A Thread for Writers to talk about Writing

[steuben]

Careful, deep world building can be a very deep rabbit hole to fall down. It can serve to distract you from the task.

Tvtropes.org is a good resource as well... but it is a much slippery rabbit hole.

To answer the question about how much detail, mention the detail once. And then again only when it is plot critical. 

As long as the magic is internally consistent it doesn't matter how loose you play with reality, within reason. You'll want to go digging around under the term "Magic Realism."

[GluttonyReaper]

3 hours ago, sturmhauke said:

The Worldbuilding subreddit is a good resource for this kind of thing. As for what to name your species, in the real world a lot of group names are ultimately translations of descriptive things like "allies" (Lakota), "the hidden ones" or "the tall ones" (Celts), "people of the Han river" (Han Chinese), "gatherers", "hunters", or "people of the mountains" (Kongo), etc. Some of these are names the group gives to itself (autonyms), while others are imposed by a colonial or other external power and the original name is eventually lost.

Ah nice, thanks, I'll check it out!

That's pretty interesting, I'll have to have a think about that

2 hours ago, steuben said:

Careful, deep world building can be a very deep rabbit hole to fall down. It can serve to distract you from the task.

Tvtropes.org is a good resource as well... but it is a much slippery rabbit hole.

To answer the question about how much detail, mention the detail once. And then again only when it is plot critical. 

As long as the magic is internally consistent it doesn't matter how loose you play with reality, within reason. You'll want to go digging around under the term "Magic Realism."

Good stuff, I'll check this out too  The plan is to write a few short character-driven stories - I'm assuming it's pretty hard to get lost in world building when you've only got 2000 words to work with

[Mukita12]

You know for all the Amateur Writer here (Including me)

Feel free to discuss any ways of writing and share tips and tricks to fellow amateur Writers

 

[James Kerman]

Hello @Mukita12, your thread has been merged into this existing thread for writers to discuss their art.

[Mukita12]

4 hours ago, James Kerman said:

Hello @Mukita12, your thread has been merged into this existing thread for writers to discuss their art.

Oh didn't know this exist.... Anyways....

What should i do if i want a novel based on a school (Like there's this transfer student who got transfered to USA and all that). What should i do with the World Building or Character Development? Any tips?
 

[steuben]

8 minutes ago, Mukita12 said:

What should i do with the World Building or Character Development? Any tips?
 

*does that joint cracking thing from the classic kung fu movies*
Many young grasshopper, many.

But you need to clarify a bit more what you will be writing.

First what genre and market segment are you writing?
Slice of life for the YA crowd? Magical realism for the pop-corn munchers? Cosmic-horror for toddlers? Ultra hard sci-fi for the academic elites?

Head over to TvTropes, my usual first suggestion and usual browsing safety protocols apply, and research the common elements for the genre and the market segment.

What is the plot?
Random events? <- slice of life
Portal to magical mystery fun land opens in the lady teacher's washroom, and only he can save both realms? <- comedy or action, and best for a TV series in which he has to go in and out every day.
Aliens from Cardiff, but they are illegal aliens since they don't have an education visa and have to hide from local enforcement agencies? <- drama, comedy, or police procedural

What is the setting?
Nothing major here, just a quick overview.
US High school, done... lots
British Keystage 4 and 5, done... lots
Japanese high school, done... lots
Indian high school, done... lots (not that I've seen much of it)
Canadian high school, done... not as much and should be done more.
Well, you get the point. The reason why it is done so much commercially is that it is an easy, almost cliche,  and fairly standardized setting, that is directed towards a very profitable market with easy to write and act plots. You will have to have to work to add something different here. And setting it In! Space!, or Underground!, or They! Fight! Crime!, is only a quarter step.
Now if this is your first rodeo, don't let that dissuade you from trying it. Much of what you will learn in trying will serve you well on the next piece that you write.

What is your pitch?
Then you need to take all of that and crunch it down into about 20, and no more than 30, words.

What is your research?
Now you need to read. Read as much as you can that is similar and related. The you need to read about writing. As you go along make notes about what worked, what didn't, and what cool thing you'd like to try to work in.

What is your plan?
Penultimately you need to plan. I have recommended and used the index card method.

Now Write!
Ultimate step is  you need to do one simple thing: write. But remember Sturgeon's Law will apply to what you write.

 

[Mukita12]

1 hour ago, steuben said:

*does that joint cracking thing from the classic kung fu movies*
Many young grasshopper, many.

But you need to clarify a bit more what you will be writing.

First what genre and market segment are you writing?
Slice of life for the YA crowd? Magical realism for the pop-corn munchers? Cosmic-horror for toddlers? Ultra hard sci-fi for the academic elites?

Head over to TvTropes, my usual first suggestion and usual browsing safety protocols apply, and research the common elements for the genre and the market segment.

What is the plot?
Random events? <- slice of life
Portal to magical mystery fun land opens in the lady teacher's washroom, and only he can save both realms? <- comedy or action, and best for a TV series in which he has to go in and out every day.
Aliens from Cardiff, but they are illegal aliens since they don't have an education visa and have to hide from local enforcement agencies? <- drama, comedy, or police procedural

What is the setting?
Nothing major here, just a quick overview.
US High school, done... lots
British Keystage 4 and 5, done... lots
Japanese high school, done... lots
Indian high school, done... lots (not that I've seen much of it)
Canadian high school, done... not as much and should be done more.
Well, you get the point. The reason why it is done so much commercially is that it is an easy, almost cliche,  and fairly standardized setting, that is directed towards a very profitable market with easy to write and act plots. You will have to have to work to add something different here. And setting it In! Space!, or Underground!, or They! Fight! Crime!, is only a quarter step.
Now if this is your first rodeo, don't let that dissuade you from trying it. Much of what you will learn in trying will serve you well on the next piece that you write.

What is your pitch?
Then you need to take all of that and crunch it down into about 20, and no more than 30, words.

What is your research?
Now you need to read. Read as much as you can that is similar and related. The you need to read about writing. As you go along make notes about what worked, what didn't, and what cool thing you'd like to try to work in.

What is your plan?
Penultimately you need to plan. I have recommended and used the index card method.

Now Write!
Ultimate step is  you need to do one simple thing: write. But remember Sturgeon's Law will apply to what you write.

 

Well my plot is about a transfer student from Indonesia trying to fit in with the American High School System, Culture, and... You  get the idea. and with a bit of romantic sub-plot.  

So yeah i need myself a better understanding of the world building and how will the story evolve.

[steuben]

27 minutes ago, Mukita12 said:

Well my plot is about a transfer student from Indonesia trying to fit in...

So a fairly stock "Fish out of water" element. But what else you got?

Quote

So yeah i need myself a better understanding of the world building and how will the story evolve.

The large pieces you will need will be some books on Indonesia culture, history, and education. And some books on US culture, history, and education. Don't go with what you "know" as your basis for background, you can use it for "colour" or plot points but never... well never is a bit strong but will do for now, for what you hang the story on. Like the transfer student gets royally schooled on Indonesian culture and history by some American white bread who hasn't been further abroad than fifty miles from his suburban home.

[KerballingSmasher]

58 minutes ago, steuben said:

colour

Excuse me, sir, for butting into your conversation, but if you're trying to be American it's "color", just another aside note for @Mukita12. If it was first person, maybe have the transfer student use "colour" though. Just a side note!

 

Edited April 27, 2020 by Kerballing (Got Dunked On)

[Mukita12]

10 hours ago, steuben said:

The large pieces you will need will be some books on Indonesia culture, history, and education. And some books on US culture, history, and education. Don't go with what you "know" as your basis for background, you can use it for "colour" or plot points but never... well never is a bit strong but will do for now, for what you hang the story on. Like the transfer student gets royally schooled on Indonesian culture and history by some American white bread who hasn't been further abroad than fifty miles from his suburban home.

As for books on Indonesian's Culture, History, and Education. Yeah i got those easily (I'm still on school as a matter of fact).
While for the US Culture, History and Education, Yeah i need to buy some of those.
Also what does even "Colour" mean?

10 hours ago, steuben said:

So a fairly stock "Fish out of water" element. But what else you got?

Yeah basically he enters a student exchange program and accepted on top of his class. Well he was a fairly Social person and particularly smart person. However once he got to US however, all of his social skill got yeeted out of the window because he knows and had a feeling that All that social skill would be useless on American Culture and just became quite person. 

And basically that's for the beginning part of the book. The character basically was a rocketry enthusiast and wants to become a Rocket Engineer (Hence he participate in that program and to have a scholarship in US). so yeah

And what does even Royally schooled means (Sorry i don't know english terms or dictionary that much

[steuben]

Hit your local library first. It's not worth buying them unless you will be writing a few books about the subject, or getting an advanced degree in US Sociology. 

Royally schooled: To be greatly educated by someone else on a subject after saying something stupid. 
Person 1: I think it would be wonderful to have a wonderful sea-side vacation in Paraguay.
Person 2: Paraguay is land locked. <Person 2 then proceeds to give fifteen minute lecture on the geography and border history of Paraguay, with the implication that more information can and will be coming.>

Colour: extra details that enhance the experience.
Basic: Three guys in a room discussing how to decorate it.
Colourful version: You have a Canadian, American, and a Brit discussing how to decorate it. The Brit is saying where to put to the couch, how many liters of paint, and how many meters of fabric for the drapes. The Canadian is saying how many gallons of paint, where to put to chesterfield, and how many meters of fabic. The American wants to put the sofa in one spot, have so many gallons of paint, and so many yards of fabric.

[Mukita12]

4 hours ago, steuben said:

Hit your local library first. It's not worth buying them unless you will be writing a few books about the subject, or getting an advanced degree in US Sociology. 

Ah i see. As for local library..... we didn't have those in my neighbourhood well i mean there are some Library in the mall but since there is this Large Scale social Distancing thingy, i can't go out to buy books, and if i want to buy them online. My parent would say no regardless of any excuse because Hey It's not related to any of my school material  (i call that BS). So yeah my only knowledge and resource about US Culture, School system, and other stuff related to that matter is from my American Friend along with a dozen of research.

4 hours ago, steuben said:

Royally schooled: To be greatly educated by someone else on a subject after saying something stupid. 
Person 1: I think it would be wonderful to have a wonderful sea-side vacation in Paraguay.
Person 2: Paraguay is land locked. <Person 2 then proceeds to give fifteen minute lecture on the geography and border history of Paraguay, with the implication that more information can and will be coming.>

Colour: extra details that enhance the experience.
Basic: Three guys in a room discussing how to decorate it.
Colourful version: You have a Canadian, American, and a Brit discussing how to decorate it. The Brit is saying where to put to the couch, how many liters of paint, and how many meters of fabric for the drapes. The Canadian is saying how many gallons of paint, where to put to chesterfield, and how many meters of fabic. The American wants to put the sofa in one spot, have so many gallons of paint, and so many yards of fabric.

Thanks, I didn't know any of this since i'm new to writing. I will try incorporate those onto my story.

[steuben]

9 minutes ago, Mukita12 said:

Ah i see. As for local library...there is this Large Scale social Distancing thingy.

There are many resources/books available on line as well. many available for free or borrow. I would also check to see if you library has an online books section, mine does. Like I said don't buy them unless you will be writing a number of books set in US high schools.  Besides, this wee spot of bother won't last much longer</british accent>.

And your folks are right, school work first. Then you can waste time with your friends over at Tosche Station.

[KerballingSmasher]

16 hours ago, Mukita12 said:

Colour

it's just color but a British spelling. No one knows why. Also can be used in reference to extra detail.

9 hours ago, steuben said:

Hit your local library first.

Always great advice!

5 hours ago, Mukita12 said:

my American Friend

oh we all have several of those  

[steuben]

15 minutes ago, Kerballing (Got Dunked On) said:

it's just color but a British spelling. No one knows why.

Actually you can blame the famed Webster for that. He attempted to "modernize" the spelling of English in the second quarter of the 19th century. He achieved a fair degree of success within his native U.S. But, his reforms did not take hold outside of there.

[KerballingSmasher]

2 minutes ago, steuben said:

Actually you can blame the famed Webster for that. He attempted to "modernize" the spelling of English in the second quarter of the 19th century. He achieved a fair degree of success within his native U.S. But, his reforms did not take hold outside of there.

Wait, really? That's fascinating.

[Just Jim]

I just found this on YouTube, and I can't begin to tell you how right he is, especially near the end when he says
"People who think you're inspired and then you write have it absolutely wrong... you write, and then you are inspired!!!"
Yup.... I've had that happen more times then I can count... 

 

Edited May 19, 2020 by Just Jim

[Selective Genius]

My character was beaten and banged up pretty bad and he was hospitalized. Prior to being beaten up, he lost someone dear to him. Now, after gaining consciousness in the hospital, he takes some time to gain his bearings but after some time, he recalls what happened the last time he was awake.

How do I write the scene of him 'recalling' the recent trauma ? I can't seem to generate any impact with what I have written....

[steuben]

Depends on what you're aiming for, how you've structured it, and paced it.

Is it a single block? Is it a series of escalating fragment-reactions to the full reveal? Which way is he fighting the recall?

Some examples for study and reference that I can quickly name
- "The Majestic", towards the end where Luke!Peter recovers his memory.
- Neon Genesis Evangelion Ep01 and Ep02, the second half of Ep01 and most of Ep02. Been a while since I've seen it.

 

 

[SiriusRocketry]

Hello there everyone!
It's been a while, and I've written a fic that currently sits at 16k words. The issue is, I posted it on an alternate account here following an inactive period (the details of which I shall not delve into) would it be okay to restart that on my account or do you think it may be a lost cause?

[KerballingSmasher]

15 hours ago, SiriusRocketry said:

Hello there everyone!
It's been a while, and I've written a fic that currently sits at 16k words. The issue is, I posted it on an alternate account here following an inactive period (the details of which I shall not delve into) would it be okay to restart that on my account or do you think it may be a lost cause?

RESTART RESTART RESTART

 

Also, WB SIRIUS!

[KSK]

Hey Sirius!

Welcome back - glad to hear there's a new fic in progress!

I'd say it's totally up to you how you want to play it, whether that's restarting it on your @SiriusRocketry account or continuing it on your alt account. I'm sure it will most definitely not be a lost cause either way! If you do choose to continue with it on your alt account, please could you PM me the link (appreciate you might not want to link it in public), so that I can catch up.  

[SiriusRocketry]

24 minutes ago, KSK said:

Hey Sirius!

Welcome back - glad to hear there's a new fic in progress!

I'd say it's totally up to you how you want to play it, whether that's restarting it on your @SiriusRocketry account or continuing it on your alt account. I'm sure it will most definitely not be a lost cause either way! If you do choose to continue with it on your alt account, please could you PM me the link (appreciate you might not want to link it in public), so that I can catch up.  

I'm just wondering whether moderators would be upset, if they don't know it's my alt

 

[KSK]

1 minute ago, SiriusRocketry said:

I'm just wondering whether moderators would be upset, if they don't know it's my alt

Ahh - I hadn't considered that. Might be best to ask one of them - they're an understanding bunch. If they turn out not to be happy with you running an alt, then please do restart the story as Sirius!

If that helps?

[KerballingSmasher]

Shhhhh...we just don't need to tell the mods.