Do you think Sandbox Mode can still be rewarding?

[Draconiator]

For me, I think so. If you design something that works as intended the first time for example, and soon you have dozens of what you built all over the place. Or it could be a one-off thing that works wonders, those types of things tend to satisfy, and it is rewarding that way.

Yeeeeeeeeep, Sandbox player and proud of it....but I tend to play it like career mode; my Kerbals could be considered a race that conquered two worlds (Kerbin/Minmus).

What about you guys? How do you feel on this?

[Uncle Mort]

Not any more; now we have a reasonably structured career and science modes, KSP is a game with a beginning and end (sort of).

I realise some are happy pootering about in a sandbox but I need that game structure to feel satisfaction in playing.

[Robotengineer]

I have just started playing stock size system again after a couple months of RSS, and started a career save and it has been fun. Sandbox can be rewarding, but I don't find it to be that rewarding in stock just because it is too easy to get from point A to point B. I also really dislike how there is no science in sandbox, who does it hurt to have the R&D building open in a sandbox game? I'd like to see the R&D archives available in sandbox.

[magnemoe]

For me sandbox is to test designs in and also to just mess around in.

[worir4]

The most rewarding thing for me is launching a twenty kerbal crewed, 500 part rocket and then watching it fail miserably and blow up before it even leaves the launch pad. I don't get the same satisfaction in career....

[Red Iron Crown]

I'm all about sandbox (well, technically science with the tree unlocked from the start). Career mode just makes me do missions I don't want so I can afford to do the ones I do want, so I just roleplay that I've done the grinding and just run the missions I like.

[regex]

I pretty much only play sandbox nowadays. Been considering an RP-0 playthrough because stock career is literally terrible at the moment (building upgrades :ugh: ) but ... I don't know. Honestly, it's more fun to launch whatever I want whenever I want, subject only to launch windows. Having structure is great but if the only way I can accumulate mad cash is by grinding crap contracts I don't want to do in the first place then I don't want to play. Basically I want to direct a space program, not fly a bunch of silly little quests.

Edited March 4, 2015 by regex

[RW-1]

I have moments of where thinking sandbox is cheating somehow, however it comes down to that you don't get the rewards when you do stuff there.

Career is fun to do but can get tedious, you can make it more frustrating by turning off options, nothing like creating a masterpiece and forgetting one item, and knowing you already hit space to launch it hehehe....

So periodically I wipe out my career and start over with enough funds and science to skip some of the basics, but I do love the challenges.

[klgraham1013]

In my opinion, career mode simply isn't fun. Silly contracts and poor tech progression really hurt the experience.

This means I'm left to create my own progression through self-imposed budgets within sandbox.

[Pecan]

What do you mean "still"?

It's more a case of; can Science/Career mode be rewarding once anyone's "won" by unlocking the insane tech-tree?

Or even; is grinding (experiments and/or silly contracts) through an insane tech-tree rewarding in the first place?

ETA: woot! I seem to have echoed the post above.

[Uncle Mort]

It doesn't matter if the career or contracts are insane, the reward comes form beating them.

[Pecan]

It doesn't matter if the career or contracts are insane, the reward comes form beating them.

Sorry, I wasn't trying to say anyone was having fun the wrong way, or even that there's anything wrong with science/career mode per se, although I get no satisfaction from 'beating' them. Just that "can [sandbox] still be rewarding" is an entirely subjective question.

[Randox]

I have never played career. I can see the appeal, but for me, it just means spending a few hours running a whole bunch of missions I don't want to do. Perhaps if I could jump into career with the first tier or two unlocked (so I could skip the early game and go strait to the middle) I'd be interested now. I still have things left to achieve in the game on my own time, plenty of them. I'm also absent minded enough in my designs that I already (happily) spend much of my time tootling around on shakedown missions and redesigning my ships.

Design is much of the game for me, and right now, I see no reason to place restrictions on myself. It will probably be a very long time before I have any desire to play in career, if I ever do.

[Denks]

I use sandbox to test things or build things I can't/don't want to build on my career mode.

[TinfoilChef]

I find sandbox mode to be some of the best fun I've had. If I want to deal with a "budget" I can work something out myself and just role play it. The contracts (especially the stock ones) are mind numbingly grindy to the point where in order to unlock all of the tech in a modded game I seriously believe it's going to take doing hundreds of the bloody things flying missions I have zero interest in.

I mean seriously, once I've got enough satellites for a good comms network I don't want to fly 50 or 90 more just to finance the stuff I actually want to do. It takes what? upwards of 9 or 10 mil just to upgrade all of the facilities, add another 150 mil to unlock all of the parts and the grind is insane. The same goes for part testing, visual surveys and rescue missions (which in my mind need to include some plausible explanation of how so-and-so got into that situation in the first place since they didn't launch from my facilities and mine is the only space program in the solar system.

When I started in 0.16 sandbox was all there was and role play / story was all of the "career" that was needed. Grind free gameplay for the win.

[magico13]

Perhaps if I could jump into career with the first tier or two unlocked (so I could skip the early game and go strait to the middle) I'd be interested now. .

You can, btw, just go into the "difficulty settings" before you start the save and add in some extra funds and/or science.

I've been playing Career with a Sandbox-esque feel to it. I started out with some extra science to unlock the early nodes and only take contracts that fit with what I want to do. And then I only take contracts to be able to fund my side missions. I had an Eeloo transfer window coming up but didn't have the funds to upgrade the R&D center to the level where I could get an antenna that could reach Eeloo. Nor was there a contract for it. But I sent a probe anyway and once it leaves comms range it'll be controlled by a kOS script. That was funded by some random contracts. My multimillion funds Duna Station paid for itself and then some, despite not having a single contract for a Duna station (just the Explore Duna and Explore Ike contracts). I managed to complete contracts for a Kerbin station, Minmus base, and Solar station all with the Duna Station (yes, I landed a massive OKS station on Minmus). I enjoy the freedom to do whatever I want, but like the artificial limitations that make me have to get a bit more creative than I otherwise would be.

I'd definitely still have fun in Sandbox mode (it was the only thing in existence when I started playing and it was plenty of fun+challenge back then). I'd just set my own limitations (with the aid of mods) rather than what the Stock game says I should be limited to. The two modes are really not much different to me. I don't think of Sandbox mode as "do whatever you want in God mode", I think of it as "do whatever you want but it's still going to require patience, planning, and skill".

[regex]

Perhaps if I could jump into career with the first tier or two unlocked (so I could skip the early game and go strait to the middle) I'd be interested now.

You might actually want to give it a try. The last few times I've tried I give myself the maximum starting cash and like, 90 science (I think 88 will get you the first four nodes), so I can have a modicum of functionality for my rockets and unlock some of the building upgrades to reduce the grind. Unfortunately, that still leaves a massive grind if you play with mods and parts unlocks, plus the literal cash wall when it comes to unlocking the R&D facility. Be prepared to launch plenty of worthless satellites into equally worthless, sometimes baffling orbits (or whatever you consider the least grindy of the contracts). After that, it all comes down to luck and getting some good contracts (which rarely happens).

[magnemoe]

The most rewarding thing for me is launching a twenty kerbal crewed, 500 part rocket and then watching it fail miserably and blow up before it even leaves the launch pad. I don't get the same satisfaction in career....

Can anybody please think of the Kerbals

- - - Updated - - -

What do you mean "still"?

It's more a case of; can Science/Career mode be rewarding once anyone's "won" by unlocking the insane tech-tree?

Or even; is grinding (experiments and/or silly contracts) through an insane tech-tree rewarding in the first place?

ETA: woot! I seem to have echoed the post above.

Once the career tree is unlocked and you swim in funds you are basically playing sandbox with optional goals, the science around Eeloo and similar contracts will keep you floating while you tries to drop asteroids down the Mohole.

For me, I tend to find the endgame boring, no idea how many times I have restarted Skyrim.

However sandbox is fun to just mess around in for some wild ideas, today I made my first functional MK2 spaceplane, 18 ton cargo and up to 19 kerbals to orbit

4 rapiers and 5 turbojets. lost 2 turbojets one landing so I need to adjust the protective wheels at back.

Edited March 4, 2015 by magnemoe

[justidutch]

I find myself flipping back and forth between the two modes. Currently I am on a sandbox kick, because I can try to design and build extremely large stations. Things one could not do in Career unless one had unlocked the entire tech tree and had 100s of millions of *inserts checkmark icon to signify funds*. And flying saucers. There's no way one would ever consider building a flying saucer in career mode.

But I do also enjoy career mode, I don't mind the grindy bits, particularly when they force you to accomplish something using very limited resources (parts and funds). So yes, sandbox is rewarding. I look forward to the new challenges that 1.0 will present, though until its release I will stick with creating ridiculously pointless orbital space stations to dock my flying saucers to.

[monstah]

I too find sandbox lacking an objective, but currently Career isn't much better, either.

What it's really lacking are story-based contracts, like the wonderful ones from Mission Controller Extended.

I've been thinking for a very long time about making some contracts with some sort of story progression. But... Soonâ„¢.

[Rusty6899]

I'm trying to build space shuttles in sandbox at the moment. There's no point in making them in career, as they aren't economically viable, but they are challenging and rewarding when they work.

I also dont make space planes often, so I make them in sandbox to avoid a huge loss of life and funds in my career.

[Aragosnat]

Yeah. Sandbox is a bit unrewarding for myself. In that the restrictions that Career mode forces upon me to design better crafts. While sanbox can do that. I still think I would be building x-mass trees just to get up into space if I was playing in sandbox still. Also it will be likely that I'll be using sandbox at least a few time to try out KSP 1.0. Since all the new features will make what I do reasonably obsolite.

[Sampa]

sandbox is all that I play (mostly due to the fact that the mods I use are not yet compatible with science or career mode)

[magnemoe]

Yeah. Sandbox is a bit unrewarding for myself. In that the restrictions that Career mode forces upon me to design better crafts. While sanbox can do that. I still think I would be building x-mass trees just to get up into space if I was playing in sandbox still. Also it will be likely that I'll be using sandbox at least a few time to try out KSP 1.0. Since all the new features will make what I do reasonably obsolite.

Xmas trees is so much an 0.22 thing, with the 3.75 meter parts an 6+1 asparagus has an serious payload to LKO capacity, so large that I have never been close to need it even then sending 100 ton to Moho. (yes it was two launches and dry to orbit and refill but more because of design)

No reason why 6+1 asparagus will not work in 1.0, you probably want to not use the TT-70 decopler because you want to minimize the cross section so the seperatorion will be more demanding.

However 6+1 asparagus will hardly be less aerodynamic than this design

http://scienceblogs.com/startswithabang/files/2010/08/gpw-20051129-NASA-GPN-2000-001877-looking-directly-down-at-STS-79-Space-Shuttle-Atlantis-Florida-19960820-medium.jpeg

[delder92663]

I usually keep two instances of the game open. One sandbox and one career.

I use the sandbox for desiging and testing before I commit to anything major in career.

Also like to run the second instance so I can design in VAB/SPH while waiting for transfer nodes, doing long burns, etc. Squad definitely needs a way to use VAB while your waiting for things like long burns to complete. The last thing I want to do is stare at a ship while it throttles for 20 minutes.

Sandbox does leave something to be desired as a stand alone but is invaluable for testing.