cubinator Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 I won't post the rest of the song until they catch one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sevenperforce Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 Here's today's mission in KSP: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 I can only presume the original point was to limit the ability of private US firms to produce imagery that might compromise national security. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 Lawyer friend agreed that nat sec was a possible compelling interest to discriminate based upon content. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatastrophicFailure Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 36 minutes ago, tater said: I can only presume the original point was to limit the ability of private US firms to produce imagery that might compromise national security. Right, because the picture from those two GoPros on the upper stage is just sooooo clear. [desire to throw tea into the harbor intensifies] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 You’d think regulation would then have to be narrow around that point. Maybe specifying ground res in cm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insert_name Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 Zubrin has proposed a lunar base plan launching on falcon 9 and falcon heavy http://spacenews.com/op-ed-moon-direct-how-to-build-a-moonbase-in-four-years/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sh1pman Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 16 minutes ago, insert_name said: Zubrin has proposed a lunar base plan launching on falcon 9 and falcon heavy http://spacenews.com/op-ed-moon-direct-how-to-build-a-moonbase-in-four-years/ I particularly like the last paragraph where he roasts SLS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NSEP Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 8 minutes ago, insert_name said: Zubrin has proposed a lunar base plan launching on falcon 9 and falcon heavy http://spacenews.com/op-ed-moon-direct-how-to-build-a-moonbase-in-four-years/ Sounds like a cool idea, SpaceX could do this if the BFR can't. Lets get to the drawing board and see if it fits inside the fairing shall we? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sh1pman Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 1 minute ago, NSEP said: Sounds like a cool idea, SpaceX could do this if the BFR can't. Lets get to the drawing board and see if it fits inside the fairing shall we? SpaceX could do this if NASA pays them to, regardless of BFR. Except NASA won’t, because it’ll make their SLS and LOP-G plans look totally stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sevenperforce Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 The current PAF is mass-limited so the mission should really be built around FH's TLI throw, not its LEO throw. I don't know why Zubrin wants to drag earth injection burn propellant all the way to the lunar surface and back, let alone EOI propellant. That's nonsense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DAL59 Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 13 minutes ago, sh1pman said: I particularly like the last paragraph where he roasts SLS. SLS roasting: the forum's official hobby. Maybe instead of calling it the senate launch system like zubrin does, it should be called the Sheev Launch System. The acronym still works out, and it sounds worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightfury Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 2 minutes ago, sevenperforce said: The current PAF is mass-limited so the mission should really be built around FH's TLI throw, not its LEO throw. I don't know why Zubrin wants to drag earth injection burn propellant all the way to the lunar surface and back, let alone EOI propellant. That's nonsense. Maybe he takes it all the way as a safty reason. If anything goes wrong , they have the fuel to go back. If they have routine on the moon in fuel production and it's safe getting there, you don't need to take it anymore. Reducing the mass later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canopus Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 1 minute ago, Nightfury said: Maybe he takes it all the way as a safty reason. If anything goes wrong , they have the fuel to go back. If they have routine on the moon in fuel production and it's safe getting there, you don't need to take it anymore. Reducing the mass later. There is no abort. He proposes the dragon to stay in earth orbit and the return fuel is created on site by the astronauts. Sounds more like a KSP challenge than an actual proposal for a lunar landing architecture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sh1pman Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 6 minutes ago, DAL59 said: SLS roasting: the forum's official hobby. Maybe instead of calling it the senate launch system like zubrin does, it should be called the Sheev Launch System. The acronym still works out, and it sounds worse. Then DSG is Darth Sidious’ Greed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrandedonEarth Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 8 minutes ago, sevenperforce said: I don't know why Zubrin wants to drag earth injection burn propellant all the way to the lunar surface and back, let alone EOI propellant. That's nonsense. It avoids the hassle and equipment required for LOR. But hauling LH2 to the Moon and back is the difficult part, keeping it liquid. Unless they use ACES tech, or lots of insulation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wjolcz Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 (edited) What's the point of Moon Station anyway? I haven't questioned it until I read the article. More radiation? Newer technology? If the answer is more radiation why not use more shielding? If it's the technology: I thought humans have landed there already? It just feels like it's a step back not forward. And I know it's about staying there for longer than 2 days but then: why not bury the base in regolith? Edited March 30, 2018 by Wjolcz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatastrophicFailure Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 @tater was spot on. This could be an issue going forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sevenperforce Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 29 minutes ago, Nightfury said: Maybe he takes it all the way as a safty reason. If anything goes wrong , they have the fuel to go back. It actually ends up being less safe, because the crew's safety depends on LEO rendezvous with a waiting crew capsule for entry. 30 minutes ago, Canopus said: There is no abort. He proposes the dragon to stay in earth orbit and the return fuel is created on site by the astronauts. Sounds more like a KSP challenge than an actual proposal for a lunar landing architecture. As I understand it, the original version has return propellant included, presumably with the thought that they'd eventually upgrade to ISRU. Hydrolox DOES give you a lot of margin in that department. 27 minutes ago, StrandedonEarth said: It avoids the hassle and equipment required for LOR. But hauling LH2 to the Moon and back is the difficult part, keeping it liquid. Unless they use ACES tech, or lots of insulation. EOR after EOI is WAY more hassle and equipment than LOR with a single return burn. 10 minutes ago, CatastrophicFailure said: @tater was spot on. This could be an issue going forward. What nonsense! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatGuyWithALongUsername Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 17 minutes ago, CatastrophicFailure said: @tater was spot on. This could be an issue going forward. This is actually good news- note that SpaceX HAS A LICENSE! Us space nerd can enjoy our complete coverage once again! That was fast, though. I wonder if the certification process went quicker because they had already done this before? It's still stupid, IMO you should only need a license for a camera with a certain resolution or something. But this discussion sounds like it could get political, so maybe we shouldn't discuss it here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sevenperforce Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 5 minutes ago, ThatGuyWithALongUsername said: This is actually good news- note that SpaceX HAS A LICENSE! Us space nerd can enjoy our complete coverage once again! I'm not so sure. It sounds like the above says that SpaceX already had its license for today's launch, and one of the "conditions on their capability" was shutting down the feed past SECO-1. 5 minutes ago, ThatGuyWithALongUsername said: That was fast, though. I wonder if the certification process went quicker because they had already done this before? It's still stupid, IMO you should only need a license for a camera with a certain resolution or something. But this discussion sounds like it could get political, so maybe we shouldn't discuss it here. Very stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrandedonEarth Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 21 minutes ago, sevenperforce said: EOR after EOI is WAY more hassle and equipment than LOR with a single return burn. Ah, but the waiting Dragon can do the docking while the returning lander just holds steady. But hey, I'm just spitballing just as Zubrin was Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sevenperforce Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 3 minutes ago, StrandedonEarth said: Ah, but the waiting Dragon can do the docking while the returning lander just holds steady. But hey, I'm just spitballing just as Zubrin was No different than it would be in lunar orbit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canopus Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 3 minutes ago, StrandedonEarth said: Ah, but the waiting Dragon can do the docking while the returning lander just holds steady. But hey, I'm just spitballing just as Zubrin was Imagine you have an Apollo 13 style accident anytime after leaving LEO. There is no hope of ever attaining earth orbit again and free return is impossible since you aren't carrying a reentry capsule with you. The Dragon back at earth won't save you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrandedonEarth Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 6 minutes ago, Canopus said: The Dragon back at earth won't save you. True. Zubrin's plan, not mine, I was just trying to find his logic, which just exposes more flaws :shrug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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