[1.12.5] Cormorant Aeronology - Mk3 Space Shuttle

[JoseEduardo]

2 hours ago, trooperMNG said:

OP: soviets really made a nice copy-paste version of the STS this time

the one in his album seems like a very cool looking custom variant, but this was an early design for Buran, OS-120:



I have no idea why they dropped it and went for the Buran as we know it though

[trooperMNG]

50 minutes ago, JoseEduardo said:

the one in his album seems like a very cool looking custom variant, but this was an early design for Buran, OS-120:



I have no idea why they dropped it and went for the Buran as we know it though

The Energia-derived vehicles (and they are MANY) could have been one of the most powerful and versatile launchers in the world... and anyway buran.ru 3d models are more than awesome!

[Pak]

8 hours ago, ZobrAA said:

@Pak I love this mod, thx alot!

Some problems, that I've noticed after some usage:

1) Shuttle, made with this parts have a serious luck of yaw stability. I have to clip 10 (ten) square wings (wing area = 1 for each) inside engine section to make shuttle more or less flyable.

2) MMU did not have SAS(!!!) so it's very hard to contlol and almost impossible to dock back to the MMU Rack... Also gyros are too weak to use MMU for station assembly or such. My solution here was:

3) The main problem at this time, but I not sure if it exactly on mod side, correct me if I wrong. So, HUGE problem is that, cargo inside of cargo bay did not shielded from aero forces on reentry. So there a lot more drag, that it should be, and some parts get ripped off by aero stream on reentry... I've tried clipping cargo colliders to be exactly inside of cargo bay collider, I've tried to switch scenes after closing bay door and before reentry.... Nothing help to prevent that.

May be there are another way to play around that?

4) Almost forget, some compability:

6) Need to change part name designator Airlock to CAAirlock to prevent conflicts (for example HabTech have the same named part). ....or this is not a problem?

Thanks, Zobr

1. I'd take a look at where and how you're transitioning into the denser atmosphere. Around 1000-600m/s is a major flat spin danger area. At this point you should be pretty much hands off on the controls and start moving into level flight. This is also where the rudder speedbreak comes in. Once you get closer to 600m/s you'll want to be pitching down to remain stable.

Also consider where your fuel is. With the shuttle you'll want to push everything forward into the nose and with the buran you'll want to be heavier in the tail.

2. Yeah I guess not. I only test in sandbox where probe cores all have the full SAS. I added it. The gyros were intentionally weak because of the old small craft wobble issues. 1.1.2 seemed to have cleaned that up a bit so they're raised in the 1.1.3 update I'm working on. I test the MMU at 10-12tons so for anything beyond that I would add some additional help on the module itself.

3. Stock issue. I don't mess with the cargo bays, only add a texture.

4. Thanks I'll add that in.

6. Not an issue.

 

 

Couldn't sleep so I started a separate project I've had in mind for a while. The Weka Shuttle! (X-20)

The goal would be a handful of parts to make smaller shuttles (1.875m) earlier in the tech tree aimed at small 1.25m payloads, crew, and tourism activities.

I'll mess with it more after the 1.1.3 update (decoupler and little fixes).

 

 

 

[Sgt.Shutesie]

17 minutes ago, Pak said:

Couldn't sleep so I started a separate project I've had in mind for a while. The Weka Shuttle! (X-20)

The goal would be a handful of parts to make smaller shuttles (1.875m) earlier in the tech tree aimed at small 1.25m payloads, crew, and tourism activities.

I'll mess with it more after the 1.1.3 update (decoupler and little fixes).

Awesome! I'm modeling the X-20 as well, I should recommend that the X-20 be based around a 1 meter fuselage, rather than a 1.25 meter one, it is much more accurate and fits well to the 1.875 meter diameter of BDB's Titan parts.  When you get around to making the skids for it, could you give me a call? I'm having trouble figuring out how to animate them. 

Edited July 8, 2016 by Sgt.Shutesie

[davidy12]

18 minutes ago, Pak said:

Thanks, Zobr

1. I'd take a look at where and how you're transitioning into the denser atmosphere. Around 1000-600m/s is a major flat spin danger area. At this point you should be pretty much hands off on the controls and start moving into level flight. This is also where the rudder speedbreak comes in. Once you get closer to 600m/s you'll want to be pitching down to remain stable.

Also consider where your fuel is. With the shuttle you'll want to push everything forward into the nose and with the buran you'll want to be heavier in the tail.

2. Yeah I guess not. I only test in sandbox where probe cores all have the full SAS. I added it. The gyros were intentionally weak because of the old small craft wobble issues. 1.1.2 seemed to have cleaned that up a bit so they're raised in the 1.1.3 update I'm working on. I test the MMU at 10-12tons so for anything beyond that I would add some additional help on the module itself.

3. Stock issue. I don't mess with the cargo bays, only add a texture.

4. Thanks I'll add that in.

6. Not an issue.

 

 

Couldn't sleep so I started a separate project I've had in mind for a while. The Weka Shuttle! (X-20)

The goal would be a handful of parts to make smaller shuttles (1.875m) earlier in the tech tree aimed at small 1.25m payloads, crew, and tourism activities.

I'll mess with it more after the 1.1.3 update (decoupler and little fixes).

 

 

 

IS EVERYONE MAKING AN X-20 THESE DAYS?!?!??!?!??!?!??!?!??!

[Pak]

37 minutes ago, Sgt.Shutesie said:

Awesome! I'm modeling the X-20 as well, I should recommend that the X-20 be based around a 1 meter fuselage, rather than a 1.25 meter one, it is much more accurate and fits well to the 1.875 meter diameter of BDB's Titan parts.  When you get around to making the skids for it, could you give me a call? I'm having trouble figuring out how to animate them. 

Yeah I put some thought into it and it pains me to not incorporate BDB's lovely transtage, but for me it's less about the X-20 and more about a medium shuttle so I may end up in an entirely different direction. I just like early shuttle concepts and the X-20's goofy space-trunk. Do you have a thread? I couldn't find any X-20 related things on the forums last night

 

33 minutes ago, davidy12 said:

Incomprehensible yelling

Yeah I guess

[macc92]

I have been doing some testing with the CA parts and it seems the lifting body sections do not create an effective 'seal' when connected to the Mk.3 cargo bay. I tested it by sending it down the runway with deployed solar panels, when a stock Mk.3 piece was used on the front and rear the panel did not break and read 'blocked by aero shielding', whereas when either of the lifting bodies are placed on the rear node of the cargo bay, the panels are not blocked and break when at speed (they can even collect sunlight with the doors closed).

 

 

[Sgt.Shutesie]

11 minutes ago, Pak said:

Yeah I put some thought into it and it pains me to not incorporate BDB's lovely transtage, but for me it's less about the X-20 and more about a medium shuttle so I may end up in an entirely different direction. I just like early shuttle concepts and the X-20's goofy space-trunk. Do you have a thread? I couldn't find any X-20 related things on the forums last night.

I don't have a thread, everything is based in the BDB thread atm. I will get a thread when I put something in game, whether it's a rcs thruster or a cockpit. 

Say, if you are looking for medium shuttles, look here. Look on different pages, there are tons of designs that come from every crazy mind at the aerospace companies.

Edited July 8, 2016 by Sgt.Shutesie

[CobaltWolf]

9 minutes ago, Pak said:

Yeah I put some thought into it and it pains me to not incorporate BDB's lovely transtage, but for me it's less about the X-20 and more about a medium shuttle so I may end up in an entirely different direction. I just like early shuttle concepts and the X-20's goofy space-trunk. Do you have a thread? I couldn't find any X-20 related things on the forums last night

You are more than welcome to take the Transtage parts and redistribute them - you may need to edit the textures on the tank, as they are on another texture sheet. I don't believe @Sgt.Shutesie is redistributing them, because his mod is meant as an expansion for BDB anyways.

[trooperMNG]

@Pak could I suggest a stockalike Dream Chaser? I miss it, I played it on 0.25 with a mod that no longer exist (at least not in the original way)

[Pak]

1 minute ago, CobaltWolf said:

You are more than welcome to take the Transtage parts and redistribute them - you may need to edit the textures on the tank, as they are on another texture sheet. I don't believe @Sgt.Shutesie is redistributing them, because his mod is meant as an expansion for BDB anyways.

Thanks. I think Shutesie and I just had the same idea. I'm looking more for something to fill in between the mk2 and mk3, so I think I might go with a completely different design. Especially since you guys are working on a great model already. I use BDB with all my saves so I don't need 2 Mk-20s!

 

8 minutes ago, Sgt.Shutesie said:

I don't have a thread, everything is based in the BDB thread atm. I will get a thread when I put something in game, whether it's a rcs thruster or a cockpit. 

Found it. Looks great!

[CobaltWolf]

Just now, Pak said:

Thanks. I think Shutesie and I just had the same idea. I'm looking more for something to fill in between the mk2 and mk3, so I think I might go with a completely different design. Especially since you guys are working on a great model already. I use BDB with all my saves so I don't need 2 Mk-20s!

Hrmm. Perhaps @TimothyC knows of some other designs to take inspiration from. According to his roadmap, @Sgt.Shutesie also wants to do HL-20 at some point. But I don't believe that ship is any bigger.

Something inbetween Mk2 and Mk3... what sort of size would it be able to hold? 1.875m parts?

[Pak]

4 minutes ago, CobaltWolf said:

Hrmm. Perhaps @TimothyC knows of some other designs to take inspiration from. According to his roadmap, @Sgt.Shutesie also wants to do HL-20 at some point. But I don't believe that ship is any bigger.

Something inbetween Mk2 and Mk3... what sort of size would it be able to hold? 1.875m parts?

Oh no worries. I've got some ideas.

Design goal-wise I mostly want a rocket launched shuttle that can deal with bulkier 1.25m payloads maybe up to 1.875m. I like reusability and flying stuff, so it would be nice to have that option during the earlier 'capsule era' of the tech tree. Lower tech and more utilitarian than the sleek mk2 bits

[CobaltWolf]

Just now, Pak said:

Oh no worries. I've got some ideas.

Design goal-wise I mostly want a rocket launched shuttle that can deal with bulkier 1.25m payloads maybe up to 1.875m. I like reusability and flying stuff, so it would be nice to have that option during the earlier 'capsule era' of the tech tree. Lower tech and more utilitarian than the sleek mk2 bits

Definitely. Similarly, the X20 should come early, since it's actually closest to Mercury, perhaps somewhat inbetween Mercury and Gemini, in terms of tech level.

Obviously, you aren't required to do this since your mod isn't a BDB expansion, but my thoughts would be that @Sgt.Shutesie's X20 and this new design you're talking about would be useful during the MOS phase of the career, building small stations, sending out your first long range probes, and possibly culminating in small early tech landings. So the X20 would be useful as a crew ferry, very small cargos, and other [REDACTED] assignments, while yours would be able to lift bigger cargo.

[Pak]

4 minutes ago, CobaltWolf said:

Definitely. Similarly, the X20 should come early, since it's actually closest to Mercury, perhaps somewhat inbetween Mercury and Gemini, in terms of tech level.

Obviously, you aren't required to do this since your mod isn't a BDB expansion, but my thoughts would be that @Sgt.Shutesie's X20 and this new design you're talking about would be useful during the MOS phase of the career, building small stations, sending out your first long range probes, and possibly culminating in small early tech landings. So the X20 would be useful as a crew ferry, very small cargos, and other [REDACTED] assignments, while yours would be able to lift bigger cargo.

Yep. That's the thought

[macc92]

1 hour ago, macc92 said:

has anyone else been having this occurrence or is it just me?

[CobaltWolf]

5 hours ago, Pak said:

Yep. That's the thought

So, I know you posted a thing in @akron's stream chat, but I stumbled across this:

http://www.aerospaceprojectsreview.com/blog/?p=13

[Pak]

5 hours ago, macc92 said:

has anyone else been having this occurrence or is it just me?

Not really sure what we're looking at. Could you explain the problem?

26 minutes ago, CobaltWolf said:

So, I know you posted a thing in @akron's stream chat, but I stumbled across this:

http://www.aerospaceprojectsreview.com/blog/?p=13

Whoa that's pretty cool.

 

I ended up with this guy based on a Grumman design. I'm liking it so I'll probably stick with it for now. The original fuselage I posted is still in there so the blended wing will be separate parts. Trying to keep things pretty kerbal with this one.

[Cuky]

3 hours ago, Pak said:

Not really sure what we're looking at. Could you explain the problem?

He explained it in his original post, but seems that he didn't quote the text he wrote above those two screens, so here it is:

10 hours ago, macc92 said:

I have been doing some testing with the CA parts and it seems the lifting body sections do not create an effective 'seal' when connected to the Mk.3 cargo bay. I tested it by sending it down the runway with deployed solar panels, when a stock Mk.3 piece was used on the front and rear the panel did not break and read 'blocked by aero shielding', whereas when either of the lifting bodies are placed on the rear node of the cargo bay, the panels are not blocked and break when at speed (they can even collect sunlight with the doors closed).

Edited July 9, 2016 by Cuky

[ZobrAA]

9 hours ago, macc92 said:

has anyone else been having this occurrence or is it just me?

Seems like my problem with "not aero-shielded payload at reentry"... But I cannot understand why - the only thing this mod does to cargobay:

@PART[mk3CargoBayL]{

	MODULE
	{
		name = FStextureSwitch2
		moduleID = 0
		objectNames = Base;BayDoor1;BayDoor2
		textureRootFolder = Cormorant Aeronology/Assets/
		textureNames = Mk3CargoBay;Mk3CargoBayThermal
		textureDisplayNames = Stock;Thermal
		nextButtonText = Change Texture
		prevButtonText = Previous Texture
		statusText = Current Texture
		switchableInFlight = false
		repaintableEVA = false
		showPreviousButton = false
		updateSymmetry = true
		showInfo = true
	}
}	

So no mentioning of any nodes or ModuleCargoBay

[ZobrAA]

16 hours ago, trooperMNG said:

the one in his album seems like a very cool looking custom variant

17 hours ago, JoseEduardo said:

soviets really made a nice copy-paste version of the STS this time

Glad you like it guys Actually my Boreas Transportation System is like a hybrid of Space Shuttle and Buran. As a more eye candy, here full mission log of BTS-2 with pics:

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
				BTS-2 LittlePonny-2
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Launch Date: Y1 D110 T17:35
Crew: Jebediah Kerman, Valentina Kerman, Bill Kerman, BoB Kerman, Tito Kerman, Chadzer Tyuri
Lifter: BTL (Boreas Transportation System)
Mission: LKO Research & Tests, Tourism, HEKO LittlePony & Redock to shuttle
Payload: LittlePony-2
Vehicle Mass: 494t
Payload Mass: ~18t
Mission Route: LKO 30.33° 77.1x76.7km
		LittlePony-2 EKO 30.35° 19.7Mmx75.8km
		LittlePony-2 Iclination multichange 30.35° -> 4.85° -> 30.35° 19.7x77km
		LittlePony-2 LKO 30.33° 77.1x76.7km
Mission Duration: 24h
Mission Outcome: Total Success (no contract reward due to contract system bug)

Side note: External Tank is LH2-Ox and KS-25 are remade to be cryogenic. Also yes, this is not a stock Kerbin, it's from my custom RescaleZ - 365 days Kerbin x3.2 Proper Resonance Rescale

[macc92]

10 hours ago, Pak said:

Not really sure what we're looking at. Could you explain the problem?

I have been done some testing with the CA parts and it seems the lifting body sections do not create an effective 'seal' when connected to the Mk.3 cargo bay. I tested it by sending it down the runway with deployed solar panels, when a stock Mk.3 piece was used on the front and rear the panel did not break and read 'blocked by aero shielding', whereas when either of the lifting bodies are placed on the rear node of the cargo bay, the panels are not blocked and break when at speed (they can even collect sunlight with the doors closed).

[gp]

I'm only posting to tell you how great this mod continues to be. The new parts are great! I hope you keep working on it.

[Pak]

1 hour ago, gp said:

I'm only posting to tell you how great this mod continues to be. The new parts are great! I hope you keep working on it.

Thanks gp, glad you like it. There's plenty more to do

 

3 hours ago, macc92 said:

I have been done some testing with the CA parts and it seems the lifting body sections do not create an effective 'seal' when connected to the Mk.3 cargo bay. I tested it by sending it down the runway with deployed solar panels, when a stock Mk.3 piece was used on the front and rear the panel did not break and read 'blocked by aero shielding', whereas when either of the lifting bodies are placed on the rear node of the cargo bay, the panels are not blocked and break when at speed (they can even collect sunlight with the doors closed).

Thanks. Not sure how I missed the text. I can't seem to see the bottom half of embedded imgur albums anymore. Maybe that's it

Let me do a quick functions check with you here to make sure we're on the same page.

1. Bay doors closed. Solar panels cannot deploy while stowed

2. Open bay and deploy panels

3. Close bay. Solar panels should now read 0.0 sun exposure, blocked by mk3cargobay

 

If these were the same steps you took I just fixed it. Luckily it was a lightbulb moment with the 'seal' comment. I had the main node on the shuttle bottoms as size 2 for whatever reason. I switched it to size 3 and it fixed it. This might be part of the weird quick loads some people were seeing too. Still seeing drag on some parts in the cargo bay as expected, but it might help with some bits falling off during reentry since it wasn't protecting the solar panels before.

 

Thanks for looking into it, @macc92

[ZobrAA]

3 hours ago, Pak said:

If these were the same steps you took I just fixed it. Luckily it was a lightbulb moment with the 'seal' comment. I had the main node on the shuttle bottoms as size 2 for whatever reason. I switched it to size 3 and it fixed it. This might be part of the weird quick loads some people were seeing too. Still seeing drag on some parts in the cargo bay as expected, but it might help with some bits falling off during reentry since it wasn't protecting the solar panels before.

Can you tell where and what need to be size 3 for a quick hand made fix?