[1.12.x] SystemHeat - a replacement for the CoreHeat system (September 1)

[Cochies]

1 hour ago, Nertea said:

 

Some screenshots would be nice to help figure out what's wrong/

I apologize, the question is removed: the reason is that I did not update something from the SH-NFE-HC set. I had too long a day of updates: because of the updated waterfall, I had to change FarFuture, and further along the chain all thermodynamics and electricity, compatibility with kerbalizm. Probably missed something...

Edited August 16, 2021 by Cochies

[Nertea]

14 minutes ago, Cochies said:

I apologize, the question is removed: the reason is that I did not update something from the SH-NFE-HC set. I had too long a day of updates: because of the updated waterfall, I had to change FarFuture, and further along the chain all thermodynamics and electricity, compatibility with kerbalizm. Probably missed something...

No problem, no bug is good!

[Nertea]

SystemHeat 0.5.5 (and 0.5.4)

• Introduced allowManualShutdownTemperatureControl field for fission reactors
• Disabled shutdown temperature adjustment on non-trimodal NTRs
• Tuned outlet/shutdown temperatures of NTRs to be more consistent internally and with FFT/NFE
• Updated Chinese localization (TerrestrisYE)

[Tabris]

@Nertea
Is there a wiki/docs for how to construct patches to integrate other mods?

[Nertea]

On 8/18/2021 at 3:53 AM, Tabris said:

@Nertea
Is there a wiki/docs for how to construct patches to integrate other mods?

Sorry I missed this. There isn't but I should make one. In the meantime you can ask questions here.

[revuwution]

I don't get why this is complaining at me (the red loop). There's more than enough radiator output.

[modus]

What version of the mod and KSP are you using?

[revuwution]

3 minutes ago, modus said:

What version of the mod and KSP are you using?

0.5.5 and 1.12.2, respectively.

[Nertea]

2 hours ago, revuwution said:

I don't get why this is complaining at me (the red loop). There's more than enough radiator output.

Looks fine to me... don't see any warning icons.

Unless you mean that the loop is red. Which is because the loops have default colour and Loop 1 color is red. 

[revuwution]

46 minutes ago, Nertea said:

Looks fine to me... don't see any warning icons.

Unless you mean that the loop is red. Which is because the loops have default colour and Loop 1 color is red. 

Oops. I didn't know this. Nevermind then...

[Krzeszny]

The Harvester configuration addon from SystemHeat is broken. 8 days ago I reported it in the Stockalike Mining Expansion thread thinking that it's that mod's fault but it's not. Baha EPL augers break in the same way with the Harvester configuration.

All unconfigured drills (SME and Baha) have broken Load (drilling speed) with SystemHeat + Harvester configuration addon installed. While stock drills usually have 125% Load with a 5-star engineer and 5% Load without any engineer, drills from SME have completely random Load values  even at optimal temperatures, and they're always hugely lower than expected, making mining very slow. Load, per KSP wiki, is "T" times "m" where "T" is thermal efficiency (between 0 and 1) and "m" is the engineer multiplier (normally between 5% and 125% where 5% is no engineer and 125% is a 5-star engi).

(The exception is that Drill-o-matic Jr in vanilla KSP, without SystemHeat has 7.5% Load w/o an engineer but with SystemHeat 5% w/o an engineer. It definitely should have 5%.)

Note that with SystemHeat and its addon, custom drill Load (drilling speed) very slightly decreases (only by 0.02% to 0.20% from cold to optimal temperature) as thermal efficiency increases (or is it because of time?), and it should be the opposite. When the optimal Loop Temperature is reached, Load still keeps decreasing seemingly for no reason, but not with all drills, only with some. Also note that if you stop drilling and start again, the PAW won't show the load most of the time, you'll only see "Operational" until you restart try slowly toggling it on and off.

In vanilla KSP, Efficiency (whatever that is) first starts above 100%, increases a bit as the temperature rises and then with stock drills it comes back to 100% at optimal temperature. However, with SystemHeat and unconfigured drills (SME/Baha EPL) Efficiency starts above 100%, increases a bit and decreases a bit while still staying above 100% at optimal temperature - it shouldn't.

 

Here's a list of tests I made for drills auto-configured with the Harvester configuration addon. The format for the Load of each drill is X / Y where X is with a 5-star engineer (the maximum possible speed) and Y is without an engineer. Y is normally equal to X/25 but in  a few cases it wasn't, those are in red.  I tested it using KRASH to teleport my mining rig to the same coordinates on Minmus each time (13 lat 80 long). The Load values of unconfigured drills change each time I open KSP, which is why second and third tests were different.

Stock:
Always 125% / 5% base efficiency
SME:
Trowel: 4.72% / 0.19% | second test (next day) 83.02% / 3.32%
Prospector: 11% / 0.17% (should be 0.44%) | second test 4.17% / unmeasured%
Wildcat vertical: first test 28% / 1% | second test 4.20% / unmeasured%
Wildcat horizontal: 83.44% / 3.34%
Tremor: 11.21% / 3.32% (should be 0.45%) | second test 82.96%  / unmeasured% | third test 36.28% / 1.53% (should  be 1.45%) | fourth test 39.99% / 1.52% (should be 1.60%)
Terravore: 83.23% / 3.33%
Lithoquake: 106.12% / 4.24% | second test 80.36% / 3% or 3.21%
Baha EPL:
DRL-0R1: 38.26% / 1.53% 

As you see, the X values are seemingly random and Y most of the time equals X/25 but sometimes not (???)

Here's the log https://drive.google.com/file/d/1eDJU0oZmCe5KH1JF6Vj6uFmMUeaw1vvg/view?usp=sharing

And here's the test vessel I use (requires SME and Baha EPL Redrilled) https://drive.google.com/file/d/1jzProEYtgaZ8LnajTUmwT7HazhHlILMc/view?usp=sharing

Edited September 14, 2021 by Krzeszny
formatting

[Nertea]

4 hours ago, Krzeszny said:

The Harvester configuration addon from SystemHeat is broken. 8 days ago I reported it in the Stockalike Mining Expansion thread thinking that it's that mod's fault but it's not. Baha EPL augers break in the same way with the Harvester configuration.

All unconfigured drills (SME and Baha) have broken Load (drilling speed) with SystemHeat + Harvester configuration addon installed. While stock drills usually have 125% Load with a 5-star engineer and 5% Load without any engineer, drills from SME have completely random Load values  even at optimal temperatures, and they're always hugely lower than expected, making mining very slow. Load, per KSP wiki, is "T" times "m" where "T" is thermal efficiency (between 0 and 1) and "m" is the engineer multiplier (normally between 5% and 125% where 5% is no engineer and 125% is a 5-star engi).

(The exception is that Drill-o-matic Jr in vanilla KSP, without SystemHeat has 7.5% Load w/o an engineer but with SystemHeat 5% w/o an engineer. It definitely should have 5%.)

Note that with SystemHeat and its addon, custom drill Load (drilling speed) very slightly decreases (only by 0.02% to 0.20% from cold to optimal temperature) as thermal efficiency increases (or is it because of time?), and it should be the opposite. When the optimal Loop Temperature is reached, Load still keeps decreasing seemingly for no reason, but not with all drills, only with some. Also note that if you stop drilling and start again, the PAW won't show the load most of the time, you'll only see "Operational" until you restart try slowly toggling it on and off.

In vanilla KSP, Efficiency (whatever that is) first starts above 100%, increases a bit as the temperature rises and then with stock drills it comes back to 100% at optimal temperature. However, with SystemHeat and unconfigured drills (SME/Baha EPL) Efficiency starts above 100%, increases a bit and decreases a bit while still staying above 100% at optimal temperature - it shouldn't.

 

Here's a list of tests I made for drills auto-configured with the Harvester configuration addon. The format for the Load of each drill is X / Y where X is with a 5-star engineer (the maximum possible speed) and Y is without an engineer. Y is normally equal to X/25 but in  a few cases it wasn't, those are in red.  I tested it using KRASH to teleport my mining rig to the same coordinates on Minmus each time (13 lat 80 long). The Load values of unconfigured drills change each time I open KSP, which is why second and third tests were different.

Stock:
Always 125% / 5% base efficiency
SME:
Trowel: 4.72% / 0.19% | second test (next day) 83.02% / 3.32%
Prospector: 11% / 0.17% (should be 0.44%) | second test 4.17% / unmeasured%
Wildcat vertical: first test 28% / 1% | second test 4.20% / unmeasured%
Wildcat horizontal: 83.44% / 3.34%
Tremor: 11.21% / 3.32% (should be 0.45%) | second test 82.96%  / unmeasured% | third test 36.28% / 1.53% (should  be 1.45%) | fourth test 39.99% / 1.52% (should be 1.60%)
Terravore: 83.23% / 3.33%
Lithoquake: 106.12% / 4.24% | second test 80.36% / 3% or 3.21%
Baha EPL:
DRL-0R1: 38.26% / 1.53% 

As you see, the X values are seemingly random and Y most of the time equals X/25 but sometimes not (???)

Here's the log https://drive.google.com/file/d/1eDJU0oZmCe5KH1JF6Vj6uFmMUeaw1vvg/view?usp=sharing

And here's the test vessel I use (requires SME and Baha EPL Redrilled) https://drive.google.com/file/d/1jzProEYtgaZ8LnajTUmwT7HazhHlILMc/view?usp=sharing

It's possible that the universal patch that was contributed doesn't work correctly, I can look at it I guess. 

[Rakete]

@Nertea

Would you consider to add some actiongroup controls for the PX-1F heat-exchanger part with a new update any time in the future?  Somehow it would be nice to be able to toggle it synchronous with a reactor.  E.g pressing AG 1 to activate the reactor, deploy cooling panels and activate the heat exchangers... Somehow this would be nice to automatize my vehicles.

Edited October 3, 2021 by Rakete

[Nertea]

Done.

System Heat 0.5.6

• Added action groups to ModuleSystemHeatExchanger for Enable, Disable, Toggle and Toggle Direction

[leatherneck6017]

@NerteaI recently added system heat and associated patches for the first time and am really enjoying it, thank you!

On 12/30/2020 at 11:43 AM, Nertea said:

System Heat 0.3.3

• Added Hibernate On Warp control to fission reactors: if activated, an enabled reactor will turn off when the ship goes on rails. It will reactivate when the ship goes off rails.

Would it be plausible to have this feature on the fusion reactor from FFT? I've twice now run out of Deuterium by forgetting to shut down the reactor prior to a long time warp (3 or so years seems to do it for the 2.5m fusion tank that holds that resource).

Edited October 14, 2021 by leatherneck6017

[Rakete]

4 hours ago, leatherneck6017 said:

@NerteaI recently added system heat and associated patches for the first time and am really enjoying it, thank you!

Would it be plausible to have this feature on the fusion reactor from FFT? I've twice now run out of Deuterium by forgetting to shut down the reactor prior to a long time warp (3 or so years seems to do it for the 2.5m fusion tank that holds that resource).

I circumvented this, by only activating fusion reactors before electric engine ignition. For the basic energy needs (e.g. on a trip to Eeloo) i always have a small fission reactor to feed the basic energy hunger - this runs the vehicles even without hibernation. As Nertea currently prepares a release of NF Electrical 2.0 with more small reactors,  I really look forward to downsizing this basic powersupply of my vehicles even more with the new small reactors cores.

Edited October 14, 2021 by Rakete

[leatherneck6017]

9 hours ago, Rakete said:

I circumvented this, by only activating fusion reactors before electric engine ignition. For the basic energy needs (e.g. on a trip to Eeloo) i always have a small fission reactor to feed the basic energy hunger - this runs the vehicles even without hibernation. As Nertea currently prepares a release of NF Electrical 2.0 with more small reactors,  I really look forward to downsizing this basic powersupply of my vehicles even more with the new small reactors cores.

It's not basic power that I run out of, I carry solar and RTG's for that. It's the Deuterium that the reactor requires to stay online. If I forget to shut down the reactor prior to a long time warp, it can run out.

[Rakete]

The fusion reactor needs a few more steps to reengage than just pulling the control rods of a fission reactor. 

I'd guess that's the reason Nertea decided to design the fusion ones without hibernation.

[Nertea]

It's more involved because a fusion reactor power cycle has more player interaction. E.g with timewarp hibernation you would have something like...

1. Timewarp starts
2. Reactor turns off
3. Depending on user capacitor setting, reactor either starts charging capacitors or doesn't
   1. If yes, sudden transient power drain
   2. If no, nothing happens but now there is a need to charge later
4. Timewarp exits
5. Reactor turns on
   1. If charged, no issues
   2. If not charged, now need to charge the reactor (takes time) and appropriately queue up a reactor on event once charged (which could take a long time or never) 
      1. Lots of edge cases in there...

Short answer, no, not anytime soon, those edge cases are messy.

[Krzeszny]

On 9/14/2021 at 7:02 PM, Nertea said:

It's possible that the universal patch that was contributed doesn't work correctly, I can look at it I guess. 

Have you?

Edited October 18, 2021 by Krzeszny

[Nertea]

Does it look like it?

[NachtRave]

Hey @Nertea, any chance for future support for KSPI-E radiators? I was looking around at your config files, looks like it may just be an additional set of patches, hopefully? HeatControl, NF, and Squad support is already awesome and covers a ton of ground, but there are also a lot of radiators that are found in KSPI-E, which in itself is an extremely popular mod that would benefit greatly from SystemHeat support.

Best of luck either way!

[Nertea]

On 10/28/2021 at 4:54 PM, NachtRave said:

Hey @Nertea, any chance for future support for KSPI-E radiators? I was looking around at your config files, looks like it may just be an additional set of patches, hopefully? HeatControl, NF, and Squad support is already awesome and covers a ton of ground, but there are also a lot of radiators that are found in KSPI-E, which in itself is an extremely popular mod that would benefit greatly from SystemHeat support.

Best of luck either way!

Sorry, not from me. That mod runs it's own heat system and generally is not very compatible with my stuff,.so spending effort adding compat stuff is odd.

[Sudragon]

On 10/31/2021 at 7:51 AM, Nertea said:

Sorry, not from me. That mod runs it's own heat system and generally is not very compatible with my stuff,.so spending effort adding compat stuff is odd.

Obviously, KSPI uses imperial pipe fittings for coolant and Nertea is using metric. And I think the fittings also have different thread pitches.  Totally incompatible.

[ruiluth]

Is anyone working on a patch for MKS? I'm just starting to plan an MKS base in my install that includes System Heat (installed by accident via Far Future Tech and liked it) and am finding it somewhat frustrating that the MKS harvesters and processors don't use System Heat. The configs look a bit complicated so if someone else has already made the patch I'll just use that, but if no one has thought of it then I'll start working on one.