totm dec 2023 [WIP] [1.12.x] MOARdV's Avionics Systems - MAS Interactive IVA! (v1.3.7, 7 April 2023)

[Ruedii]

Could we get a drop in compatability module for RPM's "Default" displays. 

Obviously it won't contain the legacy backend features as those would be replaced with new, shiny, exciting variants that aren't capable, but it would be better to start from scratch and not maintain back-end compatibility with the old.  It would just replace the glass cockpit display with MoarDV Avionics based ones instead of RPM based ones. 

Possibly the ONLY feature I would create a compatible backend for is the external camera handling, which was awesome and really can be completely redone without much hassle as of compatability (replace end to end by replacing the part module and the display module.)

If this is done already, could we get CKAN alternate dependencies and a small module manager script to replace the stuff automagically?

Edited October 13, 2019 by Ruedii

[MOARdV]

8 hours ago, Ruedii said:

Could we get a drop in compatability module for RPM's "Default" displays. 

I'm pretty sure MAS can do everything RPM can do, with the one exception being the orbital line displays (because I just got tired of trying to sort out how to implement it the right way - although MAS can use the RPM version of the line display if both MAS and RPM are installed).

Right now, I'm not really motivated to redo all of the pages from the RPM MFDs in MAS - the page file formats are different, so making MAS versions of the pages entails a lot of manual edits.  Add to that testing the pages, and that's quite a few hours.  I've got other things going on in my spare time these days (I haven't even launched KSP since August).

If someone wants to come up with conversions of the RPM pages that they're willing to share, I'll happily include them in the KSP 1.8 compatibility build, along with a MAS version of the RPM MFD.

[G'th]

Hey MoarDV Long time. 

Question for you. What has been converted as far as MAS and ASET goes? Is there still a great deal that hasn't been converted over from RPM yet? Can I presume that whats included between this mod and the FASA/BDB example pod are it or is there more somewhere?

Essentially I'm just trying to not do work that's already been done if its out there. I want the new version of my Shuttle IVA's to be fully MAS and given that I use a -lot- of ASET props its going to be wise to see what I don't have to convert. 

[G'th]

And while I'm here, I'm currently attempting to get the CRT Displays I made back up and running, but I'm running into some errors here. Not really sure what to make of them at this point. I had more, but I was able to track those down, but these are escaping me:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/6l1qvive18z7qlz/KSP.log?dl=0

[MOARdV]

4 hours ago, G'th said:

Question for you. What has been converted as far as MAS and ASET goes? Is there still a great deal that hasn't been converted over from RPM yet? Can I presume that whats included between this mod and the FASA/BDB example pod are it or is there more somewhere?

The stuff in MAS is basically all of it.  Alexustas had hundreds of props, and converting them all, even with the tools I wrote, is a slow, tedious process.  And I don't have the time and energy to do it all by hand.  

3 hours ago, G'th said:

And while I'm here, I'm currently attempting to get the CRT Displays I made back up and running, but I'm running into some errors here

Are these your own CRT prop configs?  If so, can you provide me the config file(s) for them?  I don't remember seeing those errors before.  I don't see anything obvious in the message - fc.TargetBodyName() should be a valid function.

[G'th]

33 minutes ago, MOARdV said:

The stuff in MAS is basically all of it.  Alexustas had hundreds of props, and converting them all, even with the tools I wrote, is a slow, tedious process.  And I don't have the time and energy to do it all by hand.  

Are these your own CRT prop configs?  If so, can you provide me the config file(s) for them?  I don't remember seeing those errors before.  I don't see anything obvious in the message - fc.TargetBodyName() should be a valid function.

Sure thing. And yeah they are my own configs, made back in the 1.4.2 days:
 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/q7iita6xnhjglks/CRT.zip?dl=0

Some of it has some modifications I attempted to make so it may not generate the same errors. For all I now it could just be a change in how MAS works thats breaking them but I couldn't discern anything going over the changes since. 

And gotcha on the props. For my purposes I'm going to have to convert pretty much all the useful ones so that'll be something I'll throw your way once they're all operational. 

[john1978]

Wish rasterprop was updated then this.

[Stone Blue]

18 hours ago, john1978 said:

Wish rasterprop was updated then this.

Yes, because I wish Ford had rather released an updated version of the Ford Pinto for 2020, exactly like THIS, just only with 4wheel disc brakes, *instead* of releasing the updated version of the 2020 Ford Mustang :roll_eyes:

Edited October 25, 2019 by Stone Blue

[john1978]

42 minutes ago, Stone Blue said:

Yes, because I wish Ford had rather released an updated version of the Ford Pinto for 2020, exactly like THIS, just only with 4wheel disc brakes, *instead* of releasing the updated version of the 2020 Ford Mustang :roll_eyes:

Lol all the mods that use this tell you to use rasterprop  and even his own  mods tell you to use rasterprop now were the logic in that that when it not updated now rasterprop kill all external cameras from any mods and dosent work with any of his own mods that say use it!!! So yer were the logic in that roll EYES.

[MOARdV]

1 hour ago, Stone Blue said:

Yes, because I wish Ford had rather released an updated version of the Ford Pinto for 2020, exactly like THIS, just only with 4wheel disc brakes

@Stone Blue - Don't say bad things about the Ford Pinto...  One almost identical to that pic in Wikipedia was the first car I had, and I was rear-ended *twice*. And the car never exploded! 

@john1978 - I understand that it's frustrating that RPM isn't working correctly.  However, as I've stated a number of times in various places, I can't maintain two complex mods at the same time.  I don't have a testing staff to help me check everything that can be done in these mods, and I don't have the time to do all of the testing myself.

RPM has a permissive license, so *anyone* could pick it up, fix it so it works for KSP 1.8.0, and keep it going.  However, I won't be the person who does that - KSP is no longer my top priority when I have spare time, and I have postponed other projects for too long to work on KSP modding, so once a KSP 1.8.x compatible version of MAS is out (hopefully, this weekend), I don't expect I'll be doing a lot of updates beyond critical rebuilds for a while.

[john1978]

43 minutes ago, MOARdV said:

@Stone Blue - Don't say bad things about the Ford Pinto...  One almost identical to that pic in Wikipedia was the first car I had, and I was rear-ended *twice*. And the car never exploded! 

@john1978 - I understand that it's frustrating that RPM isn't working correctly.  However, as I've stated a number of times in various places, I can't maintain two complex mods at the same time.  I don't have a testing staff to help me check everything that can be done in these mods, and I don't have the time to do all of the testing myself.

RPM has a permissive license, so *anyone* could pick it up, fix it so it works for KSP 1.8.0, and keep it going.  However, I won't be the person who does that - KSP is no longer my top priority when I have spare time, and I have postponed other projects for too long to work on KSP modding, so once a KSP 1.8.x compatible version of MAS is out (hopefully, this weekend), I don't expect I'll be doing a lot of updates beyond critical rebuilds for a while.

I'm just frustrated but I understand it your free time and I had many years  enjoying rpm.  I hope some one will pick it up bit ksp 2 round the corner so I can see less mods being kept updated.

[Danbearpig Kerman]

I look forward to the update to 1.8! I understand the burnout, thanks for the hard work. Once this is 1.8-ready I may take a stab at updating some IVAs, we’ll see!

[AgentMOO]

Your the only game in town for decent IVA immersion. I'm missing this mod greatly =( Because I let steam keep KSP up to date and just update all the mods as they come back. I've been F5'n this for days lol.

Not complaining. Thank you for your service. Just jones'n for some avionics man.

 

o7

Edited November 4, 2019 by AgentMOO

[MOARdV]

Okay, folks.  I've published MAS v1.1.0 on GitHub.  This is a recompile to work with KSP 1.8.1, although there are still some things that need updated for the new Unity (it works as-is, but the next Unity update will probably break it).

I am officially winding down active development of this mod, since I don't have the time to dedicate to updating all of the ASET props to MAS configurations, and the work I need to put in even to automate the process is excessive.  For that reason, I'm not going to bother with moving this mod to the Add-on Releases forum.  I'd rather have something that has MAS equivalents to the RPM props and MM configs needed to update RPM IVAs to use MAS, first.

[AgentMOO]

17 hours ago, MOARdV said:

Okay, folks.  I've published MAS v1.1.0 on GitHub.  This is a recompile to work with KSP 1.8.1, although there are still some things that need updated for the new Unity (it works as-is, but the next Unity update will probably break it).

I am officially winding down active development of this mod, since I don't have the time to dedicate to updating all of the ASET props to MAS configurations, and the work I need to put in even to automate the process is excessive.  For that reason, I'm not going to bother with moving this mod to the Add-on Releases forum.  I'd rather have something that has MAS equivalents to the RPM props and MM configs needed to update RPM IVAs to use MAS, first.

I'm certain what ever you decide will be awesome. Thanks again. 

[Danbearpig Kerman]

On 11/4/2019 at 4:08 PM, MOARdV said:

Okay, folks.  I've published MAS v1.1.0 on GitHub.  This is a recompile to work with KSP 1.8.1, although there are still some things that need updated for the new Unity (it works as-is, but the next Unity update will probably break it).

I am officially winding down active development of this mod, since I don't have the time to dedicate to updating all of the ASET props to MAS configurations, and the work I need to put in even to automate the process is excessive.  For that reason, I'm not going to bother with moving this mod to the Add-on Releases forum.  I'd rather have something that has MAS equivalents to the RPM props and MM configs needed to update RPM IVAs to use MAS, first.

Thanks for your hard work! I stayed up way too late last night installing Unity and getting KSP part tools installed and working, importing all the KSP assets (more than I probably need) and figuring out that the reason Part Tools couldn’t see or spawn any scenes or props was a ReStock cfg file, and technically made my first IVA: I replaced some generic switches in the Mk2 Lander Can with a MAS DSKY. The DSKY doesn’t do anything but did appear, so now I can study your sample IVAs to find out what I’m missing. This is gonna take awhile but I’m excited to get a full IVA working!

Thank you again!

Edited November 7, 2019 by Danbearpig Kerman
Typo

[kurgut]

Hi @MOARdV, is there a way that RPM could use and access the MAS camera modules so that they can be used in IVA (the JSIcam doesn't seem to work in 1.8.1), and yes, I play mostly play with rpm designed ivas (alcor, de iva extension, etc), so the question comes from here...

thanks!
 

Edited November 7, 2019 by kurgut

[Wragie]

Is there a MoarDv install guide for dummies? Dealing with flu and brain is already MELTING LOL

Thanks

W

[MOARdV]

13 hours ago, Wragie said:

Is there a MoarDv install guide for dummies? Dealing with flu and brain is already MELTING LOL

https://github.com/MOARdV/AvionicsSystems/wiki/Installation is the installation guide I wrote.  It's not much different than any other manual installation, I think.

 

20 hours ago, kurgut said:

Hi @MOARdV, is there a way that RPM could use and access the MAS camera modules so that they can be used in IVA (the JSIcam doesn't seem to work in 1.8.1), and yes, I play mostly play with rpm designed ivas (alcor, de iva extension, etc), so the question comes from here

That would require updating RPM.  At which point, whoever does that will probably fix the problems RPM is having.

[PyjackMeat]

I would update RPM if I knew how...

[Jiraiyah]

@MOARdV

Hi

I have a question, well, I never moded internal space mods so my question is more a general programmer's point of view.

Is it possible to sit and write a stand alone application that would read RPM files and replace parts properly to make them work with MAS?

Edited November 24, 2019 by Jiraiyah

[MOARdV]

5 hours ago, Jiraiyah said:

@MOARdV

Hi

I have a question, well, I never moded internal space mods so my question is more a general programmer's point of view.

Is it possible to sit and write a stand alone application that would read RPM files and replace parts properly to make them work with MAS?

There's two steps involved.  The easy part is writing a Module Manager patch to replace RPM props with MAS props (that would be a huge MM patch, with the hundreds of props involved).

The hard part is creating MAS prop config files that are equivalent to the RPM prop configs.  What you would most likely have to do is write something that can read and understand the config file (parsing the config nodes, knowing which fields are required and what settings are the default for missing fields) and map that to MAS equivalents.  A lot of that is fairly straight-forward, but there will still be a lot of manual intervention:

• the various 'compound' variables (MATH variables, MAPPED variables, etc) probably need to be sorted out by hand to figure out how to translate them to MAS equations;
• text placement will require some effort - some of the text mesh placement was done with specific text in mind, so changing fonts or font sizes will look strange if you don't take the time to find the right nudges to the text's transform to position it better to allow center-justified or right-justified text where appropriate;
• text sizes are different for non-MFD props, so the conversion tool will need to know the correct conversion scalar (it was a side-effect of how RPM drew text versus how MAS draws it, and I never figured out the exact number);
• MFDs will still be mostly manual conversion.  The design I used for MAS MFD configuration is very different than what Mihara used in RPM.  It might be possible to write a program to convert them, but I don't know if that would be faster than manual conversion;
• There's still testing the props, or enough of a cross-section of them, to make sure they all work as intended.

So, yeah, it's possible.  It's a lot of work mapping RPM config nodes to MAS config nodes.  Automating it would make it a lot less effort and less prone to errors, once the algorithms are right.  That's part of the reason I wrote the PropConfig tool that's in the MAS repo - it can churn out a lot of props that all have similar appearance where you only need to tweak a few components, but it still requires you to set up the basic configuration, first.

[Jiraiyah]

37 minutes ago, MOARdV said:

There's two steps involved.  The easy part is writing a Module Manager patch to replace RPM props with MAS props (that would be a huge MM patch, with the hundreds of props involved).

The hard part is creating MAS prop config files that are equivalent to the RPM prop configs.  What you would most likely have to do is write something that can read and understand the config file (parsing the config nodes, knowing which fields are required and what settings are the default for missing fields) and map that to MAS equivalents.  A lot of that is fairly straight-forward, but there will still be a lot of manual intervention:

• the various 'compound' variables (MATH variables, MAPPED variables, etc) probably need to be sorted out by hand to figure out how to translate them to MAS equations;
• text placement will require some effort - some of the text mesh placement was done with specific text in mind, so changing fonts or font sizes will look strange if you don't take the time to find the right nudges to the text's transform to position it better to allow center-justified or right-justified text where appropriate;
• text sizes are different for non-MFD props, so the conversion tool will need to know the correct conversion scalar (it was a side-effect of how RPM drew text versus how MAS draws it, and I never figured out the exact number);
• MFDs will still be mostly manual conversion.  The design I used for MAS MFD configuration is very different than what Mihara used in RPM.  It might be possible to write a program to convert them, but I don't know if that would be faster than manual conversion;
• There's still testing the props, or enough of a cross-section of them, to make sure they all work as intended.

So, yeah, it's possible.  It's a lot of work mapping RPM config nodes to MAS config nodes.  Automating it would make it a lot less effort and less prone to errors, once the algorithms are right.  That's part of the reason I wrote the PropConfig tool that's in the MAS repo - it can churn out a lot of props that all have similar appearance where you only need to tweak a few components, but it still requires you to set up the basic configuration, first.

Ouch, well, i think you as the developer and us as players, will only need time, lots of time and patience until others who are doing IVA start using MAS (sad story but real)

[jhook777]

Hi, first time posting on this topic. Just recently started using this mod and a handful of associated IVA's. Love it. llooooove it! It's so great!

One tiny thing, and I'm fairly certain it's a KSP issue and not actually an issue from this mod but there's a slim chance so here goes:

With the file MOARdv/FlightSystems/squad.txt  the clamp o tron and clamp o tron jr fail to load. removing this file results in the parts showing back up.

Looking at the file I see no reason for this to happen. Super confusing. Checking the below linked log showed something about the part failing to compile 

account of 'shader' being null or some such nonsense. Bizarre. Makes no sense why this would happen but has something to do with adding the cam to those two docking ports.

the other squad docking ports, like the inline, mk2 and senior and expandable all still load with this particular file left in. So... makes no sense why it fails to load those two docking ports.

Not game breaking but strange so here's my log.txt dropbox link thingamajig. Thank you again for such an amazing work of art!

https://www.dropbox.com/s/f1hxjvohd82ys0h/ksp.log?dl=0   

 

ps: log shows that i dont have dependancies installed that moardv needs (or any other mods) but that's because of incremental install till the problem showed up. The only variable that made a difference was whether or not that squad.txt file was present. so patching those two docking ports borks them in 1.8.1 for whatever reason. I saw other errors thrown, I suppose it wouldn't hurt to verify if other parts are affected by this and i just didn't notice.

 

more searching points to restock issues... so this may be something that was fixed by something else and i missed it?  nope, that wasn't it.

more searching: loaded all my mods back (including this one and dependencies) but without that one squad patch file. heres  a snip from the log generated:

Spoiler

********************SNIP*************

[LOG 17:19:49.712] GetSubclassesOfParentClass: Found 0 types with ModuleWheelDeployment parent in 40 assemblies.
[LOG 17:19:49.714] ExpansionsLoader: Expansions loaded in 27.159s
[LOG 17:19:49.714] Loading Systems: Elapsed time is 183.1779s
[EXC 17:19:54.995] ArgumentNullException: Value cannot be null.
Parameter name: shader
    UnityEngine.Material..ctor (UnityEngine.Shader shader) (at <5aeafee3fea24f37abd1315553f2cfa6>:0)
    AvionicsSystems.MASCamera..cctor () (at <5a62337ceba64bacb372e59152fc7ee9>:0)
    Rethrow as TypeInitializationException: The type initializer for 'AvionicsSystems.MASCamera' threw an exception.
    UnityEngine.DebugLogHandler:LogException(Exception, Object)
    ModuleManager.UnityLogHandle.InterceptLogHandler:LogException(Exception, Object)
    UnityEngine.Debug:CallOverridenDebugHandler(Exception, Object)
[LOG 17:19:56.630] [AddonLoader]: Instantiating addon 'BDArmorySetup' from assembly 'BDArmory'
[LOG 17:19:56.632] [AddonLoader]: Instantiating addon 'KISAddonCursor' from assembly 'KIS'
[LOG 17:19:57.735] [Agent]: Found 19 agent mentality types
[ERR 17:19:57.736] [Agent]: Cannot load mentality of name 'Competitive'. Agent already has a mentality of that type.

[ERR 17:19:57.740] [Agent]: Is missing its 'title' value

[LOG 17:19:57.741] [AgentList]: 33 agents parsed and loaded.
[LOG 17:19:57.881] [UIMasterController]: HideUI
[LOG 17:19:57.919] [BDArmory]=== Loading settings.cfg ===
[LOG 17:19:58.168] [CelestialBody]: Kerbin's solar day length is 6h, 0m, 0s long. sidereal day length is 5h, 59m, 9s long
[LOG 17:20:04.701] [UIMasterController]: HideUI
[LOG 17:20:04.708] [HighLogic]: =========================== Scene Change : From LOADING to MAINMENU =====================
[LOG 17:20:07.170] [AddonLoader]: Instantiating addon 'ContractDefs' from assembly 'KSP'

********************/snip************************

 

Edited December 5, 2019 by jhook777
post script

[MOARdV]

14 hours ago, jhook777 said:

Hi, first time posting on this topic. Just recently started using this mod and a handful of associated IVA's. Love it. llooooove it! It's so great!

 

Please update to MAS 1.1.0.  It looks like you're still using 1.0.0, which exhibited that problem in KSP 1.8.x