might not be fun for people who don't use Tweakscale. It would just introduce another arbitrary size for people to mess with.

Edited June 5, 2015 by pTrevTrevs

[kenbobo]

How would you feel about a V2 resize, if you are using it like this?

I like it the way it is, however, i would be fine with anything really.

I also modded the normal V2 control/cone to have ablator because my versions (i did an R7 model using the V2 cone) reenter. Add that if anything, please.

[biohazard15]

I've started researching material for the Saturn 1 and 1B. Unfortunately, I am having some trouble finding good orthographic projections of the smaller Saturns. If anyone has any material that could be useful for modeling, please, give it to me. I need it.

EDIT: What size would be the best for the Saturn 1? 2.5 meters seems to be the accepted size for the Apollo CSM in KSP, so it could be 3.75 meters. I saw someone mention 3.125 meters as well, although that might not be fun for people who don't use Tweakscale. It would just introduce another arbitrary size for people to mess with.

That "someone" was me, since the whole Saturn I thing was my idea

As for 3.125m size - I've planned it as temporary stage, something that you would use until you've got some 3.75m parts for your second stage.

As for the graphics - the best I've could find is this poster - http://www.chartgeek.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/types-of-rockets1.jpg (Warning: LARGE). It depicts both S-I Blocks and S-IB.

EDIT:

Woah. I knew that Apollo LES tower was big, but I never realized it was THAT big.

Edited June 5, 2015 by biohazard15

[MrMeeb]

My take on a Russain OPSEK, made with minimally modified versions of curtquarquesso's truly amazing craft files. Thank you!

[pTrevTrevs]

That "someone" was me, since the whole Saturn I thing was my idea

As for 3.125m size - I've planned it as temporary stage, something that you would use until you've got some 3.75m parts for your second stage.

As for the graphics - the best I've could find is this poster - http://www.chartgeek.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/types-of-rockets1.jpg (Warning: LARGE). It depicts both S-I Blocks and S-IB.

Thanks for the poster! I think i could get away with making the S-IV 3.125, while making the S-I, S-IV-B, and Saturn Instrument Unit 3.75.

Now, on the matter of engines, what would be best for this project, having all the engines on one stage clustered into a single part, or having each engine be an separate part, so that you have to cluster them together? With one engine part per stage, the rockets would have a lower part count, but you would have a niche engine that cannot be used for anything else. With several of the same engine part per stage, I could capture that "Lego' style that Tantares itself is based on.

Hopefully Beale doesn't mind me posting progress updates and questions on his thread. If he doesn't, i can make my own thread for the project.

[biohazard15]

Thanks for the poster! I think i could get away with making the S-IV 3.125, while making the S-I, S-IV-B, and Saturn Instrument Unit 3.75.

Now, on the matter of engines, what would be best for this project, having all the engines on one stage clustered into a single part, or having each engine be an separate part, so that you have to cluster them together? With one engine part per stage, the rockets would have a lower part count, but you would have a niche engine that cannot be used for anything else. With several of the same engine part per stage, I could capture that "Lego' style that Tantares itself is based on.

Hopefully Beale doesn't mind me posting progress updates and questions on his thread. If he doesn't, i can make my own thread for the project.

I think it can be the following:

- 3.75m cluster of eight H-1s, with space to attach some fins

- Separate H-1 (1.25m engine) for your 1.25m needs

- 3.125m thrust plate\tankbutt with 6 nodes, basically S-IV minus engine nozzles (see couple of pages back). You can mount 2, 3 or 6 engines on it. Not sure if such thing can be made with current aero system, though.

- Separate RL-10 (1.25m engine without tankbutt)

[curtquarquesso]

I've been a bit quiet here lately, so what's been happening?

To sum up:

1. Beale is a rampant revamp addict with little hope of improving.

2. Everyone is out for that greeble...

3. Pressure suits: Fashionable inside a capsule, as well as out?

4. 0.9375m is literally a certain leader of a prominent political party in Germany from 1920–1925

5. Stripes are all the rage...

6. Mr. Mod Author Sir, can you Kindly please Remake this Thing that Only I want Please and Thank You.

7. Beale's British half is trying to revive the short-lived British space programme. And doing a damn fine job of it too.

8. Tantares is looking better than ever, albeit with some minor growing pains here and there.

I think that sums it up nicely. All is well.

I've started researching material for the Saturn 1 and 1B. Unfortunately, I am having some trouble finding good orthographic projections of the smaller Saturns. If anyone has any material that could be useful for modeling, please, give it to me. I need it.

EDIT: What size would be the best for the Saturn 1? 2.5 meters seems to be the accepted size for the Apollo CSM in KSP, so it could be 3.75 meters. I saw someone mention 3.125 meters as well, although that might not be fun for people who don't use Tweakscale. It would just introduce another arbitrary size for people to mess with.

Here are the links I used for my recreation:

http://heroicrelics.org/info/saturn-i-and-ib/s-ib-fin/fin-hold-down-arrangement-med.jpg

http://www.apogeerockets.com/images/apogee_products/Saturn1b_poster_large.jpg

https://mix.msfc.nasa.gov/IMAGES/HIGH/6757861.jpg

http://www.alternatewars.com/SpaceRace/Saturn/SaturnIB_Diagram_1963.png

Just Google results, nothing fancy. They were sufficient.

For my recreation, I was using the 1.875m VA capsule, so 2.5m was the logical choice for me. If you compare the Mk1-2 Stock, it's way too large to be an Apollo capsule to the Tantares Soyuz. The 1.875m pod is nearly the perfect size if you throw on the striped adapter. Plus, it looks soooo much nicer than the stock pod. At the very bottom of the stack, I flared it out to around 3.0m-ish or so. I understand however if you want to scale it for the Mk1-2 pod.

As far as the engines go, I'd make it all one chunk. The lego idea is appealing, but putting together that engine cluster piece by piece seems like a pain. You're gonna have weird sizes, and recessed parts, etc.

I'm not sure if you're planning on this design complementing Tantares at all, or having it maintain it's own identity. Either way, I'll be looking forward to seeing what you come up with.

My take on a Russain OPSEK, made with minimally modified versions of curtquarquesso's truly amazing craft files. Thank you!

http://i.imgur.com/jhqFHoV.png

http://i.imgur.com/GqeN5zT.png

Heeeyyy!! Makes me happy every time I see my files get used. Let me know right away if you encounter any issues or have any suggestions.

[pTrevTrevs]

Here are the links I used for my recreation:

http://heroicrelics.org/info/saturn-i-and-ib/s-ib-fin/fin-hold-down-arrangement-med.jpg

http://www.apogeerockets.com/images/apogee_products/Saturn1b_poster_large.jpg

https://mix.msfc.nasa.gov/IMAGES/HIGH/6757861.jpg

http://www.alternatewars.com/SpaceRace/Saturn/SaturnIB_Diagram_1963.png

Just Google results, nothing fancy. They were sufficient.

For my recreation, I was using the 1.875m VA capsule, so 2.5m was the logical choice for me. If you compare the Mk1-2 Stock, it's way too large to be an Apollo capsule to the Tantares Soyuz. The 1.875m pod is nearly the perfect size if you throw on the striped adapter. Plus, it looks soooo much nicer than the stock pod. At the very bottom of the stack, I flared it out to around 3.0m-ish or so. I understand however if you want to scale it for the Mk1-2 pod.

As far as the engines go, I'd make it all one chunk. The lego idea is appealing, but putting together that engine cluster piece by piece seems like a pain. You're gonna have weird sizes, and recessed parts, etc.

I'm not sure if you're planning on this design complementing Tantares at all, or having it maintain it's own identity. Either way, I'll be looking forward to seeing what you come up with.

Thanks for the links. I plan to leave out the Lunar Module Adapter fairing when I model the Saturn 1B, since it can be made with Procedural Fairings.Stock fairings can be used if you're some kind of barbaric heathen. Because of this, people will be able to use either 2.5 meter parts or 1.875 parts, although one or the other will look a bit out of proportion.

I'm not sure either whether or not this will be a Tantares clone or it's own type of mod. I will attempt to texture it in a stockalike form, after seeing all of Beale's beautiful parts.

[Beale]

I'm not sure either whether or not this will be a Tantares clone or it's own type of mod. I will attempt to texture it in a stockalike form, after seeing all of Beale's beautiful parts.

Whatever you want to do is fine.

For something like this, I'd probably be happy to help do a little texturing.

More ref material if you missed it.

My take on a Russain OPSEK, made with minimally modified versions of curtquarquesso's truly amazing craft files. Thank you!

http://i.imgur.com/jhqFHoV.png

http://i.imgur.com/GqeN5zT.png

It's all starting to look remarkably KOSMOS like, I can't complain!

Great station!

Beale, do you think that you will do Pressurized Mating Adapters?

Done a while ago, I'll texture it soonish...

Much appreciated! Let me know what you like about them, and what you'd like improved.

Well, an hour or so turned into all night. Preview for my next video is now finished. Enjoy.

Additionally... Prospero/Telstar... Wow...

http://i.imgur.com/JGEogZJ.gif

Outstanding!

Great music choice.

Edited June 5, 2015 by Beale