[1.2 - 1.4] Real Scale Boosters, 0.16 (2018-03-12)

[MainSailor]

23 hours ago, NecroBones said:

 

So as an experiment, I threw together some resized fins to see how things look on the S-IB tank (going backward to make a makeshift S-I stage). Man, those fins look really out of proportion. Some of the diagrams I found indicate that the longer fins should stick out a total 8m in radius from the center, plus they're similar in height to that section of the stage, which just makes them look huge. They're bigger than the Saturn V fins. Yikes.

 

They still don't look right, so I'm having some doubts about the diagrams I found.

 

Yikes! Yeah those look way too big. I can't find diagrams with dimensions, but the photos for the Saturn I that I can see make the height look right, just the width wrong:

 

 

Edit: I also didn't realize there was a Block I of the Saturn I that didn't have fins at all even.

Edited March 10, 2016 by MainSailor

[NecroBones]

 

Yeah, I may need to tweak the fins some more. I did have them a hair too long according to the diagram, since I was forgetting that the base of the stage was wider than 6.6m. But even with the tweak, they still look pretty big. I have the other parts together to approximate the Saturn I, so here are some test images:

 

Edited March 10, 2016 by NecroBones

[Jodo42]

That upper stage... so strange! Looking great.

[Felbourn]

Yea, too wide. I did research this for Project Alexandria and though I can't remember the dimensions I found anymore, I can say with visual inspection that the narrow fins you have are correct but the wide ones should be about 60% of their current width.

[NecroBones]

4 hours ago, Felbourn said:

Yea, too wide. I did research this for Project Alexandria and though I can't remember the dimensions I found anymore, I can say with visual inspection that the narrow fins you have are correct but the wide ones should be about 60% of their current width.

 

Visually, I totally agree. What's hilarious is that the shorter ones are the ones I eye-balled, and the longer ones are where I trusted the diagrams I googled. I'll probably just shorten them and eyeball it for those too.

[KerbonautInTraining]

I'm still running RSB 0.6 but because it's not mentioned in the changelog: The SSME's plume appears to be scaled to fit the Vector. Also they are a bit loud, louder than an F-1, but that's just nitpicking. 

[NecroBones]

45 minutes ago, KerbonautInTraining said:

I'm still running RSB 0.6 but because it's not mentioned in the changelog: The SSME's plume appears to be scaled to fit the Vector. Also they are a bit loud, louder than an F-1, but that's just nitpicking. 

 

Yeah, I'm going to mix around some of the engine volumes and so forth. Part of the problem is the ones that run at higher pitch just end up sounding louder, even if they're set to the same volume.

 

Unfortunately without SmokeScreen as a dependency, the particle emitters can't be rescaled in stock (which is why some of the engines have some pretty terrible stand-ins right now). I'll probably just switch the SSME over to a different emitter for now.

[NecroBones]

 

I took a full meter off of the longer fins. It's looking closer to correct.

 

[Luc-maastricht]

I'm using this mod (which i really like)  with the Real Fuels mod, but the rockets won't liftoff. The engines start but it (the rocket) stays on the ground. I there some sort of solution for this ?

[LordOOTFD]

I have the same problem with thrust to weight being too low as well, and I looked into the real rockets and it seems the problem is real fuels giving approximately four times the fuel volumes it should, I don't know if those can be configured in this mod or if it's something from real fuels, but I can work around it by only loading part of the fuel.

[VenomousRequiem]

It seems like the TweakScale configs are still a little wonky, which sucks because I practically need this in my main install, which isn't at RSS, but rather Harder Solar System x2. "Wonky" as in whenever I hit the scale down button, they just get way bigger and won't even go back to original size.

Maybe my friend @Jso could help make them functional? We could include the stock sizes as options like BDB has, but then the particular part's original RSS size could be a default on the slider too! If... that makes sense.

[NecroBones]

3 hours ago, Luc-maastricht said:

I'm using this mod (which i really like)  with the Real Fuels mod, but the rockets won't liftoff. The engines start but it (the rocket) stays on the ground. I there some sort of solution for this ?

 

3 hours ago, LordOOTFD said:

I have the same problem with thrust to weight being too low as well, and I looked into the real rockets and it seems the problem is real fuels giving approximately four times the fuel volumes it should, I don't know if those can be configured in this mod or if it's something from real fuels, but I can work around it by only loading part of the fuel.

 

Huh, I might need to know more detail about the combination of fuel-related mods you're both using. The included config multiplies the fuel capacities if RealismOverhaul or RealFuels are installed, since they reduce the mass per unit of fuel. The multiplier tries to put the mass back to where it belongs. If something else is also multiplying it on behalf of RSB, then it could be applying twice. I may need to add more conditions to exclude in the patch, or just remove the patch altogether if we're getting supported from those mods now.

 

Is it just mainly RF that you're noticing an issue with? 

EDIT: Also, which engine configs are you using with RF (since their instructions ask you to choose one)?

EDIT 2: Can you post your KSP.log so I can see what it's doing?

 

23 minutes ago, VenomousRequiem said:

It seems like the TweakScale configs are still a little wonky, which sucks because I practically need this in my main install, which isn't at RSS, but rather Harder Solar System x2. "Wonky" as in whenever I hit the scale down button, they just get way bigger and won't even go back to original size.

Maybe my friend @Jso could help make them functional? We could include the stock sizes as options like BDB has, but then the particular part's original RSS size could be a default on the slider too! If... that makes sense.

 

Which version of RSB are you running? I updated the TS config in 0.5.1 with a greatly simplified config. Prior to that, it was breaking the way you describe. Since then, when I've tested, it appears to work correctly on my side. Maybe something else is also applying patches that affect RSB's TS config?

Edited March 12, 2016 by NecroBones

[VenomousRequiem]

I'll uh... Try it out again. I'm sorry if I've just wasted your time.

[NecroBones]

2 minutes ago, VenomousRequiem said:

I'll uh... Try it out again. I'm sorry if I've just wasted your time.

 

LOL, no worries. If you haven't tried it in a while, that might explain things. Heh.

 

[VenomousRequiem]

22 minutes ago, NecroBones said:

 

LOL, no worries. If you haven't tried it in a while, that might explain things. Heh.

 

Yes, it was fixed.

But uh...

That's at 3.75m scale... That's a lot of delta-V. 0.0

 

UPDATE:

I made you something! For those people who don't just want to use the F1B for their Saturn Multibodies. It just uses the F1 model, but they were identical anyways. 

I said I wanted to contribute and this is how I'll do it!

Edited March 12, 2016 by VenomousRequiem

[NecroBones]

21 minutes ago, VenomousRequiem said:

Yes, it was fixed.

But uh...

That's at 3.75m scale... That's a lot of delta-V. 0.0

 

UPDATE:

I made you something! For those people who don't just want to use the F1B for their Saturn Multibodies. It just uses the F1 model, but they were identical anyways. 

I said I wanted to contribute and this is how I'll do it!

 

LOL, well, 11 or 12  km/s of dV probably isn't too far out of spec for a lot of these rockets, when they don't have a proper payload on them. On the other hand, I haven't looked too closely at how TS is scaling the engines.

 

And awesome, I grabbed a copy of that config. Thanks!

 

 

Edited March 12, 2016 by NecroBones

[VenomousRequiem]

1 minute ago, NecroBones said:

And awesome, I grabbed a copy of that config. Thanks!

 

 

Just gave it a quick test run... Everything is in order. 

And yeah, I didn't test it before I posted it...  

[NecroBones]

Just now, VenomousRequiem said:

Just gave it a quick test run... Everything is in order. 

And yeah, I didn't test it before I posted it...  

 

Who needs testing anyway? lol

 

[Luc-maastricht]

7 hours ago, NecroBones said:

 

 

Huh, I might need to know more detail about the combination of fuel-related mods you're both using. The included config multiplies the fuel capacities if RealismOverhaul or RealFuels are installed, since they reduce the mass per unit of fuel. The multiplier tries to put the mass back to where it belongs. If something else is also multiplying it on behalf of RSB, then it could be applying twice. I may need to add more conditions to exclude in the patch, or just remove the patch altogether if we're getting supported from those mods now.

 

Is it just mainly RF that you're noticing an issue with? 

EDIT: Also, which engine configs are you using with RF (since their instructions ask you to choose one)?

EDIT 2: Can you post your KSP.log so I can see what it's doing?

On my Real Fuel mod i already edited the config file: useRealisticMass = false. but it doesn't seem to do anything (if i'm correct i'm using the stock alike RF Engine Configs v3.0.0).

Sorry i'm new in the mod community, so i don't know which logfile i should send , because in my logs directory i could only find logs from planets.

I was using the atlas, and when i fully loaded it with a 2ton satellite and fuel in every thank it ads up to around 2,754 ton, the delta v manager said is have around 8,478 m/s left. So i have no clue where this problem is coming from.

 

What even more strange was that i removed Real Fuels, and i still get the problem. Maybe it is in a other mod. Sorry for blaming Real Fuels

 

Edited March 12, 2016 by Luc-maastricht
Maybe a other mod

[NecroBones]

4 hours ago, Luc-maastricht said:

On my Real Fuel mod i already edited the config file: useRealisticMass = false. but it doesn't seem to do anything (if i'm correct i'm using the stock alike RF Engine Configs v3.0.0).

Sorry i'm new in the mod community, so i don't know which logfile i should send , because in my logs directory i could only find logs from planets.

I was using the atlas, and when i fully loaded it with a 2ton satellite and fuel in every thank it ads up to around 2,754 ton, the delta v manager said is have around 8,478 m/s left. So i have no clue where this problem is coming from.

 

What even more strange was that i removed Real Fuels, and i still get the problem. Maybe it is in a other mod. Sorry for blaming Real Fuels

 

 

OK yeah, it could certainly be another mod. Are these the only rocket parts that are giving you problems? If it's affecting other packs too, then it's almost certainly another mod. I think I've heard of cases where TweakScale or something else might cause the engines to have incorrect thrust, or having something like RF installed but having only the engines change fuel type, and not the tanks.

 

Something to verify: Is it doing this with all of the rocket types in RSB? Or just one or two? Can you check the engines and tanks in the VAB menu and see if they're using the same type of fuel?

 

The log I would need to see is KSP.log, which is in the main KSP folder, where the KSP.EXE file is.

 

[NecroBones]

 

I'm going to go ahead and get this update out, and let people play around with the new parts. I forgot to update the sample ETS Saturns to use the F-1A, but I'll get that on the next update.

 

0.8 (2016-03-12) - The "briefly flew" update.
 - Added Delta III parts and sample rocket.
 - Added Saturn I variant parts (S-IV stage + interstage-decoupler, S-I stage fins, RL10-A3 engine, etc).
 - Split the Agena-D model into two pieces, for easier modding of this mod.
 - Spherical propellant tanks moved to FuelTank menu category, and fuel oriented tech node.
 - Added Castor120/Carrack procedural fairing base.
 - Rebalanced the audio slightly for many engines.
 - Added more support for FilterExtensions, with icons.
 - Added Rocketdyne F-1A engine variant (using the F-1 model, config tweaked by VenomousRequiem).

 

Edited March 12, 2016 by NecroBones

[NecroBones]

I'm almost afraid to consider the Nova or the Sea Dragon. There probably isn't a whole lot of good data though, about specific dimensions, mass, etc anyway.

 

 

 

Or:

 

 

 

 

[KerbonautInTraining]

Is that just one giant engine? Holy smokes.

[NecroBones]

I think so, yes.

[Red Iron Crown]

KSP needs more Sea Dragon, would love to see your take on it.