AckSed Posted October 13 Share Posted October 13 I may be wrong about it being reentry heating, or only reentry heating: rewatching the ED stream, at 2 hours 30 minutes, when it's 38-32km up and moving 4330km/h, the glow of a fire spreads through the internal engine bay. This may just be trapped methane from engine chilldown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted October 13 Share Posted October 13 Resurrecting this, even if "old space" math: We've been told that the SS/SH stack was on the order of $100M hardware cost. If booster was really half the cost, an expended SS (recovered SH) has a cost <F9 retail ($62M). ULA rockets have closer to even numbers of S1/S2 engines (2:1 vs 5.5:1), so it might be better to call the booster somewhere between 50-80% of cost. Call it 65%. That puts a launch roughly on par with F9 cost-wise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AckSed Posted October 13 Share Posted October 13 Alternate view where you can see this massive thing just fly in: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minmus Taster Posted October 13 Share Posted October 13 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnemoe Posted October 13 Share Posted October 13 35 minutes ago, darthgently said: Maybe. The other angle is that even in those hellish conditions: zero relight failure, zero engine failures at all. But yeah, to last multiple reuses probably turning it dow from 11 to 10 or so might be a good move. Yes, they might want to add an shield to make an bubble around the outer engines. It will catch the supersonic wind who damage some outer engines. This only matter for reuse. Might even add more shielding in the bay but as I understand future boosters will has much less external stuff who can melt or burn. 1 hour ago, darthgently said: Also, to clarify, I am definitely talking vibe as Tater noted. If you watched Apollo 11 as a kid it might click more. If doing a historical analysis it is different. Apollo was Lewis and Clark. That booster catch is like the first real freight locomotive combined with track laid halfway to California. The implications of Lewis and Clark was big. The implications of the transcontinental railroad were vastly bigger. Agree, comparing this to Apollo 8 might be more fitting. Its shows the potential. Else yes Apollo was an first milestone Lewis and Clark. Now thing start to get real. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnemoe Posted October 13 Share Posted October 13 (edited) 4 hours ago, tater said: I started thinking about a Starship staging off the nose again. A small upper stage—part of the curved nosecone—staging off the aero cover on a docking port, and with a 10% dry mass, 100 tons of props, and a single Rvac could meet Orion in LEO—with a 10 ton, comanifested payload—and fly that stack all the way to LLO with 400 m/s of margin to deal with boiloff/disposal. More payload if it's just going to Gateway and Orion is braking there. A 200 ton props class upper stage can get Orion, plus an entire lander (BO/Dynetics/whatever) to LLO. Both these work with zero refilling operations. Orion to LEO with NG. So assuming NG flies soon, SLS is a total waste of time. For moonship it is designed to dock at the nose as this is simplest, it might have an backup docking port who is also an backup door, also nice for restocking from an cargo dragon, who could also bring home more samples. Now I would make the crew section much smaller than an full starship who is way overkill for 2-4 people even if you go a bit crazy. Might even have an fairing, no need to bring the steel hull for the crew space to the moon after all, it also make it much easier to deploy solar panels, radiators and antennas. Perhaps even an sun shade for the fuel. I would even considering using an second moonship as the gateway moon space station with modification as an station. But it would work as an fuel depot and an rescue craft if moonship has landed but is unable to reach orbit. Fuel leak or engines damaged during landing. Edited October 13 by magnemoe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeSchmuckatelli Posted October 13 Share Posted October 13 58 minutes ago, tater said: Resurrecting this, even if "old space" math: Worth resurrecting; reminds us of what's been accomplished cost-wise. Cost, in the days of Shuttle was enormous. What's been accomplished in the last 40 years is remarkable. The next 10 should be fun to watch! What I really, really want to see is what kind of science packages folks can dream up. SX is clearly going to Mars - that will be amazing. But I'm now dreaming of a Super-Webb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnemoe Posted October 13 Share Posted October 13 1 minute ago, JoeSchmuckatelli said: Worth resurrecting; reminds us of what's been accomplished cost-wise. Cost, in the days of Shuttle was enormous. What's been accomplished in the last 40 years is remarkable. The next 10 should be fun to watch! What I really, really want to see is what kind of science packages folks can dream up. SX is clearly going to Mars - that will be amazing. But I'm now dreaming of a Super-Webb. You could simply put an web sized fixed mirror telescope inside an Starship Hubble style much cheaper or make something much larger. How about going into orbit around the other planets in reasonable times. Even bringing landers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeSchmuckatelli Posted October 13 Share Posted October 13 (edited) 14 minutes ago, magnemoe said: How about going into orbit around the other planets in reasonable times. Even bringing landers. Yeppers. Samples galore! We could also do a ride-share to various planets with a constellation telescope that just keeps getting better with every launch and new destination. Imagine having a radio telescope with antennae at Saturn, Jupiter, Mars & Earth. As long as the planets are not aligned - that's a big antenna. Edited October 13 by JoeSchmuckatelli Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuke Posted October 13 Share Posted October 13 54 minutes ago, JoeSchmuckatelli said: Worth resurrecting; reminds us of what's been accomplished cost-wise. Cost, in the days of Shuttle was enormous. What's been accomplished in the last 40 years is remarkable. The next 10 should be fun to watch! What I really, really want to see is what kind of science packages folks can dream up. SX is clearly going to Mars - that will be amazing. But I'm now dreaming of a Super-Webb. cant wait for space telescope spam. you thought the eht was awesome, wait till your aperture is the size of the inner solar system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeSchmuckatelli Posted October 13 Share Posted October 13 Reusability question: They obviously got 33 Raptors back that they can look at and learn from. Given that Elon said that some of the outer ring bells were warped, are any of those engines reusable? Doesn't seem like something you could just bang the dents out of... but maybe everything but the bell could be reused? And if its only the outer, leaving the inner ones relatively undamaged... when would they risk another booster with recovered engines? As early as ITF 6 - or would they have to go onto another vehicle later on down the line? (Speculation fine (unless you work at SX and want to give away Sekrets???)) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codraroll Posted October 13 Share Posted October 13 Looking at the reaction videos, this was a very big day for expletives. Lots of excrements and acts of intercourse were being canonized. Many people called upon their deity of choice, or stated that the deity was doing a bit of stuff in bed. Sometimes repeatedly. I think many of the attending kids learned exciting new phrases today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darthgently Posted October 13 Share Posted October 13 Any guesstimates on how far down range hot staging occurred? It happened around 69km altitude but am curious. I’m thinking that the average slope was at least 2:1 if not higher Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minmus Taster Posted October 13 Share Posted October 13 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PakledHostage Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 (edited) 6 hours ago, Codraroll said: I'm not sure if I'd break out the Apollo 11 comparisons, but it might still be up there with some of the earlier Apollo launches. Yeah, we have to remember that we live in a bubble. This is super cool to all of us, but many others don't care. My wife told me this morning to turn off the replay I was watching, because "nobody cares". And I asked on my work's company chat after flight 4 if anyone had watched and all I heard was crickets. Apollo was before my time, but from what I can tell from the historical record, almost everyone cared about Apollo 11. Sadly this, only a few of us nerds care. Edited October 14 by PakledHostage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotel26 Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 (edited) 7 hours ago, Minmus Taster said: +10, my man! Edited October 14 by Hotel26 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zolotiyeruki Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 8 hours ago, Minmus Taster said: Well, hello there, new wallpaper! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darthgently Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 (edited) Excellent video from across the Rio Grande in Mexico maybe? check out the shockwaves and the sunlight bent by heat at the landing. Though I do wish some of these cell phone vids weren’t cut off before the sonic booms crackles arrive. It’s like missing dessert Edited October 14 by darthgently Added convenient link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brotoro Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 Very impressive video. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnemoe Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 6 hours ago, JoeSchmuckatelli said: Reusability question: They obviously got 33 Raptors back that they can look at and learn from. Given that Elon said that some of the outer ring bells were warped, are any of those engines reusable? Doesn't seem like something you could just bang the dents out of... but maybe everything but the bell could be reused? And if its only the outer, leaving the inner ones relatively undamaged... when would they risk another booster with recovered engines? As early as ITF 6 - or would they have to go onto another vehicle later on down the line? (Speculation fine (unless you work at SX and want to give away Sekrets???)) My guess is that the bells has to be replaced the rest of the engine should be ok unless its heat damage up there. The bells has cooling channels in them so its not something you can just knock back into shape. I guess they need to add an skirt to the booster so shield the outer engines from the supersonic airflow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatastrophicFailure Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 7 hours ago, Codraroll said: Looking at the reaction videos, this was a very big day for expletives. Lots of excrements and acts of intercourse were being canonized. Many people called upon their deity of choice, or stated that the deity was doing a bit of stuff in bed. Sometimes repeatedly. I think many of the attending kids learned exciting new phrases today. I, like so many others, am out of likes for the day, so here’s a bunny with a pancake on its head: 4 hours ago, PakledHostage said: My wife told me this morning to turn off the replay I was watching, because "nobody cares” This is legal grounds for divorce in seventeen states. And Puerto Rico. Just sayin… and now for something completely different: speculation that it’s just a LN2 purge, but still, dang impressive that they got it back on the stand and loaded cryogen on board in a matter of hours after the very first catch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brotoro Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 Loading propellants? Wow. Even if it’s just liquid nitrogen…I’m surprised the quick disconnect plumbing is still in working order, considering the way it was belching flame like crazy as the booster was landing (and for several minutes afterward). I guess maybe it’s supposed to flame like an angry dragon despite that looking like an undesirable anomaly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farmerben Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 On 10/12/2024 at 5:47 PM, GuessingEveryDay said: They added a custom screen for when you crash on top of Starhopper Personally my favorite is mechazilla.io i made it to lvl 8. not easy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darthgently Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 Positively disruptive Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeSchmuckatelli Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 (edited) 9 hours ago, darthgently said: Excellent video Pretty much due West from the launch site. (Equinox was less than a month ago.) Likely within 3-5 miles. horizon.pdf (washington.edu) Edited October 14 by JoeSchmuckatelli Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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