What would a Mars colony have to offer in the way of goods and services?

[Robotengineer]

What would a Mars colony have to offer in the way of goods and services? 

In the past, colonies have been established for economic, faith and political reasons. I am concerned with the first and to a lesser extent the last. On the issue of the first, there will be no gold, beaver skins or crops to be exported to Earth, so the goods will have to be of a different sort.

Tourism might be a major player on Mars after the colony matures, but IMO, the number of people who would be willing to spend years of their life in transit and on Mars, and have the wealth to afford it, would not be large enough to support a large tourism scene.

The biggest economic boon, at least at first, would be entertainment. The whole colonization project could be streamed live*, or scripted to and turned into a reality tv show (I would hate to see the crowning achievement of our species be lowered to that level). Of course, after the first few years the novelty and awe would wear off and the money flow would start to wane.  

These are just my initial thoughts, and I look forward to seeing yours. 

*At least as live as one can get with the time delay. 

[fredinno]

1 minute ago, Robotengineer said:

What would a Mars colony have to offer in the way of goods and services? 

In the past, colonies have been established for economic, faith and political reasons. I am concerned with the first and to a lesser extent the last. On the issue of the first, there will be no gold, beaver skins or crops to be exported to Earth, so the goods will have to be of a different sort.

Tourism might be a major player on Mars after the colony matures, but IMO, the number of people who would be willing to spend years of their life in transit and on Mars, and have the wealth to afford it, would not be large enough to support a large tourism scene.

The biggest economic boon, at least at first, would be entertainment. The whole colonization project could be streamed live*, or scripted to and turned into a reality tv show (I would hate to see the crowning achievement of our species be lowered to that level). Of course, after the first few years the novelty and awe would wear off and the money flow would start to wane.  

These are just my initial thoughts, and I look forward to seeing yours. 

*At least as live as one can get with the time delay. 

Realistically, there is no economic driver.

[Spaceception]

A vacation joint, Unless we develop ultrafast propulsion technology's, like fusion drives, getting stuff from Mars to Earth would be stupid and worthless. If it were the question of the Moon, and NEO's, it'd be metals.

Edited January 16, 2016 by Spaceception

[Bill Phil]

There's more economic incentive in asteroids and free space colonies. Simply because shipping from Mars is much more costly.

[SargeRho]

You can build a space elevator on Mars, with current materials. That would require relocating Phobos though, you can also use a mass driver to shoot things most of the way to orbit.

Mars could export materials, but also at some point culture, so, movies, games, books, as well as all sorts of scientific innovations.

Also possibly spacecraft, once the colony is large enough?

Edited January 16, 2016 by SargeRho

[sojourner]

Luxury goods would be the only real export and that would take a very mature colony to begin with.  Imagine a Martian vintage of wine grown in vines cultivated in the martian soil. Or exotic wood grown under 1/3 gravity.

 

Things that can't be reproduced elsewhere.

[Nuke]

i think people will be driven away rather than to. for example mining. say looming environmental collapse forces a moratorium on all but essential mining operations. so people might go to mars to escape the bureaucracy of legal mining operations on earth (which no doubt cost more than launching a space colony). that of course ignores the fact that in that scenario our economy will be so shot to hell that launching a colony ship would be impossible.

Edited January 16, 2016 by Nuke

[fredinno]

11 minutes ago, sojourner said:

Luxury goods would be the only real export and that would take a very mature colony to begin with.  Imagine a Martian vintage of wine grown in vines cultivated in the martian soil. Or exotic wood grown under 1/3 gravity.

 

Things that can't be reproduced elsewhere.

You could simulate those in an orbital space station tho.

[Nibb31]

35 minutes ago, sojourner said:

Luxury goods would be the only real export and that would take a very mature colony to begin with.  Imagine a Martian vintage of wine grown in vines cultivated in the martian soil. Or exotic wood grown under 1/3 gravity.

 

Things that can't be reproduced elsewhere.

I don't think perchlorate salts will make a very good wine.

[RainDreamer]

Habitable land. Once the world population is high enough people have to go somewhere.

[Mitchz95]

I doubt it could offer anything, to be honest. At least not until interplanetary travel becomes cheaper and/or faster than doing stuff on Earth.

The only real reason to colonize Mars is because someone wants to colonize Mars for non-profit reasons. Once it's there, the trading would be between independent Martian settlements.

[fredinno]

39 minutes ago, RainDreamer said:

Habitable land. Once the world population is high enough people have to go somewhere.

The Moon and LEO are better for that, especially since LEO stations can have 1G. 

[SomeGuy123]

Don't laugh.  In my futuristic "fan fic" world...big companies set up on Mars to

a.  Research illegal subjects free from being spied on by regulators (the really illegal labs are out on Pluto)

b.  Tax evasion purposes 

[Scotius]

"For SCIENCE!" And also as a conveniently close staging and supply base for the exploration of asteroid belt. On Earth many cities and ports began as trading posts, coal stations etc.

[Spaceception]

4 hours ago, SomeGuy123 said:

Don't laugh.  In my futuristic "fan fic" world...big companies set up on Mars to

a.  Research illegal subjects free from being spied on by regulators (the really illegal labs are out on Pluto)

b.  Tax evasion purposes 

I really want to give you rep, but it won't let me, why can't I give out more than 25 likes!?

[Tw1]

6 hours ago, SomeGuy123 said:

b.  Tax evasion purposes 

You could almost be on to something there....

[Albert VDS]

Mars has a lot of science to offer and possibly answer to the most important question "Are we alone?".

[Kaos]

In the beginning, construction of stuff on Mars would be more important, as a base there would be quite dependent on imports from earth. The sooner most of the things needed are constructed on Mars the cheaper the construction of a Mars colony would be.

Beyond that point: A lot of money is made by selling some kind of data. Be it films, computer programs or scientific results. I mean: Would you have refused to buy KSP, if it was developed by some company on Mars?

But there are also opportunities for selling material stuff: Delta-v from Mars to GEO is 7 km/s, delta-v from earth to GTO is 12 km/s. So transporting satellites, fuel or other stuff to GEO could earn them some bucks.

This topic has to be seen a bit from the financial point of few: The construction is expensive and has to be supported somehow from earth. Be it gouvernancial, rich people that want to see a Mars colony or some other source. As soon as the colony is big anough and can produce most of its own stuff, the need some internal economy system (I know there is disagreement how big such a colony has to be or whether this is possible at all, but if it is not possible there will be no colony in the long run and I try to answer what a colony could sell. I also would discuss whether it is possible, but not in this thread). For the daily live, people on Mars would use some Mars currency for which they buy stuff produced on Mars. Nevertheless there would be some exchange between Mars and Earth currency, be it because some people find it cool to own 25 Mars bucks or some people want to trade something and need the other currency. If people on Mars can build rockets and deliver stuff to Earth, they can earn Earth money, even if they sell stuff that can be produced easily on Earth. Then Earth bound production would be a lot less complicated for the same goods an more profitable. But if the marslings strongly desire Earth money for some Earth goods, they would do it nevertheless. So something will be exported on the long run from Mars to Earth. But then of course it would be something where they get the most money per effort. This is why I suspect the main export goods to be data and stuff for other locations in the solar system.

[Spaceception]

1 minute ago, Albert VDS said:

Mars has a lot of science to offer and possibly answer to the most important question "Are we alone?".

I kinda don't want there to be life on Mars, so we can Colonize/Terraform without the UN getting in the way. I much rather it be Europa that has life.

[Snikersnee]

We can better understand the universe and solar system. A human can do way more than a rover. A human can say, "Hey, that doesn't look right..." and can also move faster. (Yeah we don't have lasers attached to us, but we're getting there)

[Albert VDS]

It would actually be much more beneficial for humans if they is life on Mars. We would have a second example of life and could lead to an understanding on how life actually work and possibly got started. and most importantly answer questions we didn't ask. All of which could help us as a species.

There is no reason to not colonize Mars if there is life there, the only problem is terraforming it. Which is a problem to begin with.

[sojourner]

9 hours ago, Nibb31 said:

I don't think perchlorate salts will make a very good wine.

Obviously, you'd have to make the soil viable to plant life, just as you would for anything you plan to grow there.

10 hours ago, fredinno said:

You could simulate those in an orbital space station tho.

Really? Have you seen how discerning wine aficionados can be about different vintages? Where the grapes are grown. what the weather was like ina given season, When they were picked in the season?

 

Let's go with another example. Cuban cigars.  How many have tried to replicate the cuban cigar and yet, the originals (as portrayed in media) are still the most prized in the world.

 

That's why you go with luxury goods, because they can't be exactly reproduced elsewhere.

[tater]

Tourism is a non-starter, almost no one with the vast wealth required is gonna go on a multi year vacation. Luxury goods from Mars is simply nonsense, IMO. Mars, like any destination in the solar system is only a destination due to humans constructing an entire environment. 

Why lift a 100% constructed environment to Mars when you can do it in an Earth-Moon Lagrange point? If you think there is something special about the chemical balance of Martian soil for wine, add that to the soil in your O'Neil colony.

The tax idea makes no sense, as moving any money to Earth to spend it would be the point where it gets taxed (it's either income at that point or a capital gain), and government won't leave money on the table.

Mars is almost perfectly wrong, sadly. Enough atmosphere to be a PITA, not enough to be terribly useful. Ditto with gravity. Deep space makes more sense to me.

 

Edited January 16, 2016 by tater

[sojourner]

1 hour ago, tater said:

 If you think there is something special about the chemical balance of Martian soil for wine, add that to the soil in your O'Neil colony.

 

 

If this is so easy, why do people praise one wine over another on earth?  Some things cannot be reproduced.  Having said all that. You would need a very mature Mars colony to begin with before local luxury goods would start to see any demand back on earth.  Look how long it took for similar things to develop in the Americas. Do you think there was any demand in europe for Kentucky Bourbon ten years after Columbus? 100 years? No, it took a good half a century.

Mars has nothing to offer in return in the near future beyond being a life boat for humanity.  It will take hundreds of years for it to develop into anything resembling even a small earth bound nation in terms of economy.

[tater]

Martian wine would end up being valuable simply because it was from Mars, frankly. Studies have shown that even wine experts cannot actually tell expensive wines from cheap wines, and if you tell people a wine is really expensive, they will like it better than the same wine given a lower price.

None the less, transportation costs are vastly too high to make those goods cost-effective as products. It's a novelty for the super rich, I don't see it being the major economic driver. Expensive wine on earth has exactly the same fixed costs as cheap wine, really. You could just as well send some barrels around the moon and back and sell "space wine."

Sadly I don't think there are any sound economic reasons for Mars.