[1.10.x, 1.11.x, 1.12.x] MOAR Station Science - Out of BETA

[linuxgurugamer]

27 minutes ago, Apricot said:

I also came into contract issues. Contract generator (StnSciContract.cs) generates contract for "Experiment: Seed Growth" (/GameData/StationScience/Parts/StnSciExperiment1.cfg). However this part is not avaible at all in the tech tree (idk why). There is another part called "Experiment: Plant Growth" (/GameData/StationScience/ArcanumIndustries/Parts/exper01PlantGrowth.cfg) available instead. These two parts are definitely not the same part. Thus the contract cannot be completed.

Could be a mistake, I'll have to take a look

28 minutes ago, Apricot said:

I think many others running into "Kuarqs" might share the same issue, because the Kuarqs experiment parts happen to be named the same in (/GameData/StationScience/Parts/) and in (/GameData/StationScience/ArcanumIndustries/Parts/). @linuxgurugamerPTAL.

You need to be specific as to the files, please.  I took a look,don't see it

 

[Apricot]

2 minutes ago, linuxgurugamer said:

You need to be specific as to the files, please.  I took a look,don't see it

StnSciExperiment2.cfg titled #autoLOC_expPrograde_title which is "Experiment: Prograde Kuarqs" in English localization.

exper02ProgradeKuarqs.cfg in ArcanumIndustries dir also titled "Experiment: Prograde Kuarqs"

[linuxgurugamer]

17 minutes ago, Apricot said:

StnSciExperiment2.cfg titled #autoLOC_expPrograde_title which is "Experiment: Prograde Kuarqs" in English localization.

exper02ProgradeKuarqs.cfg in ArcanumIndustries dir also titled "Experiment: Prograde Kuarqs"

Ok, it's confusing and I'll fix it, but they parts have different names.  The Titles are the same, but titles aren't the same as part names

[Speadge]

if additional info on my problem (retrokuarqs contract not reacting to updates on experiment) is needed, im happy 2 help. im just not sure how.

intentionally, i also thought there might be a naming issue, - but im not sure

19 hours ago, linuxgurugamer said:

Ok, it's confusing and I'll fix it, but they parts have different names.  The Titles are the same, but titles aren't the same as part names

 

edit:

my ship used:

name = costlyExperimentRetrogradeKuarqs

 

edit2:

after having the files in /parts deleted, my contracts vanished.

when i delete the files in /ArcanumIndustries/Parts/ , my ship/station vanishes.

so this might be the culprit?

 

edit3:

if arcanum-parts are the way to go, shouldn't THEY be listed in StationScience.cfg?:

  // To disable contracts for a given experiment or planet, remove that
  // entry from these lists
  experimentChallenge
  {
    StnSciExperiment1 = 1
    StnSciExperiment2 = 2
    StnSciExperiment3 = 2.5
    StnSciExperiment4 = 3
    StnSciExperiment5 = 2.5
    StnSciExperiment6 = 3.5
  }

 

edit4:

removed the arcanum-experiments and re-enabled the old ones:

  	TechHidden = false
	category = Science

so i got back the old distinguishable models AND i could finish the contract (after launching a new experiment to space).

everything's fine for me that way!

Edited July 13, 2021 by Speadge

[linuxgurugamer]

3 hours ago, Speadge said:

after having the files in /parts deleted, my contracts vanished.

when i delete the files in /ArcanumIndustries/Parts/ , my ship/station vanishes.

so this might be the culprit?

Well, you delete parts, ships using those parts get deleted.

 

[Speadge]

6 hours ago, linuxgurugamer said:

Well, you delete parts, ships using those parts get deleted.

 

yeah, that was part of debugging - no complain.

i wanted to show you, that the contracts are tied to the old parts, that you deactivated...

Edited July 15, 2021 by Speadge

[linuxgurugamer]

1 hour ago, Speadge said:

yeah, that was part of debugging - no complain.

i wanted to show you, that the contracts are tied to the old parts, that you deactivated...

But I didn't deactivate any parts, I don't understand what you are saying.  I merged two mods, and two parts (one in each) of them seem to have the same title, but internally they are different parts

[Speadge]

31 minutes ago, linuxgurugamer said:

But I didn't deactivate any parts, I don't understand what you are saying.  I merged two mods, and two parts (one in each) of them seem to have the same title, but internally they are different parts

Hi,

 

the file "StationScience.cfg" seems to control wich PARTS (not experiments) are evaluated for contracts.
Since the current Version of your mod has the "default" parts disabled with the lines

  	TechHidden = true
	category = none

in i.e. "..\GameData\StationScience\Parts\StnSciExperiment1.cfg"

But THIS part is needed for the contracts:
StationScience.cfg

  // To disable contracts for a given experiment or planet, remove that
  // entry from these lists
  experimentChallenge
  {
    StnSciExperiment1 = 1
    StnSciExperiment2 = 2
    StnSciExperiment3 = 2.5
    StnSciExperiment4 = 3
    StnSciExperiment5 = 2.5
    StnSciExperiment6 = 3.5
  }

 

So the arcanum may bring the experiments - but since the PARTS have other names, THEY are not tied to the contracts at all

Edited July 15, 2021 by Speadge

[luna_cat]

Hi,

I have a problem with the plasma fuels experiment. It's now full of eurekas, xenon, and kuargs. Instead of a "Finalize" button, there's a "Deploy" button. The experiment status is "Bad Location". The experiment is docked to the TH-NKR Research Lab. What would be a good location? Pressing "Deploy" does nothing, presumably because it's in a "Bad Location".

I really like this mod, but I wish that it would give me a little more information about what it needs, and what it can do. For example, the plasma fuels experiment does not show that it requires a supply of xenon. That's something to discover when you try to run the experiment. I've looked carefully, but perhaps I missed it.

I'm running KSP 1.12.1, with Making History and Breaking Ground.

Incidentally, it appears that the cyclotrons are not drawing any power, although they work just fine producing quargs. Both the Fusebox mod, and Near Future Systems Manager don't show them drawing the 90 ec/sec that I expected to see.

Thanks for supporting this mod.

[linuxgurugamer]

On 8/4/2021 at 10:05 PM, luna_cat said:

Hi,

I have a problem with the plasma fuels experiment. It's now full of eurekas, xenon, and kuargs. Instead of a "Finalize" button, there's a "Deploy" button. The experiment status is "Bad Location". The experiment is docked to the TH-NKR Research Lab. What would be a good location? Pressing "Deploy" does nothing, presumably because it's in a "Bad Location".

I really like this mod, but I wish that it would give me a little more information about what it needs, and what it can do. For example, the plasma fuels experiment does not show that it requires a supply of xenon. That's something to discover when you try to run the experiment. I've looked carefully, but perhaps I missed it.

I'm running KSP 1.12.1, with Making History and Breaking Ground.

Incidentally, it appears that the cyclotrons are not drawing any power, although they work just fine producing quargs. Both the Fusebox mod, and Near Future Systems Manager don't show them drawing the 90 ec/sec that I expected to see.

Thanks for supporting this mod.

Log file please, and a save file wou l.j d be helpful

[Sheachen]

This is a nice MOD.I have created a Chinese Localization file myself.Would you mind adding it to the mod file? I can upload it to github if you want

[mattssheep4]

Should the experiments (Creature Comforts, Plant Growth, etc) be able to attach to a craft? Or are they supposed to go in a cargo part? Or is there some other arcane way to use them? It may be a mod conflict, but I can't attach them to my craft, nor can I put them in any inventory part.

[Brigadier]

2 hours ago, mattssheep4 said:

Should the experiments (Creature Comforts, Plant Growth, etc) be able to attach to a craft? Or are they supposed to go in a cargo part? Or is there some other arcane way to use them? It may be a mod conflict, but I can't attach them to my craft, nor can I put them in any inventory part.

I believe they get installed in a specific part, a lab of some kind.

[mattssheep4]

Do you know how to put them in a lab? There's no inventory slots for the labs as far as I've seen.

[UnanimousCoward]

2 hours ago, mattssheep4 said:

Do you know how to put them in a lab? There's no inventory slots for the labs as far as I've seen.

It's been a while since I used this mod, but if I remember right, you don't put them in the lab.

You need to have a station with a lab with kerbals in it (and the right kind of supplementary equipment for some experiments, e.g.  the Zoology Bay for the Creature Comforts experiment).

Then if I recall right, I used to dock the experiments to the station. (I'm not sure they need to actually be docked to the lab, but it's probably a good idea.) Attach a Docking Port Jr to a free end of the lab, and another to the science experiment. 

If you've already got a lab with no  docking port, you could try just docking the experiment to a free docking port somewhere on your station and see if it works that way.

Edited October 6, 2021 by UnanimousCoward

[mattssheep4]

Well, if I can't actually attach the experiments to a craft, I can't exactly dock it to the station either. 

[UnanimousCoward]

Why can't you attach them to a craft? They have vertical attachment nodes, don't they?

Try attaching the experiment as the top part of your rocket, with a docking port attached to the top of that as the very top part of the rocket. Then dock that craft with the station like you would any other craft.

I think as long as the experiment is part of the station (e.g. part of a docked craft), you can run it. (But I might be wrong about that.)

[SuppaTenko]

You don't need to install experiments anywhere.

1) Launch space station with appropriate modules. For example: if you want to run Rocket Fuels experiment - just launch station with TH-NKR lab. If you want to run Creature Comforts E- F-RRY Zoology bay is your choice. Read experiment description in VAB to know what you need. You will need a lot of power to run cyclotrons - I prefere fission reactors from Nertea's Near Future Tech mods. Don't forget to include kerbals - lab won't run without Scientists. Same goes for zoology bay. The more - the better.
2) Build supply ship. It must have:
- Experiment you want to run. It can be part of your ship. Or it can be installed via stock orbital construction system or via KIS/KAS from ship incentory. Works any way.
- Resources. Zoology bay experiments need 'kibbal'. Fuel experiments need some fuels. You can find info in VAB.
- The way to return your experiment results home. High-level probe core with 'Collect all science' button will do the trick. Or you can use crew capsule with heat shield and chutes if you do manned resupply mission. You can transmit results via radio, but it is not very effective.
3) Dock your ship to your station. If your experiment is not part of your ship and is your stock/KIS payload - do some orbital assembly here.
4) Right click experiment and hit Start experiment button. Experiments run on Eurekas and resources. Right click your TH-NKR lab and hit 'Start research'. Make sure you have scientists onboard. It will fill Eurekas gauge. Transfer needed resources to experiment's part. For example 'Rocket fuels' needs some LF and OX. Right click on your fuel tank, pin it, do the same for experiment and transfer in as much as needed. Check resources crossfeed if you can't transfer fuels or so.
Quarks experiments need quarks. Cyclotron will make 'em. Each of three experiments has it's own Quarks decay rate. Prograde quarks has the slowest. Excentric quarks has fastest decay rate. You Cyclotron must produce quarks faster then they decay or you will not be able to fill Quarks gauge.  For Retrograde and Excentric quarks you will need more then one Cyclotron online to keep up with decay. Zoology Bay needs 'kibbal' to generate bioproducts. It also needs scientists onboard. You can use same scientists to produce bioproducts in Zoology bay and then transfer them to TH-NKR Lab to produce Eurekas.
5) When all gauges (Eurekas, Resources, Quarks etc) are filled - you can hit 'Finalize results' button in experiment right-click menu. Et voila! Experiment is finished now.

Finalized experiment can be treated many ways:
1) They can be 'Baked' in spectrometron. Just like any other experiment results. After this you can transmitt it to Kerbin via radio link with 90% efficiency. Spectrometron requires Cyclotron to function, but it can work with any experiment results - not only Station Science Expansion ones. Usefull for far-away missions.
2) They can be transfered to any science container of your choice via 'Collect all' button or action group. You can bring them home in this container ot take by EVA Kerbal or... Well, you know, experiment results are experiment results. After transfering results you can detach used experiment module and mark it as garbage in Tracking Station or send it lithobraking or whatever. You don't need it anymore.
3) They can be detached and stored inside KIS or stock payload bays and returned to kerbin like that with your supply ship. The most interesting and the most difficult way in my opinion.

Sometimes KSP glitches a bit and things doesn't work just right. You may need to relaunch game or reload save for resource transfer to work or for buttons to appear. Typical situation for heavily-modded installs, and i got used to it.

I wrote that quick tutorial by memory, so it CAN be inaccurate in some ways. I can record tutorial video for you if needed, but only on holidays - a bit busy and tired right now =)

[SuppaTenko]

Oh, by the way. How about making experiment pods with switchable textures\models? Old and new style. I like new ones, but striped old ones look good with Nehemia Engineering Orbital Science mod experiment containers and equipment containers. And new ones are hard to tell apart.

[linuxgurugamer]

14 hours ago, SuppaTenko said:

Oh, by the way. How about making experiment pods with switchable textures\models? Old and new style. I like new ones, but striped old ones look good with Nehemia Engineering Orbital Science mod experiment containers and equipment containers. And new ones are hard to tell apart.

That would be nice, would you like to do the graphics?

[SuppaTenko]

On 10/13/2021 at 6:11 AM, linuxgurugamer said:

That would be nice, would you like to do the graphics?

I actually wanted to tamper with B9PartsSwitch configs myself and post the results. But I'm not very skillful tho.
I will totaly do them if I have free time this weekend.

---

Aaaaand nope. I don't think I can change part's model with B9PartSwitch because it relies on existing mesh transforms. For that I need to blend two models together. And my modeling skills are tinkercad-level. Same goes for stock variants system. Sorry. 
I also found the exact difference between Arcanum Industries style models while I was looking at part configs. Now I can determine which is which.

Edited October 17, 2021 by SuppaTenko

[mattssheep4]

@linuxgurugamerI found out the root issue after taking a look at the code and doing some testing. (I'd put this in an issue on github but apparently you've got it set so the public can't access the issues tab.) 
It boils down to two issues:
1. There are references to KSP_Log, which I finally found in your SpaceTuxLibrary mod, in the StationExperiment file. 

2. The StationExperiment class is derived from ModuleScienceExperiment, which requires the Assembly-CSharp.dll as a reference.

One or both of these issues caused the StationExperiment module to not be recognized as a PartModule, and since that PartModule was referenced in the cfg files for the experiments, they became unusable.

I would put in a pull request, but I don't want to screw with your workflow, which is different from mine.

[linuxgurugamer]

20 hours ago, mattssheep4 said:

1. There are references to KSP_Log, which I finally found in your SpaceTuxLibrary mod, in the StationExperiment file. 

Yes, and that is  listed as a dependency, did you have it installed?  If not, it won't load.

 

20 hours ago, mattssheep4 said:

2. The StationExperiment class is derived from ModuleScienceExperiment, which requires the Assembly-CSharp.dll as a reference.

If that's not there, the game won't load.  Assembly-CSharp.dll IS the game

[luna_cat]

On 10/5/2021 at 7:25 PM, mattssheep4 said:

Should the experiments (Creature Comforts, Plant Growth, etc) be able to attach to a craft? Or are they supposed to go in a cargo part? Or is there some other arcane way to use them? It may be a mod conflict, but I can't attach them to my craft, nor can I put them in any inventory part.

The way that I've always used the experiment parts is to make them part of a craft.  I  fly the craft, and dock to a station in orbit that has the lab modules, cyclotron, etc. After docking, you run the experiment. When it's done, finalize it, undock, and return the craft with the experiment to Kerbin. 

[Daniel Prates]

14 hours ago, luna_cat said:

The way that I've always used the experiment parts is to make them part of a craft.  I  fly the craft, and dock to a station in orbit that has the lab modules, cyclotron, etc. After docking, you run the experiment. When it's done, finalize it, undock, and return the craft with the experiment to Kerbin. 

Same here. Usually a remote probe. Easy. The crew go separately. Heck the scientists can even live in the station while you send successive different experiment probes and run one after the other. With kerbal health or kerbalism it is even more interesting as providing a prolonged stay is harder still. While you're at it, install near future electrical + system heat and give a try at running nuclear reactors plus a dedicated heat management system; the cyclotrons seem like they were made for that.

Edited October 24, 2021 by Daniel Prates