[UNOFFICIAL/FANMADE] 0.17 Discussion Thread 3

[Ki11aWi11]

So does this NERVA engine rule out any chance of Ion engines? Solar panels would look pretty cool on my space station, even though the thrust sucks.

[Cesium137]

So does this NERVA engine rule out any chance of Ion engines? Solar panels would look pretty cool on my space station, even though the thrust sucks.

I don't think anybody would be able to answer that for certain.

[AmpsterMan]

I wouldn't see why that would be the case though... Ion engines have even higher ISP and lower thrust than nuclear engines.

[Tommygun]

Ion engines seem to be a good choice to get to Jool and future gas giants that are really far out, but I'm not sure how good they will be for the trip back to Kerbin with a relatively smaller SOI and moving deeper into the sun's influence?

[Cesium137]

Ion engines seem to be a good choice to get to Jool and future gas giants that are really far out, but I'm not sure how good they will be for the trip back to Kerbin with a relatively smaller SOI and moving deeper into the sun's influence?

You bring up an interesting point, but I think it may be the other way around. The farther away you are from the sun, the larger effect a smaller amount of energy will have on your trajectory.

[Accelerando]

I have a somewhat difficult time believing that electrical power-generating solar panels would actually be viable options for Kerbals.

[AviatorBJP]

hm, would it be possible to land on Moho at all? (the far side)

I think it may be, if Moho is a close analog of Mercury. Temperature on Mercury is -184 C to +427 C. I'd say that's cool enough to land on, until the sun comes up. I think Moho may be tidally locked, meaning that one side always faces Kerbol. In that case, I would expect decent conditions somewhere on the dark side of the planet.

[Atimed]

I have a somewhat difficult time believing that electrical power-generating solar panels would actually be viable options for Kerbals.

-The guys will sure find a way to make it happen, if panels are to safe, use nuclear generators, or thermo nuclear...

-Since they already got the tech ..

-But id like to see something like ..

-Its not like they do anything, besides smile and scream...

-Make a part that has got 3 bicycles hooked to the ship battery, and Viola free energy..And it will keep them fit..

Edited September 19, 2012 by Atimed

[Cby]

Will the bikes be on the inside, or the outside?

[EvilotionCR2]

D*mn it!I has think we will have lot of new parts!

[EvilotionCR2]

Folks' date=' PLEASE, when you quote a post with images, snip the images from the quote. It makes the pages unnecessarily long. Also, we don't need to see the same image over and over and over....

Cheers!

[b']Capt'n Skunky

KSP Community Manager

I wanted to donate 100$...After that,not

[Spadde]

Lol, yea right

[Rickenbacker]

I think it may be, if Moho is a close analog of Mercury. Temperature on Mercury is -184 C to +427 C. I'd say that's cool enough to land on, until the sun comes up. I think Moho may be tidally locked, meaning that one side always faces Kerbol. In that case, I would expect decent conditions somewhere on the dark side of the planet.

The trick will be to get there without overheating. You'd be in the full sunlight most of the way, but if you can manage to get to the dark side without blowing up, you can do a direct landing and probably survive.

[Tommygun]

Will they start modeling heat in version 0.17 ?

[etildard]

Doubtful, as it doesn't appear on the list of planned features.

But we can still dream can't we?

[Flowz0r]

I wanted to donate 100$...After that,not

I was gonna donate everything I own to charity. After that, not.

Why do you hate starving children?

[Shadownailshot]

I wanted to donate 100$...After that,not

Off topic. And you're not gonna donate because a moderate explained common courtesy?

I don't see any reason Ion engines would no longer be viable because of NERVA. NERVA's ISP is 800, and an ion engine's real world ISP is anywhere from 4000-8000. That's a lot of difference, and it means a very little fuel can go a very long way.

[LaydeeDem]

Will they start modeling heat in version 0.17 ?

They have been modeling heat since .14. Using the telemetry plugin, many people have recorded the temperature of Kerbin's atmosphere.

[Rocketscienist]

It´s great to see the porgress of 0.17 !!

[nivvydaskrl]

I wanted to donate 100$...After that,not

The moderators have a job to do. Please understand that you weren't being singled out; several other people had also quoted those images, you just happened to be the last one before Skunky said something. No one was picking on you. ^.^

Other folks, be nice. The guy probably feels like he was singled out, and is being a little prickly as a defensive measure. Let's just let the subject slide, I'm sure he didn't mean any harm, not really.

The trick will be to get there without overheating. You'd be in the full sunlight most of the way, but if you can manage to get to the dark side without blowing up, you can do a direct landing and probably survive.

As I understand, the solar heating model isn't yet complete; at least, it's not in the patch notes. I'm unsure what that means for Moho in this development cycle, but the alpha currently has some limitations. We know, for example, that Moho is supposed to have lava on it, but due to time limits in this sprint of the development, lava's been left off for now.

I don't see any reason Ion engines would no longer be viable because of NERVA. NERVA's ISP is 800, and an ion engine's real world ISP is anywhere from 4000-8000. That's a lot of difference, and it means a very little fuel can go a very long way.

Indeed! NERVA engines also have a much higher maximum thrust, and a better thrust-to-weight ratio, than ion engines. They fill a nice slot between low efficiency, high thrust-to-weight chemical engines and high efficiency, low thrust-to-weight ion engines. They're medium performers in both categories. Great choice by the dev team, so far as expanding the players' toolset goes.

[Rocketscienist]

I also thought so, when i see the Pic of the engine!!

[Shadownailshot]

Indeed! NERVA engines also have a much higher maximum thrust, and a better thrust-to-weight ratio, than ion engines. They fill a nice slot between low efficiency, high thrust-to-weight chemical engines and high efficiency, low thrust-to-weight ion engines. They're medium performers in both categories. Great choice by the dev team, so far as expanding the players' toolset goes.

I know, I think it's awesome. I hope when (if?) ion engines or something of the sort makes it into the game, they'll do a VASIMR or MPD thruster. Standard ion engines have disappointingly low thrust. I'm also hoping for hybrid rocket engines... and I'm also going off topic.

The NERVA certainly is a great addition. I've said it before, but I'll be using this on every interplanetary craft I made. I'll only be starting out with orbital craft. It helps me feel out how much fuel I use. And I may even be able to come back after my first trip.

[Tauge]

*snip*

Indeed! NERVA engines also have a much higher maximum thrust, and a better thrust-to-weight ratio, than ion engines. They fill a nice slot between low efficiency, high thrust-to-weight chemical engines and high efficiency, low thrust-to-weight ion engines. They're medium performers in both categories. Great choice by the dev team, so far as expanding the players' toolset goes.

Imagine how low the thrust will have to be to balance out an ion engine though...the NERVA engine that Nova showed has 80(newtons? what is the unit of thrust they are using?) of force, and that was for balance reasons, for an ISP of 800s. If we get ISP in the neighborhood of 4000s, how low will the thrust have to be for balance? 4? 5?

[Shadownailshot]

Imagine how low the thrust will have to be to balance out an ion engine though...the NERVA engine that Nova showed has 80(newtons? what is the unit of thrust they are using?) of force, and that was for balance reasons, for an ISP of 800s. If we get ISP in the neighborhood of 4000s, how low will the thrust have to be for balance? 4? 5?

I'd bet on around 5 or so, yea. They're adding in the physics time warp though. So that shouldn't be all that painful.

[TheProdigy]

I'd bet on around 5 or so, yea. They're adding in the physics time warp though. So that shouldn't be all that painful.

Yeah but we will only be able to time warp to 4x with physics for now. Considering real ion engines burn for weeks/months at a time...i dont think that would help in the slightest.