Stevie_D

I love how people who lost out on a small, insignificant gamble with their own money on a video game are still prepared to lose a lot of their own money on a gamble in a court of law, against a multi-national corporation that can stack the deck against you far more by throwing dozens of their lawyers at you to defeat you. And even then, find it as easy as shooting fish in a barrel because the law is literally on their side in this case - due to you all essentially signing a contract when you clicked the button "buy Early Access game." AND they will have dozens of precedents from other Early Access games that did the exact same thing with which to show the judge. With sincerity, you folks need to google "the sunken cost fallacy" and read up on it. Gamblers who don't know when to quit are the ones who lose the most. But hey, you wanna burn more cash? I wish you all the luck in the world.

I can understand why emotions are high and folk are looking for help from anywhere... but I don't know why people are desperately throwing crackpot ideas around of asking space industry experts to save a video game... it's a wishful fantasy. Business people who are not in a certain industry rarely move into that industry. I'm not saying it's unheard of, but the vast majority of business people who are in an industry and know it inside out are the ones that are most likely to invest in that same industry. So you're better off throwing out proposals to publishers and game studios with a history of producing space or scifi games. But the biggest problem of all is that they'd have to negotiate with Take 2 for the rights to KSP. And, to put it frankly, despite the lay offs, Take 2 don't *need* to sell and KSP doesnt represent a big enough franchise that would recoup them a lot of money. If they did, they would've already. That means they can ask any ridiculous price they want and be as annoying as they want in any negotiations. Take 2 aren't known for playing friendly and, like Disney, can just let an IP sit on their back catalogue dead for years... just to be safe that no competitor made a better product with the IP and make the money they should have done.

If I were the KSP franchise owner I wouldn't want KSP2's reputation to be the pillar of the brand's identity. That reputation right now is for late, buggy, cold garbage with disingenuous publishers and silent devs.

Regardless of whether it continues development or not, this is the death knell of the game. It will never have a staff of 70 people ever again. With a hugely reduced staff it will therefore take far longer to complete than the already glacially slow pace it's already going at ....which was part of the reason it has garnered such a bad reputation in the first place. And the only way they can avoid it taking forever is to cut items off the road map. A hugely reduced staff will also mean less bug catches and fixes, so quality will undoubtably suffer... to a game already beset with bugs and basic missing features KSP1 has. Worse is the fact this is a hammer blow to the game's reputation, status, and profile online and among gamers. Many who came back month-to-month and stopped in just to check on the progress will now never come back, or if they do, yearly or worse. The community, already angered at the complete silence on this project, are unlikely to get *more* communication and updates with *less* staff. No offence to Nate, but he's promised time and time again communication would increase, upped it for a couple months, then fell back down to silence again. It is clear the team are either incapable of working out a communication strategy or they are hamstrung by Private Division guidelines. Nothing will change in that regard. It will certainly not improve with reduced staff. Player numbers on the steam charts were already almost back to rock bottom, even before this news. That, coupled with the above, means the worst part - decreasing internet and social media engagement numbers, less people interested, less people clicking, less people taking notice of a product that Take 2 wants to sell. Take 2 are run by numbers... the very reason this entire debacle happened was because they are run by numbers. And, with an already niche game played by less than 300 or so people a day with a destroyed reputation from burning the gamers more than once, well... take a look at previous games in gaming history with development cycles as catastrophically bad as this and devs or publishers as bad as this and it will tell you time and time again it never leads to a successful product. Most times it leads to a cancelled product. No Man's Sky is an aberration, there is no point using that as a hopeful beacon upon with which to hang your hopes. Hello Games *needed* NMS to be turned around because their entire company's reputation rested on NMS's success. It was a 1 game company. Private Division was specifically set up by Take 2 to be their "throw a tiny bit of cash that we can easily spare at indie projects and see if any turn out to be the next Minecraft. If they don't, then we haven't lost anything." If Take 2 as a company ever took a hit, then the "flip-a-coin" test projects in Private Divison would be the first to be easily jettisoned or easiest targets to reduce costs. And that's almost exactly what happened. Private Division are the games T2 cares *the least* about. Take 2 use Private Division to spend the *bare minimum* to see if *test projects* work out. They will not chuck money at KSP2 to turn it around ...because, unlike Hello Games, it simply doesn't matter to their company's future if it doesn't succeed. So they will, at best, let it limp on and see if a tiny reduced team can bring it to fruition and make a few more bucks. But if the metrics and numbers continue dropping (and they will due to the events of the last few days and the lasting damage to the Steam review page) then I would be surprised if development did not stop at some point. Spending millions on a game with an almost rock-bottom reputation that only garners a bare minimum of players... due to its bad reputation... and at best only had scope as a niche game they hoped to grow?... The moment they realize they will never *reach* even that niche market anymore they will pull the plug. And as for any corporate statements that you pin your hopes on?... just remember Nate said this project was fully funded and everything was fine and would be fine from here on... only 5 months ago. Look how iron-clad THAT statement was. Star Theory - destroyed. Intercept Games - destroyed. Putting your faith in any statement Take 2 related when all they care about is the AAA titles is foolhardy. Corporate statements are put out to lie and deceive or to sucker you into continuing to believe in their product or buy their product. They do not have your best intentions at heart, they only care about parting you with your cash. And you know what they say about a fool and their money...

As Pulstar says, you shouldn't get your hopes up by that. It's the same difference between "developing" a game and "supporting" a game (the terminology the corporate press release used). Just because you support a game it does not mean that game is actively being worked on. Handing off the game to another group could be handing it over to 2 people who just manage the steam account for it. I'm not saying that will be the case, but it's an example of why you shouldn't read too much into that term. Whatever happens, one thing is certain - this game is not going to continue on in the same manner it has been up to now. The 5% layoff by Take 2 included nearly *all* Intercept employees - that tells you something. If they laid off 5% of their workforce evenly then only 5% of Intercept Games employees would've been affected. 90% is the region we're looking at for Intercept, and that's a conservative estimate. Even if they rehire some of them, you wouldn't close the entire studio if you had a similar workforce. You close the physical building because you do not need a building for that many people anymore. Half the size? A quarter? 1 single office room in Private Division's HQ because only 5 people will now work on the game? Who knows. But if any future development does happen on this game, it will be *greatly* reduced. I'd be highly surprised if the road map stays the same as it is at the very least.

I imagine he doesn't know himself. All he's doing is being a nice and courteous person and cleaning up files and writing notes as to what he was working on and where it was at, so that if someone comes after then they can pick it back up easier. That shows real class, btw. Many lesser people having been sacked would just do the bare minimum and clock out.

Yep, right now we're all quietly wishing we were sat around a little campfire together, clinking our mugs in comradery, sharing sympathies, telling tales of our fun times in KSP, our hopes and dreams for KSP2, our bitterness towards corporate greed, our continued bemusement at how Bill ever graduated to become an Engineer in the first place... ...but how about a little light-hearted positive speculation about the future? Based off of what we know. What we know... Most of the people working on KSP2 have been laid off and Intercept's office studio closed. Nate hasn't been laid off, and perhaps a few key individuals that he said he can't live without. Corporate / Private Division / The devi... *cough* .. I mean Take 2, says it continues to "support" KSP2 (but the word "support" does not mean development! Support could be as simple as keeping the game online in its current form, indefinitely.) Private Division / Satan's Arseho... *cough* ... I mean Take 2, are unlikely to sell the game as it is to another company. At best they would sell the rights to the Kerbal franchise later down the line. So what do you think the future holds, if KSP2 isn't cancelled? Serious or funny. Me, personally, I have a picture in my head... Well, it's rather a dim picture, because you see it involves a dimly-lit janitor's closet in Private Division's Headquarters. It USED to be the janitor's closet, but that was the best space PD's budget could allocate for an office for KSP2's continued development. It has a (obviously) yellow POST-IT note covering the Janitor's door sign, reading "KSP 2 DEV STUDIO" One tiny light-bulb barely illuminates the room. Nate's desk is an upturned bucket with a second-hand laptop on top of it as he squats on the floor to work. He complains whenever Nertea's butt rubs up against his face whenever they shift in their positions. Nertea gets a -proper- desk, you see, because he's the talent. He's currently busy making every-single-art-asset for the game... until the end of time. He has to, his ankle is chained to a pipe. Matt Lowne is tied up in the corner, gagged. His pennance for daring to speak out against the devs, PD, and Take 2. His head is held in place by wooden stakes in the wall. His eyes held open by those same restraints in A Clockwork Orange. He's forced to stare at a poster of Scott Manley all day long. Roverdude's skeleton is in the other corner... "Coding." The bones of his arm and index finger rise as the water pump it's attached to fills a tank and then falls to hit the keyboard every thirteen seconds when the water spills over. Meanwhile, back on these forums, our new community moderator "AI_Dakota" keeps repeating the same message to every post with "I can promise and guarantee that the game is still being worked on and development continues. Is there any other way I can help you today? Please rate this AI_bot experience if not. For customer support on this AI_bot, please email [email protected]"

Totally understandable response and reaction, mate. Don't blame you one bit. If I was still modding I would be doing exactly the same.

Chris Nertea Adderley could've created all the parts they'd ever need by now, all on his own.

Maybe they're funding Disney and Marvel movies...

Damned supernovas.... ...being all arrogant and creating the heavier chemical elements. What?!? HYDROGEN AND HELIUM WEREN'T GOOD ENOUGH FOR YOU?!?!?

And you don't generally close the building they are all working in. And bloomburg and government webpages don't report it as happening. At best, you can argue development has paused. The likelyhood the game will ever have a 70-person-strong dev team ever again? That is pretty much obviously a hard no.

I suppose the only real logic you can throw at this argument is... ... if he's willing to chuck money at Gina Carano to fund her court case against Disney for [snip] giggles,... then he's SURELY gotta love KSP more than Gina Carano.

Why not write to the man yourself and ask him nicely? The reason why it's not likely is because ESA is a community space program of European nations. Their budget and goal is to their science and space research and development. They answer to their respective countries, who answer to their respective politicians, who answer to their respective peoples. When people start asking "Why is our taxpayer's money, supposedly allocated to furthering space and science, spending a few ***million*** on a ***video game?***" It is pretty hard for the head of ESA to say "Um... positive advertising?" ESA partnered with KSP in the past because it cost them virtually nothing and could easily fall under their advertising budget. A video game costs more. A lot more. More than could be justified when that money at ESA should be going to furthering the real-world spaceflight that KSP aims to replicate. TRANSCRIPT FROM JULY 2024 ESA MONTHLY OVERSIGHT COMMITTEE Oversight Committee : "Why didn't our latest Arianne rocket fly?" Philippe Willekens : "Our budget fell short by 2 million." Oversight Committee : "How? Why?" Philippe Willekens : "Um, we helped an indie developer make a video game." Oversight Committee : "Is that in our organization's charter?" Philippe Willekens bolts for the door and flees the building. Philippe Willekens (shouts): "KSP FOREVEEERRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!"

Well, I get everyone is sad right now and emotions are running high. This is a big part of what we thought was our future entertainment and happy fun time being flushed down the toilet.

Damned right! And Charles Babbage! Why, if that b*stard hadn't invented the computer in the first place, i'd never have a computer on which to play the original KSP in the first place. My hopes would've never been raised for KSP2! I need a time machine to travel to 1820's London and beat that git up!

It's at moments like this that I'm reminded of the Simpsons mob, that keep changing their collective mind on who they are going to attack whenever someone at the front shouts the latest idea in their head and shouts the loudest.

Threads like this are a waste of time. Class action lawsuits happen when you have an actual leg to stand on. The moment you bought KSP2 in Early Access you agreed to the terms and conditions, whether you read them or not. Those terms and conditions clearly tell you that you should understand that Early Access games on Steam may stop development at any moment and the game can be taken down at any moment. That is why Early Access was created as a category. All you'd be doing is giving money to lawyers who would be more than willing to lie to you and tell you that you could win the case and then shrug when you lose hands down.

Just like all those millions who hope they win the lottery each week?

Best of luck, @Dakota Not that I thought Dakota would be allowed to tell us anything at all by the higher ups, but now it's pretty obvious that we'll be getting no news for a while, while Private Division sort themselves out and decide what they're going to do.

I didn't intend it to come across that way. And I never denigrated his work, I was applauding it. I was sympathizing with him losing his job - a past tense situation. My only mis-step was continuing on with ONE word in the past tense , using "were" an inspiration. He still is. Jeez, some people will nitpick ANY positive message to ruin it.

It is not about making some money, it is not even about making most of the money. In today's business world, it is about making *all* of the money, at any cost.

Poor guy, ( @blackrack ) had his dream job and it was taken away from him within months. As a fellow modder, if you read this, I feel for you, my friend. You are always an inspiration.

I think part of the problem was the player numbers were quickly falling back off though. If you look at the Steam player count, they shot up to 1,500 after For Science but, after 4 months, they were on track to be back where they were pre-patch in the 100 to 200s.

But that's why it fell under Private Division. Private Division was specifically designed and created to be Take 2's "let's see if we cant find the next Minecraft or Among Us with ***minimal investment***" division. It's sole reason for existence is to fund promising indie projects, to see if one of them becomes the next big breakout hit. KSP1 being what it was obviously made KSP2 a prime reason for investment. If that investment doesn't produce the breakout hit they wanted then it never cost the larger company too much and doesn't cost them much to axe it with minimal impact to Take 2's overall finances. It also meant that if Take 2 hit hard times or things take a downturn, then the first things that get culled are the small-time "test" projects in Private Division... which is exactly what's happened.