Box of Stardust Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 (edited) 49 minutes ago, Xd the great said: It aims at the predicted point of the craft. Basically, to avoid anti aircraft fire, dont fly straight. The flying AI will make small turns to point the guns at the target. That doesn't answer the question at all. But I guess the wording was a bit clunky, so I also made an edit. Edited July 12, 2018 by Box of Stardust Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xd the great Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 1 hour ago, Box of Stardust said: That doesn't answer the question at all. But I guess the wording was a bit clunky, so I also made an edit. Ah I see what you mean. I will test it later. Spoiler: this is not gonna end well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xd the great Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 Well, no. I mounted gau 8 on the side of my fighters. Nothing hapened. For overshoulder guns, use vulcan turrets. I have an interceptor designed to gun down anything. You might wanna take a look at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Box of Stardust Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, Xd the great said: Well, no. I mounted gau 8 on the side of my fighters. Nothing hapened. For overshoulder guns, use vulcan turrets. I have an interceptor designed to gun down anything. You might wanna take a look at it. That still doesn't really answer the question. I don't need a construction solution, I'm looking for exact AI behavior. Precise AI behavior, as how it is peogrammed. I already build some of the most high-performing combat aircraft, and part of that is learning exactly how the AI works, down to the smallest behavioral quirks, which gives me knowledge of what to exploit when building and tuning the AI, and what to avoid. A slightly off-center gun, in my hypothesis, causes the AI to make minute adjustments to get the gun on the target, despite the gun being pointed perfectly center, instead of just aiming the plane at the target and letting the gun fire. I would test my question myself by pointing a fixed Vulcan off-center by an angle or so, and then try with that mirrored, but I'm not at my computer right now. Edited July 12, 2018 by Box of Stardust Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightguard Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 5 hours ago, Box of Stardust said: That still doesn't really answer the question. I don't need a construction solution, I'm looking for exact AI behavior. Precise AI behavior, as how it is peogrammed. I already build some of the most high-performing combat aircraft, and part of that is learning exactly how the AI works, down to the smallest behavioral quirks, which gives me knowledge of what to exploit when building and tuning the AI, and what to avoid. A slightly off-center gun, in my hypothesis, causes the AI to make minute adjustments to get the gun on the target, despite the gun being pointed perfectly center, instead of just aiming the plane at the target and letting the gun fire. I would test my question myself by pointing a fixed Vulcan off-center by an angle or so, and then try with that mirrored, but I'm not at my computer right now. oh no, my fighters' gonn' die I have a suggestion, can you put the radar windows, flir camera, and other stuff in rpm? or maybe put the weapon manager in rpm too? something like that. that way, it would be cool to use iva view when dogfighting (and/or boatfighting and tank fighting) @DoctorDavinci @Papa_Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoctorDavinci Posted July 12, 2018 Author Share Posted July 12, 2018 6 minutes ago, Nightguard said: oh no, my fighters' gonn' die I have a suggestion, can you put the radar windows, flir camera, and other stuff in rpm? or maybe put the weapon manager in rpm too? something like that. that way, it would be cool to use iva view when dogfighting (and/or boatfighting and tank fighting) @DoctorDavinci @Papa_Joe RPM isn't our mod, however all the hooks are there for that information to be displayed .... all it takes is for someone who knows how to make stuff for RPM to use it Perhaps that person could be you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightguard Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 49 minutes ago, DoctorDavinci said: RPM isn't our mod, however all the hooks are there for that information to be displayed .... all it takes is for someone who knows how to make stuff for RPM to use it Perhaps that person could be you uuuuh no. i dont even know how to do basic modding, i dunno how to make parts or iva's even... though... i'd like to learn... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papa_Joe Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 (edited) 8 hours ago, Box of Stardust said: That still doesn't really answer the question. I don't need a construction solution, I'm looking for exact AI behavior. Precise AI behavior, as how it is peogrammed. I already build some of the most high-performing combat aircraft, and part of that is learning exactly how the AI works, down to the smallest behavioral quirks, which gives me knowledge of what to exploit when building and tuning the AI, and what to avoid. A slightly off-center gun, in my hypothesis, causes the AI to make minute adjustments to get the gun on the target, despite the gun being pointed perfectly center, instead of just aiming the plane at the target and letting the gun fire. I would test my question myself by pointing a fixed Vulcan off-center by an angle or so, and then try with that mirrored, but I'm not at my computer right now. The deflection angle is based on the weapon's transform position. so no matter where it is mounted, it will be with reference to the weapon's direction of fire. You can see this in BDArmory\Modules\ModuleWeapon.cs around 1571 starting with "// aim assist". Edited July 13, 2018 by Papa_Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xd the great Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 8 hours ago, Box of Stardust said: That still doesn't really answer the question. I don't need a construction solution, I'm looking for exact AI behavior. Precise AI behavior, as how it is peogrammed. I already build some of the most high-performing combat aircraft, and part of that is learning exactly how the AI works, down to the smallest behavioral quirks, which gives me knowledge of what to exploit when building and tuning the AI, and what to avoid. A slightly off-center gun, in my hypothesis, causes the AI to make minute adjustments to get the gun on the target, despite the gun being pointed perfectly center, instead of just aiming the plane at the target and letting the gun fire. I would test my question myself by pointing a fixed Vulcan off-center by an angle or so, and then try with that mirrored, but I'm not at my computer right now. Well, my testing shows that the AI just points the plane at the enemy and shoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xd the great Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 So, in conclusion, if you make your guns not point straight ahead and straight at the back, you only have half the firepower if you are lucky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xd the great Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 The AI is so stupid that I can fly straight and not get shot at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Box of Stardust Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 58 minutes ago, Papa_Joe said: The deflection angle is based on the weapon's transform position. so no matter where it is mounted, it will be with reference to the weapon's direction of fire. You can see this in BDArmory\Modules\ModuleWeapon.cs around 1571 starting with "// aim assist". So how are multiple guns pointing in the same direction calculated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xd the great Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 50 minutes ago, Box of Stardust said: So how are multiple guns pointing in the same direction calculated? FIRE EVERYTHING pointing at the enemy. The plane points its nose at the enemy and fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Box of Stardust Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 2 minutes ago, Xd the great said: FIRE EVERYTHING pointing at the enemy. The plane points its nose at the enemy and fire. You still don't understand the depth of the questions I'm asking and the answers I'm looking for. Valiant effort for attempting to contribute though. Since you said you have some good fighter planes, let me give you an incremental challenge. Under AI-only dogfight competitions and using no turrets, have your planes beat my planes in this order: Challenge #1 Challenge #2 Challenge #3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XOC2008 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 To be accurate, the plane will attempt to point it's GUNS at the enemy and fire. I have had success with Schrage Musik BF-110s, firing straight up at the belly of bombers and positioning themselves there under AI. I have has an A-10 with the offset GAU that has a 2 degree downwards slope and it will lift the nose to fire at a flying target in front of it. The AI will calculate how to fire bases on the position of the fire transforms and the convergence/divergence of the line of fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Box of Stardust Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 11 minutes ago, XOC2008 said: To be accurate, the plane will attempt to point it's GUNS at the enemy and fire... The AI will calculate how to fire bases on the position of the fire transforms and the convergence/divergence of the line of fire. Yeah, I've assumed these based off of behavior of things like placing turrets on planes, and how weapons will try to slew onto target individually and only fire if the target is within the aim. 12 minutes ago, XOC2008 said: I have had success with Schrage Musik BF-110s, firing straight up at the belly of bombers and positioning themselves there under AI. I have has an A-10 with the offset GAU that has a 2 degree downwards slope and it will lift the nose to fire at a flying target in front of it. These are some very helpful notes; pretty much what I was looking for. So I guess that answers my original question. I was wondering how it interacts with multiple fixed weaponry (assumed pointed in the same direction with 0 convergence/divergence). I had an assumption that the AI takes an average aim point from them, but testing with the debug lines active made me figure that the AI fires guns if a target is within a certain variance from a specific gun's aim. Though, I'm still trying to wrap my head around the AI logic for something like this (not my current project, but good illustrator), with fairly significantly varying translate values for the guns; all the guns fire when the plane is pointed at a target: It also brings the hypothetical of how the AI would react if one side's guns were removed, leaving only the ones on the remaining half. Construction-wise, and why I asked all this in the first place, my current project has boiled down to: is it more effective (read: more compliant with AI behavior) to have a single over-shoulder, offset-to-side position (as in most fighter jets), or two guns mirrored on each side/a single centered gun? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xd the great Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, Box of Stardust said: You still don't understand the depth of the questions I'm asking and the answers I'm looking for. Valiant effort for attempting to contribute though. Since you said you have some good fighter planes, let me give you an incremental challenge. Under AI-only dogfight competitions and using no turrets, have your planes beat my planes in this order: Challenge #1 Challenge #2 Challenge #3 Oh well, my interceptor uses 18 vulcan turrets. Challenge unable to accept. I assume you should pm the dev team for answers then. Edited July 13, 2018 by Xd the great Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xd the great Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 I think the AI does not care about the weapons placement and just fire when an enemy is in range and may be hit by the weapon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrodriguez Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 26 minutes ago, Xd the great said: I think the AI does not care about the weapons placement and just fire when an enemy is in range and may be hit by the weapon. the "may be hit" I think is equivalent to 10-15% angle between the firetransform and the vessel.Com or vessel root part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xd the great Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 In short, MOAR GUNS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BF2_Pilot Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 (edited) Could you tell me how can i change the rocket sound and how to set the fire rate of the rocker pod ( 100RPM is too high for my turret) Emm, if i can change the model of the cannon shell is ok too. Edited July 13, 2018 by BF2_Pilot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xd the great Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Changing RPM requires turning off guard mode, seleting the weapon, mess with the arm button and sliding the slider for controlling RPM, which requires opening the GUI 4 hours ago, BF2_Pilot said: Could you tell me how can i change the rocket sound and how to set the fire rate of the rocker pod ( 100RPM is too high for my turret) Emm, if i can change the model of the cannon shell is ok too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKurgan Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 (edited) On 7/13/2018 at 10:21 AM, Xd the great said: Changing RPM requires turning off guard mode, seleting the weapon, mess with the arm button and sliding the slider for controlling RPM, which requires opening the GUI You stepped in what?? You shot WHO!?!? On 7/13/2018 at 5:33 AM, BF2_Pilot said: Could you tell me how can i change the rocket sound and how to set the fire rate of the rocker pod ( 100RPM is too high for my turret) If you want to edit the .cfg file for a weapon to change it's RPM, open the cfg file for that weapon, scroll down until you find: MODULE { name = ModuleWeapon Under that, look for roundsPerMinute = Change that to your desired RPM. Save and test The sound is at the bottom of ModuleWeapon. Look for this: fireSoundPath = In here put the path for your custom sound. Should look like this one from my mod: fireSoundPath = KTech/Parts/RGturret/RailGun Where the sound file is Railgun.wav Also notice the / instead of \ Edited July 14, 2018 by TheKurgan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gomker Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 On 7/10/2018 at 11:06 PM, Nightguard said: yeah, but if the kerbal g force setting is- oh right, ai still works if kerbals pass out. True, mainly these Gforce settings are for pure drone craft to allow you to stretch reality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sticky3002 Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 Hello! First thing, this mod is absolutely amazing. Second, I'm having this issue which I'm not sure if it's a bug or a toggable option and I'm kind of afraid this might be a stupid question since I'm a newbie ... But when I have my weapons toggled on and fire them at a target afterwards, the weapons automatically toggle off when any of the target craft's parts explodes. Let me elaborate, let's say a part from any craft within the physics range explodes, if I have my weapons toggled on they'll toggle off automatically. Here are some screenshots: Spoiler It's a bit of a non-issue since I can just hit my action group key to activate the weapons again, but I was wondering If I could get help on this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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