Positives of console KSP

[The_Rocketeer]

Please don't demean yourselves by turning this into yet another master-race/Squad-bash thread.

I've been making changes to my living space lately, and I'm weighing up a lot of options for entertainment equipment. I don't want to get too deep into the particulars of that, but it would feed my decision making process to have some first-hand feedback about KSP on console.

I already have plenty of first-hand experience of KSP on PC. I also already know about the main and major complaints about console (e.g. savegames, lack of mods etc).

So, please let me know what you feel the best things about console KSP are, whatever they are - what are the things that really work?

******

Perhaps I wasn't clear enough, so I'll reiterate.

I do not want comparisons with PC KSP, discussions of PC hardware performance, or in fact anything to do with PCs whatsoever.

I do want discussion of what is enjoyable about KSP on console. If you don't play KSP on console, you really have nothing useful to contribute in this thread.

Edited September 22, 2016 by The_Rocketeer

[nosirrbro]

That's honestly hard to say inbetween clunky controls, vast amounts of bugs and lack of mods, but...

Ehm....

ehhhh..……

I've got nothing. Anybody else?

[Foxster]

Does the console version smell nicer maybe?

Other than that I have nothing either. I suspect it would be a pretty major downgrade. 

[Alshain]

I don't have a console version, but as I understanding it the console version is nearly identical to the PC version with a few exceptions.  (Not counting bugs, which will be fixed).

The main one is the lack of mouse & keyboard support despite the consoles actually supporting such devices.  The interface from the videos I've seen is still very much tailored to a mouse and keyboard, especially in the editor. Moving a mouse cursor with an analog stick doesn't seem appealing to me.

The advantages are simply that not everyone has a PC beast they can play games on.  Kids in particular often have consoles but not PC's, or at least not game capable ones.  There are very few laptops capable of playing games, and many do not know what they are shopping for when they buy a PC, but they can be certain that Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo, and even Steam (which actually plays the PC version) have built these boxes for the expressed purpose of playing games.  Unless you are a PC builder or buy a higher end computer, you may not have access to the PC version.

Edited September 22, 2016 by Alshain

[Majorjim!]

The only advantage of the console version is the price of the hardware, and that's it. You can play KSP on PC with a controller through a TV laying on the sofa so the price is literally the only advantage.

[Elthy]

8 minutes ago, Alshain said:

The advantages are simply that not everyone has a PC beast they can play games on.  Kids in particular often have consoles but not PC's, or at least not game capable ones.  There are very few laptops capable of playing games, and many do not know what they are shopping for when they buy a PC, but they can be certain that Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo, and even Steam (which actually plays the PC version) have built these boxes for the expressed purpose of playing games.  Unless you are a PC builder or buy a higher end computer, you may not have access to the PC version.

There werent many PCs sold in the last years that couldnt run KSP. Even low end laptops can run it, and i doubt there are people today without at least that.

[Alshain]

Just now, Elthy said:

There werent many PCs sold in the last years that couldnt run KSP. Even low end laptops can run it, and i doubt there are people today without at least that.

Are you sure about that?  I would guess at least 75% of PCs sold in the last years couldn't play it effectively.  Most of them are laptops these days, and they share RAM with the video card.  Very few laptops have the necessary dedicated video RAM (or processor!) to play Minecraft, let alone KSP, and they market that as a good thing!  Most manufacturers are taking advantage of Intel's built-on iGPU to reduce costs and size, this works fine for Microsoft Office and Internet Explorer.  However, that isn't really going to play KSP very well. 

 

[moogoob]

4 minutes ago, Alshain said:

Are you sure about that?  I would guess at least 75% of PCs sold in the last years couldn't play it effectively.  Most of them are laptops these days, and they share RAM with the video card.  Very few laptops have the necessary dedicated video RAM (or processor!) to play Minecraft, let alone KSP, and they market that as a good thing!  Most manufacturers are taking advantage of Intel's built-on iGPU to reduce costs and size, this works fine for Microsoft Office and Internet Explorer.  However, that isn't really going to play KSP very well. 

 

While not 30fps, and of course with all the settings turned down I can get KSP running on my 2009-era Macbook Pro 13". It's not fantastic, but runs with only 4GB of ram (shared with the onboard video!)

As to "very well", I concede that point. I wouldn't try to build any stations on my laptop, for example.

EDIT: And I've been running Minecraft on it since the days when my total was only 1GB ram.

Edited September 22, 2016 by moogoob

[Elthy]

11 minutes ago, Alshain said:

Are you sure about that?  I would guess at least 75% of PCs sold in the last years couldn't play it effectively.  Most of them are laptops these days, and they share RAM with the video card.  Very few laptops have the necessary dedicated video RAM (or processor!) to play Minecraft, let alone KSP, and they market that as a good thing!  Most manufacturers are taking advantage of Intel's built-on iGPU to reduce costs and size, this works fine for Microsoft Office and Internet Explorer.  However, that isn't really going to play KSP very well. 

 

It runs on an IGPU, although you have to tune down the settings depending on which generation you got. Those IGPUs improved a lot in the last years...

[wumpus]

11 minutes ago, Alshain said:

Are you sure about that?  I would guess at least 75% of PCs sold in the last years couldn't play it effectively.  Most of them are laptops these days, and they share RAM with the video card.  Very few laptops have the necessary dedicated video RAM (or processor!) to play Minecraft, let alone KSP, and they market that as a good thing!  Most manufacturers are taking advantage of Intel's built-on iGPU to reduce costs and size, this works fine for Microsoft Office and Internet Explorer.  However, that isn't really going to play KSP very well. 

I suspect that to get 75% of the laptops, you will have to include chromebooks that can't play it at all.  For anything much beyond a direct chromebook competitor, I've found that everything else works.  Could you post the specs (especially the GPU) of something that doesn't work?  The only one I've seen unacceptable is an old dual athlon (at least 10 years old) notebook.

I really hope that the console controller [on the console game.  Obviously doing it on a PC is trivial, assuming you have one] allows you to rotate and translate using left and right  console controls: that is one of the bigger drawbacks of mouse and keyboard and the only reason I'd want to plug in a  console controller.

[Sneaky Bstard Sword]

29 minutes ago, Alshain said:

Are you sure about that?  I would guess at least 75% of PCs sold in the last years couldn't play it effectively.  Most of them are laptops these days, and they share RAM with the video card.  Very few laptops have the necessary dedicated video RAM (or processor!) to play Minecraft, let alone KSP, and they market that as a good thing!  Most manufacturers are taking advantage of Intel's built-on iGPU to reduce costs and size, this works fine for Microsoft Office and Internet Explorer.  However, that isn't really going to play KSP very well. 

 

Remember that RAM is only really a big issue for KSP if you install a ton of mods. And even if you do start to run short on an IGPU-based rig, there should be enough swap available to at least prevent a CTD from RAM shortages. 

I mean, even my $200 chromebook *can* run KSP (after installing Debian 8 via Crouton), just not above 15 fps in the VAB lmao. 

[Alshain]

Just now, Sneaky Bstard Sword said:

Remember that RAM is only really a big issue for KSP if you install a ton of mods. And even if you do start to run short on an IGPU-based rig, there should be enough swap available to at least prevent a CTD from RAM shortages. 

I mean, even my $200 chromebook *can* run KSP (after installing Debian 8 via Crouton), just not above 15 fps in the VAB lmao. 

Ok, well have fun trying to play this game on an iGPU and not getting overly frustrated with it.  I did that when my video card died last year and ultimately I'd just rather never play KSP than play it like that again.

[Sneaky Bstard Sword]

1 minute ago, Alshain said:

Ok, well have fun trying to play this game on an iGPU and not getting overly frustrated with it.  I did that when my video card died last year and ultimately I'd just rather never play KSP than play it like that again.

I actually used, back when I first built my desktop but before I ordered my dedicated GPU. It wasn't that bad in all honesty. My framerates were nothing stellar (no pun intended), but that's really not a big deal. 

[Red Iron Crown]

Aside from the usual console advantages (hassle-free, affordable, standardized hardware; simpler couch playing experience), I think the console versions have some achievements available that aren't on the PC version if that is important to the player.

[The_Rocketeer]

Perhaps I wasn't clear enough, so I'll reiterate.

I do not want comparisons with PC KSP, discussions of PC hardware performance, or in fact anything to do with PCs whatsoever.

I do want discussion of what is enjoyable about KSP on console. If you don't play KSP on console, you really have nothing useful to contribute.

Please take your negativity and discussion of PCs elsewhere.

Edited September 22, 2016 by The_Rocketeer

[Leopard]

Console is decently priced, has a lot better acceptance in the lounge, is a lot quieter and is easily hooked to a decent sized tv so overall takes a lot less space than a PC.

also the eggbox takes a lot less care and feeding than a windows PC (which I gave up on over a decade ago when I realised I was spending one evening a week just to keep it running, and the flipping thing always seemed to need to reboot a few times before I could use it).

Installing the game is a very simple process, no need to worry about conflicting drivers or discovering say the sound doesn't work.

Also a serious plus point, you have an eggbox, you buy the eggbox version, it works, I got a refund on the mac version as desire having one only about 6 months old it won't run it, 4GB ram not being enough for a game noting it needed 3GB minimum and 4GB recommended. Thought the world had moved on from such misleading minimum requirements.

 

The game isn't perfect, but once it works the overall experience is vastly better than mucking about trying to keep a PC alive

[Alshain]

@The_Rocketeer So you just want to know what is enjoyable about KSP in general then?  Didn't you say you have plenty of first hand experience?

[The_Rocketeer]

@Alshain do you play KSP on console?

[Leopard]

1 hour ago, wumpus said:

I suspect that to get 75% of the laptops, you will have to include chromebooks that can't play it at all.  For anything much beyond a direct chromebook competitor, I've found that everything else works.  Could you post the specs (especially the GPU) of something that doesn't work?  The only one I've seen unacceptable is an old dual athlon (at least 10 years old) notebook.

I really hope that the console controller [on the console game.  Obviously doing it on a PC is trivial, assuming you have one] allows you to rotate and translate using left and right  console controls: that is one of the bigger drawbacks of mouse and keyboard and the only reason I'd want to plug in a  console controller.

 

Macbook air, 2015 model, 4GB ram, i5 processor, latest OSX, rock solid.

except playing KSP, which I gave up on and got refunded, typically ran for a few minutes at best, normally a lot less, seemed to be a shortage of ram, 6 month old machine, that until very recently was the current spec.

[Elthy]

1 hour ago, wumpus said:

I suspect that to get 75% of the laptops, you will have to include chromebooks that can't play it at all.  For anything much beyond a direct chromebook competitor, I've found that everything else works.  Could you post the specs (especially the GPU) of something that doesn't work?  The only one I've seen unacceptable is an old dual athlon (at least 10 years old) notebook.

I really hope that the console controller [on the console game.  Obviously doing it on a PC is trivial, assuming you have one] allows you to rotate and translate using left and right  console controls: that is one of the bigger drawbacks of mouse and keyboard and the only reason I'd want to plug in a  console controller.

Is anyone using chromebooks at all? I havent seen one in my whole life, i thought those were an even worse flop than steam machines...

[Deddly]

Please keep this on topic, everyone. OP would like to discuss what parts about KSP work well on console.

If you would like to continue comparing hardware, please feel free to start a new thread about that.

[Guest]

I find the finer flight controls an undervalued treat.

[The_Rocketeer]

I have to say I find the direction this thread has taken, despite my cautions against it, really very depressing. This was not an invitation to bash consoles, it was an invitation for console players to come forward and volunteer something good about their experience of KSP. Some long-standing members of this community have acted and posted like serious reproductive organs and they should be ashamed of themselves.

You're better than this.

 

[RX2000]

I doubt that there are very many console players here on the forums yet.

[The_Rocketeer]

@RX2000 I agree the console-only demographic may still be a pretty marginal one (for now) in this community, but there have been enough of them to create some heated and controversial discussions on other topics, and to highlight, expound on, and bitterly complain about certain bugs. I may be fishing in a small pool, but I don't think it's entirely lifeless, and I certainly don't want anybody dumping pollution in it.