[Minimum KSP: 1.12.2] Heisenberg - Airships Part Pack

[Angelo Kerman]

2 minutes ago, 19chickens said:

This is awesome!  I threw together an airship (Hangar Extender is a must) but when I loaded a Buffalo it kinda tipped over.  Oops.

Also, is there a craft file for the Akron?

Not for the Akron, I'm planning on using it for a story, and besides, it combines the Heisenberg, Buffalo, Pathfinder, and MOLE mods, so you'd need all of them to use it. I'd have to redesign the airship to use just the parts in the Heisenberg mod along with stock parts. I suppose I can create the KSNS Macon (ZRS-5), named after the USS Macon (ZRS-5), for the next release, that just uses the Heisenberg and stock parts.

The airship will flip over if you're not careful. That seems to be the number one problem people are having, although the Akron is pretty well balanced and flies just fine. Regardless, next update will have a significant boost to the gyro ring toque (like 500 units of torque), along with a bump on its ElectricCharge requirements.

12 minutes ago, Enceos said:

@Angel-125 It's yours, I donate

Crossing fingers for simple internals :3

Thanks! I'll do some tweaks and see what I come up with.

[Shnyrik]

47 minutes ago, Angel-125 said:

you can attach the flight deck fairing to the flight deck, and then stick an extension onto the fairing

Hm, it really works Thanks!

[Enceos]

@Angel-125 Meanwhile in my universe...

Your Gondola parts are one of a kind! )) Wanted to sculpt a big cockpit for my ships myself, but your mod exceeded all my expectations.

Edited January 14, 2017 by Enceos

[Shnyrik]

On 13.01.2017 at 10:08 PM, Dr.Wolfram said:

So here some good tips i learned  being airship pirate  ... ehm to avoid flipping

1. Add moar Gyro-rings

I'm afraid I'll have to argue with that

To my mind, keeping CoM and center of buoyancy (CoB) together is much-much-much more important then any gyro-rings or winglets.

As for the CoM, it is rather easy. You just need to move it somewhere to the geometrical center of your airship by balancing fuel tanks. The CoB is not shown in editor, so you'll have to tune it after launch.

The easiest way (to my mind) is during the first launch of airship to:
1) turn off all controls
and
2) by increasing (or decreasing) buoyancy of nose or tail make it hover perfectly horizontal.

This will make the airship stable and controllable. If you remember the adjustments you did, during later launches you'll be able to make them before releasing the launch clamps. This will make launches fast and easy.

Then you'll have to remember, that lift gaining from speed changes your balance a bit. So after you reach the desired speed you might have to finetune your buoyancy balance. After that you may leave your airship flying in background for hours without any autopilot at all.

Of course, the airship will still gain altitude slowly no matter what, just because spending fuel makes it lighter. So you'll still have keep an eye on it. And one more: watch out for mountains

 

On 13.01.2017 at 10:08 PM, Dr.Wolfram said:

Allign Center of Thrust of those lateral propellers with CoM of your ship, missallighning them will pitch the nose of your ship

Yes. And if you still have your propellers not on one line with your CoM there still is a way to fly relatively easy.

When you want to move, you have to:
1) start from the engines that are closer to the line of symmetry (the upper ones);
2) accelerate re-e-e-ealy slowly.

When you get some speed, your rudders will be able to parry any torque you get from misaligned engines (if your CoM and CoB are balanced, of course).

Besides, changing thrust of propellers on just one side (either manually, or by mod like Davon Throttle Control) will make your behemoth perform mush more intense maneuvers, than you can imagine  

Edited January 14, 2017 by Shnyrik

[Dr.Wolfram]

3 hours ago, Shnyrik said:

I'm afraid I'll have to argue with that
 

Oh, I didnt knew how to tune CoB, thanks for advices!.. You sir should write a manual about this (awesome) mod Well, like i say: the more u play Ksp, the moar u learn

Already knew the trick with propellers, i even reached pro-lvl where i park my ship in Jeb's style 

[Deizelpunk]

4 hours ago, Shnyrik said:

I'm afraid I'll have to argue with that

To my mind, keeping CoM and center of buoyancy (CoB) together is much-much-much more important then any gyro-rings or winglets.

As for the CoM, it is rather easy. You just need to move it somewhere to the geometrical center of your airship by balancing fuel tanks. The CoB is not shown in editor, so you'll have to tune it after launch.

The easiest way (to my mind) is during the first launch of airship to:
1) turn off all controls
and
2) by increasing (or decreasing) buoyancy of nose or tail make it hover perfectly horizontal.

This will make the airship stable and controllable. If you remember the adjustments you did, during later launches you'll be able to make them before releasing the launch clamps. This will make launches fast and easy.

Then you'll have to remember, that lift gaining from speed changes your balance a bit. So after you reach the desired speed you might have to finetune your buoyancy balance. After that you may leave your airship flying in background for hours without any autopilot at all.

Of course, the airship will still gain altitude slowly no matter what, just because spending fuel makes it lighter. So you'll still have keep an eye on it. And one more: watch out for mountains

 

Yes. And if you still have your propellers not on one line with your CoM there still is a way to fly relatively easy.

When you want to move, you have to:
1) start from the engines that are closer to the line of symmetry (the upper ones);
2) accelerate re-e-e-ealy slowly.

When you get some speed, your rudders will be able to parry any torque you get from misaligned engines (if your CoM and CoB are balanced, of course).

Besides, changing thrust of propellers on just one side (either manually, or by mod like Davon Throttle Control) will make your behemoth perform mush more intense maneuvers, than you can imagine  

How do you keep it from exploding when you load it tho!

[Angelo Kerman]

42 minutes ago, Enceos said:

@Angel-125 Meanwhile in my universe...

Your Gondola parts are one of a kind! )) Wanted to sculpt a big cockpit for my ships myself, but your mod exceeded all my expectations.

Wow, looks great! Glad to see that I succeeded in making gondola parts that are very versatile. @Shnyrik Looks like a fine airship.

Speaking of airships, I'm working on some craft files. They won't include the AirPark part or carrier accessories, but I definitely recommend them. First up is the titular Heisenberg, made entirely from the parts pack and stock. She has two first-class cabins, two passenger cabins, and can carry cargo as well:

Walkways courtesy of @Enceos.

Next is the Macon, a modified Heisenberg-class airship that's been turned into a flying aircraft carrier. Macon has a wider hangar deck than her sister ship, the Akron. I'm still working on the mesh for the wide hangar fairing.

To complement the Macon, this is the Aeris 3V, a trainer VTOL aircraft:

Her VTOL engines are a little weak, but you can fly her if careful.

Finally, this is the Skydancer, equipped with two habs, two science labs, two greenhouses, a drill, ISRU, and relays. She's ready to fly to Laythe- just add science.

These will be available in the next release.

[19chickens]

I've started work on an exploration airship!  Here's a Buffalo next to it:

Pretty happy.  I managed to get it onto the cargo lift!

Oh.  Oh god.

what have i done

I think I summoned the Kraken.

[Snoopy47]

1 hour ago, 19chickens said:

I've started work on an exploration airship!  Here's a Buffalo next to it:

Pretty happy.  I managed to get it onto the cargo lift!

Oh.  Oh god.

what have i done

I think I summoned the Kraken.

looks good, any trouble with the cargo lift? I cant get mine to work it only lets me open the doors and toggle the lights

 

[Angelo Kerman]

1 hour ago, Snoopy47 said:

looks good, any trouble with the cargo lift? I cant get mine to work it only lets me open the doors and toggle the lights

 

I haven't had any problems with the cargo lift. It works fine for me as long as I keep the airship in focus. Actually, it works even when it's not the focused vessel. I've added a couple of tweaks for the next release to do things like not persist the elevator travel distance if you unload the scene, so if you, say, lower the elevator, go back to the space center, and then come back, the elevator will be back in the ship. This is by design, the elevator is a bit of kraken-tech, and I don't trust KSP to properly set up its position and state when you leave the scene.

Also, if you run into a situation where the elevator is raising up past the hangar deck, try doing something sensible, and stop the elevator. It's not hard, there is a button to do that.

Edited January 15, 2017 by Angel-125

[19chickens]

That would be a good idea.  My issue was that I dropped the cargo lift down and then went to the Space Center.  This meant that when I drove the Buffalo out the lift thought it was 7 metres down but was fully up (no lower elevator button) so it "was" 14 metres down.  If I then raised it up it kept going up.  The way I solved it was to keep the Buffalo away whilst I lowered it and then raised it all the way up.  Then I went to the Space Center and back again, fixing it.

[Snoopy47]

2 hours ago, Angel-125 said:

I haven't had any problems with the cargo lift. It works fine for me as long as I keep the airship in focus. Actually, it works even when it's not the focused vessel. I've added a couple of tweaks for the next release to do things like not persist the elevator travel distance if you unload the scene, so if you, say, lower the elevator, go back to the space center, and then come back, the elevator will be back in the ship. This is by design, the elevator is a bit of kraken-tech, and I don't trust KSP to properly set up its position and state when you leave the scene.

Also, if you run into a situation where the elevator is raising up past the hangar deck, try doing something sensible, and stop the elevator. It's not hard, there is a button to do that.

I figured I may have missed something somewhere, if I right click the cargo lift it just has 2 buttons, (open door & lights) along with the sliders for the lights. 

Its the one thing preventing me from compleating a full blown flying mobile command center for Eve

[Angelo Kerman]

1 hour ago, Snoopy47 said:

I figured I may have missed something somewhere, if I right click the cargo lift it just has 2 buttons, (open door & lights) along with the sliders for the lights. 

Its the one thing preventing me from compleating a full blown flying mobile command center for Eve

Did you install the plugin that comes with the Heisenberg?

[Snoopy47]

1 hour ago, Angel-125 said:

Did you install the plugin that comes with the Heisenberg?

Plugins are all there yea

[Viscosity]

Im having an issue where the mod parts will not show up.

the hl and firespitter parts show up but the Heisenberg parts and the carrier parts wont show. im going to retry without the carrier parts but have low hopes for it.

Edited January 16, 2017 by Viscosity

[Angelo Kerman]

17 hours ago, Snoopy47 said:

Plugins are all there yea

Hm, ok, does this happen with new airships you've created or existing ones? Just trying to get a feel for what's going on as I don't see the issue you're reporting.

14 hours ago, Viscosity said:

Im having an issue where the mod parts will not show up.

the hl and firespitter parts show up but the Heisenberg parts and the carrier parts wont show. im going to retry without the carrier parts but have low hopes for it.

I'll need to see logs, there's not enough information. Make sure you install everything that comes with the mod.

[sirrliv]

Okay, I'm really sorry, but I am just utterly flummoxed by this rolling over problem. As an experiment, I've tried building just about the simplest airship I could think of how to build; basically three long envelop sections with a gyro ring at either end and a nose & tail cone in their proper places, the tailcone twisted round to an X pattern so the fins won't smack the runway, with a small Bison gondola slung underneath and engines extending at a slight downward angle from the gyro rings at either end of the ship (engines that I have yet to even turn on, I should note), all supported on stock 8 XL landing gear grouped fore and aft. No flight deck or anything on top since this is supposed to be a test ship. I'll see if I can post some pics to better explain how I built her and so you chaps can see what's going wrong.

Tried taking off, set the HL airship controls for auto pitch & auto elevation, airship barely lifted off the ground and then started rolling to starboard, ending up upside down. Tried again, this time remembering to turn on the SAS, which apparently activates the gyro rings. Same thing happened; lift off, roll over. In exasperation I added two more gyro rings so that there are now 4 rings total separating all envelop sections. Made no difference, still rolled on take-off.

I've tried my best to ensure that everything is symmetrical, that the COM remains in the center and slightly below center of the envelops, but no matter what I do it doesn't seem to make a difference, my ship just keeps ending up upside down. If anyone is willing, please PM me and I will gladly send you my .craft file for you to see what I'm doing wrong. As for me, I'm at a complete loss.

What's really vexing me the most is that I've never had this problem with any earlier version of this style of mod; I never had rolling problems with old Hooligan Labs airships, I didn't even have it with the initial iterations of Heisenberg here. But since the updates that added flight decks and the like something's happened and the stability is just gone and I don't know why or how to compensate for it.

[Angelo Kerman]

28 minutes ago, sirrliv said:

Okay, I'm really sorry, but I am just utterly flummoxed by this rolling over problem. As an experiment, I've tried building just about the simplest airship I could think of how to build; basically three long envelop sections with a gyro ring at either end and a nose & tail cone in their proper places, the tailcone twisted round to an X pattern so the fins won't smack the runway, with a small Bison gondola slung underneath and engines extending at a slight downward angle from the gyro rings at either end of the ship (engines that I have yet to even turn on, I should note), all supported on stock 8 XL landing gear grouped fore and aft. No flight deck or anything on top since this is supposed to be a test ship. I'll see if I can post some pics to better explain how I built her and so you chaps can see what's going wrong.

Tried taking off, set the HL airship controls for auto pitch & auto elevation, airship barely lifted off the ground and then started rolling to starboard, ending up upside down. Tried again, this time remembering to turn on the SAS, which apparently activates the gyro rings. Same thing happened; lift off, roll over. In exasperation I added two more gyro rings so that there are now 4 rings total separating all envelop sections. Made no difference, still rolled on take-off.

I've tried my best to ensure that everything is symmetrical, that the COM remains in the center and slightly below center of the envelops, but no matter what I do it doesn't seem to make a difference, my ship just keeps ending up upside down. If anyone is willing, please PM me and I will gladly send you my .craft file for you to see what I'm doing wrong. As for me, I'm at a complete loss.

What's really vexing me the most is that I've never had this problem with any earlier version of this style of mod; I never had rolling problems with old Hooligan Labs airships, I didn't even have it with the initial iterations of Heisenberg here. But since the updates that added flight decks and the like something's happened and the stability is just gone and I don't know why or how to compensate for it.

Try commenting out or removing the "CoMOffset = 0,0,4.5" lines in the airship hulls (in the HL10 folder).

 

[sirrliv]

4 hours ago, Angel-125 said:

Try commenting out or removing the "CoMOffset = 0,0,4.5" lines in the airship hulls (in the HL10 folder).

 

Thanks so much, sir. I did this and now everything works fantastically! I shall apply this process to the cargo elevator and other envelop parts.

[Angelo Kerman]

7 hours ago, sirrliv said:

Thanks so much, sir. I did this and now everything works fantastically! I shall apply this process to the cargo elevator and other envelop parts.

Good to know. I'll change that for the next release. I'm shooting for end of the month, I have plugin work to do, and need to create the wide fairing option.

[Odonian]

Here's a little agroponics base I just landed on Minmus built around Heisenberg flight decks. Love the form factor of the parts in this pack.

If only the color of Wild Blue cabin lights matched stock cabin lights. Maybe there is a simple way for me to change them?

Edited January 19, 2017 by Odonian

[Angelo Kerman]

6 minutes ago, Odonian said:

Here's a little agroponics base I just landed on Minmus built around Heisenberg flight decks. Love the form factor of the parts in this pack.

If only the color of Wild Blue cabin lights matched stock cabin lights. Maybe there is a simple way for me to change them?

Looks nice. For the lights, you can replace the Glass.dds texture with one of your own creation that matches stock lights.

[Enceos]

@Angel-125 Decided to make an ariship, but noticed that the Airship Utils button is missing. Do I need anything special for it to appear?

[DStaal]

5 minutes ago, Enceos said:

@Angel-125 Decided to make an ariship, but noticed that the Airship Utils button is missing. Do I need anything special for it to appear?

Do you have Hooligan Labs?  It's a dependency.  (It does all the airship stuff.)

[Enceos]

Just now, DStaal said:

Do you have Hooligan Labs?  It's a dependency.  (It does all the airship stuff.)

Didn't know that. Thanks!